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2022 what small executive car?

  • 27-09-2021 9:58am
    Registered Users Posts: 363 ✭✭ PN14

    Current company car is up for change in 2022. Currently in a 508 previous to that had a mazda 6. Looking for where to go next.

    Mileage of approx 40,000km per year. Can change up or down from 30-50k per year depending on site locations etc. Will be on higher end of range for next 12 months due to couple of sites in Dublin & Drogheda so plenty of longer motorway stuff currently. Longest one way trip at the moment is 325kms.

    Looking at budget of around €50k mark. Can be a little higher or lower depending on lease deals etc but €50k new price is probably where its at.

    Current Options diesel -- A4, 320D another 508 GT model this time (current is mid range allure). No interest in cross overs. Left side choice completely a ford ranger wildtrack pickup (would suit on site works a bit and suit lifestyle outside of work but its 15 years since i drove pickups and wouldn't fancy spending 6hrs in one of those older ones but I assume newer ones are more comfortable)

    Was half thinking full EV. Like the ionic 5 had a drive in one last week nice car. Long range one worst case would get me up to site without charging even allowing for 120km cold winters day driving (I dont see myself sitting at 100kms on the motorway to conserve battery not worth that). I will have access to charging on site during the day and no issue with charging at home.

    1st world problems really any thoughts on above or anything else to add to list. With lead times etc need to be making a call on this in next few weeks.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,536 ✭✭✭ Leonard Hofstadter

    Stick with diesel. Not many people who buy diesels need one strictly speaking, but your usage is perfect for one really. No need to worry about plugging in or running out of range, or any of that sort of hassle either. Plus you'll do 1000 - 1100 km on a tank, you'll be waiting a very long time before an EV can give you that sort of convenience. With an EV you've to be worrying about slow chargers and fast chargers, and then they only do their maximum charging rate between 10 and 80% anyway. So when you hear companies saying that you can add 100 km in 10 minutes, that's only for 70% of the battery. And the WLTP figures are hopelessly optimistic, granted fuel consumption figures have been overly optimistic for ICE for a long, long time, but obviously less range than advertised in a petrol or diesel is nowhere near as much hassle as it is in an EV.

    If you've got one way trips of over 320 km, you simply won't be able to go there and back in an EV without finding somewhere to pull in - do you really want to be wasting another 60 minutes of your time when you've such a long journey, when a diesel gives you 1000 - 1100 km in five minutes?

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,686 ✭✭✭ Theboinkmaster

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,124 ✭✭✭ carsfan2

    Audi A4 is very old design now. There’s a new Mercedes C class coming I think which is bound to be a comfortable cruiser.

    bmw 320d would be a good choice too.

    with your mileage I’m not convinced electric wouldn’t require too many compromises and occasional inconvenience with our charging network although I’m sure some ev people will dispute this.

  • Registered Users Posts: 50,125 ✭✭✭✭ bazz26

    Leftfield option - Alfa Romeo Giulia?

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,648 ✭✭✭ maddness

    320d all day.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 742 ✭✭✭ Zurbaran

    I’d consider the Lexus ES. Will match the diesels mpg whilst being smoother and quieter.

    Depends on if you value sporty over comfort really. If it’s sporty you won’t go wrong with the 320d but you will get a harder ride than the Peugeot you have.

  • Registered Users Posts: 50,125 ✭✭✭✭ bazz26

    The company cannot claim VAT back on petrol however.

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,667 ✭✭✭ selectamatic

    Isn't the 3 series getting a facelift in 2023?

  • Registered Users Posts: 50,125 ✭✭✭✭ bazz26

    Around this time next year.

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,536 ✭✭✭ Leonard Hofstadter

    SOP for the LCI is in July 2022. I'd get a pre-facelift, they're putting in the dual curved screen nonsense once LCI is introduced, and getting rid of the buttons for the radio and climate controls, so as well as having a tackier looking interior, it's not going to be as user-friendly as the current one.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 12,387 ✭✭✭✭ fits

    Would you have dedicated ev chargers at work? If not I’d probably stick with diesel.

    I have an Id.3. Tour. Drove 270 km yesterday and used 60% of battery capacity mostly motorway at 120. That probably has the longest range of any of the mainstream EVs at the moment. The Kia ev6 and ioniq5 worth a look for fast charging capabilities but they are big cars so I think range would be a bit less. I haven’t had to use public charging yet in 6 weeks of ev driving but I don’t think I’d like to be relying on it regularly at the moment anyway.

    Post edited by fits on

  • Registered Users Posts: 363 ✭✭ PN14

    Thanks guys. Decisions decisions

    Current 508 easily over 1000kms per tank on the motorway. Lovely car, comfortable, quiet, a bit underpowered on B roads but on National routes no issue with overtaking etc. Well speced and they do look well. Would honestly be happy enough in one for the next 3 years just maybe fancy a change. Might get tired of the same place after 6 years.

    Take your points on the EV. Nice idea especially with 0 BIK next year and reduced amounts after that. The longer spin at over 300kms one way do probably rule it out though. Currently over 6 hrs round trip stopping for another hr would add to what is already a long day. It would require a stop as the charging on site would be granny cable effort. I might enquire about a tesla 3 SR+ see where it comes in at budget wise. Not overly gone in them but I'm sure the acceleration would be lovely!! and the longer range even on the SR model would be good. Any idea how they hold up longer term build quality wise over poor rural roads. Still clock up plenty of milage on poor rural roads.

    Guilia really lovely externally but internal starting to look a bit dated now. Similar with jag XE. Not sure how they'd stack up on lease either as resale does affect cost

    Already have an A4 on fleet here its an Audi lovely nothing at all wrong with it just when you start trying to add some of the spec items my 508 currently has it gets beyond budget real quick.

    I haven't actually taken a look at the 320 yet must try and get a test in one.

    Other one I looked at was the VW Arteon. Similar fastback to the 508 and look well on the road particularly from rear.

    A lot might come down to availability in the new year and what can be got.

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,667 ✭✭✭ selectamatic

    Would moving to a slightly smaller segment be a runner? A well spec'd dsg Seat Leon st 2.0tdi 150 would make a fine motorway car although comfort might be a bit less than the 508.

  • Registered Users Posts: 50,125 ✭✭✭✭ bazz26

    What about a Volvo v60? The S60 saloon isn't available in diesel anymore but the v60 estate is still sold in diesel.

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,418 ✭✭✭ Wildly Boaring

    Ah I have one.

    Not in the same league as a 3 series or an A4.

    508 be bigger and longer wheel base so comfier on motorway.

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,364 ✭✭✭ California Dreamer

    You really need to do and drive a ranger. Totally different to what pick ups were 15 years ago. I had one for a weekend and when I went back into my X5 I missed it. Perhaps the Skoda Kodiaq as well?

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,028 ✭✭✭ Lantus

    Take a look at a well speccd skoda superb. A solid motorway cruiser. The 2l tdi 150hp dsg l&k is 50k.

  • Registered Users Posts: 363 ✭✭ PN14

    Thanks guys

    Dont think I'd go back in segment really, driven a few base model leons as courtesy car while 508 was being serviced and they're not in the same league at all, unless it was a golf GTD that might tempt me but for the bones of 50k its still a golf.

    Funny enough always wanted a superb, OH had a few octavias and we always had planned to upgrade to superb at one stage. Kind of went out of the head really seen a few sportline ones on the road lately, red or blue with black lettering, they looked well. I must get a look at one up close.

    I thought all volvos were gone from Diesel. Dont really need an estate to be honest. Needs to be diesel to claim back vat through company as noted above earlier or electric. No vat reclaim on petrol so rules out Volvo, toyota, lexus etc or most of the petrol hybrid stuff.

    Bit of homework for weekend so -- get a closer look/drive in a ranger, superb & 320d

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,606 ✭✭✭✭ R.O.R

    In that segment, there's very little to touch the 3 Series at the moment. A4 is old hat and on a lease is a good bit more than the equivalent 3 Series, due to different manufacturer supports.

    Would you be able to persuade them to allow a 5 Series, or would that be off the cards due to the optics of it? 520d SE Auto coming in about €60 a month less than a 320d M-Sport over 3 years / 120k. 520d would be the more comfortable cruiser, 320d M-Sport a better car to drive on the twisty's, better looking and newer tech, but when you are trunching up and down a Motorway the handling through bends isn't really that important. 520d SE would have a much more compliant ride as well.

    I was getting 1000 - 1100km from a full tank of diesel on my 318d earlier in the year - pretty much all Motorway and R-Road driving, and it's not a big tank - 55l I think. I know Peugeot used to have bigger tanks than everyone else on the 407, but not sure about newer stuff.

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,070 ✭✭✭ Stallingrad

    Ranger only really makes sense if you need that level of utility. As mentioned above they drive really well (for a truck with leaf springs) but are not in the same league as a premium saloon for comfort or refinement. Not sure I would want to do 40k a year on one.

    Superb and 3 series are both great cars, hard to see anyone being disappointed with either. As ROR says above though, why buy a 320D if a 520D is within reach?

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,686 ✭✭✭ Theboinkmaster

    I agree nothing is close to the 320d in this segment.

    the G20 is a massive improvement over the old model - interior especially is really high quality and absolutely gorgeous. It's almost the same as a 8 series or X5, just smaller but a lot of the components are the exact same.

    I'd go 3 series all day long.

  • Registered Users Posts: 363 ✭✭ PN14

    Thanks for input guys

    Optics might affect the 5 series as a choice but at the end of the day the cost is what will count. Nothing lost by asking anyway!

    I think max i've put in the 508 was around 54ltrs and that was with the reserve well drained so I guess similar to the 318d 50ltr tank with a few reserve ltrs.

    Ranger would suit life outside of work more than the work part. I know its not a premium saloon and wouldn't expect it to be. If the mileage was lower i'd be seriously tempted just with way vehicles are going it might be the last chance to have an old school diesel 4x4.

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,418 ✭✭✭ Wildly Boaring

    Yeah 3 series.

    Pick-ups are for farmers and builders.

    The ranger is better than others. Still corners worse than a Kuga which is that bad in bends I sold ours after 10 months.

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,536 ✭✭✭ Leonard Hofstadter

    Just to note on the G20 3 series, if you get an SE, the standard tank is a mere 40 litres on the diesel, that would drive me crazy. Fortunately, there is an optional 59 litre tank, and the Sport models upwards come with a proper sized fuel tank.

    The G20 is a massive improvement inside compared to the previous generation 3 series, it's also supposed to be a big improvement on the driving front as well and more like the BMWs of old.

  • Registered Users Posts: 8 Gatorcar

    Surprised no one has mentioned as Tesla model 3, cheaper fuel and decent range

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,536 ✭✭✭ Leonard Hofstadter

    That's because the rest of us have taste, also did you read the OP? He or she needs range and convenience, something fridge freezers on wheels, sorry I mean EVs, don't have.

    Even if they did have the range and charging/filling times of ICE (which of course they don't), what good is that when the Government is telling us that for the next 3-4 years, we may have electricity blackouts because we don't have the capacity? That's not something that will ever be a problem if one sticks with good old fashioned petrol (or diesel). Personal dislike of EVs aside, it is hardly an incentive to buy an EV if our grid cannot cope with the demand that is already, and yet Eamon Ryan thinks we should buy more of them. Remember this is the clown that told us in 2008 to ditch our petrol cars for diesels - and we all know how that's gone. Ironically, modern diesels are actually clean but now people want to ban them.

    Teslas have shocking build quality and the functionality is so heavily compromised in the real world; for example, to operate some of the windscreen wiper settings, you have to use the touchscreen. What a ridiculous idea for something as important as that.

    Post edited by Leonard Hofstadter on

  • Registered Users Posts: 363 ✭✭ PN14

    Funny enough its a construction company i work for and the lifestyle outside of work is actually a farm part-time tipping around for the old fellow at weekends !!! so I tick both boxes. Not that my work requires a pickup but would be handy on the farm for access and bit of towing every now and then.

    Actually took one for a spin yesterday -- wildtrack 2.o bi turbo automatic. As noted above by others some difference from the last pickup I drove. I was concerned about motorway hauling on it however on the spin yesterday on a national primary and some backroads I actually think the motorway national primary roads would be no bother at all fair degree of comfort in in. It is actually the more local roads i think would be the issue, as you noted, cornering is still like a barge compared to executive saloon and I found the pickup on power out of slow corners is ponderous enough compared to the car, not sure if thats just the auto box or engine. Now I would accept that this is the case with that type of vehicle just not sure if after the quick drive yesterday its something i could live with. Might slow me down a bit but you'd definitely have to adapt your driving to one.

    Must try and get a decent look at the 3 series over the next week or so. Will all eventually come down to the figures & maybe availability in the new year. Guy we deal with is actually off for a few weeks so wont know pricing for a bit.

    Is there a new C class on way? Any thoughts on one of these saw a picture on the inside of a new model and looks pretty cool

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,418 ✭✭✭ Wildly Boaring

    I work for a construction company myself but my car carries boots, hiviz, coats and helmet.

    Never been off-road bar a couple roughish access roads.

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,070 ✭✭✭ Stallingrad

    New C-Class has just been launched. You know its going to be good, though some reviews suggest the diesel engines are a bit sub par. Interior is down to personal taste, whether you don't mind not having physical buttons for things. The 3 series is better resolved in this respect, and probably the last 3 series to get buttons for all the important stuff.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,939 ✭✭✭✭ Cyrus

    i wouldnt discount the Ioniq on the basis of a few misinformed ramblings, have a look at some real world range tests (youtube is great for them) and see what you could expect from one, access to granny charging while you are on site would also be a help, youll get 2kw an hour so if you are there 5-6 hours that is 10-12kw which could well be the difference between needing a charge on the way home or not.

    Contrary to misinformed belief if you do stop to fast charge (assuming it wont be a full recharge as you wont need it) it will be a 15-20 min stop, not an hour.

    i currently have a q5 diesel as my etron is in for some warranty work, i personally wouldnt wish it on anyone, awful engine.