Fall out with a friend - thoughts?

sporina

So, "John" and I have been mates for a good few years.

Last autumn we fell out - and just looking for others thoughts on it.

We wer at an exhibition - I asked him where he wanted to start (showed him the plan) and he was like "on just get on with it".. so I said.. "eh are you ok?" he said "your being annoying - can we just get started"..

I was quite upset by this - so... it seemed me asking him where he wanted to start (massive exhibition - we would not do it all).. "annoyed" him..

Anyway - I just proceeded to make my way thru the stalls - he was behind me but then disappeared.

About 30 mins later he texted to say sorry - he didn't wanna walk around with mask on, carry luggage etc so he was in the cafe across the rd.

i replied saying ok and I'd be out when I'm done.

That was grand - though I did feel he was out of order. But I wanted to have a good day so I let it go.

...................

Then on the way home, we reached the toll.. he took out his card but went to the booth with no card option.... only coins.. I then got coins out - he threw them in but one was chucked out so he had to get out of the car to feck it etc..

We drove off and he was so flustered.. said "OMG I hate tolls.. they are so annoying - why can't we just drive from A-B without having to stop at them etc.

I was taken aback... and asked "really?, tolls annoy you?".. he yelled back "yes am I not allowed to be annoyed by them?"..

I was stunned - 1st world probs etc.. anyway.. I said "well, I wouldn't let them upset me - maybe we just need to prepare for them better ie: go to the right booth - whether cash/card etc"..

He got so annoyed.. saying I wasn't allowing him the right to feel annoyed..

I felt he was being really irrational - and remembering the issue at the exhibit.. I said "I have bigger things to annoy me in life.. why let this spoil our day out?"..

Anyway.. we didn't speak the rest of the drive home.. I got out of the car - thanked him for the day and went home.

I texted him Happy Xmass and Happy NY.. he replied to both with "Thanks"..

Nada from either of us since.. i miss him.. but I don't wanna reach out to him again..

He's obviously very annoyed with me? What, cos I didn't agree with him about the tolls? Maybe I didn't react in the best way? But I was really taken aback... like, seriously... tolls annoying you? Ok - I could have humoured him - but I had done that earlier in the day... he feels like a lot of work.. I know we need to preserve friendships but self respect and honesty is important too eh?

Thoughts?

PS Sorry this is soooo long ekk

sporina

NSAman

Sounds like he has more going on than just tolls and an exhibition.

simple answer, take him out for a drink/meal and ask him outright. At least you’ll have your answer. I suspect there is more going on with him….

spurious

It wasn't the tolls or the way round the exhibition, as NSAman says - something else either was or maybe still is bothering him.

Coffee/meal/drink - whatever would be normal for you. Don't drag it up. If he wants to tell you he will. If not, let it go.

Princess Calla

Yeah there's something else going on in the background with him.

He turned up for the exhibition so was obviously trying to put whatever is bothering him to one side.....he obviously failed and small stuff was irritating him, but he removed himself from the situation and got a coffee. You were able to continue on your own, granted you probably wanted to share the experience.

However you would have annoyed me at the toll.....when it's fairly obvious someone is in bad form don't goad them into an argument. The simple response would have been to agree that yes tolls are a pain in the h*Le , not give a lecture on how unprepared he was.

Reach out again to him and see if he wants a coffee....if you need to drive anywhere offer to pick him up and do the driving.

Ash.J.Williams

did he ever have feelings for you caller?

LilacNails

I echo what the others are saying.... Sounds like he has stuff bothering. I think u did annoy him in relation to comments about the toll ... If I were in a bad mood and someone was trying to make light of something and not see I'm just a a **** mood it would pee me off.

Reach out to him ask how are things and would he like a catch up. If he doesn't want I would leave it. Maybe the friendship isn't worth as much to him as it is to u, and that's ****.

bucketybuck

Sounds like he was in a mood and decided that you were annoying him, if it hadn't been the tolls that day then it would have been something else.

And while there probably was more to the story or going on in the background, now he has decided that you were part of the problem and so has distanced himself from you.

And for all we know it might be true, maybe you have some behaviours that annoy him and this had been building up for a while.

But it doesn't really matter, if that is how he handles things then I personally would not be crawling to him begging for a talk. His actions ended this friendship, its him that needs to reconnect if he actually wants to.

Liberty_Bear

Hi OP

This might not be a falling out but just the after event of an incident he might have had. I do like the suggestion to bring him out for a meal and a chat. Tis all about creating that safe space for him to chat about whats happening. Ask leading questions maybe - such as - How are things going for you in life? Are you finding anything difficult? Anything on your mind?. Do it after some small talk so it does not look like you are there to ambush him.

mrslancaster

His reply to your Happy Xmas & NY were a bit off and if you really want to keep the friendship going then you could text again and ask if he wants to meet for coffee / catch up and take it from there.

If he doesn't get in touch to arrange something or have a chat then that's his choice and not much you can do about it.

As others said, he could have something else going on in his life right now but I'm not sure I'd be asking if he's finding things difficult or if he has anything on his mind - he could be very happy doing something new, busy with a new job/new relationship, making plans to travel etc.

IMO, that's a conversation for later on if you do manage to re-connect and if he does have any issues bothering him, and he wants to tell you about it, he'll do it in his own time.

sporina

thanks for all the replies.. I few resonated with me.. @Princess Calla I had already let him off with being rude and irrational at the exhibit - I wasn't gonna lie to him to keep him happy - thats hardly a healthy friendship is it?!!

@bucketybuck oh I was walking on egg shells with him all day... I could tell he was in a mood.. sure, I prob have behaviours that annoy him - but the shoe was on the other foot that day - if being considerate is annoying then I'm at a loss (by asking him where he wanted to go at the exhibit).. he was being super annoying.. yes the ball is in his court..

To all in general.. yes, he does have a worry on his mind.. I won't go into details (in case he reads this) but its a war he has taken upon himself.. no need for it - I have tried to understand his thinking... I can't - but I just listen and empathise.. had listened to him talk about it for 2 hrs before the toll..

We all have problems.. my gosh - if only ye knew the troubles I have had and continue to have in my life.. (he knows about em btw) - but it does't give one the right to treat others badly - or act totally irrationally - esp when there is no call for it.. (exhibit)..

So, I didn't agree with him about the toll - am I not allowed my opinion? And anyway - it was his own fault - going to the wrong booth - but rather than taking ownership if that he blamed the tolls.. lol.. v v immature imo...

This thread has helped me to process this... and in conclusion.. I don't think I need a friend like this in my life.. I think he has a lot of growing up to do.. bless.. he's 45.. ekk..

PS He has been like this before.. there wer 2 incidences that I can think of off hand.. and again he was v irrational and immature.. and I had to make the effort to reconnect - encourage communication..

I did my bit here - twice.. I think i'm done..

JoChervil

First, we don't know the story, which lead to the exhibition and we don't know, how your friendship developed earlier. For example, whose idea was this exhibition? Because if he felt he was somehow forced to do it, so it would explain his bad mood. Maybe he preferred to do something else instead?

On the other hand your two remarks at the tall were patronising and would annoy me.

People have right to feel what they feel. It doesn't matter how silly or unjustified it seems to others. People have sensitive points in different places. So instead of acknowledging his feelings you used these situations to show how better you are than him and how better you would handle them. So are you really his friend?

I don't think you are good for each other.

JoChervil

I mean I feel cranky, if I don't have coffee after a journey, so maybe he wanted to have a coffee first, which you might have dismissed? Have you noticed his disappearance and texted him about it? He went for a coffee, you continued with your visiting. Maybe he felt exhibition was more important than him for you? Maybe he felt being used by you to have a lift to an exhibition and his needs didn't matter for you?

Princess Calla

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118585796#Comment_118585796

There's a phrase "pick your battles" it's very clear he was frustrated at himself over the toll booth, but then rather than turn it into a joke or just say nothing you used it to get the boot in as you were p*ssed off over the exhibition.

When I'm a passenger I act as navigator so I would have been directing which booth to go too.

If I was a driver and my passenger started to lecture me over something (unless I had done something that endangered both our lives) I'd be royaly p*ssed off.

It sounds like the friendship has run its course he's not chasing you to make amends and you have lots of anger towards his choices.

I think you are just seeking validation that he was in the wrong and you were in the right. Unfortunately none of us can give you that validation.

sporina

@JoChervil gee super imagination there.. we had just had b'fast.. the exhibit was a mutual decision... as for the rest.. ..

@Princess Calla - you think a joke or saying nothing wudda worked? I think not.. PS I didn't mention what happened at the exhibit etc at that point.. read my initial post..

Nah this guy is too much work.. perhaps we have run our course - and I am ok with that,. will miss him.. but doesn't mean it would be right to make contact.. and yes, one other user on here did imply that the ball was in his court.. 😊

Hannibal_Smith

Some friendships last some don't. It's not the fault of anyone really - they just run their course.

As everyone else has said there was obviously a bigger issue at play here. With the good friendships crap happens too but generally you both address it or just get over it and move on.

If your fall out happened in the autumn and there's been nothing from either of you since - I'd file it in the category of 'friendship that was grand while it was good, but just wasn't meant for the long haul'. I think this was his objective BTW- to move away from the friendship and move on.

pulling ?luggage? around an exhibition while masked?

can I ask how that arose? it's the kind of thing would have me on a very short fuse I must say.

I see sheep

Are you male or female op?

JoChervil

You told that story from the moment convenient for you. While probably something happened beforehand, which annoyed him big time. You might have been the biggest contributor to it, but we don't know this part of the story.

Yet, we know how you reacted, when he made a simple mistake. I wouldn't like for a friend a person, who "kicks a man, when he is down".

But giving you any advice is futile because you are not capable to take on board anything, what doesn't fit your picture. So you won't gain from different points of view, because you are fixed on yours.

JoChervil

And things are usually unrepairable between people, when one party doesn't want to own their part of the problem. He said sorry, did you?

sporina

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118589530#Comment_118589530

doubt it - he got me a really cool thoughtful pressie for my Birthday which was 2 weeks b4 this happened..

sporina

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118589556#Comment_118589556

covid

sporina

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118589580#Comment_118589580

female

sporina

@JoChervil thanks for your input - but i'd bet your projecting... he said sorry for the 1st issue.. but proceeded to be immature and irrational etc later on.. just cos I didn't agree tolls wer annoying (it's funny really).. and not the 1st, 2nd or 3rd time.. 45 yrs ekk - time to grow up = but not at my expense.. writing this post has helped me realise that.. I've lots of good mates thankfully.. and I am a v good mate - but not a doormat.. in conclusion.. would rather no mates than a **** one.. boundaries and all that..

Princess Calla

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118593147#Comment_118593147

Yeah covid was a given.

I think the main question was why luggage was involved. Why didn't he leave it in the car.

I suspect due to your dodging of the question that the luggage was yours and he was being nice carrying it for you.

He realised with the mask and a large busy exhibition that dragging luggage was zero craic so went off to get a coffee leaving you free to enjoy the exhibition.

witchgirl26

OP honestly you don't sound very forgiving in the first place. Was it a bit much over the tolls, probably but maybe he was annoyed at himself and didn't want to say that so was giving out about the tolls. Sometimes small things annoy people. And yes it may be "1st world problems" but it doesn't meant that in the moment, they're not very annoying. I've had major problems in my life before and dealt with them ok but it was the straw that broke the camals back that often tipped me over. Like dropping my phone & breaking the cover. Not exactly something to be the level annoyed I was but it was a cumulation.

And yes, part of friendship is forgiving so why couldn't you have just let the toll thing slide? Did it really matter all the much? Just allow him to be annoyed and rant for a little while. I do it for my partner and god knows he does it for me. Same with my friends.

His background issues may not be something you agree with given you think he took them on himself, but that's not for you to judge in that regards. He was obviously struggling that day so why poke it?

And when he texted you to say he'd left the exhibit, did you reply at all? Or go to meet him in the cafe to see if he was ok? Or did you just go off and enjoy yourself? I know if I'd gone to a show with a friend and they disappeared, I'd be more concerned about them rather than getting on with enjoying the show.

NSAman

Having read the replies, I think John might have just come to his senses.

he drives her, is expected to carry luggage, buys things for her…and she shows no sympathy or empathy for him?

ManOfMystery

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118593163#Comment_118593163

Why did you post this thread? It sounds like you have your mind fully made up despite the suggestions and possible reasons that some posters here are putting forth.

We're all human. Sometimes people wake up grumpy, sometimes people have bad days, sometimes there's serious stuff going on in their life and sometimes it's as simple as being in a bad mood because their blood sugar is low and they need to eat something.

The moan about the toll? It's like moaning about the weather. Sometimes people just want to have a moan and have their friend say "I agree, it's a pain in the arse isn't it?" rather than tell them that if they had made adequate provisions and checked weather forecasts and planned ahead then it wouldn't be an issue - that comes across like condescension.

There was no massive fight here, or theft, or betrayal, or worse - it's relatively petty stuff about being in moods (some of which is understandable, I personally get irritated lugging stuff around with a face mask on), and it would seem a shame to throw a friendship away over that.

Tork

OP, can you clarify who was carrying your luggage at the exhibition?

sporina

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118589556#Comment_118589556

i can to pull my luggage around too.. I wasn't complaining.. gotta go with the times - twas out of our control - and actually - he had a backpack - much easier to say..

in any event twas out of order taking it out on me.. like I said, apparently I was being annoying cos I asked him what he wanted to do.. and I rose about that.. era too much work.. at 45 yrs.. he cudda said from the start.. hey, i'm not happy to walk with luggage and mask - meet you later

sporina

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118593848#Comment_118593848

lol the assumptions!! lol twas his OWN luggage - and was actually a backpack.. I "pulled" my own luggage around - with no complaints.. logistics didn't allow for luggage to be put in the car

your forgetting about his saying I was annoying for asking him his preference.

Tork

Maybe he thought bringing his backpack around the exhibition, while wearing a mask would be ok. That was, until he got there and found it to be too much. If he had been looking forward to attending this, he will have been pissed off and disappointed at how things panned out. I'm not excusing him for his behaviour, just trying to make sense of it. It was a long trip for nothing and that may have still been irritating him when you got to the toll booths.

It's possible that at this stage, he's not eager to rekindle this friendship and that having that spat suited him.

sporina

@witchgirl26 I was just surprised about the tolls - and then when I didn't agree he had a fit.. I had humoured him all day - no more.. that was the straw that broke the camel's back for me! and I have had to humour him loads in the past..

I guess, had I humoured him about the tolls it would be like giving him the message that he can behave how he wants, like the way he did at the exhibit... that would not make for a healthy friendship - he should respect my feelings and opinions too - its two way..

And he knows all the trauma etc I have had in my life over the last 18 mths.. one would expect better from a friend - not to be called annoying when no need for it.

I posted here to get others thoughts - most are full of assumptions etc.. but the thread has allowed me to process it all - job done..

As for the rest - read my initial post - seems you didn't

sporina

@NSAman his choice to drive (always wants to do the driving), we both carried our own luggage, we both buy each other presents etc.. been listening to him about this issue of his for years now.... with no judgement

sporina

@ManOfMystery see post 33...

sporina

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118594283#Comment_118594283

see post 31

Tork

You're playing catch-up here. I've since read that post and replied!

realdanbreen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058231338/fall-out-with-a-friend-thoughts

If he was driving and went to the wrong booth then why was he asking why ye could not try and avoid tolls when driving?

Hannibal_Smith

Mod Note

Sporina you have posted in Relationship Issues looking for advice PI/RI being an advice forum. Posters have taken time out of their day to offer advice to you. It may or may not be relevant, only you can decide that but often when you post on a public forum you get a broad spectrum of responses and you have to take that into account.

As you are happy that you have resolved your issue I will close the thread there.

Thanks to everyone who offered advice.

HS