Divorcing my wife ahead of inheriting

LegacyUser

My mother and father recently passed seventy years of age, I got married last year to my but we have had a tonne of marital problems since.

I wont go into detail on it now or here as everyone will have their own judgemental opinions and I don't want to turn this into a dumpster thread. I had tried very hard to keep my wife happy, I have my own house no mortgage bought outright since before meeting my wife.

I was about to buy her a used car this week, we spent time abroad together previously and returned to Ireland last year amid the pandemic, my wife has far higher educational qualifications than myself and is constantly belittling me on this, I am a regular guy who spent alot of his life and have been working on the family farm since the return and drawing dole, my father would give me a few thousand in cash every now and then and is a kind and caring man.

My wife constantly belittles me over not working when I am working albeit not in a way that she sees fit, I am enjoying whereas she is only happy when she sees me struggling and suffering. She is 35 years old and last week I approached the topic of children and she flat out rejected it until I had a career full-time established here. This is coming on her drawing PUP non stop since she lost her job due to covid. I never once criticises her on this.

Anyway I had a long and frank discussion with my parents yesterday and their decision is that they are going to disinherit me if I don't leave my wife as I'd lose half of everything in the inevitable breakup and divorce. Everything would be left to my sister if that happened. We are talking 3 houses, a farm with 50k per year income and a value of €1.5m and around €400k savings so as you can imagine when I do inherit it will be very substantial.

My parents already bought my sister a house at my own forcing as they were cheap in the post crash environment and my sister hadn't a penny herself at the time but has since got herself into a great career paying well shes been working since college non-stop. I love my sister and wouldn't care if she got everything as me and my father generally don't enjoy as good a relationship as we should due to differences over the farm and we will often have a roaring match over something but I'm the only son and the family name mentality is huge by him. He has neglected the farm to point of disaster, it is like a warzone and an embarrassment compared to other tasty tidy farmers who have pride in the place, a classical example of a business where a penny was never spent only profits extracted and everything left to rot and fall apart.

I have fallen out of love with my wife to be honest due to her treatment of me, our sex life became non-existent and we don't even live under the same roof now. My parents stark discussion has forced me to finally decide it is better to separate from a money point of view and the fact she isn't ready for kids despite her age profile running late. I tried hard but I also want my freedom. My father put it bluntly, get rid of her now, the land and money will always be there, you will meet another woman and you can have a child but never marry again unless the law changes to a fairer system.

It is a tough one with family first misogyny but is steering me towards ending the marriage. I have booked a few sessions with a therapist to discuss it also.

Big Bag of Chips

Why would you even suggest having a child to your wife? I'm not surprised she flat out rejected it. You two are not happy. You are talking about divorce and getting rid of her. Bringing a child into that situation is a ridiculous notion.

Get yourself to a counsellor. Pick apart your issues. Why you ended up in a marriage with a woman you are so incompatible with. Why you tried to discuss having a child as recently as last week. And why you're already thinking of meeting someone else, having a child with her but not giving her any security.

I hope if you do meet the future mother of your child that you are honest with her from the beginning. That you see her as nothing more than the provider of your heir (where will your child live while you ensure the mother has zero rights to any of your assets?

Your marriage is very unhappy, and you really really need to pick through that with a professional. But please do not even consider having a baby with a woman unless you are willing to at least try to share your lives. It will only end worse than the situation you're in now.

You need to speak to a solicitor, and your parents need to too. You could end up having to sell a chunk of everything in order to pay the inheritance tax that will be owed. Also, your parents could be around for another 20 years yet.

Caranica

You need to talk to a solicitor. Divorce in Ireland is never final and any settlement can be revisited if there is a change in one party's circumstances. The shorter your marriage the stronger your position is.

Ellie2008

There’s a lot to take in in your post.

As a aside with a house mortgage free you are in a far better position than most & should be declaring your income.

It doesn’t sound like you & your wife like eachother much if at all. It has been a bad year to put it mildly & I think tempers are frayed all around.
Only you can decide what steps to take but as another poster has said I don’t think divorce is as final as you think it is so I’d recommend you consult a solicitor.

It comes across as if your parents are putting pressure on you to divorce. That may not be the right thing for your relationship. It’s been a bad year, both you & your wife are unemployed. Maybe it’s possible up save the relationship. Presumably there were reasons you married eachother, have they all disappeared?
Maybe your parents should seek legal advice as there are many sophisticated ways to leave someone property that might mean that it’s off the table in a divorce trusts, life estates etc, not something I know a huge amount about but worth getting good legal advice. I think it would be a pity if money concerns drove your relationship into the ground.

The first step Id advise you to take is to find the right therapist & talk all of this through. Maybe you could also go to couples counselling.

ztoical

Ignoring the money side of things OP why on earth do you want to stay together? You've written nothing positive about your wife or your relationship. Its frankly baffling you want to have a child with her.

Why put all this other information in your post, or post at all? You are clearly unhappy in the relationship so end it but you also have other issues as well. You have a good relationship with your father and have screaming matches with him but he gives you money regularly and his kind and caring, you say he's ruined the farm but also state its worth 50K annually. But your working on the farm so why, if the plan is for you to take it over anyway, aren't you helping to improve what you think is wrong? What exactly are your goals and dreams in life other then inheriting? Have a kid I guess but why? Cus you want one or because its expected? I'm not trying to have a go OP, I just think your focusing on the wrong thing focusing on money. You've only been married 1 year but already having such issue so end it, not cus of the inheritance but because you aren't happy.

Focus on yourself OP, figure out what you want, not your wife, or your parents or society.

TheW1zard

Hes not asking any questions, looks pretty black and white!

K.Flyer

ztoical wrote: »

[...]You've only been married 1 year but already having such issue so end it, not cus of the inheritance but because you aren't happy.
Focus on yourself OP, figure out what you want, not your wife, or your parents or society.

This a thousand times.. Life is way too short to have that sort of drama in your life.. cut and run.

antix80

K.Flyer wrote: »

This a thousand times.. Life is way too short to have that sort of drama in your life.. cut and run.

First of all.. If it's as bad as you say it is I'd be telling madam to take a hike as soon as possible. Did you ever love each other?

You probably do need to have a good think about your future plans. I think your father's right this time but what if he holds the inheritance over your head, or you tip away on the farm and he leaves it all to your sister?

bilbot79

Urgent divorce. Don't bother with the therapist.

AckwelFoley

Your parents can't leave all to one siblings and you with nothing. Maybe in Hollywood but in the real world that would be a will that gets contested. Monies received during their life such as a house etc would be taken into consideration

Sounds like a **** relationship to be in. You need to get out the gap as fast as your 2 legs can carry you. It's not going to get better.

Gekko

You don’t mention a prenup so I assume you don’t have one.

Get to a solicitor asap and get the divorce sorted

You’ll most likely have to pay off the wife or sell your house and split the proceeds but it doesn’t sound like that will be too much of an issue for you

Larbre34

Gekko wrote: »

You don’t mention a prenup so I assume you don’t have one.

Get to a solicitor asap and get the divorce sorted

You’ll most likely have to pay off the wife or sell your house and split the proceeds but it doesn’t sound like that will be too much of an issue for you

Prenuptial agreements have no validity in Ireland. So nobody has them.

Big Bag of Chips

OP, one other thing to consider is your dad's influence into your life. He shouldn't get a say on your relationships. He has no right to tell you to meet someone, have a child, but never get married. I can see his point with this relationship if it is really as bad as you claim. But.. Why did you get married? Did you love each other at one time? Has your families influence and interference in any way contributed to your marriage difficulties?

Is you sister married? Is she allowed get married if she wants? Or is it ok for her because she's a woman, so their thoughts are if her marriage breaks down she'll just kick her husband out and keep everything?

Your family situation sounds quite toxic. You are an adult man whose life is being controlled by the old patriarch. That might suit you, for now. But as mentioned your dad could live another 20+ years. Do you live your life by his rules until then. Never finding your own happiness? Can I ask why don't you work? Surely gaining your own independence now away from your family should be a priority. Especially if you don't actually work, and take a proper income from the farm. For as long as you are hanging around waiting for your inheritance your dad pretty much controls you. He controls everything about your life. He's already making sure you get rid of your wife. He has told you you won't be allowed settle down again with someone. Although maybe he doesn't realise if you have a child with a woman, and live with her she will likely be entitled to something of your precious assets, regardless of whether you're married or not.

I feel sad for you, OP. Your life isn't your own.

tea and coffee

Forget what your parents want- the other posters are right- it won't be a case of divorce the wife, cash in..
What do you want yourself- I think the counselling is a good idea for sure

Hannibal_Smith

I really hope you follow through and see the therapist OP. That family situation is not healthy. To be fair to your wife now is not an ideal time to be having a baby when you're not working and she is out of work because of Covid. You're not thinking it through at all and all you're seeing is her body clock running down, which is very unfair on her.

To be getting what sounds like pocket money from your dad every now and again is no way to sustain a family of your own. It's left you in a situation now where you feel your family are calling the shots in your life.

If your marriage isn't a happy one, that's reason enough to separate. It's something you have been thinking about yourself for some time.

But equally, you need to get some sort of independence from your family. What's to say they won't like the next person and threaten the same thing? You have a legal right share in your parents estate so a will attempting to dilute that can be challenged, but it's extremely poor form for your parents to be using something like that as a carrot to control your life.

Ellie2008

AckwelFoley wrote: »

Your parents can't leave all to one siblings and you with nothing. Maybe in Hollywood but in the real world that would be a will that gets contested. Monies received during their life such as a house etc would be taken into consideration

Sounds like a **** relationship to be in. You need to get out the gap as fast as your 2 legs can carry you. It's not going to get better.

It’s very difficult to contest a will in Ireland. It’s called a Section 117 application & the court will only change the will of the court is satisfied the testator didn’t make “proper provision” for the child which is an onerous standard. Lots of caselaw on it. By the sounds of it the OPs family have supported him. Nobody is entitled to a inheritance.

Ellie2008

Hannibal_Smith wrote: »

I really hope you follow through and see the therapist OP. That family situation is not healthy. To be fair to your wife now is not an ideal time to be having a baby when you're not working and she is out of work because of Covid. You're not thinking it through at all and all you're seeing is her body clock running down, which is very unfair on her.

To be getting what sounds like pocket money from your dad every now and again is no way to sustain a family of your own. It's left you in a situation now where you feel your family are calling the shots in your life.

If your marriage isn't a happy one, that's reason enough to separate. It's something you have been thinking about yourself for some time.

But equally, you need to get some sort of independence from your family. What's to say they won't like the next person and threaten the same thing? You have a legal right share in your parents estate so a will attempting to dilute that can be challenged, but it's extremely poor form for your parents to be using something like that as a carrot to control your life.

The legal right share applies to spouses. I think you mean the rules of intestacy where there is no will. Where there is a will regarding children the courts will subject to limited exceptions respect the wishes of the deceased which is only right IMO.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/death/the_deceaseds_estate/what_happens_the_deceaseds_estate.html#

Idle Passerby

Last week you wanted a baby, this week you want a divorce. Your only married a year OP, was it this dysfunctional before the wedding? To be honest your total financial dependence on your elderly, manipulative parents at this stage of your life doesn't make you the most sympathetic character in the marriage.

Jequ0n

Sounds like everybody in the situation is only focussed on themselves and uses others as pawns. I’d get rid of the wife first and ensure you get your share of the inheritance on your terms. Your parents are past 70 and might need you more in the future, so make sure they are aware of this. It will feel great if you take on some control of your own life and those who seek to control it.

Neyite

I actually don't see anything wrong with your wife wanting you to have a career, a fall back option for you. I also can't fault her for wanting a future father for her kids to be independent of his parents and to earn his own money, not get ad-hoc pocket money from Dad in return for tough physical work.

While I don't think your marriage sounds like a good one right now and it might be better off for your both to go separate ways, I really don't like the way that your parents are dictating your life for you either.

Frankly, by holding the inheritance over your head and by your preference to not have your own career, they've got you by the balls for the next 20 odd years and could still go and leave the lot to a donkey sanctuary anyway. Or spend the lot and have the farm taken for the Fair Deal scheme. So if you don't divorce this wife, and if you stay unmarried, if you don't dump the next girlfriend you get because they don't like her, if you don't eat your vegetables or for any silly reason they want, they can threaten to disinherit you. That's no way to live, is it?

I agree that you need to talk it over with an impartial counsellor to figure out what choices you want for your life.

Ellie2008

Neyite wrote: »

I actually don't see anything wrong with your wife wanting you to have a career, a fall back option for you. I also can't fault her for wanting a future father for her kids to be independent of his parents and to earn his own money, not get ad-hoc pocket money from Dad in return for tough physical work.

While I don't think your marriage sounds like a good one right now and it might be better off for your both to go separate ways, I really don't like the way that your parents are dictating your life for you either.

Frankly, by holding the inheritance over your head and by your preference to not have your own career, they've got you by the balls for the next 20 odd years and could still go and leave the lot to a donkey sanctuary anyway. Or spend the lot and have the farm taken for the Fair Deal scheme. So if you don't divorce this wife, and if you stay unmarried, if you don't dump the next girlfriend you get because they don't like her, if you don't eat your vegetables or for any silly reason they want, they can threaten to disinherit you. That's no way to live, is it?

I agree that you need to talk it over with an impartial counsellor to figure out what choices you want for your life.

Fair deal is a very good point, I don’t how it could impact a farm.

Ellie2008

Idle Passerby wrote: »

Last week you wanted a baby, this week you want a divorce. Your only married a year OP, was it this dysfunctional before the wedding? To be honest your total financial dependence on your elderly, manipulative parents at this stage of your life doesn't make you the most sympathetic character in the marriage.

Who is manipulating who though? Is the OP not somewhat manipulating the situation himself by waiting around for the farm. Plus the lack of loyalty to a woman he swore loyalty to a mere year ago.

Big Bag of Chips

Ellie2008, Personal Issues isn't a discussion forum. We ask posters to offer advice to the OP when posting rather than getting into discussion with other posters.

Thanks,
BBoC

Gekko

Larbre34 wrote: »

Prenuptial agreements have no validity in Ireland. So nobody has them.

Did not know that

xzanti

anewpath wrote: »

get rid of her now, the land and money will always be there, you will meet another woman and you can have a child but never marry again unless the law changes to a fairer system.

Find a woman, knock her up and give her zero security. Great advice Dad.

Your situation sounds miserable. If you want out then divorce your wife. But don't let your parents sway you one way or the other.

fits

Get your divorce and sort yourself out. Don’t be afraid to walk away from the farm. It sounds like a millstone more than anything.

xzanti

fits wrote: »

Get your divorce and sort yourself out. Don’t be afraid to walk away from the farm. It sounds like a millstone more than anything.

Hear, hear.

votecounts

AckwelFoley wrote: »

Your parents can't leave all to one siblings and you with nothing. Maybe in Hollywood but in the real world that would be a will that gets contested. Monies received during their life such as a house etc would be taken into consideration

Sounds like a **** relationship to be in. You need to get out the gap as fast as your 2 legs can carry you. It's not going to get better.

They can. know plenty who plan to leave all to one child and nothing to the rest.
Do what's right for yourself, your Fathers ultimatum is shocking

Smee_Again

votecounts wrote: »

They can. know plenty who plan to leave all to one child and nothing to the rest.

The parents can leave a child out of the will but the child can claim the parents failed in their moral duty to provide proper provision for the child in accordance with his means.

sporina

Big Bag of Chips wrote: »

OP, one other thing to consider is your dad's influence into your life. He shouldn't get a say on your relationships. He has no right to tell you to meet someone, have a child, but never get married. I can see his point with this relationship if it is really as bad as you claim. But.. Why did you get married? Did you love each other at one time? Has your families influence and interference in any way contributed to your marriage difficulties?

Is you sister married? Is she allowed get married if she wants? Or is it ok for her because she's a woman, so their thoughts are if her marriage breaks down she'll just kick her husband out and keep everything?

Your family situation sounds quite toxic. You are an adult man whose life is being controlled by the old patriarch. That might suit you, for now. But as mentioned your dad could live another 20+ years. Do you live your life by his rules until then. Never finding your own happiness? Can I ask why don't you work? Surely gaining your own independence now away from your family should be a priority. Especially if you don't actually work, and take a proper income from the farm. For as long as you are hanging around waiting for your inheritance your dad pretty much controls you. He controls everything about your life. He's already making sure you get rid of your wife. He has told you you won't be allowed settle down again with someone. Although maybe he doesn't realise if you have a child with a woman, and live with her she will likely be entitled to something of your precious assets, regardless of whether you're married or not.

I feel sad for you, OP. Your life isn't your own.

fair enough - but what advice would you give the OP?

JustAThought

votecounts wrote: »

They can. know plenty who plan to leave all to one child and nothing to the rest.
Do what's right for yourself, your Fathers ultimatum is shocking

I wouldn’t agree with you. Its probably the father sees the marriage as the dysfunctional car crash it seems to be & is being honest. Why should he favour a blown-in his son barely functions with a year into a marriage with the gift of half a farm that may have been in the family for generations. Perhaps he also sees a golddigger or opportunist. As it is, he at least is being honest with the son in case the son is planning on working for cash in hamd and little wage with the presumption of inheriting as many sons do. The father os letting him know what is ahead and being financially honest and seeking not to take advantage of his labour and to let him know his honest intentions. Seems fair.

As for the marriage - can you get an annulment?
<Mod Snip> The marriage sounds over. Sometimes you need to cut your losses and walk away. <Mod Snip>

How did things ever get this bad so quickly?
And the father is right about life goals and the children.

<Mod Snip>

3DataModem

You mention the fact you lived abroad for a while. If you are planning to start the process, you *might* be better off doing it in the other country you lived in if possible. I know someone who separated while living in the UK and immediately started UK divorce proceedings in case their spouse started them in Ireland first. As a poster above said, Irish divorce may never be final from a financial perspective.

MouseTail

Smee_Again wrote: »

The parents can leave a child out of the will but the child can claim the parents failed in their moral duty to provide proper provision for the child in accordance with his means.

No they can't, there is no moral duty to leave estate to adult children. The only exception is if that child is incapacitated.

Smee_Again

MouseTail wrote: »

No they can't, there is no moral duty to leave estate to adult children. The only exception is if that child is incapacitated.

Of course they can, whether they are successful is another story but leaving them out entirely opens the door to the will being challenged.

99nsr125

https://boards.ie/discussion/2058197514/divorcing-my-wife-ahead-of-inheriting

Your parents are right

Caranica

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117584579#Comment_117584579

Friends of mine were both nationals of another country, married there, lived in Ireland about 10 years. Divorced in their home country (much much easier) then one party went to get remarried and registrar wouldn't accept foreign divorce as Ireland was both of their countries of residence. So what you're suggesting may not work.

jimmycrackcorm

https://boards.ie/discussion/comment/117622134#Comment_117622134

The most recent divorce referendum to shorten the term to two years also allowed for the recognition of foreign divorces so that has changed.

As for the OP, his father is spot on.

AmberGold

You’ve titled your thread divorce ahead of inheritance like this is the main event. It sounds like the goose is cooked on a few fronts and the inheritance is a long way off.

As another poster has said move to the UK, file for divorce pronto! One year into a marriage that’s not working, no point in prolonged suffering. Be prepared to hand over half the house, small price to pay if you ask me!

1874

Op doesnt say where they got married?

I'd consider keeping the wife onside and suggest moving to where they got married for the purposes of work or if she is equally onboard even to openly discuss divorce, but I would aim for the former.

While I wouldnt have thought Id agree with the parents, I can see where they are coming from, and it just doesnt sound like the marriage is ever likely to be a success. It is possible two people can turn things around, but equally prolonging the agony may equally worsen things.

I suggest get out as quick as possible, I'm less aware of what the conditions of an allument are and it may simply be easier to get a divorce abroad.

Under no circumstances bring a child into that relationship. It is possible a child can be loved by both parents but I think they will always know there is a division of feelings. The longer you stay in this situation the worse it is and if you have a child, you are screwed completely.

I say this, because many of the things the OP says sound very familiar to me, in my experience subtle to blatant belittling of qualifications, despite being a hard worker, diminishing someones contributions.

I know saying not to bring a child into such a relationship may sound harsh, but it wont fix things imo, you are tied to someone that doesn't like you and you them for the rest of your life. imo divorce ASAP and break all contact with them. While I wouldn't cut them out completely, I'd even be cautious of common friends. I love my child dearly and could never think of them not being around, but despite feeling I would have less of a relationship and possibly no rights with them if I had not got married, I consider myself worse off being married. There is nothing pleasant in an unhappy marriage or one where the other person lays down the conditions and limits of that relationship. Not to be more callous, but I would sleep apart from someone like that and not take any chances (ie complete abstinence) in case in a moment of weakness you get on the hook, or even without cause, told you are a father.

Get out asap imo, all the better if there is a possibility of doing it abroad.

notAMember

Tbh, while your relationship is very rocky with your wife, she talks some sense on not having children as neither of you have jobs or a direction on the farm. What age are you yourself? If your parents are in their seventies, you are potentially mid 40’s to early 50’s now, so I am assuming you’re not a grad starting a career here.

Is the farm responsibility the reason you can’t get a job? do you want to farm permanently and your dad won’t hand over the reigns? In his 70’s it will be difficult to maintain the farm , what is their plan on succession of that business? Hire a farm manager?

Do you think your wife is stressed out by the pandemic, moving country and not having a car in rural Ireland? Her situation sounds fairly bleak. Is she Irish?

Your relationship with your parents is incredibly dependant for an adult.

The farm is falling to pieces you’ve said, and you don’t get on with your dad. It sounds like your parents don’t like your new wife, who you have met rather late in life. Being threatened with disinheritance unless you divorce is quite the ultimatum. Did they like her before you married and something changed, or they have always disliked her and disapproved of the marriage?

This stark conversation you had with them, was it about children as you described? Are they literally threatening to cut you off because your wife isn’t a simple brood mare and is thinking through the consequences of having children while both of you are unemployed?

That conversation with your parents where you suddenly decided you didn’t love your new wife anymore once your parents mentioned you not getting a 1.5M inheritance has rocked you clearly.

I would take a deep look at that controlling relationship with your parents and think about that farm. It’s affecting your whole life.

mary 2021

If i were you id tell her you are not happy and want out and that you need to sell the house and split it. Then move into your parents house and with a few quid in the bank get your act together and enjoy your inheritence you have no kids so a re visit is not as fruitful. Put all you get into a limited company so she can get her hands on it.

jmlad2020

Any update OP? Please for the love of Christ don't continue something you aren't happy in. She would drop you like a hot potato if another man came along it by the sounds of it. High probability she divorces YOU in a few years and takes you for half, because she can.

Something similar happened in my village, guy ended up committing suicide wishing he got out earlier.

colly10

I won’t get into the relationship, it’s a one sided story, don’t know how severe or frequent the things you’ve pointed out are and everyone has problems they need to work on together. Only you can say whether you should separate, your not married long so I presume it wasn’t terrible when you married ... how long are you together?

You shouldn’t talk to family about problems with your wife but you are where you are. I find wanting to have kids at the moment bizarre given the current situation, having kids can be tough work and it certainly doesn’t sort relationships. Her age risk is overplayed by the way unless she’s a fair bit older than you.

Your family shouldn’t put the pressure on in that way but presume they think they’re doing the right thing after hearing a one sided story

I really think you should give your dad a break. He’s clearly caring cause he supports you and will still consider giving considerable inheritance. Farm work is tough, i’d say he has his money made and is burn’t out with it ... you as someone who may inherit should step up and keep it the way you feel it should be kept when he’s no longer around. Sure he can help out but works probably not his main priority now. Ye could drop the arguments with him anyway

Big Bag of Chips

jmlad2020 please do not ask for updates. Nobody is obliged to come back to the thread.

Thread closed. OP if you would like it reopened for any reason please contact me or one of the PI moderators.