Pensions Age to ..... 72 !?

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118150011#Comment_118150011

People are going to have to get used to - and prepare for - moving to lower responsibility/lower pressure jobs toward the end of their careers. Everything has been structured with the idea of you retiring from the top, and final salary pensions in the public sector (now gone for new entrants) were a clear part of this.

When pensions came in, the age was 70 and the average health of someone at 70 was far, far worse than the health of someone at that age now. But you didn't continue doing the same job all the way to the end.

I already know of plenty of cases already of people who were perfectly capable of doing their current job when promoted to it; but are absolutely lost / failing in it by their late 50s due to early decline.

Problem is there's plenty of people with mortgages going at the full repayment rate till 65/66 already, and without significant inflation those payments will become unserviceable if they drop to lower paid employment towards the end.

Mad_maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118149356#Comment_118149356

My mother saves a hundred quid per week on the state pension, often more than a hundred

Strumms

It’s going to get like the US so. Where you go into a supermarket and see 70 plus year olds stacking shelves and working the checkouts... why ? because they have to.

their quality of life being abused having paid in all their lives, just so we and they can support the new arrivals? Fûck that.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118151934#Comment_118151934

The "new arrivals" are going to be the ones paying the tax to pay those pensions.

Mad_maxx

My post was deleted?

Stovepipe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118149835#Comment_118149835

No. It was posted on several threads during the time of the water protests and it was shown that local councils were empowered to divert monies from the accumulated road tax in each county instead of passing it directly back to central Govt. It saved the bother of having to ask for it back,administratively,for each Council. So,the councils embraced it enthusiastically and instead of having lads going around filling potholes, they went around patching the many leaks in the pipe network. As long as each council passed back a certain amount, they could retain an amount proportionate to the size of their population. The upside for councils was that they could address genuine water quality issues and get money from Europe for doing so and stop wasting money on pothole filling to humour county councillors. That was the whole point of paying your road tax in your county of residence;the money had an effect ,locally, instead of the perception that it was ringfenced for big urban areas. I'm not making this up out of my head.Murphy and others pointed it out at the time and he was laughed at until the relevant by-laws were pointed out.

Stovepipe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118150769#Comment_118150769

Well done,her, but that money is simply at rest for now and will be spent in future so it will be hit by VAT at some point so some of it will go back to the coffers in time. Pensions are not a one-way street. I always find it incredible that you can contribute a great many taxes to the State for 40 years and more yet when you want 13 grand a year back and usually live for about 20 years after retirement, the state reacts as if you are stealing from their pockets.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118153804#Comment_118153804

well said, and a good percentage of that 13,000 goes back into the state coffers via VAT you pay on purchases, around 23%...give or take.

Mad_maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118153804#Comment_118153804

Most people collect far more than they put in

c.p.w.g.w

How does the government dipping into private pensions actually work in real terms?

Stovepipe

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118153939#Comment_118153939

By putting duty or a percentage when you want to draw it. Or by reducing the untaxed amount you can take out. These are the little things you have to pay attention to when the Minister is reading out the Budget and after droning on for a few hours, slips it in that "pension duty has gone up from 0.5% to 0.75%". No-one notices until they read the small print and realise that the Minister has just stung the pension holder for a few hundred a year more. His pension is safe and secure but yours has just been "raided" and there's nothing you can do about it.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058212191/pensions-age-to-72

It's Ireland, what would you expect. Worlds highest inheritance taxes, one of the highest CGTs in existance. DIRT - must be the worlds highest because no one else is stupid enough to have one. Deemed disposal of ETFs so they can get their hands on CG you haven't realised. Does any other country have that one? VRT... levies on all forms of insurance that already cop a massive 23% VAT.

One day this country might wake up and ask itself why it has one of the least efficient and highest paid civil services on the planet, besides the cute answer that if it didn't, the taxes might need to be reduced or some even done away with.

Due to just the health issues associated with aging, 72 is disgusting.

Give the civil service a pay rise and then extend the pension age. The neck. Glad I decided to emigrate.

Strumms

It’s turning into an even more dangerous, unfair, unhealthy, divisive, unsafe, malevolent kip of a place to live...

where rewards and handouts are free and plentiful for those not or whom haven’t contributed... cash, property, healthcare etc... but those who try get off their holes, sacrifice to make something of themselves are denied help, support and opportunities at every fûcking turn, this pension idea should be proof 100%...yet are expected to fund that help for others out of their own sweat and hard work... this country is a dump.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118149122#Comment_118149122

again, it truly is down to embracing public debt, its not as dangerous as we think it is, we should be trying to use some of this public debt(money), and literally just give it to citizens to spend, it worked very well in relation to pandemic payments

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118155830#Comment_118155830

Just wait for the climate emergency taxes to hit. Their recently announced plan of action is without exageration, terrifying. It includes stuff like 1.5 Gw of solar, which simply is not economically viable in such a cloudy country, where only 14% of the hours in a year of actual sunshine. The only way that solar will be built is with substantial subsidies. There have been several chancers already lobbying the government for subsidies so they could go ahead and build their money printing machines driven off the taxpayers purse, while they retire to the Cayman islands, like a large number of the Scottish and UK wind farm owners. Currently 10% of gov't revenue comes from taxes and charges on ICE. They have been offering subsidies - pension money - to get people to buy EV's. Every EV not only costs the gov't, it elimates part of the 10% money generator. Then ther's the subsidy to install a charging point, toll exemptions, negligable registration fees. Im semi suprised it's only 72.

Then you have the push to retrofit and upgrade buildings and a massive big stick will be required to disuade people from cheap kerrosene and get them to put in very expensive heat pumps - €25,000? - no bother, lucky I don't already have a mortgage to pay, don't need to buy an expensive EV due to 'incentives', and have several times that amount just lying around not already paying carbon taxes, so even though the break even is several decades away (if it doesn't need repairs) sign me up. /s

The whole response to the 'climate emergency' will be so expensive that the pension will probably have to be eliminated entirely - of course you don't actually, being a bunch of cute hoors, you just raise the age to 84.

jmreire

I'm not sure where this will end up. On the one hand we have the plan to raise the pension age, and even to support the present system, we need an ever growing increase in the Nrs working. And on the other hand we have the situation of AI and automation reducing the nr of available jobs......

You're not going too get much work out of a person in their 70s. Physical work, forget it. Office work? Not even, rsi will be widespread. Remember Office work for previous generations involved lots of walking around searching for Physical files, going to the fax etc. Today it's click click click.

Decades of that all day long will ruin your wrists, forearms, neck and back too.

I suspect you'll end up with loads on the dole and of those who still have mortgages some will work, others will effectively sell to the bank to stay In their homes.

There will of course be some who can and will work on and enjoy it. Just like today.

For most it's a massive smack in the face and backwards step

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118149109#Comment_118149109

Empty vessels shouting racism at every chance

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118149209#Comment_118149209

Correct 👍

Over in the UK

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/state-pension-age-rise-conservatives-think-tank-centre-social-justice-a9064071.html?amp

nobody is really thinking this through..workplace accidents will rise,nobody will want an older worker etc etc

Strumms

A lot of people plus 65 will end up ‘going sick’ ... more pressure on younger colleagues and the business financially... it’s a boneheaded move...

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118158311#Comment_118158311

I hope that you are right.....do you have any areas in mind?? Now while its not going to happen overnight, we are in the dying days of vehicle's needing drivers. All new EVS are automatic transmissions, and HGV have been heading for automatic transmission for a long time now. This is all leading to driverless transportation. All computer controlled, if you think that's a crazy idea, just think how many people sit into their cars each day and switch on their SatNavs....thousands of them, and they are all working at the same time. So its not such a big step to have them actually drive the car to its destination. When they can fly drones many thousands of miles away from their base, and control them, putting the same technology into vehicles is the logical next move. Just think how many jobs will that eliminate? And that's just one area. Even in the supermarkets now, its hard to find one that does not have several self-service checkouts in operation. Lots of jobs going to be lost, I think anyway.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118150769#Comment_118150769

One of the lucky ones so, good luck to her. A friend of mine, living solely on his pension, is finding it hard going. He lives 15 miles away from the nearest town / city, and neither smokes, drinks or gambles. His one extravagance is his car and this he needs as he lives in a rural area, 15 miles out from the nearest city, and no public service. I know him very well, and when he says that he is now counting the pennies, I believe him absolutely. Considering all the price increases in recent times, he is really worried as to how he will get on during the winter, once these price rises filter into the system. He will not be the only one either.

When did pension age first hit 65 and what was the average lifespan then, what was the typical health of an average 65 year old?

Seems only obvious that if longevity and health improve then you have to allow for a simple recalibration every now and again in age-related benefits

Whats the problem folks?

Strumms

Problem is people should be enabled to enjoy their lives at that point free of the requirement to have to go to work and having paid in, should be of the ability to get something back at 65...

rest, a pension and absolute enjoyment of life... anything getting in the way of that is bolloçksology.

Why 65?

You've avoided the question, and the point?

Why not 40, so?

touts

I was young enough (late 20s) in the last recession to realise that there will be a couple of more before I hit retirement and they will screw me badly each time. So I have planned my retirement on the idea that since I'm stupid enough to have a private pension I won't get any state pension. If I'm wrong then it will be a bonus. But I upped my contributions to allow for no state support at all. It's a pain but it's the smart thing to do. I'm going to retire at 65 and the state can't do a thing to stop me.

jmreire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118159149#Comment_118159149

Thats the way anyone starting out now should plan, base it on the fact that by the time you will retire, there will only be the most basic of pensions available. ( if at all !! )

Some people live to 120 but I`d bet they are useless to the workforce the last 50 years of their life.

UK but relevant:

"About two-thirds of men and three-quarters of women now reach the age of 75, according to the ONS

https://www.theguardian.com/money/poll/2011/oct/20/pension-still-worth-it

Remember life expectancy is an average. We live longer but because of medical intervention. Your last few years can involve cancer treatment. Cancer is the leading cause of death.

https://www.joe.ie/news/irelands-leading-causes-death-revealed-646264#:~:text=The%20leading%20cause%20of%20death,of%20all%20deaths%20in%20Ireland.

It actually doesnt matter a bit what any of us think. The reality is you cannot get blood from a stone and it`ll cost in unemployment payments or in a pension. With jobs for life a complete thing of the past and contract after contract for many people you can expect a very high unemployment rate for those in their 70s. Ageism is a well known thing when it comes to employment. People also generally do not want to work into their 70s.

The labour force participation decreases and unemployment increases the older you get after a peak in the 35-44yr old age group in men and the 24-35yr old age group in women (likely due to child rearing but it never recovers).

It is all in here for those interested https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-wamii/womenandmeninireland2016/employment/

Great recipe for workplace productivity. I can imagine all the workplace claims for bad backs etc. Nobody will want to touch a 70yr old.