Mayo GAA Discussion

spakman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118605130#Comment_118605130

I'd take the silence as a good thing. They weren't long confirming TC did his cruciate :(

flasher0030

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118590531#Comment_118590531

Doesn't make sense. By that reckoning if a team wins an All-Ireland, it's put down to luck for the manager, because he had good players there in the first place. But for managers on teams that don't do the business over a long period of time, they take the flack because they haven't rebuilt properly.

A large number of the Mayo squad retired over a year ago. It's not a secret that the vast majority of people were certain that it brought the curtain down on what was a beautiful decade for Mayo GAA. What did the manager do? Around 10 months later they were in another All-Ireland final. For me, it is one of the finest team building achievements that I have ever witnessed. Lost Tommy Conroy over a week ago. McLaughlin last weekend, and still come away with a win up in Monaghan due to the depth of the squad. And that's after 5 or 6 members of the team retired less than a year ago. You cannot just write that off as fortunate. Surely, you have to give Horan some credit for building that team back up.

I think you also mentioned about the keeper situation. Maybe I am in the minority, but I would have Robbie Hennelly up there with the best keepers in Ireland right now. He was known for having a couple of wobbley moments, but I think he has turned that on his head. He is not perfect, but he is keeping Mayo in many games from what I see. Since he was man of the match in that league final against Kerry couple of years ago, he he gradually clawed his way back up there - very decent kick-outs, penalty saves, close range saves. How many did he save against Donegal. That equalising point against Dublin last year. Equalising point against Donegal last Sunday week. To me, he seems like a man whose confidence is soaring. Problem is that one bad game again, and the naysayers will be out in force that he is a weak link. Whereas the likes of Rory Beggan and Niall Morgan can have off days and will get away with it, as they are perceived to be "strong" keepers.

Green&Red

I’d agree with you that Hennelly is one of the best keepers there is, solid shot stopper, excellent kick outs, some clutch scores. His kryptonite is poor decision making when the pressure is really high. His record of mistakes in finals is awful. So he can be the best keeper in Ireland for 364 days of the year but he has consistently made at least one big mistake in almost every final he’s played in starting with that minor replay. Even club has been the same.

I’d love to see him get through a final without being the talking point after because he seems like a really nice lad.

The initial point is being overlooked, we need a viable backup, probably Jennings IMO, who gets game time in the league and is capable of stepping up if Rob got injured but more likely will be our captain for 2025 or 2026

Barlett

I’ve heard from a reliable source that McLaughlin’s injury isn’t a bad one

blowitupref

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118607958#Comment_118607958

He's watching his college side in action tonight while wearing a protective boot.

Paul Towey showing well off the bench, any reason why James Horan hasn't given him more game time?

Edit** i now understand he started, was late to watch the live stream as i was watching extra time in the other semi final and presumed when wearing number 32 he was brought on.

spakman

Well if he's not making his college team....

blowitupref

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118612966#Comment_118612966

Plenty of top quality players wasn't starters for their college teams. For example ten years ago the subs DCU brought on to win the final was David Kelly Sligo and Michael Murphy Donegal.

Blackjack

and people think we have problems with our keeper….

https://twitter.com/darranmarshall/status/1492567680754278404?s=21

PressRun

Delighted for Mickey Moran today on the win with Kilcoo. Treated abysmally by the Mayo county board, but a true gent, one of the games great managers.

MacDanger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118622799#Comment_118622799

Yeah, delighted for MM

eastie17

I know I'm jumping ahead here, but what are peoples thoughts on manager at the end of the season? Logically many will say depends on how Horan does which is fair enough.

Personally I think its the end of the road again for him at season end, I dont believe he can win an All ireland with Mayo, based on last years AIF performance. We know the things he is best in the business at, but the Achilles heel of being just too stubborn and a bit of tactical blindness prevent him from getting over the line. I wouldnt see the point in continuing with him, ideally would love to see him take on some other kind of role in Mayo football, like overseeing the overall football direction, underage academies something like that but he doesnt strike me as the kind of man who would be happy with something like that. Dare I say it, wouldnt surprise me if he went off somewhere else and did some good work which would be a pity.

Rochford again? The man who has gotten us closest since Maughan in 1996. I still to this day believe if he had been brought in as a consultancy capacity after the semi, and was listened to tactically, we would have won it. What would be different this time is that your not up against the best team there ever has been in gaelic football. Interestingly listening to Andy Moran talking about him, and Kieran Fitzgerald on Corofins first AI win of recent times, both separately said they never were more prepared or felt more ready for a final as they were under him. In one case they won, Corofin, in the other we lost but put up a score that would have won every other AIF before that. Some will say Donegal havent set the world alight under him but Bonner has to be calling the shots and while I'm sure Rochford has a large input, but I dont know that, I dont think you can say their performance, be it good or bad, is all down to him.

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118628915#Comment_118628915

Althought i agree with alot of what you are saying, personally i think its time to park that discussion until the end of the season. Horan is in charge and more than likely will be in charge until he decides not to be regardless of results. So personally i think its time to wish him well and get behind the team!

eastie17

I understand but this is a discussion forum, discussing things like that aren't going to detract from what the senior team are trying to do this year or from my ability to get behind them. In fact they are the whole point of a discussion forum I would have thought. I'm not disparaging or belittling anyone's efforts,

I dunno what it is with us Mayo fans, we cant seem to discuss anything about Mayo that might seem anyway negative in case, what? The team or management will get wind of it and then not play as well? We have a very overinflated sense of importance if that is what we think.

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118630172#Comment_118630172

I don't control what's discussed on this forum so i was simply taking part in your discussion by replying to it with my own opinion. That is a discussion from my understanding!! I don't for one second think anyone on that Mayo panel or anything to do with it give two flying v's what is discussed on this forum or any other. I just don't think that is a topic that will garner much interest at this stage of the year, especially considering it was discussed to death after the final last year (thus my opinion on it). But if others feel the same as yourself I'm sure you will get more replies

RedDevil55

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118628915#Comment_118628915

I don't see the point of going back to Rochford. You say this time he won't be up against the best Gaelic football team ever, well he also won't be handed the best Mayo team in 60+ years. He went close to the holy grail in 16/17 but we had pretty much an injury free run those years, which hasn't been the case recently. Also, if you're crediting Rochford for running Dublin close, you have to question the 3 consecutive losses to Galway and being beaten by Kildare in the qualifiers. Rochford gets a lot of praise for being tactically astute and flexible, but in the 2017 final we pretty much played Horanball.

A lot of people seem to have lost faith in Horan, but I still maintain the final last year was there to win. Creating 4 or 5 clear goal chances would suggest the tactics worked pretty well. Missing them was the problem. You can quibble a few slow substitutions in the final, but ultimately none of the subs played well in any case.

It would be good if Maurice Sheridan goes on a long run with the U20s this year. Outside of him, I don't see many alternatives to Horan.

homewardbound11

Solan was night impressive at U20 and with Andy in Leitrim I hope they do well.

PressRun

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118630529#Comment_118630529

I would sort of agree with you. We created chances in the final, but didn't convert them. Tyrone converted theirs. Our midfield utterly malfunctioned. Tyrone's didn't. That was basically the sum of it. The problem was the majority of the players didn't do their job on the day and the harsh truth is that a lot of the newer players, bar a couple, aren't the same standard as the original Horan group anyway.

Green&Red

I would take Rochford back in a heartbeat.

I'd disagree with what Parlance said last week, I think Horan has done two unbelievable rebuilding jobs with Mayo. Outside of goalie he has given a huge number of players a chance. The year we won the league he blooded a load of new players, theres very few players in the county who can say they didn't get a chance. Having said all that I just don't think he has the tactical nous to win the AI.

Rochford on the other hand does. Personally I think its nonsense to throw the losses to Galway at him, we had won five on the bounce, who cares about Connacht, he was priming that team for Dublin in the final/semi-final. He had so many smart decisions that we'd never see under Horan. O'Shea at FB and Dillon v Tyrone are two. We had a sweeper and some protection for our backs. He studied teams before we played them. I firmly believe if he was on the sideline in this years final we'd have won it.

flasher0030

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118633112#Comment_118633112

It's a tough one - Rochford or Horan. I know the Horan shortcomings have been done to death at this stage. But I think some of the things that Rochford did are a case of trying to be too clever. He put O'Shea in full back against Donaghy. Surely if Kerry were a little smarter, they would have identified a lack of pace in the position right in front of our goal, and tried to exploit that.

Rochford was the one who replaced David Clarke with Robert Hennelly at the 11th hour in an All-Ireland final - a decision which haunted Rochford and Hennelly for some time afterwards, and if I recall correctly led to ill feelings for David Clarke. If it paid off, he knew he would be seen as a tactical master. But the All-Ireland is not the place to be taking chances on unknowns.

My concern with Rochford would be that he tries to be too left-field to find the magic bullet.

RedDevil55

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118633112#Comment_118633112

Some of those tactical moves by Rochford get overplayed. Alan Dillon was taken off at half time vs Tyrone with the scores level. A 34 year old Donaghy was Kerry's man of the match in the drawn game when Aidan was full back.

Horan has tried some left field tactics too, like playing Loftus midfield, Keegan corner back etc. He has used a sweeper on plenty of occasions but people seem to overlook that.

Green&Red

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118635014#Comment_118635014

Kerry's man of the match? Is that a made up title you gave him? Because I remember Andy scoring 1-5 and getting actual MOTM. Not that scores are everything but he got one point, in the replay Donaghy didn't get a touch.

Dillon came off in the Tyrone game because all he had in him was a half and Tyrone had already subbed McMahon (I think) off. Andy Moran goes through the tactical side of it in his book, Rochford completely negates Harte's plans

RedDevil55

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118635174#Comment_118635174

He was Kerry's most influential player, call it whatever you want. May have only scored 1 point, but he set up a lot including 2 goals. True he didn't do anything in the replay but we were completely on top that day. I don't remember much brilliant full back play keeping Donaghy out of the game.

Dillon got on a lot of ball in that first half but I don't think it disrupted Tyrone that much. At the end of the day the scores were still level when Sean Cavanagh got sent off. That was real deciding factor in the game along with a couple of super long range points from Keegan. It certainly wasn't some tactical masterclass

Green&Red

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118635464#Comment_118635464

Andy Moran disagrees with you but sure ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

PressRun

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118634961#Comment_118634961

To be fair, taking a chance on an unknown in the final has been done before and worked out spectacularly - the Clare hurlers did it 2013 with Shane O'Donnell. He only played for them a couple of times early on in the season and then was dropped for the rest of the year. He was brought in for the final replay at the last moment and he ended up scoring 3-3 and of course Clare won the game.

That was a bigger risk than playing Hennelly imo - at least Hennelly had played in big games before. Rochford made a tactical decision based on stats from the drawn game. It wasn't a completely incomprehensible decision tbh.

flasher0030

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118636379#Comment_118636379

I don't think the Clare move was a bigger risk. At least with a forward if they are not being effective, there are a variety of options that the manager can look to - switching positions, bringing on a choice of subs. And little notice is taken. But with a keeper, it's all or nothing - if things go badly, only choice is to bring on sub keeper. From what I recall, Robbie made a number of mistakes, gave away a penalty, and got a black card, so the substitution was actually forced anyway. But the damage was done already. Not blaming Robbie Hennelly. He was a bundle of nerves. I think Rochford is very good. His managerial record obviously speaks volumes. But I think that was reckless that day. Unnecessarily put too much spotlight on Robbie.

spakman

I would tend to agree. I can see the tactical logic of it, Dublin had Clarke's kickouts sussed - Hennelly was actually warming up towards end of drawn game, I thought Rochford was going to bring him on then!

But I don't think Rochford gave enough thought to the pressure it put on Hennelly - based on Hennellys past experiences in high pressure situations, and also that making such a big call for a final replay was always going to be a huge talking point.

That's all with the benefit of bitter hindsight of course :)

dobman88

Anyone with 2 season tickets that cant make the game in Croke Park on Saturday, I'd give them a good home if available.

Barlett

McLaughlin played tonight in the final so he’s obviously fit again

Kalyke

I just cancelled a room in the Grand Hotel in Tralee for the night of the 12th if anyone is looking.

muddle84

https://mayogaa.com/news-detail/10077348/

Few debutants named!