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12 Speed

  • 10-08-2021 10:41pm
    Registered Users Posts: 2,414 ✭✭✭ harringtonp

    Anyone running this, how do you find it ?

    See the smallest sprocket on a cassette is usually 10 tooth. Was always wondering how small you can go and what it is about 12 speed that enables this... why not before ?

    See also that components are expensive to replace


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,841 ✭✭✭ Plastik

    Anything smaller than an 11t will not physically fit on a standard freehub body. 12speed uses the new XD/XDR standard that allows the 10t to fit.

    No idea how much smaller is possible, or worth trying. Broad brush, I recall reading previously about drivetrain losses/friction the smaller you go.

  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 18,591 Mod ✭✭✭✭ Brian?

    I think the main advantage of 12 speed is that you have a hugely increased range. You can have a semi compact up front and not miss out on the top end speed compared to a standard or the climbing gears compared to a compact.

    I actually never saw the point of 10 or 11 speed, but the 10 on 12 speed makes sense.


    And so on, and so on …. - Slavoj Žižek

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,414 ✭✭✭ harringtonp

    They are my conclusions too Brian. Currently have 10 speed, never owned 11 speed and looking at a new bike that enables off road but is fast and light enough to be used as a winter road bike (which realistically would be its main use).

    A lot of new gravel/cx bikes are now 1x crankset. I like the idea and simplicity of 1x but there seems to be a limit on the chairing max size that comes with the crankset. They may come with a 40t chainring for example but the max you can put on may be a 46t. Now 40x11 would certainly leave you struggling on a club spin and even 46x11 is far from ideal in fast moving bunch environments. But a 10 tooth cog is a game changer and 46x10 is slightly faster than 50x11 (it lies between 53x11 and 53x12)

    Gravel/CX 12 speed bike offerings are beginning to happen but will usually come with an knobbly, wire tyre suited for off road.. surprise surprise.

    A second wheel set with lighter wheels and light slicker tyres would be what you would ideally be looking for for road. Big question for me when you go looking for a new set is how many will offer the SRAM XDR freehub body option.

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,165 ✭✭✭ Breezer

    I recently bought a 1x gravel bike, 40t chainring with 36/10 12 speed cassette. I have to say I absolutely love the simplicity of the shifting.

    I find I start to spin out at 45 km/h downhill. For me, that’s fine, but if you want to race it over winter, you’ll want get a 2x (or both, and convert it).

    Regarding wheels, Hunt can fit the XDR freehub body. I haven’t looked any further than that yet. I’m thinking I’ll get a set and put some road tyres on them.

    I can’t comment on the wear and tear aspect. I’ve only had it just over a month and I suspect from your post that you’ll ride it harder than me (or maybe not. I seem to break the 105 drivetrain on my commuter with astonishing frequency!)

    The components are all expensive to replace though and I haven’t managed to find spare 12 speed quicklinks yet, for example.

  • Registered Users Posts: 469 ✭✭ Zen0

    I don’t know about 12 speed, but it’s recommended that you replace an 11 speed chain at the 0.5% wear mark, as against 0.75% for 10 speed. So, all other things being equal your chain will wear out faster. That being said, it’s getting harder to replace 10 speed components so at some stage you have little option but to embrace the change.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 462 ✭✭ benneca1

    Have SRAM Force AXS love it but really alll you are getting is the range which we uded to get with a triple Lowest gear is equivalent to 34 32 and the fastest is the same as 53 11 with 24 gears in total that in my view is very like 3 X 8 with 52 39 30 up fromt.That said it looks cool and you dont have the stigma of a granny gear

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,414 ✭✭✭ harringtonp

    Would you know why you change the 11 speed at this mark but not the 10 speed ?

    Up to recently with the worldwide shortage on components I have been running 2 bikes on 10 speed and never had problems getting components. Was getting Ultegra 6700 chains for about 20euro, having said that my most recent one was 25.

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,414 ✭✭✭ harringtonp

  • Registered Users Posts: 3,165 ✭✭✭ Breezer

    I don’t race and don’t tend to get into this sort of analysis, so I’ve no idea if that’s good, bad or indifferent. My Garmin said 45 km/h and my pedals were spinning more quickly than I’d have liked for comfort, so I stopped pedalling. Racers may have a different view of the matter, I guess.

    Is 90 rpm downhill a normal thing to be doing?

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,136 ✭✭✭ saccades

    90 rpm is cruising spin tbf.

    Have 12 speed on the MTB (500% range, Inc 10t cog), the upper level versions are coated and very tough. Coming up to 2.5 years on there and it gets a tough life so far. Bloody expensive too, as the main set of cogs are a single bit of CNC to make them light. Current road bike is 2x11, won't need 500% range on that so a fairly close range.

    I know loads of people will say they are used to 2 rings up the front, and that it's automatic to adjust front and rear and that the "perceived" ease of 1x isn't worth it, but it is.

    No thinking about anything, just click and up (or down).

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  • Registered Users Posts: 710 ✭✭✭ devonp

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,297 ✭✭✭ Macy0161

    A bit surprised that 10 speed are getting harder to find, notwithstanding the covid/ suez issues that's affected all parts. Shimano have released new iterations of Tiagra, and 10 speed GRX in the last year or two. Pre-covid, even 9 speed components were readily available.