Retention or Exempt- garage door to window.

Patricia Meath

Hi, my father has a holiday home in South of Ireland. It's a bungalow in rural area. Built in 2002, the original plan was to have an up and over garage door at LHS of front of house. However this was changed to a window & room was subsequently used as an extra bedroom. Father now wishes to sell & wondering if he needs to apply for retention of this window or could it be considered exempt? County council planning offices not that helpful as minimal staff available.

doug82

Was the change made at the time of construction or subsequently?

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058210477/retention-or-exempt-garage-door-to-window

Planning department won’t help you either as they have to be impartial and will tell you to employ an agent.

whether it was exempt or not will come down to

1. was it converted at the time of construction of the original house.
2. was it converted afterwards?
3. did the parent planning de-exempt the exemptions?
4. is it within the area allowed for exemption?

Patricia Meath

Doug82- it was done at the time of construction- up and over garage door was never put in.

Patricia Meath

Gumbo converted at the time. Don't have copy of PP to hand. Am concerned that as it is at front of house , it may need retention. Rural setting on half an acre.

maestroamado

I will tell you what happened in a local case.... About 5 years ago guy decides to convert garage to room in exactly the same circumstances... They then decide to move and sell the house...

Then about 6 months ago the house goes for sale again and this time the selled needs to apply for retention before they can sell the house...

Also try looking to se if the original planning is approval is available on-line but likely a bit early for this... All of these files are available for viewing free of charge at the local planning office by appointment and you can copy what you need...

I would be inclined to put it on the market and say nothing...

wildwillow

Was the change of use and garage door replacement done at the planning stage and included in the permission.

If not you need to apply for retention to comply, any buyer will want a certificate of compliance. Change of front facade is enough to need retention.

Because the garage is attached to the house, there will probably be no extra levy to pay for the additional bedroom, as it would have been factored into the original planning.

It is best to have everything in order before putting house on the market as otherwise you may lose a sale while purchaser waits for planning.

aFlabbyPanda

We had this recently with a house we bought. The was a detached garage (roller door, with windows & side entrance) on the property but questions arose if it was compliant or not. It turned out that there was planning permission for a garage but the one they built was bigger.

It didn't present a problem for us however the advice we had from the engineers at the time was to apply for retention if we were to resell.

Patricia Meath

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117952969#Comment_117952969

Cheers maestroamado

Interesting idea.

Patricia Meath

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117953080#Comment_117953080

Thanks aFlabbyPanda. This garage was a part of the house- shared the same roof etc. Looks like we may need to apply for retention although easier option would be an Exemption.

Patricia Meath

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117952976#Comment_117952976

Thank you wildwillow. Afaik permission was granted for up 'n over type garage door but a window was put in instead and room became a bedroom. I guess I'll need to locate the original PP. Looking at how to apply for retention & all the paperwork involved scares the bejaysus out of me- was hoping I could get this done myself rather than spending money on an expert.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117952908#Comment_117952908

If it was done as part of the original construction then its not a conversion and therefore not exempt. If it was done afterward it might have been exempt.

Options are now, apply for retention. Or lie and say it was converted afterwards.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117952976#Comment_117952976

Not quite right. Conversation after construction is permitted for a garage to the side of, and attached to a house. In that case you can change a garage door for a suitable window.

muffler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117953472#Comment_117953472

If the bedroom had have been shown on the initial planning application then there wouldnt be an issue. Likewise, and as stated by others, if the approved garage had been converted after the house was built then there would not be an issue. As mentioned above also the way it was done would not leave the conversion exempt.

You have 2 options. You can apply for retention permission which should be straight forward. In 40+ years in submitting retention applications for extensions, converted garages, converted attics etc etc I have never encountered a problem. The other thing is that no one knows when the garage was converted. Whoever is going to provide you with an exemption cert will have to take your word as to when this was done. Im not encouraging that but it has worked in the past for others.

If you really want to play safe then just apply for the retention.

Patricia Meath

Thanks Muffler. Need to go see the PP which is in solicitor's office to get clearer picture. Considering the floor of the 'garage' is level with rest of the house, I am guessing that the plans showed garage with an up 'n over door to the front. Hopefully Dad will now tell me that he converted it a year later- albeit without any paperwork.

Can I just clarify why you said "there would not be an issue if converted afterwards"?

muffler

The Planning & Development Act makes provision for carrying out certain works around the house that do not require planning permission .. exempt in other words. One of the listed exemptions is converting an attached domestic garage to habitable accommodation. So if you have a house with an attached garage then it may be changed into a bedroom without the need to apply for planning. Of course there are a few conditions attached to these exemptions so you need to check those out but generally most such conversions are exempt.

In your particular case there was no conversion as the room in question was a bedroom from day one and hence would not benefit from the exemption. However if your dad tells you that a year after moving into the house he removed the garage door, partially built up the ope, fitted a window, raised the floor level, plastered walls etc then that work would be exempt. No proof needed in these situations UNLESS you get a very awkward buyer who insists that the proof is indeed needed.