Mayo GAA Discussion

Westernview

I never said you don't need a good manager but we have had some pretty good ones and it wasn't enough. The manager is only as good as the talent at his disposal.

Where we are on the role of honour isn't very relevant when you consider it's only 1 minor title and 2 u21s in what will be 40 years next year. Sporadic wins.

I know we aren't going to agree but I can't see a senior all ireland for Mayo until underage titles become a more regular occurance no matter who is in charge.

Barlett

Yeah that’s a fair enough view , but I just don’t see us winning the underage titles regularly without a serious financial investment in full time underage coaching in schools etc

MacDanger

The ladies survived a relegation playoff at the weekend and Mchale stepped down afterwards so that's both senior teams looking for a new management team. I wonder would Diane O'Hora be in the mix for it, she's done v well with Kildare

Audioslaven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123610254#Comment_123610254

it is the clubs who are developing the players not development squads run by mayo GAA or even the schools. The mayo development teams are reaping the benefits of what all the clubs have done to u14. The money and programmes need to be put into the clubs to drive it. It’s the only way to improve coaching across the county and drive it at a younger age. Young bucks are in and out of these mayo development squads and the clubs are there to pick up the pieces when they are dropped and do the reset. I think the level of coaching across clubs at underage is very questionable.
I think some of these managers at u17 and u20 are not even picking the best players. I heard Heaney got a fair clipping at some game recently over this exact point. Same with Guardiner fecking up as well if he did the right thing and could have taken a step further.

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123612277#Comment_123612277

I sat right behind the subs for the Cork game and his body language really suggested that he was done with that role, long before half time. I didn't get the impression that the players were too fond of him either based on the interactions that day.

It was the first time I ever saw a manager not joining the team in the changing room for the half time break which I found very strange?

muddle84

https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/gaa/arid-41664992.html

Horan has ruled himself out of the manager position thankfully!

naughto

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123612405#Comment_123612405

They didn't want him there in the 1st place he gas done some damage to mayo ladies gaa.

Westernview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123612980#Comment_123612980

They don't seem to want a lot of their managers. Maybe the managers aren't the problem.

Westernview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123612323#Comment_123612323

More manager blaming. Heaney and Gardiner 2 decent and fair men giving something back to Mayo football. They deserve better and respect from supporters.

Audioslaven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123613122#Comment_123613122

People are questioning why they are making such calls. This is nothing to do with calling them not decent or unfair. I think people are questioning their judgement in regards to players and selections which is totally different to what you are implying. You also get some serious blinkered supporters who see no wrong and then people are wondering why we are not wining the big prize… well go figure that one out!!

Westernview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123613378#Comment_123613378

Well they are gone now so maybe you're happier now. We now have vacancies at senior, u20, u17 and the ladies team. Its very difficult to find people willing to put in the time to manage and no wonder if they are getting a 'clipping' at games and being accused of 'fecking up'.

Audioslaven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123613449#Comment_123613449

Let me ask one question…. Have they anything in common?

blowitupref

Mayo's U17 joint managers Tom Reilly,David Heaney and Peadar Gardiner U20 manager stepped down tonight.

naughto

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123613114#Comment_123613114

Managers are only as good as there last result an machales have being shocking,people leaving the panel as they he didn't have a clue.

Any one who says managers can't kick the ball over the bar for them it's true but you need to have faith in you manager just look at donegal same team under Roachford bar murphy,who have a very good chance of winning the All-Ireland.

Westernview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123613526#Comment_123613526

Tel me what they have in common.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123613879#Comment_123613879

A lot of the players were already in Australia and not playing for Mayo before McHale took over. And previous to that Carnacon players withdrew and only one of them came back under new management.

So I'm not sure what you are expecting from McHale or the next manager that replaces him. A lot of the available players are too young to compete at senior intercounty level.

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123613931#Comment_123613931

I imagine its that they won nothing. But the u20's did win connacht this year if I remember rightly!

Westernview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123614500#Comment_123614500

And seniors won the league so it couldn't be that they are linked by winning nothing.

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123614506#Comment_123614506

The league win was three years ago at the very start of McStays stint. So I don't think you could argue he had a successful term even including that league win. No Connacht title, and a steady decline in championship performance year on year.

Overall I would say we have had little success at all three grades over the last three years to be fair.

Westernview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123614600#Comment_123614600

The last year or 2 was certainly taking a downward direction from the initial league success. But I also feel the average standard of player is falling at the same time due to retirements and long term injuries.

It may be a coincidence that all 3 adult management management posts have become vacant at the same time but it's also concerning. 2 year terms may become the norm now due to the sheer workload and pressure from supporters to deliver titles. It must be almost intolerable.

IMO the age groups between 10 to 16 are critical as formative years for developing players and this is where more focus should given. Any bad habits carried through to U17 level onwards are very hard to root out and address. We saw some poor decision making by the u17s and 20s near the end of games and there is only so much their managers can do.

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123614947#Comment_123614947

I don't see any argument against the downward trend over the last 3 years. You could argue year 1 was flat compared to 2022 which was a quarter final knock out. 2023 was also a quarter final knock out, 2024, prelim quarter final knock out and no league title, 2025 group stage knock out with no league title.

I agree on the formative years, and that there is only so much the managers can do. But isn't that why they're there? To do what they can? They pick the players that play, so if the players aren't making the right decisions, how can a portion of that not be attributed to coaching and selection? I get the managers can't take the whole blame, but they should be taking on a large portion of the responsibility. The managers are there throughout the whole selection process speaking with the clubs and running the trials after all.

muddle84

What was Ciarán's role with the minors this year? Was he part of Reilly and Heaney's backroom team?

Westernview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123615087#Comment_123615087

I'm not arguing against the downward trend. I said things were going in a downward direction. However if you're talking about flatness there was far less of it in the recent Donegal game compared to Horans last game in 22. Little or no kick from us that day and well beaten.

Yeah managers can help somewhat but after u16 they are limited a lot by the skillset of players. Put it this way I've seen a lot of managers come and go but the limitations of the players seem to follow a familiar pattern. Heads down, soloing into tackles, poor shot selection, panicky decision making on the home straight. I think a lot of the managers at U17 upwards would be achieving more connacht and AI titles if these issues were dealt with at the younger age groups.

spakman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123615193#Comment_123615193

Explain Donegal then? Or Meath

Westernview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123615269#Comment_123615269

In what way?

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123615193#Comment_123615193

Sorry, when I said flat, i meant that the trend was flat, it was neither up or down. They were knocked out in a quarter final in both years so the trend was flat from 2022 to 2023.

Again, I agree that there is only so much a manager can do, but I think you're under estimating the effect the right manager can have with players. All the things you're referencing can indeed be improved drastically with the right manager and backroom team. Horan in 2011 is a good example of that, the core of that team were well into their 20's and he improved them immensely. Just like Jim McGuinnes has with Donegal also.

Audioslaven

In regards to the Minors, by all accounts the management team for this year were going to be gone. The U16 management team will take over for next year unless someone pulls the rug under them. There are alot of political moves been played in the background I'd say!!!

Audioslaven

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123615370#Comment_123615370

Sure look at what Gavin did for Dublin. He took them onto another level. A good manager is the foundation for success and is no different than running a business.

Westernview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123615370#Comment_123615370

I've been watching Mayo since the 80s and Ive seen so many peaks and troughs. Even if a new manager improves things drastically as you say, Mayo football history suggests that that means reaching and losing all ireland finals. Have we not had enough of that?

We are often that bit short...not enough scoring forwards or quality on the bench. Horan did a lot for Mayo football but when I often heard him talking about working on players skills I cringed a bit because there's very little gain you can make in that area with senior footballers. The main difference he made was in conditioning, organisation and discipline. That has proven to be not quite enough.

TsuDhoNimh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123615091#Comment_123615091

No, not since last year. He'd stepped away.

Fingers crossed we see him involved somewhere at some level shortly. A fantastic coach that got fairly rave reviews (from players and other coaches) in his time with the academy, the minors or in with the seniors over the years.

muddle84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123615640#Comment_123615640

Yes, I know the lads that attended the trials last year from my own club were raving about him as a coach. Didn't know he had stepped away!