Solar for Dummies.

graememk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121854856#Comment_121854856

Id guess the solar generated in the app is correct.

The battery discharging correctly is indicating that the CT seems to be in the right place/direction.

On the 2nd of march what does the ESBN site show what you have imported?

It should show no(or little) import from when the solar started producing, Once the battery is full, export should be showing up then too, Then battery to discharge and then finally import again when battery is empty.

Also the calculation for consumption is taking account what is used from solar. if you consumed 20kWh in 24 hrs, the solar doesnt add to that value.

But that graph from today IS strange. The consumption shouldnt be at 3kW when the battery finished charging. Is there a screen on the inverter that shows the use right there and then? Compare that to the app and what is running in the house, and then start turning stuff off!

If you flick back to the 2nd of march how does the export match up with the ESBN data?

more screenshots, more data!

ColemanY2K

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121854856#Comment_121854856

I'm sure you know this but the total for a 24 hour period from the ESB hdf file needs to be divided by 2 as it's half hourly data. So if the import total is 20kWh then in reality you've imported 10kWh. Same goes for export.

Eleusis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121854856#Comment_121854856

It wouldn't be that insane if you use electric heaters. Do you know your consumption pre solar?

Rulmeq

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121855446#Comment_121855446

Yeah, it was 18kWh on average, but since I wasn't on a smart plan, I don't have a break down by day/hour like I do now. So given that, I would expect to not be drawing from the grid from about midday until about 10pm, yet the graphs I'm seeing on the ESB network site show that there's rarely a part of the day that I'm not pulling from the grid.

Rulmeq

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121854957#Comment_121854957

Thanks for taking the time to give me this info. I'm going to get you guys some graphs and extra data today, and get a photo of the thing in the meter box.

Rulmeq

Sorry for dominating this thread, but here are the graphs/charts requested.

The first one I have is a graph from ESB-networks website for the 1st and 2nd march the detail isn't great, but it clearly shows that at no point were we not drawing from the grid - which doesn't make sense to me, during the peak generation period, and for a few hours after the battery should have been covering all our needs. You can even see at peak generation around 4pm, we were still consuming from the grid, even if there was something doing that, say the oven, I would expect it to draw from the battery before it went to the grid (we were told it was intelligent enough to do that)

https://imgur.com/DaFdLjj

So, here are the images from the app for the 1st and 2nd of March (I didn't include the battery as they were cluttered enough, but I can include it if someone wants to see it, but just like the one I posted above, when the battery stops charging, our "consumption" goes right up to match generation.

Fusion solar app for March 1st:

https://imgur.com/byHLAUZ

and Fusion solar app for March 2nd:

https://imgur.com/xahiaUx

The same days from the Energia app

Energia for March 1st:

https://imgur.com/dqGpEIo

and Energia for March 2nd:

https://imgur.com/PKrENDe

So the final image is from the data I downloaded from the ESB-networks site itself, so the half hourly data for the 2nd of March. I had to reverse the times as it's descending, so I took only one day and graphed it. The graph itself looks very similar to the Energia one of the same date, again showing that despite the sun splitting the rocks, and the panels generating 5kW, apparently we were still drawing from the grid.

https://imgur.com/58nqoX0

I will go out soon and get a photo of the thing in the ESB meter box and either add it here, or another post. The more I look at this, the more I realise I need to go back to the original installers, because this is not right.

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121855667#Comment_121855667

How many electrical heaters do you have active in the house?

Rulmeq

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121855873#Comment_121855873

Here's the set up we have, we have oil for the central heating and water, and we'd decided we were going to use more electric since we had the solar and battery. So we got 5 sun ATC heaters installed, 2 of them are 1kW, 3 are 1.5Kw. So we have the central heating working in the morning and this gives us hot water for the entire day.

Then during the day I work from home, so I have my 1.5Kw heater turned on, and if we're both home, then there will be a 2nd one. But at the moment, I'm the only one home - I also don't have it on all the time, I've set the thermostat to 20C. So the worst case scenario happens at night, if we both have them set to 20C and they come on, so you can see the peaks at night on the graph where that happens.

graememk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121855667#Comment_121855667

Stick with it here,

Theres something not right. What, I'm not sure.

What a hybrid inverter is meant to do is try and keep the grid at 0w, either by charging the battery or discharging the battery,

There is limits on how fast it can discharge but thats by the by,

Heres mine for example, I charge on night rate, so once 8am hits My import is 0

When doing your total from ESBN, Its supplied in kW. but in 30 minute intervals, So when graphing, Id leave it at its original value and then just divide the sum by 2 to get your total kWh. Is that "2.5" 5kW on the esbn data?

but, you can see there is some export and import at the same time, Possibly due to the heaters (and the inverter not detecting it.)

I would also think the battery should be covering most of your load until it empties in the evening. - All fingers point to the CT - the thing that measures the grid.

@HotSwap your becoming the residential Huawei expert.. Do they use a CT or a meter?

(as an aside, Electric resistive heating is very expensive, money wise, youd be better off just using your export to cover the oil bill. Im not sure of what your day rate is, but say 30c per kwh where oil is about 10-15c/kWh depending on how good your oil boiler is!)

tommythecat

I would be returning those heaters and using your oil. Electric heaters consume a lot compared to what the oil will cost you.

But first port of call is to stop using them for now and see what/if anything changes. At least you can rule them in or out.

Rulmeq

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121856200#Comment_121856200

Wow, that graph:

That's what I was expecting to see, but on no day does the the power consumption stay flat once my generation stops - which suggests that my battery is not working (even though it is discharging, where is that going to?)

So for example here is the 26th of Feb, where the graph goes to zero when we were generating (like yours), however as soon as we stop generating at 6pm we start drawing 500w from the grid constantly. However if you look at our solar app, the battery was at 100% at 6pm and started discharging to match our usage, so the last part of the esb graph should be practically zero:

ESB for 26th Feb

https://imgur.com/SMIhTn9

App for 26th Feb (battery charge is blue, discharge is purple) and again consumption is orange/red (you can see the battery matches consumption almost perfectly until midnight, so I do not see why we were drawing anything from the grid.

https://imgur.com/16605Xi

This really sounds like the battery is not supplying the house at all, but I don't know where the charge is going, because the lights on the front of it show when it's full and when it's discharged (there are 10 green lights, equating to 10% each)

Here are the photos of the meter box as well, I'm not sure there's much to see, but you guys probably will be able to spot anything out of place (I covered the installers name, in case there's GDPR issues with it)

Rulmeq

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121856406#Comment_121856406

The oil is very inefficient, it's not even a combi-boiler (the house is 2006, so it was probably the last of its kind installed), that is next on the list of things to change, we only use the 2 as I said at the moment, and they have their own app telling me that they only use 3kWhs per day when on full time (don't have any reason to doubt them, but I guess it could be wrong). We haven't used them in the past 2 days, so will wait and see if that has any impact on the graphs.

I think the issue is somehow related to the battery, given the graphs provided above, even if we had all our electric heaters on, and they were set very high so they were on constantly, we still wouldn't be anywhere near the usage we're seeing (and as I said, we don't, we usually have 1 on while I'm wfh and it's set to 20, so it's kicking in and out - and I've set a limiter on it to max 75%, which means it's effectively a 1.2kW unit)

graememk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121856760#Comment_121856760

Touching on the oil, Combi Oil boilers arent that common, They do exist, but wouldnt be the done thing. Oil still will be cheaper as theres no night rate etc. But gonna park that for now.

CT isnt in your meterbox, must be in your consumer unit. Unless you know what you are doing, I wouldnt recommend anyone digging around in their consumer unit.

The CT is seeing something, But Its not seeing the export. Possibly on the wrong cable.

It is seeing consumption from something as the feb 26 shows some battery discharge.

Ive built my own monitoring using the openenergymonitor system and the way you calculate consumption is

consumption = Solar + grid (can be negative when exporting) - battery charge + battery discharge.

the result of this situation, It does not see the grid export, so it is assuming it is being used "somewhere" and makes the consumption graph meaningless.

You can also see import happening when your battery is charging so confirming that your inverter cannot measure the grid.

Rulmeq

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121857139#Comment_121857139

Sorry, meant condensing - it's just a plain old oil boiler (massive one, 44kw). I will replace it soon.

Thanks for the details, I will just have to suck it up and go back to the original installer (that's going to be fun, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if they did this on purpose, or actually no, given the level of incompetence they displayed throughout the 6 months it took them to get it sorted, they probably just f*cked it up like everything else.)

Thanks to everyone who provided feedback.

HotSwap

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121856200#Comment_121856200

Sorry I’m very slow with the replies these days.

it’s a CT connected to a small meter which is connected via rs485 into the inverter.

like so:

What’s the issue?

HotSwap

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121856200#Comment_121856200

Just a note, it’s definitely possible to have both in import and export within the same 30 minute period. I noticed this a lot myself when things like kettles and oven and hobs are turning on and off.

what will happen is the thermostat in the oven will click on drawing about 2000 W, which will initially be pulled from the grade for a very short amount of time until the inverter realises and ramps up the battery output to compensate at which point, the loud will no longer be pulled from the grid.

Is there something that was done as a DIY install or was a professionally installed?

The devils

PYLONTECH US2000 / US3000 / US5000 battery cable pack (Power cables + data cables) - Cables - Accessories - ESS | NKON

Could i use these cables for 2 batteries in parallel 25 mm^ - battery to battery to solis or would i be best with 50mm^ between batteries ?

Batteries would be 305ah x 16 x 2

Thanks

Ginger83

Is there a minimum amount of panels required to make a new string?

If adding panels to an existing string is there a maximum length of cable allowed between panels?

What is the maximum number of panels allowed per string?

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121867355#Comment_121867355

For the first and last question it's based on the inverter MPPT min and max voltage and the solar panel Voc voltage. Best have a read up on it online.

On the cable length, there isn't a limit per say, but the cable needs to be sized accordingly .

graememk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121858231#Comment_121858231

Issue is that Inverter isnt seeing what the grid is doing,

Smart meter is showing import while battery is charging from solar, Inverter sees export as consumption, (again, via smart meter).

The CT/meter is seeing something, but not all the house load. My guess is incorrect placement of CT.

graememk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121867669#Comment_121867669

120V is the usual startup but inverter dependant.

Cable size in a domestic setting, 4 mm2 is fine, its not like your going 50+ m, then id bump to 6.

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121867669#Comment_121867669

Thanks. I have 8 panels facing northwest but I was thinking instead of adding to them I could put a few on the shed facing southwest for better generation.

The cable length might be 25 feet though

Ginger83

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121867784#Comment_121867784

Thanks. I will look into the difference in generation but on the roof as I add panels I'm getting closer to a chimney and it also has a pole for broadband

Liam2021

Just wondering can I let the Dyness battery go below 20% SOC

con747

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121876724#Comment_121876724

Check the model number and google the specs, some allow up to 90% discharge under warranty afaik.

HotSwap

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121867774#Comment_121867774

Ideally would be placed on the meter tails. Cable between the meter and the consumer unit. Is it possible that the ct is installed on the cable running from the consumer unit and the inverter?

Rulmeq

I finally got brave enough to take the cover off the fuse box, so 3 photos of the clamp:

IMG_5830.jpg

IMG_5831.jpg

IMG_5832.jpg

I've been in contact with the original installer, but they are as bad as they were when they were installing it.

In pic one, does it look like the clamp isn't fully closed, or is that just the design of it?

In the other pics, the clamp is at the bottom of the circuit breaker, but the arrow is pointing up, is that the way it should be? That circuit breaker is for the feed from the inverter I believe (it's newly added as part of their install anyway)

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121891355#Comment_121891355

Looks like that clamp isn't closed.

It otherwise looks correct, arrow usually points towards inverter and it looks like it's on your main MCB. Try to take a clear picture of that MCB.

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121891355#Comment_121891355

That clamp is definitely not closed and that's 90%, if not 100%, of your issues there.

Except... no-one on here can tell you that touching that clamp would be a good idea. That's a hazardous environment and it's right on a breaker that does not have a consumer operable isolation method from the meter box. I'd suggest getting the installers back in to rectify matters. They should probably cable-tie it shut just to be sure.

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121891630#Comment_121891630

I agree, too much copper showing on that mains cable.