Was the IRA Kingsmill massacre an act of false flag terrorism

Harryd225

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118370989#Comment_118370989

Extremely doubtful at the time of this massacre in 1976.

MakersMark

It was another IRA war crime.

Remember Fenians, if it was a war, then there were war crimes!

generic_throwaway

Noted IRA supporter tries to whitewash IRA atrocity.

Harryd225

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118371098#Comment_118371098

Well according to British military intelligence it was done by rogue IRA members doing a solo run so it was no more of a war crime for the IRA than it was when any rogue UDR/RUC members who went and killed Catholics off their own back.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118370997#Comment_118370997

You think that the people shot were good for a laugh.

Cold.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118371098#Comment_118371098

Well shouldn't it be looked at in a court?

Why are they not too keen to make charges of 'war crimes' you'd have to wonder...afraid of what might tumble out, maybe?. Same reason they resist a truth recovery process.

PeaSea

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118371055#Comment_118371055

The British were up to stuff.

This is stuff.

Therefore the British were up to it.

Sorry but without any proof its meaningless speculation. If they did do it I wouldnt be surprised, but just because theyre capable doesnt mean they did.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118371215#Comment_118371215

We need to know what Nairac and his like were up to at the very least.

PeaSea

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118371228#Comment_118371228

100%, yes.

Harryd225

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118371215#Comment_118371215

There is no hardcore evidence but in light of the hardcore evidence in relation to sectarian killing on the loyalist side at the time, there is strong reason to believe it could be true, the goal of all the sectarian killing on the loyalist side was mostly to provoke an IRA reaction and draw them into a sectarian conflict and away from it's war against the state thus draining it's support leading to a quick British victory, they weren't getting the reaction they wanted so maybe they decided to take matters into their own hands. During 74-76 loyalists killed about 300 innocent Catholics while republicans killed about 60 innocent protestants and loyalist paramilitaries in retaliation.

There was also a man with a strong English accent overseeing the operation at the Miami showband massacre which is as good as proven now to have been orchestrated by British intelligence, the same thing at Kingsmill, now even if they didn't expect all the victims to be dead anyway in the next two minutes why would he have put on a posh English accent? They were posing as a UDR checkpoint where everyone would have had Irish accents anyway.

There was a Catholic man there at the time who was told to run away when they pulled over the bus, the man with the English accent never spoke until he had already gone so if he was putting the accent on why would he have not spoken before he left?

Alan Black the lone survivor says there was a cover up for what reason he does not know, he claims there was never any investigation into it and that all the files were lost in floods and fires, he says at least one of them was a double agent, a former British soldier who they still won't name to this day.

Maybe the whole cover up was just to protect the informer I don't know but I personally believe there was more to it than that.

Harryd225

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118371228#Comment_118371228

We may not ever know what the Brits had him doing but at least we know he got what he deserved in the end.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118371098#Comment_118371098

There was no war, just a long series of terrorist incidents hai

Harryd225

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118371482#Comment_118371482

Ok Phil.

Harryd225

Hh

El Tarangu

A former Sinn Féin MP famously commemorated famously the massacre on its anniversay; given that he was so proud of the association between Sinn Féin/IRA and this massacare, it would seem unlikely that he would do so if it had been a British intelligence operation designed to discredit his organisation.

I don't think that a British accent is necessarily a smoking gun either, there were a number of members of the IRA who would have been brought up in Britain.

As another poster pointed out, just a lot of hot air from the usual suspects who, although they are proud of the murder and mayhem caused by their terrorist heroes, still find it expedient to muddy the waters on the question of responsibility for SF/IRA's most heinous acts of barbarity.

Harryd225

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118372335#Comment_118372335

That Sinn Féin MP made an idiotic mistake he always used to post weird pictures of himself like that one on social media.

Even the official British intelligence line released years later was that it was done by rogue IRA members.

I don't think there were many people with posh English accents in the IRA at the time, Investigators from the PSNI's Historical Enquiries Team (HET) who briefed relatives of the 10 Protestant victims drew a blank on his identity

"We have asked everyone we can think of who served in the security forces at the time who this could have been but we have been unable to put a name to him."

The same thing during the Miami showband massacre by loyalists, there was a man with a posh English accent who was overseeing the operation, both operations almost identical fake British army checkpoints, bus brought to a halt with a posh English man in charge of things, it's said it could have been Captain Robert Nairac who was a high ranking member of a shadowy intelligence unit at the time, records show that he was elsewhere at the time but I still wouldn't rule it out.

According to John Weir, members of the glenanne gang began to suspect that Nairac was playing republican and loyalist paramilitaries off against each other, by feeding them information about murders carried out by the "other side" and ordering them to carry out more sectarian attacks with the intention of "provoking revenge attacks by the IRA'' members of the IRA did carry out some revenge attacks but very little compared to what the Brits would have wanted, maybe they decided to take matters into their own hands.

Dohvolle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118371228#Comment_118371228

Ask anyone in Crossmaglen, who used to drink with him.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118370734#Comment_118370734

Group think does not amount to evidence. Actual evidence is thin on the ground.

Harryd225

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118373590#Comment_118373590

Actual evidence was thin on the ground for most cases regarding British state collusion with loyalists up until the last 15 years or so, it doesn't mean a lot of people didn't put 2 and 2 together and realise what was going on, up until 15 years ago the survivors of the Miami showband massacre I mentioned in the OP didn't believe any collusion took place and claimed that it was just a few rogues, now he has a documentary on Netflix claiming the massacre went right up to the top.

Some people only believe or question something when the evidence becomes so overwhelming the BBC are forced to make a documentary out of it, the theory is more than plausible in my opinion.