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180km daily commute

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  • 14-02-2022 2:24pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭


    Hi All,

    Only recently started looking at EVs so very new to the whole thing but wondering how easily you would manage a daily commute of 180kms with an EV? What models would ye recommend?

    I would be installing a charger at home. What are the costs associated with charging? Tried looking through this forum for some similar questions but didn’t see any.

    Thanks in advance



Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,111 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    ... how easily you would manage a daily commute of 180kms with an EV? What models would ye recommend?

    You need an EV that will do that commute in all weathers with plenty to spare for any additional evening runs you need to do.

    So, any new EV that has ~60kWh battery pack will be fine. You might be able to survive on some of the smaller battery packs but I think you should over compensate here and not try to scrape by.

    In terms of recommending one. It depends on you really.... whats the budget, what requirements do you have in terms of size, style etc.


    I would be installing a charger at home. What are the costs associated with charging?

    A good rule of thumb is that whatever you are paying today for your diesel car to do that commute you can divide that by 5 to get, roughly, what it will cost you in electricity at home.

    When charging at home you will charge at night at a rate of approx 8c/kWh and how much it costs you is then proportional to the amount and style of driving you do. A rough guide is that the car would use 16-20kWh/100km (driving style and weather dependent) so it would cost 8c x 20kWh = €1.60/100km.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 18,860 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    Budget? car size?

    My stuff for sale on Adverts inc. outdoor furniture, roof box and EDDI

    Public Profile active ads for slave1 (adverts.ie)



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,165 ✭✭✭Paul Kiernan


    Can you charge at work? Even with a cable out the window!



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,922 ✭✭✭Reati



    This 8c per KWH thing always feels a bit suss to me as it doesn't count in the additional costs added to standing charge, extra cost of daytime KWHs etc. I see some of the companies now also up the night rate if you cross 2000KWH in the billing cycle (a stretch but doable if a heat pump house and a ton of commuting etc)

    I'd love to see the all numbers some time to learn what the costs are like. I'd imagine it's still better that the other rates though right?



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Doing 180km in all weathers in one go is easier than stop and start 180km where battery loses heat in cold weather. Even latest Corsa or eC4 could manage that.

    For comfort room you'd need to look at Megane eTech, MG ZS, Cupra Born or id3 or Korean stuff. After that you are getting in to the Luxury brands with luxury prices.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 580 ✭✭✭ddarcy


    My rule of thumb is take what is listed as WLTP range and divide by 2. If your daily driving is under that you should be grand.

    the night rate thing depends on usage. If you can’t charge at work you probably be pumping in close to 40 kw/hr a night. So pending your other energy usage you can budget that in.

    id take these as worst case scenarios as there are lots of other factors.



  • Registered Users Posts: 972 ✭✭✭harmless


    Yes I'd also like to see if there is a catch with the 8 cent inc VAT KWH night rate.

    Which company is offering this?

    I've tried some of the main ones and the cheapest I've seen so far is 12.70 cent for night rate with Electric Ireland.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,111 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    I currently pay 17.62/8.71 for day/night (inc vat) with Bord Gais.

    It used be down around 6-7c until this year as we all know electricity prices have gone up alot but you can still get decent value if you shop around.


    When you switch from 24hr rates to day/night rate your day rate will go up by 1c and you pay ~€50/yr extra on standing charge but your day rate will halve! With an EV you will still be quids in.

    For me, I was already on day/night rate (I have a heat pump) before I ever got an EV, so there was no extra for me but it doesnt matter if you have a heat pump or not.... EV=night rate... unless you are doing very small mileage.


    For the OP here, it would be an absolute no brainer to get day/night rate. The extra €50 would pale into insignificance compared to the literally thousands he would save per year on fuel.

    You only need to use about 3 or 4 units of electricty by night to break even. With a 60kWh EV and 180km commute you will be using many many multiples of that so there is nothing suss/misleading/catch here. Lots of EV driving, you should be on night rate.



  • Registered Users Posts: 446 ✭✭ec_pc


    You need to shop around a bit more. Electric Ireland have a night rate inc VAT of 9.34 on Their EnergySaver nightsaver with 26% discount applied. Also Bord Gais can offer day rate of 16.12 and night of 8.5 which I am on. No limits to night time usage.


    Energia have a 2000 KWH monthly limit for their night rate and also a 3000 limit on the day rate before you revert to the standard rates. But if you are using that much electricity, you have bigger issues to deal with!



  • Registered Users Posts: 972 ✭✭✭harmless




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  • Registered Users Posts: 446 ✭✭ec_pc


    I disagree on the standing charge being a factor as you have to pay this to have an electricity supply to your house regardless of whther you have an EV or not. It is not a specific EV charge really.



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,111 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    I'd love to see the all numbers some time to learn what the costs are like. I'd imagine it's still better that the other rates though right?

    Some numbers to give you some perspective on it.

    Average house in Ireland uses a ball park figure of 4000kWh's per year. If you have an EV or a heat pump you would be doubling or trebling that.

    Taking Bord Gais, they currently offer a 16c/kWh rate for an urban 24hr meter and a standing charge of €228/yr

    To switch to day/night with them you'd go on 17.29/8.56 and €300 standing charge


    Lets say you have a background load in your house of 300W. Over 9hrs thats 2.7kWh's that is used on night rate (~1000kWh's) without you changing any of your behaviors or adding an EV. So, what would the change cost you...

    24hr rate --> 4000 x .1608 = 643.20 + €228 = €871 total

    day/night--> (3000 x .1729) + (1000 x .0856) + €300 = €519 + €86 + €300 = €905

    So, even before you add an EV it results in it costing you only an extra €35 for the year!


    If you do 15000 km's a year in your car it would cost

    Diesel... 6l/100km... €1.70/l... €1530

    EV... 20kWh/100km... 8.56c/kWh... €257

    Thats a €1273 saving for only 15k km's.... more miles more savings! So, the €35 for switching to day/night is largely irrelevant when you have a heat pump or an EV in the equation.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,910 ✭✭✭kanuseeme


    I love the diesel consumption figures sometimes, if I am hymning and hawing about buying a EV its 6 l/100km you will save a fortune, if its a phev then super duper new diesels do 3L/100km wasting your money.



  • Registered Users Posts: 647 ✭✭✭kaahooters


    so ev get 6l/100km?

    and dielses get 3l/100ml? what diesles do that?



  • Registered Users Posts: 12,111 ✭✭✭✭KCross


    I dont understand your point @kanuseeme

    What figure should be used? I did somewhat pick the figure out of the air but I think its a reasonable enough ball park figure to pick for most modern ICE cars (~50mpg)? Whatever figure you pick it wont be radically different and hence wont change the economics that much either. What figure would you use?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,910 ✭✭✭kanuseeme


    Not complaining just something made me giggle with recent posts I read, 60 mpg, 4.5 l/100 km, I always thought was good for a diesel car, 25% in the difference.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,910 ✭✭✭kanuseeme


    The answer I got was for a phev doing 3.9 l petrol / 100km was any modern diesel could easily match it on a long run.

    Its when "people" try to convince you to go with a EV, use the worst/high consumption figures for a diesel to justify it and when trying to stop you buying a phev use the best possible consumption figures for the most polluting type of car possible.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,875 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    My 520d Long term average is 29MPG.

    My mams long term average in her 530e is 49MPG.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,106 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Back on topic...


    OP, here's my recommendations

    ID.3 58kWh or 77kWh

    ID.4 77kWh if you need the extra space


    Model 3 SR


    MG 5 or ZS LR


    Nissan Leaf 40kWh (bit borderline but should be fine)

    Peugeot e208/Open Corse E/Citroen eC4 should be fine


    Kia E-Niro 64kWh

    Kia EV6

    Hyundai Ioniq 3 or 5

    Home chargers can be installed for around €600 post grant, check the home charger thread for up to date prices

    Cheapest night rate at the moment is 6.28c/kWh from Energia (look up their EV plan). This does have a higher day rate though, so doesn't always make sense

    Using that and an assumed average consumption of 19kWh/100km, you'll be looking at about €2.14 per day in electricity

    Assuming 5l/100km of diesel and €1.68/l, that'll be €15.12 in diesel for comparison

    Assuming 230 working days per year, that's an annual saving of almost €3000

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 647 ✭✭✭kaahooters


    long runs dont matter, the majourity of cars in ireland are doing short hops, schools shops ect which i agree, phevs and evs ae perfect for.

    but thanks for the answer, it seems like its just habbit for people at this point, wonder what theyll all do when they cant buy new ice cars anymore (2030?)



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