Low Mileage

ingalway

Does it sound reasonable that a garage says that the consistent issue of multiple warning lights coming on in a 201 car bought from new is due to not doing enough mileage?

The car has been into them 4 times with the same issue. They have changed coils and plugs but keep saying it's not doing enough mileage. It's a 1.0 litre petrol, purposely bought for small journeys. I'm sick of hearing it's not doing enough miles. As far as I'm concerned it's the car that is at fault, not the drivers lack of mileage. If minimum miles are required should that not be started before sale? Am I being unreasonable? I am not willing to accept that I either up the mileage or constantly take it back in when the lights come on again. It's faulty but the garage say it isn't?!

Any advice, it's driving (!) me mad!

Miscreant

What's the mileage?

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117906466#Comment_117906466

5,500 kms. Would have been higher without lockdown but probably not massively. Was cocooning for most of year.

Flinty997

Not enough mileage is very vague.

What are the exact issues.

Buddy Bubs

Which warning lights? But sounds like bollox to be honest

Atlantic Dawn

That's about 100km a week so more than 7km each way trips a day at a minimum which I'd have expected in a petrol is fine. Perhaps in the winter with lights on, rear demister on, heating on it would be borderline at recharging battery but should be no issues with coil packs.

mickdw

If it's in for similar issues each time' keep records and if no real fix. get legal advice.

That kind of mileage should be enough to keep a petrol car perfectly happy if averaged out over the term.

bazz26

My father only put about 45k miles on a car over about 10 years and there were never had an issue related to lack of driving it. To me they sound like they are talking shite because they probably don't know what exactly the problem is. If they are so convinced its from a lack of driving then ask them for that evaluation in writing, I bet you won't get it.

Capt'n Midnight

Short journeys with lots of stop start ? Does it ever get an 'Italian service' where it gets a nice fast run from time to time ?

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117906736#Comment_117906736

The PCS warning light, tyre pressure light (pressure is fine in all tyres), engine malfunction light and slip indicator light, all come on continuously then get turned off by the garage, but somehow there is no fault with the car.

The first time it was in: missfire found on cylinder 3-2 and missfire still in cyl 3. Transfer spark plug from cylinder 3-2 and missfire to cyl 2. Replaced spark plug cylinder 2.

2nd report: eml and traction control lights on, P0139 and C120 engine and ABS oxygen sensor B152 slow in active test, replaced O2 sensor bank 1 sensor 2.

3rd and 4th time I think they said they tried to replicate faults and were sending reports to manufacture but neither could replicate. I assume that means they turned the dash error lights off, couldn't get them to come back on. They came back on anyway after the 3rd visit. Waiting in anticipation now as only just come back from a week in the garage!

Even if it was only driven 20 kms a week, with an occasional longer trip, shouldn't it just function properly anyway? A brand new small petrol engine surely is designed for this?

Casati

They are talking rubbish, no car manufacturer has a minimum mileage requirement, there is obviously something either mechanical or electrical wrong- they need to properly diagnose and fix it

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117906786#Comment_117906786

Not often but it has had a few 50km round trips. To be honest going any distance with those lights on, or with potential to come on, does not inspire confidence to go very far!

Hellrazer

What car is it?

Aint Eazy Being Cheezy

My moneys on it being a Seat

Wildly Boaring

If it was a small diesel I'd begrudgingly tend to agree with them.

Small petrol. Nope. This is what they are being sold for!!

fryup

make & model? OP

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117907326#Comment_117907326

Toyota Aygo

Flinty997

That would be hybrid I assume.

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117909124#Comment_117909124

No, petrol.

.red.

I'm no expert but a 1.0 Toyota aygo is designed as a small city runaround. Its marketed by Toyota as a "compact city car".

Saying a fault on one of them is due to lack of mileage is like saying a large saloon diesel is failing because of high motorway mileage.

I'd be giving them one last go to fix it and telling them the next stop after that is a solicitor.

Josephfromdowntheroad

Lack of mileage on a petrol is a new one to me.

mortis43

Is it a Toyota main dealer you are speaking to? Not to hijack the thread but my experiences of Toyota main dealers (two different places over the past two years) has been nothing short of shocking. Mostly for dishonesty such as what you’ve mentioned above. Maybe get a second opinion at another garage or independent mechanic if you can?

bazz26

It's a 2020 car still under manufacturer's warranty that Toyota should be fixing. I wouldn't be getting any independent mechanic involved.

smartarsery

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117907003#Comment_117907003

With a lot of different faults like this I'd guess at it being a loose/corroded/broken ground connection, or some other kind of wiring issue. Seems like they're trying to fix the symptoms instead of finding the real problem. Kind of like putting an ice pack on your forehead because you're sweating from an infection, instead of treating the infection.

I once had an ABS/traction-control light on because my EGR valve was clogged and so the computer couldn't do the calculations for traction control properly. The dealer wanted to "try" a new ABS module for €800!

And yes, the "low mileage" excuse is definitely BS!

Capt'n Midnight

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117907173#Comment_117907173

That means the engine and associated bits and bobs has getting up to temperature for a while so they can't blame condensation or carbon.

Markus Antonius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117907003#Comment_117907003

If you know this much about cars, why bring it to the garage at all? I suggest get a small scan tool that you can read/erase codes with yourself. That seems to be all they're doing anyway.

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117909761#Comment_117909761

Yes it's a main dealer which I think make it worse, firstly that they say such rubbish continually and secondly that they can't fix it after 4 attempts.

Sam Russell

Look for a full refund, or a new car.

Solicitor is best next step - they have tried to repair and failed, so replace with new or refund - Sale of Goods.

Miscreant

5500kms in a year is not what I would consider extremely low mileage. My mother has a 2010 car with 46000kms on it and it runs like it was new. I realise it is an older car than the one you have OP but I have never come across a minimum mileage requirement on any vehicle I or my family have ever bought.

The garage sounds like they may be fobbing you off until the warranty is up on the car so they can wash their hands of it. As a previous poster said, you may be best looking to go the Solicitor route. Definitely get Toyota Ireland involved in this as well as you may want to get a statement from them on this "independently" of the dealership.

PsychoPete

It could be that they haven't seen that issue before and might not be a fix from toyota about it so it's a bit of trial and error

Henry Ford III

Write to the dealer principal and list the issues and the ENTIRE timeline of attempts to fix it.

Say you're unhappy, that the car isn't fit for purpose, and that you will REJECT the car if it isn't fixed next time permanently.

No need for a solicitor. Yet.

The car sounds like a dud tbh.

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117920812#Comment_117920812

Excellent advice. Thank you very much.

Markus Antonius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117909925#Comment_117909925

Edit: I didn't realise you bought the car in said garage. In which case harrass them like a possessed gorilla

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117921056#Comment_117921056

Thanks. I did think it a little strange to advise that I'd be running tests myself on a car bought from new and still under warranty.

Casati

Bring it to another Toyota garage. The first garage only gets paid once by Toyota - Toyota won’t pay them for any time they are spending on it now hence they aren’t interested.

Tell the second garage all the faults and what has been done to date and they should do a more detailed examination and repair on Toyota’s time

horse7

Is it an SIMI dealer?

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117922865#Comment_117922865

It is.

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117922686#Comment_117922686

That would mean even more time on this - the car was in for a week the last time. They sold it, it's under warranty, they/Toyota need to sort it out. I don't have the time to be going to another garage and leaving it with them.

Wildly Boaring

Have you written to Toyota directly?

bazz26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117926347#Comment_117926347

It makes feck all difference.

Mehaffey1

I wouldn't expect the issues you've been having to be attributed to a lack of driving, especially in a small petrol engined car. Clicked into the thread expecting to read about DPF issues or EGR problems obviously not in your case.

The good old Briggs and Stratton lawnmower can happily go without use for 4 months every year with the most basic of minor servicing.

I'd say your exact problem is one they haven't experienced before in your Toyota garage and need to pin the problem on something. I would be looking at having the issues diagnosed at another well recommended Toyota garage at least half local to yourself.

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117927146#Comment_117927146

Apparently each time they are fault finding, they are sending the results live to Toyota, who are advising as they go along. As neither can find the root cause of why it keeps happening then the alternative is to blame the driver and lack of mileage. When/if it happens again then Toyota directly should be taking over and if they have a better garage who know what to do then they can send it to them. I appreciate your advice but I just don't have the time to go a considerable distance to another Toyota dealer. Surely diagnostics should be standard across all dealerships.

ingalway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117926456#Comment_117926456

Not yet. I'm still holding on to the very slim chance that the lights won't come on again but it's highly unlikely.