Dismissed for COVID mistake

Hotblack Desiato

Despite the great length of this thread, I'm still none the wiser as to how "self isolating" equates with "spending five hours in a car potentially infectious sitting next to a potentially infectious colleague."

🙄

GerardKeating

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117678173#Comment_117678173

Really, the only thing the hotel did "wrong" was citing a reason for sacking them, since they were there only 2/3 months, they can be dismissed for no cause and they have no recouse to any complaint or redress.

The best thing for them would be to look for another job, and maybe omit/forget to include this on a CV.

archfi

Maybe it's just me, but I think one of the absolute worst aspects about this site is people's willingness to dive on the slightest aspect of a story and claim it's made up. Why? I have no idea, but it completely ruins any reasonable discussion. One of the only ways that an anonymous internet forum can run at all is if people take things on face value to some extent.

@kirving I agree.

I posted up a work problem I was in a good few years ago and within three posts some ignorant, officious knowall Inspector No-Clue poster effectively ruined my query by surmising I was engineering the situation to hoodwink my then employer. It's like some on here think this forum is for them to take part in a sad cluedo like mystery using someone elses problem or some facet of it.

I had to ask the mod to delete the thread as (at that time) I was a nervous wreck that it if I continued I'd post something identifiable with the added non-helpful guessing-I-was-lying from one or two posters making the thread a trainwreck. The mod was excellent by the way in how they dealt with it.

It went to WRC and I was successful and correct and awarded appropriately.

Palmach

Situatuon resolved. Stiff legal letter snet to the hotel and both have received two weeks pay and a glowing reference from the hotel in which states they left to get further experience and the hotel would be glad to have them back. A salutary lesson for those in the hospitality industry. Low pay and this kind of high handed treatment of employees is one of the reasons you can;t get good staff. Both are now working in Kerry, Many thanks for the help to all.

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682036#Comment_117682036

Just like that? I didn’t know whether this thread was a real life account of a grievance, I am certain of my opinion now.

Flinty997

I've seen B movies set on Mars that were more credible than this thread.

qwerty13

I love the smell of an agenda in the morning!

timmyntc

Even if what they did was wrong - why should the hotel have any right to sack them for something that happened when they were not at work?

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682036#Comment_117682036

If anyone believes this for one second, they probably believe in fairytales too. 🧚

1/10

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117681010#Comment_117681010

Manure

If you cant follow simple logic without emotion, bow out.

Again and this will be the 4th time this has been explained to you. THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A LEGAL OBLIGATION AND A HEALTH RECOMMENDATION. What don't you get about that?

You can be as big a moron as you like in your own time. That's your right. A right I will defend. You may be happy to be totally controled, I am not

Where a persons personal rights are violated, I will absolutely advise them to seek redress. Again, you seem to think this is wrong and your employer should be allowed infringe upon them

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682174#Comment_117682174

This is exactly what people in this thread don't seem to get.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682036#Comment_117682036

Well that's bullshit. In less than a week? Who sent this legal letter and if they are legally correct, why settle for what they are entitled to in the first place?

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682245#Comment_117682245

Are you saying that an employee can only be dismissed for not following legal obligations?

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682174#Comment_117682174

First off, the hotel has every right to sack them if they are still under probation. You can be gotten rid of/ terminated for any reason in your first few months if the employer doesn't think you pass muster.

Think of their behaviour from the employer's POV. Because, in that context, they have proven one of two things.......they have displayed exceptionally poor judgement skills on two occasions by showing up to work while having symptoms and then not following directions handed down by management and/or medical staff. Depending on the industry involved, not following orders properly and making poor judgement calls can literally get people killed. It's that simple.

So this person either willfully ignored the dangers involved, or were too dumb to realise the dangers involved. That is a valid reason for not allowing them to become full-time permanent members of staff.

Would you really want such a person working on a building site, or in a kitchen, or working with medicines, or power tools or etc. etc.?

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682452#Comment_117682452

The employer gave a reason (allegedly) for firing them - which opens up potential can of worms for them.

So with that in mind, did what they did constitute a firing offence? Because I cant see one

[Deleted User]

There is a distinction between "you're fired because you did X" and "you haven't passed probation because you did x, so you're being let go". The outcome is the same, but there is a difference between the two. Without seeing anything in writing or having been in the room when that conversation happened, there's not much else to go on.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682245#Comment_117682245

Wow. Whose emotions are flaring now? I obviously touched a nerve.

You're not a moderator here Niner Leprechaun.

Until you are, have no right to tell me how to engage in any thread or to bow of one, so remember your place.

Dempo1

This story is perplexing on many fronts, vague being one of them. Firstly I can't get my head around a 5 hour trip for tests, where is this Hotel, Timbuktu? Secondly it's not very clear what actually happened and if something did, how was it proven exactly and thirdly and forgive me if I've missed an update on unfair dismissal legislation but I've not heard of Gross Misconduct persuant to a Covid Mistake.

It would appear the Hotel in question is not suffering any staff shortages we all hear about allegedly impacting the hospitality sector , if they can just dismiss 2 employee's on what appears to be a whim.

Just Bizzare, my humble opinion of course 😏

C3PO

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682036#Comment_117682036

…. And they all lived happily ever after!!! 😊

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682653#Comment_117682653

waffle waffle waffle.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682276#Comment_117682276

You know I am not

martingriff

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682036#Comment_117682036

Right all of this just like that.

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117688413#Comment_117688413

Glad to hear it, sounded like you were arguing that employees can’t be dismissed for not following guidelines as opposed to not following legal requirements.

Palmach

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117688507#Comment_117688507

Just like that. They should not have been fired for doing something in their spare time and the hotel did not follow fair procedures. You cannot fire someone without giving them a chance to responde. The HR person clearly shat their pants when the WRC was mentioned and it was pointed out they'd be on the losing side.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117682036#Comment_117682036

This absolutely did not happen. The hotel may (or may not) have been in the wrong, but it is completely irrelevant, because the employees have no legal comeback at all on the employer. None.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117689074#Comment_117689074

This also absolutely did not happen. You can fire someone for any reason you like if they are working for less than a year with you. The WRC wouldn't touch this, and any HR person who would panic at the mention of the WRC clearly couldn't find their arse with both hands and a satnav.

[Deleted User]

Anyway, as an earlier poster said...

...and they all lived happily ever after.

What.Now

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117689103#Comment_117689103

 "You can fire someone for any reason you like if they are working for less than a year with you"

This is not true. You can let somebody go without giving them a reason but if you give them a reason you better be damded sure that it's within the law or your work procedures.

For example if a manager wanted a younger workforce he can go about saying to the 60 year old he employed 4 months ago that 'this is not working out for us' I'm letting you go. However if he says to the 60 year old 'we a looking for a younger workforce so therefore we are letting you go he would be in a whole heep of trouble.

fun loving criminal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117677579#Comment_117677579

Yes believe it or not, people really are this thick.

A few weeks ago, only sometime in June 2021, someone took the day off from work after a weekend for having a cold. Just rang in sick.

They came back two days later and I asked them did they get a covid test. No they didn't because having a cold isn't a symptom of covid I was told. So they came into work cleared up from symptoms, yet it very well could have been covid and could be still infectious but no way of knowing without a test.

A few more colleagues backed them up saying a cold isn't a symptom of covid so don't need a test.

Yes, a year and half in and there are people who just don't get it. But then again, it's not exactly spelt out on the HSE website and this is what people are going by. They need to include feeling like a cold as a symptom.

Quantum Erasure

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117675765#Comment_117675765

yes

Dav010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117689074#Comment_117689074

This is certainly a surprising development in your story. Considering your friends did not have the protection of the most important legislation relating to dismissals, The Unfair Dismissals Act (you need 12 months service for this to apply) and would have to rely on other legislation relating possibly to equality or industrial relations, which given that their predicament relates to an alleged breach of Covid guidelines, there case was by no means guaranteed to succeed, it is hard to see how HR “shat their pants”, and would more likely to have done absolutely nothing. But it does give the story the happy ending, and no doubt makes the point you wanted to make from the start.

[Deleted User]

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/117688535#Comment_117688535

Work guidelines that are clearly defined and agreed by union / employee.

Not health guidelines issued by the government such as eat 5 fruit / veg a day