US and UK to now furnish Australia with nuclear submarines.

ShatterAlan

For anyone still naive enough to think that the war in Afghanistan was to save a few peasant women from having to wear the burkha rather than to put a ring of steel around Chine I would let you know this. Biden has announced that the US and their pucky little lapdog, The UK, are to supply Australia with nuke subs. Fresh off their ignominious defeat in Afghanistan they are moving to a different tack. Keep the "3 eyes" on China and control the Pacific.

https://www.rt.com/news/534958-biden-australia-nuclear-submarines/?utm_source=browser&utm_medium=push_notifications&utm_campaign=push_notifications

Kermit.de.frog

I don't see what the problem is. China is a threat to it's neighbours and the democratic world.

Makes me angry, Irish people (defence freeloaders) who hide behind "neutrality" while everyone else does the work in the big bad world. We don't get a say because we contribute zero and hide.

As it should be. We'll get a say when we grow up and join NATO and spend 2.5% of GDP on defence.

Ha Long Bay

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058209026/us-and-uk-to-now-furnish-australia-with-nuclear-submarines

Would Russia Today typically be your go to news source?

85603

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897770#Comment_117897770

Thanks but personally Id rather not be in an alliance with the worlds most conflict prone country.

Eu/csdp is our place as a very small cog. We owe nato sht.

Timberrrrrrrr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058209026/us-and-uk-to-now-furnish-australia-with-nuclear-submarines

They're not "supplying them with nuclear submarines"

UK, US, and Australia announce landmark military pact

https://f7td5.app.goo.gl/9TtJJP

"Australia's ABC News said it the country would use the American and British technology to replace its existing Collins class submarines with a type more suitable to the deteriorating strategic environment.

the United States and Britain would share their knowledge of how to maintain nuclear-defence infrastructure.

Australia in 2016 selected French shipbuilder Naval Group to build a new submarine fleet worth $40 billion to replace its more than two-decades-old Collins submarines."

Fr Tod Umptious

What are they going to use them for ?

Keeping COVID out ?

Piollaire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897939#Comment_117897939

To keep China from taking over their sea lanes

VinLieger

So it seems many who have a problem with this don't understand the difference between a nuclear powered sub which is what Australia is getting and a sub with nuclear weapons on it which is not what Australia is getting.....

lawrencesummers

The Chinese have shown in the last decade how much better that are at expanding their interests in many places like Italy, Afganistan, Cuba, Venezuela while the UK and the US have been unable to handle even their own homegrown problems and their influence around the world has shrunk.

Its going to take a lot more than the combined armies of Aus UK Us to scare the Chinese.

The Chinese have a bottomless wealth of cash, a massive population of underpaid overly obedient people with the ability to produce their own modern weapons on a level equal to the rest of the world its hard to see who is going to blink first in this.

Flinty997

Certainly their exports are nothing to be sneezed (or coughed) at...

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058209026/us-and-uk-to-now-furnish-australia-with-nuclear-submarines

I'm not sure there's anything in your post thats actually correct. Did you intend to post this in conspiracy forum and miss?

[Deleted User]

This reminds me of the western gang-up on China during the boxer rebellion in 1900. I thought we were ending white supremacy?

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898068#Comment_117898068

everything he said was correct except Afghanistan being designed to ring fence China. Back in 2001/2 China wasn’t seen as a threat. In fact the US had just welcomed China into the WTO.

[Deleted User]

looking at some military supplier acquisitions recently in Australia, I would imagine the subs will be built in Australia, with support of UK/US companies (BAE Systems more than likely, unless they morph into something else in the mean time)...

Another point of interest.... Africa... the USAF didn't just build a new airbase in Niger for no reason

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898124#Comment_117898124

That is an interesting take on it. White Supremacy?

85603

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898227#Comment_117898227

Any excuse.

archer22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897771#Comment_117897771

It's actually quite a good site, lots of news on it that the western MSM won't touch..only a fool would dismiss it out of hand just because its Russian.

timmyntc

It's all about countering China - the next big war will involve the US and China, have no doubt. The big question is, who else?

China are gearing up to invade Taiwan, the US and other western interests may try and stop them, but it wouldnt surprise me if Biden let them have Taiwan and tried to appease the Chinese.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898227#Comment_117898227

the Americans want to end “500 years of white supremacy”. Apparently though this does not mean ending American supremacy or the “descendants of the british empire” supremacy.

of course the term has lost all meaning, where it once meant white or European colonialism, now it’s more likely used for nationalism.

apparently this nuclear deal has pissed off the French who had a deal with Australia for submarines, now defunct

Peregrinus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898190#Comment_117898190

The announcement is that US/UK will provide the technology transfer needed for the nuclear submarines. My guess, though, is that they will provide the entire propulsion system, not just the technology - i.e. the engines will be manufactured in US/UK and bought by Australia. Australia lacks both a nuclear defence capacity and a civil nuclear power industry; it really doesn't make sense to think of Australia establishing the capacity to manufacture just reactors for submarine engines.

As for the subs themselves, there has been no announcement as yet about where they will be built.

There's a bit of background here. Currently Australia is operating Collins class diesel electric submarines which were designed in the 1980s, delivered in the 1990s, were long plagued by reliability and maintenance issues, and are due for replacement. After five years of dithering, a contract to replace them was awarded in 2016 to a French consortium. The replacement submarines were also to be diesel electric, and were to be manufactured in Australia by the French consortium and based on an existing design, the French Barracuda class submarine. From a purely practical point of view construction in Australia never made a huge amount of sense - it adds both cost and delay to the project - but the political attractions are obvious.

This project in turn has been plagued with problems, and the projected cost has ballooned from $10 bn (in 2009, when they started to scope the project) to over $90 bn (this year). Delivery of the first submarine (out of an intended 12) wasn't expected until 2030 or 2031, with the final delivery occurring in the 2040s or possibly even 2050s.

Today's announcement means that that project has now been cancelled, and presumably there'll have to be a new design of submarine and the negotiation of a new contract for their construction, with new tenderers competing. We're back to square one, in other words.

Against this background, there must be a possibility that the government will reluctantly conclude that considerations of cost and timescale must now trump the political attractions of dockyard jobs in Adelaide. The Collins class submarines are barely serviceable as it is, I don't know that the defence establishment will be willing to wait until 2040 for replacements.

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897949#Comment_117897949

If the Australians hadn't sold China so much ore, coal and food that would have been a better way to stop the Chinese taking over the sea lanes. Good idea to supply your "enemy" with all the materials to make weapons, then your military industrial companies will nerd to build weapons to protect you from the weapons you helped build.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117897991#Comment_117897991

It'll be configured for NATO standard munitions. While they might not have any nuclear weapons at the moment the sub will easily be able to use them.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomahawk_(missile)

Dyr

Good to hear

Meanwhile, China is burying itself deep into our universitites.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898347#Comment_117898347

my interpretation of reading between the lines is, that setting up there for reactor manufacture, won't only be for submarine propulsion, but more so a strategic location for eventual sub support, rather than having to send the boats back to UK or US. Local expert knowledge, which is only achieved by being involved with the manufacture... also with "benefits" of technology seeping into the civil market. This co-op agreement would secure Uranium ore in Aus for use on that side of the would without having to be shipped in from elsewhere, or send the ships elsewhere to be refuelled.

Canada and NZ's stance on this over the coming years will be interesting. But this has been a long time in the making with the UK and Aus turning into miniature carbon copies of the USAF, with numerous technology sharing agreements already in place for maritime ops..

[Deleted User]

French unhappy.

https://twitter.com/brunotertrais/status/1438391743733448709?s=21

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898497#Comment_117898497

Good, their universities tend to be technocratic and classical. No wokeness.

bob mcbob

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898124#Comment_117898124

Here is a history lesson for you

https://www.cfr.org/video/lessons-learned-hitlers-rearmament-germany

it was only on September 1, 1939, when Germany invaded Poland, that "the rest of Europe confronted, rather than appeased, Hitler." This four-year delay, he argues, points to a basic difficulty in international relations. "Aggressive, expansionist states are most easily stopped early on when they are weak and vulnerable," he says, but "precisely because their capabilities are limited at that point--and their intentions can only be guessed at--it is often hard to persuade other countries to act."

85603

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898523#Comment_117898523

EU will hit back in good time.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898551#Comment_117898551

Sure, everybody who isn’t an American poodle is a Nazi. You could have posted that prior to the invasion of Iraq, because Saddam was a Nazi. Assad was a Nazi. Ghaddaffi was a Nazi. Putin is still a nazi. The Islamic world is Islamofascist and pretty much Nazi. Iran a Nazi state. Every time the US and it’s poodles need to invade somewhere Hitler comes out of the box. Which is odd for the US, because for the actual Hitler the US didn’t get involved until Germany declared war, three days after pearl harbour.

by the way during the boxer revolution, when 8 countries were involved in the invasion of China, Germany was involved. The propaganda was absolutely white supremacist. Here is St Michael holding saving Europe from the, er, Buddha

yellow peril

Gatling

Maybe china should rethink it's idea that it owns the whole South China seas ,the idea that America wants to put a ring of steel around China is the same nonsense that the russians propagate for explaining away their actions in Ukraine and further afield ,

China has massively expanded it military might over the last number of years , massively expanded its capabilities , mostly with stolen US stuff ,not so long ago they couldn't produce a reliable jet engine ,now they have some jets that resemble stealth fighters and a bomber coming soon , mostly not stealth they look it but they are regularly detected by other countries older generation aircrafts and radars ,

North Korea is the the spark that could light the fire though ,if Kim falls in the next few years , China could well move in to keep Nk under their control , rather than allow any of reconciliation and possible reunification of the Korea's ,

VinLieger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898417#Comment_117898417

Are you actually suggesting that the UK or US would break the Non Proliferation Treaty signed by 191 other countries including Australia?

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117898138#Comment_117898138

War in Afghanistan was to ...ring of steel around China...Nope.

Supply Australia with nuke subs. ...Nope

Defeat in Afghanistan... depends what you think their goal was, but mostly nope.

They are moving to a different tack. Keep the "3 eyes" on China and control the Pacific. ..this is not a different tack so nope.