Richard Branson’s Edge of Space Flight - Begrudgery in Action?

JupiterKid

So as many here will be aware, billionaire and self-made business mogul Sir Richard Branson finally and successfully made it to the edge of outer space on his Unity Virgin Galactic vehicle last week. He said it was an amazing experience and wants to open space up to those wishing to pony up a cool €200K for the experience of seeing the blackness of space, the curved Earth below and four minutes of weightlessness. 

Personally, I was happy for him - but many others were most certainly not. I posted the story of Branson’s sub-orbital flight up on a Facebook group for gay men over 40 I am a member of - and the anger and vitriol in the comments reserved for Branson, and those other two billionaire space entrepreneurs - Jeff Bezos of Amazon and Elon Musk - were a real eye opener. 

I am more than aware that there is horrendous inequality and poverty, wars, Covid, famine etc. in the world, global warming where Europe is currently flooded as America burns - but Richard Branson himself has pledged almost his entire estate to charity when he kicks the bucket, has done good work already in this regard - but no, apparently he still deserves the ire and anger of people for what they see as a massive ego trip and publicity stunt for his Virgin Galactic enterprise. 

Yes, I am sure there is truth in some of those criticisms - like how the super rich hardly pay taxes, avail of legal loopholes etc. But I think Sir Richard is trying to make the world a better place and open up space tourism. Maybe I’m not as bitter, jaded and cynical as some. 

He also carried a Pride flag on his mission to mark the 5th anniversary of the Orlando gay nightclub massacre - but if anything, that made the men commenting on my post even angrier - saying he was paying “lip service » to LGBT visibility and that he treated his workers like complete dirt. 

Real begrudgery in action - and it isn’t just an Irish thing, lads... 😔🙄😏

Your views on the issue? Is that anger and bitterness against Branson really warranted?

https://boards.ie/discussion/2058199251/richard-branson-s-edge-of-space-flight-begrudgery-in-action

It's not begrudgery. It's absolute astonishment that anyone thinks that such a vanity project should be treated with anything other than contempt.

Not 100% sure why you brought sexuality into it.

You know the answer yourself.

Atlantic Dawn

It's about 4 minutes in 'space', the amount of fuel and resources needed for each flight are insane, the same bellend tax exile waffles about saving the planet he is destroying. They should be taxed at 200% per flight.

Tony EH

It's the complete redundancy and uselessness of the action that's the problem. There's no "begrudgery" involved.

Suckit

Fcking new boards. I can't quote a part of the post.

I am more than aware that there is horrendous inequality and poverty, wars, Covid, famine etc. in the world, global warming where Europe is currently flooded as America burns - but Richard Branson himself has pledged almost his entire estate to charity when he kicks the bucket,

I don't care what he does with his money, but please don't say that him pledging his money to charity after he dies is a generous thing. A lot of them do it. The cynic in me thinks dig deep enough and you may find some incentive (and not that the charities are benefitting).

Why not do it when alive? Why not go out tae fck on the streets and give (a) homeless person(s) a house that they can't sell. Or pay scientists to focus on cancer or breaking down plastics. Stop the 'culturalisation of Africa' to benefit the already wealthy. Try beating global warming. Maybe build a ship and give Dolphin massages on it.

Let them do whatever they fcking want with their money, but don't bullsh*t with the sh*t they do with it when they die. Possibly most of it is hidden for the family anyway, and the rest would be taxed etc. Or too vulgar to give. Whatever their reason for doing it, it's not imo for the good of the World.

jimmycrackcorm

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622793#Comment_117622793

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622795#Comment_117622795

Had the internet been around in 1492, the same comments would have been made about Christopher Columbus making a vanity trip across the sea and about the wasted resources doing so. Yes, I'm aware that Branson isn't going there and finding a new country, but this is about humans pushing the boundaries of possibility.

It's very likely that in the future there will be space tourism, hotels in space, all made possible because a few rich people started funding the journeys just as the Columbus trip was. History is littered with successes despite the whinging naysayers.

jimmycrackcorm

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622810#Comment_117622810

Bill Gates does this in practice and only gets blamed for some sort of 5G chip conspiracy. If I were a billionaire, I'd just stick to space travel and avoid the conspiracy theories.

Atlantic Dawn

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622819#Comment_117622819

Christopher C was using the wind and timber to get from A to B, wasn't bothering anyone except those who believed the earth was flat.

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622819#Comment_117622819

Comparing Richard Branson with Christopher Columbus is amazingly beautiful in it's simplicity and disregard of context.

Branson didn't push any boundary. None whatsoever.

con747

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622824#Comment_117622824

FFS the Earth is not flat? 😮

jimmycrackcorm

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622826#Comment_117622826

Branson, Bezos, and Musk are pushing boundaries. In my grandparent's generation, tourism wasn't a thing. Now everyone travels worldwide.

Columbus was mocked for going on a ridiculous nonsensical journey on a wild hunch. Maybe by your own ancestors who didn't have the imagination to envision anything that they couldn't see right in front of their eyes...

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622840#Comment_117622840

Branson didn't do anything that hadn't been done before. Comparing him to Columbus is either incredibly disingenuous or incredibly ignorant.

Effects

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622845#Comment_117622845

Well he's made it possible for anyone with 200 grand to go on a crappy four minute trip into space. That hasn't really been done before.

jimmycrackcorm

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622845#Comment_117622845

Why is it only necessary to do something that someone hasn't been done before to make it important?

If you actually took more than one second to read my post, I wasn't implying he was doing the same, I was saying that idiots mock people who don't actually understand the implications of what it's about. There's no doubt that there were people in 1492 thinking that Columbus was an idiot.

Let me ask you this: Do you think that in the future there won't be hotels in space? Bearing in mind that world travel itself was historically only a rich pursuit?

I watched the entire Branson 'space' experience from beginning to end, since I had a few minutes free, and my main takeaway was that he is some scammer.

Recreate the Virgin Galactic travel experience for free by bending your knees slightly in an upward bound lift.

magicbastarder

i am a little confused about this being something that's groundbreaking. it's over 60 years since this was first achieved.

In terms of the innovation of space travel, that goes to NASA and all the other space agencies. Space is incredibly important in terms of our general future but to date, I haven't seen much evidence that Musk or Branson are doing it for any huge benefit to society.

If anything, I think it points to a general need to tax the mega wealthy more. And I'd totally be in favour of sending that money into scientific endeavors by the various research groups that exist.

magicbastarder

"Virgin Galactic moved into its facilities in New Mexico in May 2019 after years of delay. The glitzy building, called Spaceport America, was paid for with more than $200 million in mostly taxpayer money"

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/07/11/tech/richard-branson-virgin-galactic-space-flight-scn/index.html

billionaires going into space for ****'n'giggles on taxpayer subsidised jollies sounds like a dystopian sci-fi movie, not something to be admired.

Del2005

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622886#Comment_117622886

We already have enough junk in space. Can we not keep ruining places for tourism.

People are complaining that air travel is bad for the environment but at least that is bringing people and freight where its needed. What is the use of sending ordinary people to nearly space?

Tony EH

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622829#Comment_117622829

You should ask Richard Branson. He might know.

Montage of Feck

I like Branson, but his flight was hardly revolutionary you could fly to the edge of space in a 60's era Mig and the US had the X-15 which operates much the same as the virgin galactic.

But fair play to him anyway for following his passions.

francois

He's involved in the most expensive willie waving contest of all time

buried

Comparing the situation to 1492 is completely ridiculous. Columbus went in search of the great passage to the east through a land beyond the west, and he had plenty of evidence to show he wasn't going to fall off the edge of the world in doing so, or run out of oxygen in a perpetual dark vacuum by doing it either. Outer Space is a different animal. We as a species cannot survive in it, nor ever will. Anybody that ever went up there to the zone that is well beyond the exosphere, levels towards deep space near the moon, they never went back up there either. There is a reason for it. I'd be intrigued to see if Branson does it again. I've a feeling he won't.

AllForIt

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622803#Comment_117622803

I'm sure some said the same thing when people started attaching wings onto bicycles.

Christy42

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117624348#Comment_117624348

What did he invent? They were trying to invent a flying machine. Branson isn't trying to invent anything. We have had people in space for the last 60 years. He didn't even come close to ISS so what did he do that was unique?

There are a lot of benefits to space travel. Branson's little jaunt is not one of them. Curious how much tax payer money his company brought in in covid relief schemes as well. Would this have been possible without public funding going to his companies I wonder.

Same for Bezos. He is entirely funded off of abusing his workforce.

greenpilot

Firstly. I think the engineering team are to be applauded for their skills and ingenuity in applying current tech to try to push the boundaries of what a private company can achieve.

Secondly, most of the negative comments come from folks who have zero interest in Spaceflight, engineering or aeronautics. Let them off. Ignorance is bliss.

If it takes the drive of a few egotistical billionaires to push the technology of Rocket Engineering and orbital/suborbital flight, then great!

Capt'n Midnight

Branson the shameless self promoter pipped him to the post.

New Glenn and the BE4 engine still haven't flown never mind made it to orbit reliably. Nothing to show for how deep Bezos' snout has been in the trough. Main contribution to the space race is lawsuits against NASA funding others.

He's even using other people's rockets to launch his satellites. Branson has put stuff in orbit.

In this competition Bezos is the one with an "*" beside his name.

BTW first civilian flight above 50 miles in a reusable craft was 17/1/63 by Joseph A. Walker in an X15.

Bezos will have one record "the world's first unpiloted suborbital flight with an all-civilian crew" ie they are going as Payload

AllForIt

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117624383#Comment_117624383

Apparently flight travel can be a lot quicker by going straight up and down, rather than the more linear fashion it's done now. That can't be done with regular 747's and thus a redesign is necessary. Perhaps his work will help in that regard.

Pics of him standing up in the ship with a model in his arms and the earth visible in the background or it never happened.

JupiterKid

Well, it seems like there are a few very valid concerns around the flight - but I believe this is more part of a wider push to open outer space to tourism than a simple vanity exercise for Branson, Musk and Bezos.

Sure there is some competition and one-upmanship between the three of them, but the history of space exploration has shown us that competition boosts innovation and taking risks to advance human spaceflight.

And Wally Funk is going up on Tuesday. 👍👍😎

Would you go up there if you got the chance?

Dr. Bre

Stay at home Richard

magicbastarder

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117624439#Comment_117624439

first paragraph, i don't think anyone is disputing that.

second paragraph, you don't know that.

and also, it's like saying 'you can't have an opinion on an epidemic of gun crime unless you can field strip an M-16'. what he's doing is helping to feed the egos of the ultra rich.

JupiterKid

Looks like many on this forum share the same opinions of those who responded to my post on FB last week. There always has been, and always will be the politics of envy. Some people always see the negative in everything and have little good to say about anything and anyone.

The rich and the famous get a lot of criticism and flak for doing things in a public way - some of it perhaps deserved, some not IMO like Branson's flight. I recall years ago an interviewer asking Elton John about the 'outrageous' bill for fresh flowers he'd had delivered to his UK home - it had been all over the red top tabloids that were screaming indignation. He came straight back that he could spend his money how he pleased but those sneering should remember that his £500K kept a lotof florists and gardeners busy

Building an ocean going yacht a metre longer than your nearest rival billionaire keeps a lot of people in work, and they are mostly good jobs. Yes, the planet is in a pickle entirely of our own making - but how many of those Branson naysayers could genuinely claim to never ever be frivolous with their disposable income?

Hypocrites methinks.

magicbastarder

classic irish response - when others disagree with you, claim it's begrudgery.

whisky_galore

Not begrudgery, I'm sure there's far more worthy things you could be doing with a sh1t ton of money than a boys-with-toys dick measuring contest and opening up space to (of course) the super-rich.

silverharp

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117631192#Comment_117631192

you mean like the first commercial airlines in the 20's and 30's

Mr_Muffin

His money. He can do what he pleases with it.

magicbastarder

"Virgin Galactic moved into its facilities in New Mexico in May 2019 after years of delay. The glitzy building, called Spaceport America, was paid for with more than $200 million in mostly taxpayer money"

branson seems to have form in making money from the public purse. (the article below is not the one containing the quote above, which was posted earlier in the thread)

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/jun/10/truth-richard-branson-virgin-rail-profits

Capt'n Midnight

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117630001#Comment_117630001

Outer space ?

Dennis Tito went to the ISS for 8 days of weightlessness back on April 28, 2001. Sub orbital flights with a few minutes zero gravity don't really count.

breezy1985

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117631142#Comment_117631142

I really don't have a problem with Branson or John or whoever spending money how they like.

What I find really weird is how people like yourself obsess and idolise these billionaires. The worst at the moment is Musk the way some people fawn over everything he says and does but the craziest one of all was Jobs. The hero worship of Jobs was essentially a cult with his special uniform people swallowing every word especially at those big church cult press releases he used do

JupiterKid

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117631720#Comment_117631720

No, I don't fawn over Richard Branson, Elon Musk or any other billionaire space adventurers. They are flawed individuals just like you and me. But unlike you or me, being rich, they have the means to follow their ambitious dreams. The sheer extent of their wealth does bother me as the gap between the ultra-rich and everyone else widens further - but that is neo-libersal capitalism and how it works. I just think that they don't deserve all the scorn and criticism they get from naysayers - they are trying to do something that will ultimately be beneficial for humankind.

And I'm pretty sick and tired of that old chestnut "we shouldn't explore space, under the oceans etc. because of all the problems on Earth etc." - if we all held that view, nothing much would progress and we'd stay in our caves, fearing our own shadows.

magicbastarder

i don't think anyone has made that argument here. and i don't think anyone here will be saying the same thing about, say, the launch of the james webb telescope when that goes ahead (hopefully later this year), as they are saying about branson.

the aim of what branson is doing is to facilitate space tourism; it's not about exploration, not about science or knowledge. it's about giving the ultra rich an opportunity to spend a literal shed load of money so they can have a nice view.

breezy1985

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117631770#Comment_117631770

I don't know you seem to be getting pretty bothered about any criticism of him. It comes across as being beyond just disagreeing about his endeavors.

As for space flight I have been crazy about it ever since I was a child and watch all the actual exploration done by the likes of Cassini, Rosetta and the Mars rovers.

What Branson done was not exploration as he did not explore anything or go anywhere new. Its like saying I should be praised on high for going to Paris for a weekend. Ide probably do what he done if I had the money but why you or anyone else gets so excited and reverential about it I'll never understand

Drexel_3

I look at it this way. The more people / companies flying to space the more accessible it will become.

Macy0161

Most of the criticism of Branson I've seen has been pointing out that he was funding this, while calling* for State Aid for various other parts of his "empire". Bezos gets the same regarding the tax avoidance/ tax position his company takes. I personally wouldn't call either begrudgery, more calling out the juxtaposition/ hypocrisy.

*which he did from his Private Caribbean Island.

JP Liz V1

Space Monkeys

Ultimate Gowlbag

I havent seen the begrudgery others might have,but i was more amused by the fact that it seemed nobody actually cared about the whole thing.....he done this supposedly amazing thing and it seems the world just said "meh"!

breezy1985

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117632909#Comment_117632909

Because it was "meh" compared to actually amazing stuff in the 21st century like landing a robot on a fast moving asteroid

Shebean

Proof that there is such a thing as too much money. His business of course but when you look at it from a moral perspective it's a disgusting vanity project.

The Amazon Rainforest is giving off more CO2 than it takes in. Up to 10 times more in some regions. We have people living and dying on the streets and starving to death. Not Branson's responsibility I know.

There should be a cap on personal profit with allowances or exceptions made on charity and social projects. Excess should be used to help the most vulnerable and tackle climate change. Between his airline and if this becomes a regular thing, how much damage to the environment was required for this?

Branson is doing this for ego and profit. He does not deserve a pat on the head.

BattleCorp

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622793#Comment_117622793

I'd agree with you on many things but not this. It's Branson's money paying for it so why shouldn't he spend his money as he sees fit.