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Recommendation for a compact PHEV SUV

  • 19-01-2022 9:40am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 112 ✭✭


    As the title says, we are looking to buy an PHEV SUV, our use would be lots of short trips during the day (daycare, gym, supermarket...) but also packing it and taking it on the weekends outside the city with the kids. Our budget is around 45k and space is important, so we probably won't consider anything smaller.

    So far our only contenders were:

    Volkswagen Tuareg -> they are not delivering PHEV SUVs until 2023, so discarded

    Mitsubishi Outlander -> No new cars in Europe this year, discarded too

    Peugeot 3008 -> I love it, but saw people online having problems with the electric system, and even when we test drove the car the other day the electric system failed to start with an error (the seller was trying to cover it saying that it was low battery, when it wasn't). Big red flag if even your test car is not working.

    Hyundai Tucson -> Top (and only) contender for now, ticks all the boxes, but I personally find it hideous inside or outside, but I guess I'll get used to it...


    Any recommendations out there that we are missing?



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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 21,298 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Eniro, Ioniq 5, EV6 would be my pick in that group.

    Forget the phev idea. 45k is a good budget and you'll get a long range EV for that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,170 ✭✭✭crisco10


    I would have thrown the Enyaq in maybe too?



  • Registered Users Posts: 21,298 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Yes I always forget the MEB cars. ID3/4/Enyaq are selling very well and are great family cars.



  • Registered Users Posts: 112 ✭✭amargar


    We take trips across Ireland often, we wouldn't want to depend on having to charge our car mid trip, so we are strong on PHEV



  • Registered Users Posts: 21,298 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    Across Ireland is ~250km.

    EV6, MEB cars etc all have double that.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 112 ✭✭amargar




  • Registered Users Posts: 6,544 ✭✭✭zg3409


    What real world EV only range do you need for 98% of trips? What car are you driving at present?

    Post edited by zg3409 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,170 ✭✭✭crisco10


    We went thru same thought process and were surprised at how little charging would be needed while pottering around ireland (depends what part to an extent). The current set of EVs are capable for approx 400km which is plenty if you can destination charge (even granny cable).

    Best advise, play about with Abetter route planner and model some of your typical journeys. And see what you think of the charging required.


    We ended up getting Ioniq 5.



  • Registered Users Posts: 112 ✭✭amargar


    what do you do if you want to go from Dublin to the west of Ireland for a weekend?



  • Registered Users Posts: 112 ✭✭amargar


    I appreciate the comments about fully electric, but we travel a lot during the summer months east-west and last thing I want is to be worried looking for chargers.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 564 ✭✭✭Pivot Eoin


    if youre set on plug in hybrid, id be looking only at the RaV 4 or the Tucson in that price range.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,170 ✭✭✭crisco10


    Fair enough. Just sharing our experience, we started at exactly the same spot as you, even only looking at PHEV or ICE then ended up doing a total u turn.


    Re the West of Ireland, that's what I meant by looking at ABRP. To see if what you wanted was possible in a long range BEV.



  • Registered Users Posts: 112 ✭✭amargar


    Can you charge at a normal outlet? So if you get an airbnb, can you just throw a cable through the window?



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,170 ✭✭✭crisco10


    Yes you can. That's a granny charge, and is slow. Depending on car, that can take approx 24 hours to go from 0 to 100%.

    But in reality, we realised that going from 20% to 80% would be enough which would be mostly possible over night at our destination (family, air bnb etc)



  • Registered Users Posts: 112 ✭✭amargar


    That actually changes our whole plan, we are definitely going to look into the Enyaq or other full EVs



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,027 ✭✭✭Lantus


    Great plan. Phev is already being phased out by several manufacturers as ev becomes the standard. I would just stick with an ice if it was that critical.


    Enyaq is a beast but tough to spec at 45k. 50k more realistic but a lot of options not great value for money so research very carefully. The family pack with trays and other stuff is less likley.


    Ioniq 5 and ev6 are both good SUV type alternatives.



  • Registered Users Posts: 89 ✭✭tobottherobot


    We currently have a Niro PHEV and its a great car all round. The only thing that I find that lets it down is the limited boot space... if you regularly have the boot full on your trips, make sure you assess the boot sizes on the PHEVs as some tend to be limited due to having to carry an engine + battery + electic motor



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,473 ✭✭✭maidhc


    I always find these threads interesting. I have no doubt BEV cars are the future, but a PHEV is a far better bet for living and driving in Ireland now.

    I think buying a current gen BEV at the moment like buying a DVD+RW recorder 20 years ago. It might work long term but it might not.



  • Posts: 864 ✭✭✭[Deleted User]


    Have you considered the Cupra Formentor?



  • Registered Users Posts: 64,674 ✭✭✭✭unkel



    Says the person with no EV experience ;)


    Look at the people above who were in the same boat and against the odds and what people in the pub said, went BEV instead of PHEV. Like the OP, it is mostly a matter of not being familiar with BEVs and the way the work. Most people are afraid of change and wait until most other people have adopted new technology first before they finally jump in.


    PHEV only ever was a compliance solution...



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,182 ✭✭✭Miscreant


    Car manufacturers are releasing new PHEV versions all the time so it is certainly not a dead/cul-de-sac technology at the moment. Big names like Jaguar, VW, KIA/Hyundai, Ford and so on, are all announcing or have announced new PHEV models recently so I would not discount the vehicles at all.

    Like the OP, I regularly travel Dublin to the West and when the time came to change my Toyota hybrid, I looked at PHEV and BEV technology before deciding that at the time, a PHEV suited our needs. I don't regret the choice as I can quite comfortably potter around my daily journeys on battery power (up to 60kms, although not in winter) and then when the longer journey comes, I do not worry about charging until I get to where I need to be. That being said, I will be looking at a BEV for my next car as the driving ranges have increased now to the point where I would be comfortable setting out Westward and know that I can do it in one hop with some "granny" charging at the other end when needed.

    I find that this forum tends to encourage the BEV side, almost to the detriment of any other "electrified" powertrain, but not everyone is willing or ready to go full electric and a lot of people have no charging facilities where they live so alternatives such as PHEV and parallel/series hybrids must be available.

    In the end, the market will find equilibrium in it's own time but I would not be discounting the "not BEV" vehicles at all if they still meet your needs. There is still a lot to be said for the convenience of pulling into a filling station for fuel and being back on your way in less than 5 minutes on a long journey.



  • Registered Users Posts: 64,674 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    @Miscreant - the only reason car manufacturers are still releasing (relatively long range) PHEV is that is makes them compliant. These cars count the same as BEV, so lets them produce a few more profitable diesels without having to pay crippling CO2 penalties. Without having to use up as much battery capacity (of which they are all short) as for making a BEV


    Compliance...


    Toyota, for once, have been completely open and honest about this and have stated this many times.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,170 ✭✭✭crisco10


    Me too, love these discussions.

    My honest opinion is that neither PHEV or BEV is a slam dunk in Ireland at the moment. It really depends on the individual use case. As mentioned previously, when we looked at it BEV was a no brainer for us. It could be made work for our periodic forays out of Dublin with relative ease and there was no doubting that it was better for around Dublin than a PHEV.

    However, counter point was a friend of mine who travels to the Inisowen Peninsula every month, there is poor charger coverage on the route north, and poor charger coverage around Inisowen. And probably not enough time spent at the destination house to get enough Granny Charger. He got a PHEV.

    I do however think that for most people based in the greater Dublin area, a BEV will work more often than not. And save you a sh!t ton in running costs.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,182 ✭✭✭Miscreant


    Absolutely agree with you @unkel, however "compliance" cars are not necessarily any less suitable for someone over a BEV model.

    The writing is definitely on the wall for the IC engine, and I don't think anyone can deny that. I am a big fan of BEVs of all different types but would not immediately discount a vehicle with a combustion engine if it met my needs.

    As for the OP: Depending on where in the West of Ireland you are going, you could seriously look at either PHEV or BEV. My trips rarely exceed 220kms in one go when travelling West so you could definitely get by with a BEV such as the ID4, Enyaq, Ioniq5, EV6 in around the price range you are looking at. Charging with a granny charger when you get there is OK but you will only be putting about 2KWh back in the battery every hour (or thereabouts) so you would have to factor that into your return calculations. Otherwise, take a look at the Rav4, Kuga and Tucson PHEVs as compact SUVs or the XCeed, Niro, Ioniq PHEVs if they fit the bill. For your budget, the choice is very broad so it will all come down to your own preference.



  • Registered Users Posts: 112 ✭✭amargar


    Do you think a PHEV is going to sell ok as a used car in some years?



  • Registered Users Posts: 64,674 ✭✭✭✭unkel


    Nobody knows for sure, but you can bet money that the only type of car that will have relatively low depreciation compared to others is pure EV. Particularly if / when the €5k subsidy is dropped. There is likely to be a big gap and then PHEV is likely to be the next best thing compared to petrols and diesels and any non plug in hybrids that can only be fueled with fossil fuels.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,489 ✭✭✭Tony H


    we had a phev for less than a year (kia xceed ) loved the ev part and traded up to a kona , would not go back , went from Cobh to Donegal in a day , charged in J9 Mayfield and had no problems , a bit small for family but its grand for the oh and myself and a dog , wish we had skipped the phev stage now , full EV is great to drive , swore i would never drive an auto , would not go back to manual now .



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,182 ✭✭✭Miscreant


    I don't believe they will be worthless. PHEV is not going to die by 2030 and there are still 8 years to go before then so if you buy a PHEV now and keep it for the usual PCP period of 3 years, there is still plenty of time to go. The second hand market for ICE/PHEV/hybrid is not going to disappear over the next few years and there will still be demand for good used cars.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,473 ✭✭✭maidhc


    I’d still buy a diesel new tomorrow if I was buying a car, because in the immediate present that is what works best for me and unless diesel doubles in price in the next 12 months will continue to make the most sense.

    i think people should buy what works for them.

    ill definitely be buying a BEV, but I’d rather wait and see how it all plays out.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 7,738 ✭✭✭Grumpypants


    I've had a PHEV for almost 4 years. It was great and I reckon 80-90+% was done on battery. But that takes its toll.

    I'd charge at home, drive to work use all the battery, charge in work, go out at lunch to move it so the other phev owner could charge after lunch, drive home and use the battery, charge again at home.


    I'm living pretty rural so even a pop to the shops or school run was over 10km.


    I'm forever plugging it in and would usually charge and use up the battery 3-4 times a day.


    That is a pain in the ass, but worse it hits the battery health. It's a 2015 with only 65%, and now only does 22km in winter, so even more charging.


    I can get about halfway to work now on battery.


    Moving to full EV. Getting the MG ZS EV which will do 400+ km on a charge when pottering around these small roads. So it will be one charge a week now.


    If you travel to the west a lot, the great secret is the chargers here are nearly always empty. Most people charge at home.

    Train station, Lidl, and local hotel have 6 between them and they are rarely in use. Most of our bigger beaches like kilkee have chargers at the beach.

    If you are popping down west for a week you won't be stuck.



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