Mo money mo problems

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118119202#Comment_118119202

You're not wrong. Marriage is essentially a contract between people, what you own they own and what they own you own. That's what would happen if one partner died suddenly intestate and no children.

It's amazing how couples get tied up into knots about this. I suppose it was always thus among the rich but ordinary folk should just keep things simple and work as a team.

Princess Calla

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118122847#Comment_118122847

I was just about to say the same.

Not much advice being given at all.

bullpost

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118122965#Comment_118122965

Well there is some relevance.

In law where a couple cannot come to a decision on a split of assets , the judgement will normally dictate a 50/50 split. This implies legally there is no distinction between a married couples finances . So if someone enters a marriage with significant assets above their partners, in the event of a divorce theres no guarantee they get to keep them etc.

MrMusician18

I don't know why people are suggesting gambling as the issue, as the OP has the statements and knows where the money has gone - seemingly all on frivolous spending. In a household that has €5k in standard household expenses per month on top of someone pulling back their contribution, while at the same time increasing their spending, it's easy to see that the €10k could be gone.

As for advice for the OP, you need to have a discussion with your husband about his contribution and his spending. I won't be an easy conversation.

Thoie

Would he be willing to sit down and go through the budget with you - for example MABs have this calculator:

https://mabs.ie/money-tools/my-budget/

There are lots of other ways of budgeting too. During that conversation you could point out that if 50% of "running the house" costs €10,000 a year, and his take home pay is €15,000 a year, that leaves him with €5000 a year for discretionary spending, but that over the last x months he's spent far more than that.

Princess Calla

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118123059#Comment_118123059

No one is questioning the legality of the situation though.

Every couple will manage a situation in a way that suits their own means.

Tom, Dick and Harry telling the OP how they manage their money is of no use to the OP, the OP didn't ask for advice on how to budget or manage joint savings.

They had a system and the husband was the main enforcer of "the rules". This worked for them up until recently. The husband has now gone rogue that's the issue....how to deal with a rogue partner and if anyone experienced the same and if so how did they get back on track.

Sunny Disposition

Yeah, how other people manage their finances isn't really relevant. The system they had would work fine if there was reasonable behaviour by both.

If anything they need to decouple their finances further given the husband doesn't care about not contributing to a joint account and then cleaning it out. What a disgrace.

Cuddlesworth

You spend 5k a month in household expenses and don't have joint savings it seems.

OP earns around 60k at the moment(70% of 5k + 100) and OP's husband earns I would guess around 35-40k considering the child he is(2k a month contribution).

We all know somebody like your husband, he lives paycheck to paycheck. He views his income as a target to spend and I would guess before Covid he has been spending well over 1k a month in what he viewed as "his" disposable income. I can nearly guarantee he has zero savings and piles of useless crap around.

You honestly don't seem to be much better. You have went at least year with little to no oversight of household funds and its not occurred to you that 5k a month is a lot of money in general household expenses before you even start to take into account incidentals and savings as a couple living with kids.

You would want to start with a financial advisor, some targets for joint savings(with joint reasons to save) and some oversight of his spending. Maybe a therapist or counselor for his compulsion control.

Cuddlesworth

Just going to add, your comment about his income dropping from lack of commissions. Do you actually know how much he earned(and spent)? If you can, I would suggest getting the last 3-5 years of his bank statements and looking at his actual earnings and expenditure. He might have made a lot more then you or even he knows.

Flinty997

You have to force the issue. you have to regain control of your money. This guys behavior will bankrupt you. I would immediately set up your own account and remove his access to your money as much as possible. Then I would sit down with a spreadsheet and work out all the money, then agree a plan withhim

I would have one account for standing orders (no cards) and a different one for shopping. But you should have personal accounts for your own spending.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058216438/mo-money-mo-problems

As an aside to the OP's conversation with her husband, the OP should also double check to ensure that no bills including the mortgage bounced.

skallywag

OP, we have a similar setup where we have a joint account for the usual general household expenses, which we pay into from our own accounts each month. We then use our own accounts for 'private expenditure' if you like, where we pretty much do what we like with our own money and will buy things without the need to consult the other, etc. It is a system which works very well, as we frankly do not need to get into any discussion if one or the other wants to buy something for themselves.

If I happened to find out that huge amounts of money had gone 'missing' from the joint account for the type of personal items that you describe, then I would be absolutely furious. I would also fully expect to be on the receiving side of herself's wrath if I was to use the same account for such a purpose. This issue needs immediate attention, and I would not hold back or sugarcoat the discussion in any way.

I would not pay too much attention to the gambling angle that some have shoehorned in. You will always have the usual suspects projecting their own worst thoughts of humanity onto all and sundry. It does not take long to burn through such an amount if there are regular packages etc. coming. In fact I believe that you have even said that you can see each and every expense, and it all tallies up.

You do definitely need to have that discussion though.

Flinty997

I 'd be worried this would take a long time to resolve with the partner, the risk being this created a huge issue like wrecking your credit rating. Or causing huge debts. I would want to lock everything down to prevent this now. So that a financial issue doesn't lead to irreconcilable differences in the future.

cj maxx

Look after your own money ( I mean either open a new personal account or cut out the direct debits).

Also the gambling thing worries me. Why would you think that ? Leads me to suggest you already suspects a problem with gambling.

Princess Calla

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118134682#Comment_118134682

She doesn't suspect gambling she can see all the transactions and saw the parcels arriving. Other posters have suggested gambling.

miamee

OP it sounds like you need to radically overhaul how you both deal with money. You deposited 10k in the joint account for emergencies but didn't even notice that it was slipping away over months. Your husband, I assume, knew it was for emergencies but spent it anyway. Neither of you seem to pay too much attention to your money at all. I'd check our joint account every few days just to look over the transactions and make sure there is nothing out of the ordinary there - I have had a card skimmed in the past and another stolen so I am always on the lookout for transactions that aren't ours just in case but it's not a bad habit to have.

You do need to sit down and talk to him, develop a financial plan that you can both agree to and stick to. Ask him how he proposes to reinstate the 10k emergency stash (or however much of it he spent on gifts for himself)? If he is not able to help himself spending cash once he sees it's there then you don't put emergency cash in the joint account any more, ever. Leave enough to cover your bills and expenditure with an agreed amount exta for 'sundries' (going for lunch/dinner, a magazine, a book, few drinks, whatever). And you control the savings even if you both contribute to it.

Flinty997

Most online accounts can have notifications if the account falls below a certain level. I would enable these going forward so you get warnings if the money in a account is low. Though if you just have one account with a big balance this is harder to manager. Different accounts for different things, with lower balances are much easer to manage and track.

fits

It’s also very risky to keep a large amount in a current account anyway. I’d keep it to minimum required for month and the rest on deposit out of reach.

Neyite

While this involves a very large sum, the money isn't the crux of the issue - the trust and agreed behaviour regarding shared finances IS the important thing here.

Like others have said, every couple has their way of doing things. Your husband wanted expenses split 50/50 and you did that - at cost to yourself in circumstances where he had the money but chose not to share it proportionally, and you had it tight.

Now the tables have turned and hey, so have his rules apparently.🙄 Which he knows was wrong, otherwise he'd have told you he was using the shared account. He owes you 10k, by his own rules, right? So, work out a repayment plan, do an audit of your finances and make sure that he's paying exactly 50% +the repayment and keep anything that isn't a shared household expense in an account only you can access.

The other alternative is to do a full review/audit of your shared finances, stick to the 50/50 but also unfortunately you would need to write off the 10k and going forward if you ever have savings, lodge it to an account only you can access.

Emotionally I don't know though how you'd move on from this. It is at it's essence showing you that when it comes to finances, he's happy to shaft you when he's got money and also shaft you when you have money - and I don't think that even if it was a situation that he subsequently fixed, that I'd be able to have any respect for him any more - especially if he doubled down on belligerence and selfishness when caught. You'll may see now that the scales have fallen a bit that he is selfish in other ways - so it sounds like you've some thinking to do, unless he's mortified, apologetic, remorseful and will do anything to reinstate your trust in him...

Flinty997

I would ask him the question. Where do we do from where, financially obviously, but the rest of it as well.

JeffKenna

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118122544#Comment_118122544

This is the only solution.

RojaStar

I agree that the financial arrangements are not the issue here. This is a massive breach of trust and frankly a giant fcuk you to the OP on the part of her husband. Whether that was intentional or not, it's exactly what he has done. I personally would really struggle to get past this and sitting down to make a financial plan (other than cutting him off immediately) would be a lot lower on my agenda than getting absolutely furious with him and demanding an explanation. He is behaving like an entitled child, particularly as it's quite clear he wouldn't be facilitating the reverse situation.

How is your marriage otherwise OP? The reason I ask is that I'd be surprised if this was the only area of concern when it comes to respect and communication. He is taking you, your marriage and your finances for granted and he needs a MAJOR wake up call.

I'm starting to think I am mad.

Wife and I both earn similar, me a bit more, but I pay all the bills, mortgage etc. She has a significant savings account but if we go anywhere away she usually pays for it, but we dont do a joint savings or anything.

On your situation OP, it is not a money issue, it seems like a control issue. The money, the need to control what was put in and the need to use " his or yours" etc seems like its that issue. I would say have a very frank and open discussion with him, maybe even one of the spending apps like revoute.