Do the Incels have a point, how important are looks in our society?

I've never been great with the ladies myself. And yeah, sometimes I wonder if my chin was a bit bigger and my nose was smaller if it would be different.

Then again, looks won't help you get a good leaving cert or secure a 2:1 in college. They won't help you in climbing up the corporate ladder. Appearances can never replace hard work.

Morris Garren

'Incels' do not have a point. In fact, the title 'incel' is one slang term/identity tick-box too far.

Case closed. Move on

Sy Kick

There's a lot of focus on incels

But what about that other category. Those people who through no fault, under no control or volition of themselves end up getting marginally, slightly less sex than they would optimally have if they could ideally set in ideal world. By less it could be 5% or 1% or whatever.

They don't get a name!

They don't get to set off bombs or do school shootings!

Ekerot

Yes, looks matter.

jmlad2020

The problem with Incels is they do not understand how to be attractive to the opposite sex. They are fed Disney and Romcom crap from a young age (as we all are) combined with a lack of masculine father figures in their life they grow up with a skewed sense of reality.

Yes looks are important but also confidence and a sense of purpose in life. All Incels are lacking in these and expect girls to magically like them for who they are; usually nerdy types, who play video games, lack social skills and an ability to connect with their peers. Understandably they are angry at this "lack" and lash out. The internet is not helping things, with Instagram fueling a "look at how cool and pretty I am" mentality and Pornography leading to a sense of entitlement towards sexual relationships

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058204498/do-the-incels-have-a-point-how-important-are-looks-in-our-society

But appearances and hard work is better than hard work! It's hard to completely respect a fat person for example.

Quantum Erasure

there's more to life than being really, really, ridiculously good looking

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117768286#Comment_117768286

A neighbour used to say to me, if I had bother finding a girlie for myself. "They won't come knocking on the door to you"

completedit

Looks are everything man. After a certain age though they become less important and it's more about enjoying the fruits of being handsome and beautiful in your younger years. I don't see how looks aren't everything in the context of romantic relationships?

NiceFella

There is no doubt looks are an advantage. But to say it is the only show in town is to be shallow and devoid of personality. Such People like this ain't worth knowing in my opinion.

Your dealt a hand in life, you saddle up and make the most if it.

I knew a guy once who let's say wasn't the best looking, but every week I saw him trying his arm with all sorts of women with mixed success. When it didn't work out he had a sense of humor about it. He didn't take himself too seriously. He is now happily married with kids. His approach to adversity was admirable.

jmlad2020

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117768525#Comment_117768525

This Incel was a pretty dashing looking fellow. Also a sociopathic murderer with no social skills and a warped sense of reality. Looks aren't everything. Work on yourself.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-43892189

NiceFella

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117768525#Comment_117768525

Every post you say the same thing and as many posters have explained to you already that your understanding of attraction is very superficial.

For example if you have a sense a humor that someone else jives with. THAT IS ATTRACTIVE. You will automatically look better to the other person.

Being able to relate on an emotional level through life experience is also attractive.

I've met many people who I didn't initially fancy that changed as soon as I got to know them.

You package your idea of attraction as being realistic but it really isn't. It's just negativity.

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117768525#Comment_117768525

Sure looks are important. However I would argue they're more important for women in many ways. They certainly seem to have far more advertising aimed at them, spend far more of their hard earned on improving them, fret about them more and suffer more from body dysmorphia and eating disorders. Men can also "earn" attractive points far more easily and can be "in the game" for longer too.

Plus most people hook up with what they fancy at some stage in their lives pretty much no matter what their looks. Men and women. If I consider my male friends the two who have had most success in attracting and indeed keeping women over the years are hardly Adonis made flesh. One is shorter than average, the other not exactly svelte, neither are wealthy either and photography wouldn't be their best friend.😁 Both are happily married now, but if they ended up divorced, or alone for some reason, I'd bet the farm they'd find someone else in short enough order. Oh and their various amours down the years were generally objectively better looking than them.

Of the women I know, I'd say the most good looking ones had the more difficult times funny enough. Particularly when younger. I've also known a few women who were "Incels" too. I currently know a fair number of single women, who've been single for a while too. Sure, it's much easier for women especially in the online world to get a shag, but finding a halfway decent guy who isn't a chancer and wants more, not nearly so easy.

NI31

Good looks are one of the attractive qualities that will help you attract a woman. It's not the most important or even one of the top five. No use fretting about it though unless you are thinking of plastic surgery.

More navel gazing and once again no actual people watching.

I have said it in every thread on this subject that looks are not everything. The best analogy I can think of is poker. Getting two aces in your first deal in Texas Holdem is certainly an advantage. But you can still win if you get dealt a 2 and a king off suit. Aces are useful but unlike completedit above talking about "looks" they are not "everything".

The strongest opening hand and the weakest opening hand can still win. It might take more effort and luck and work to win with the weak hand - but generally there is not a hand in poker that you can not win with.

But as I said I recommend people watching. Pick a few locations and a few days. Sit and watch people walking buy in numbers. Watch the people who are paired off. You will see good looking people in great numbers and you will see ugly ass people in great numbers - all paired off. And you will see single people too.

But a lot of incels and people who subscribe to that line of thinking - seem not to people watch. They look at things like results on dating apps and this artificial atmosphere validates their preconceptions.

In my experience - anecdotal - it generally comes down to effort. How much effort are you making with the hand you have been dealt. I made zero effort with my hand for most of the early part of my life - and the results showed.

As soon as I got myself off the couch and away from too much time at a monitor - started to work on some actual discipline and personal responsibility - and some self reflection and self awareness - everything changed. And that potential is there for everyone. Even (maybe even especially) completed it who I for whatever reason feel genuine concern and hope for.

And here I am now having just become a father for the 4th time a couple days ago - so any rambling or spelling mistakes or whatever above please take my apologies for :) I am - - - currently unrested :)

I think there is a cohort of men and women out there who feel if they can’t get someone they are genuinely attracted to then they would rather stay single. If they themselves aren’t particularly attractive then they are in trouble.

mikethecop

I look like a busted bag of horse apples , but i train a bit i dont do stuff to excess and im not a complete sad sack waster nutbag and i do ok for myself .yes looks matter but not as much as mentality

Wibbs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117769309#Comment_117769309

"I look like a busted bag of horse apples" You Sir, win the interwebs tonight. And I'm so nicking that. 😁

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117769315#Comment_117769315

That's not what I'm saying. These incels just talk about looks as if they're everything. But looks won't help you do well in college or work.

growleaves

I don't think incels have much of a point no.

Overall, women are looking at the 'inner man'.

Things that make a difference:

Confidence (which can be gained through competence and doing things that gain self-admiration), sociableness, being at ease with oneself, being interesting, irreverence, and many other qualities.

iamstop

There is someone out there for everyone imho.

If you live in a small town or city and are not having much luck, spread your wings. Go travel. You might find you're pretty attractive to the women on some far flung country in Asia or S. America.

chrissb8

Looks can help get your foot in the door in aspects of life. Jobs and partners specifically. That's about it though, all the rest is left down to personality, humour etc.

That said if you are not working with what you're given looks wise you're not helping yourself. Take john who is 35+ years old and who is balding, big belly and insists on still wearing skinny jeans. John would be better if he found a hairstyle that suits him, lost the weight and took better care of himself in general.

While looks aren't everything there is a standard people should set for themselves. Because being a slob is not attractive and telling people as such that looks don't matter is just a bare-faced lie. Looks matter to a point. Not the being over 6ft, ripped, the facial bone structure looks. The basic looking after yourself and dressing well kind of looks.