Appeal Penalty Points

Wed12

Hi, looking for opinions/help please. Three months ago I was driving on a road which had roadworks on it. I wasn't sure exactly where they were and its a long road. As I was driving I came up to a stopped truck on the road which was slightly in to the left, and I stopped. It was a large transport/courier truck. The car behind me started beeping at me so I looked at the truck and thought it must be parked/delivering something off and went to overtake it. When I was passing it I noticed the flag man in on the left hand side in front of the truck, he wasn't visible from where I was behind the truck but his sign was on stop. The car that had beeped me was following me also, and a motorbike came along a couple of minutes later and did the same, also not seeing the flag man. I pulled in infront of the truck as soon as I realised the flag man was there. The car that followed me also pulled in. We didn't go past the roadworks until the next flag man turned his sign to go. A couple of hours later the gardai rang me and said I'd been reported and would I come down to make a voluntary statement to give them my side of the story or I'd automatically get penalty points and a fine. So I made a statement and explained what happened. The site foreman told the gardai there was no truck there, total lie!! So it was his word against mine, I asked the garda i to check for CCTV from the petrol station we had been beside but he said it wouldn't show the road, and had no interest in checking the shops CCTV across the road. I think its unfair as I did stop as soon as I saw the flag man and didn't pass the roadworks, the flagman was not visible from where I was stopped. I didn't purposely ignore the flagman. However the garda rang me the other day and said his superintendent has given me two penalty points and a E80 fine. Is this worth fighting via an appleal or court? Its the foreman's word against mine. Thanks!

Some paragraphs would be useful.

What is the offence of which you are accused? These are the only ones which attract 2 points and an €80 fine, I don't see anything suitable. Possibly the last one?

Using a vehicle with defective or worn tyres 

Learner permit holder driving unaccompanied by qualified person 

Failure to comply with mandatory traffic signs at junctions 

Failure to obey traffic rules at railway level crossing 

Driving a vehicle on a motorway against the flow of traffic  

Failure to stop for school warden sign 

Failure to stop when so required by a member of the Garda Síochána  

Failure to yield 

Driving without reasonable consideration  *

There's no legal definition of reasonable consideration.

SeeMoreBut

How did the Garda get your number?

LillySV

I had a Garda accuse me of driving through a red light before , even though it was yellow when I went through and had video evidence of it being yellow.. i went home to check and was clearly yellow… rang to try appeal it and was told that the only way to appeal is court!!! So pointless …. Pay a solicitor to represent me in court or just take the smaller penalty and fine …… took the later obviously … guard was only a bastard … as I’d say 98% of them are now….

Wed12

I haven’t got the penalty points notice in the post yet but the Garda mentioned the points would be for careless driving.

Apologies about the absence of paragraphs!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118047638#Comment_118047638

Wed12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118049757#Comment_118049757

The foreman gave him my reg plate number

Darc19

This is total and utter bullsh1t.

And some eejits will think it's true.

The facelift didn't get rid of the troll

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118051097#Comment_118051097

Careless Driving is a serious offence, it is a mandatory court appearance offence, it usually involves a driving ban on conviction and doesn't attract penalty points.

If any of it is true.

GM228

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118051279#Comment_118051279

Side note, you are correct that it is indeed a mandatory court appearance, it isn't a fixed charge penalty point offence, but, does attract 5 penalty points upon conviction.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118051648#Comment_118051648

Ah, you're right. It's on the RSA list as "Driver found to be driving carelessly"

SeeMoreBut

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118051110#Comment_118051110

Phone number

Wed12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118054086#Comment_118054086

I’m sure the guards can look up driver details on their system if they have the reg plate

Wed12

Still waiting for fixed penalty notice in the post (ten days since I was told they were being applied) so will clarify the wording of what they are for when I get the notice

Squatman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118049815#Comment_118049815

gombeen. why would you need a solicitor if you had video footage?

Richmond Ultra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118051279#Comment_118051279

It's probably a 51a ticket

LillySV

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118074116#Comment_118074116

To fight my case … I have no legal experience and wouldn’t be entering a court room to risk getting double the amount of points cause I’m shite at representing myself . They could say that even though it’s yellow.. they felt I still had time to stop for all I know… I wouldn’t be relying on the legal establishment siding with me over a cop tbh

Squatman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118074953#Comment_118074953

terrible logic to be fair. you either broke the red or you didnt. you say you didnt. You say you have evidence of that. you then accepted that you did infact break the red. in a case like this a visit to the station, and the garda that issued the points, or the super would be able to review and quash the points. ( this certainly was the case)

LillySV

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118079599#Comment_118079599

No I didn’t break them, it was gone yellow though … in regards to goin down to station … afraid that’s not how it’s done anymore … now your up on pulse fairly quickly and they’re doing nothing for ya … follow the official rule … appeal in court. There was afew cops got in trouble for removing offences /points previously … so you not goin to get many of them sticking their neck out for you now

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.thejournal.ie/penalty-points-cancelled-1897905-Jan2015/%3famp=1

Squatman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118080665#Comment_118080665

maybe, but the superintendent could certainly make a recommendation based off the evidence. seems from everything that you are saying, it was very naive of you to admit to an offence that you did not commit. would you be willing to take some of my penalty points too?

LillySV

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118084019#Comment_118084019

I don’t think I’m too naive assuming that a judge will pick a guards word over me… anyways I have them now so that’s that. Best of luck to ya if u fond of taking on the guards … although I’d wonder how you have penalty points to take since you so tough . Anyways over and out , have a good life

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118080665#Comment_118080665

Yellow is Stop, isn't it? Is it the same in Ireland, through yellow is generally the same as through red?

magicbastarder

yellow is stop, unless it is dangerous to do so. red is stop.

LillySV

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118085572#Comment_118085572

It’s only stop if it’s safe to do so … if you are already committed to going through the lights and it’s safer to do so, then continue

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118085723#Comment_118085723

This is what I think, thanks!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118085729#Comment_118085729

This is different. At Italy this would be wrong (but no one cares 😉)

LillySV

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118085756#Comment_118085756

Well what I said is more or less what magicbastarder said … I hadn’t actually seen his comment when posting .. if I had I would’ve said “like this “ 😃. Anyways I wasn’t going to risk going to court to represent myself or risk getting double the amount of points on the off chance a judge will agree with me … judge could easily have said i had time to stop and throw the book at me … some will chance it , go to court and get it thrown out..: others will chance it and loose ..:.I didn’t risk It… It’s the third set of points I’ve got since points introduced here so couldn’t exactly present myself to the judge and say I’m a safe law abiding citizen (before you ask , the other points are now gone and we’re for clear speeding offences )