Hill walkers V well everyone....

Johnny Jukebox

iwillhtfu wrote: »

I could honestly care less about someones age but in my experience it's generally those in an older bracket and wait for it.... I'm going to ruffle feathers again female that would be inclined to complain about bikes and speed.

100% my experience too.

Tenzor07

spookwoman wrote: »

Are MM an official gov funded organization, asking because what if someone injures themselves on their "upgrade" or repair?

Not sure, they seem to have Carte Blanche to carry out works on public land, they were all parked up around the aerials at Ticknock a couple of years ago, so appear like contractors... but are volunteers...

rizzodun

They have since modified their post due to the backlash they have gotten on facebook, as well as putting up a half hearted apology.

It's obviously not a nice thing to happen but to blindly blame without any evidence as it seems by their posts it's hard to have sympathy.

https://www.facebook.com/MountainMeithealDW

spookwoman

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Not sure, they seem to have Carte Blanche to carry out works on public land, they were all parked up around the aerials at Ticknock a couple of years ago, so appear like contractors... but are volunteers...

That picture you put up of the trail is far worse than what would have been there. Plenty of native plants etc destroyed by MM compared to what mountain bikes and general foot traffic had done. Judging by that picture they are a law onto themselves

Tenzor07

rizzodun wrote: »

They have since modified their post due to the backlash they have gotten on facebook, as well as putting up a half hearted apology.
It's obviously not a nice thing to happen but to blindly blame without any evidence as it seems by their posts it's hard to have sympathy.

Well yes they apologized for their Post, however they haven't said sorry for blaming Mountain Bikers for destroying the tools.... Tells you all you need to know about this shower.. and what they think of other users of the hills and forests....

nak

Tenzor07 wrote: »

I'd rather the likes of Coillte or NPWS put walking trail maintenance out to commercial tender than hand off the work to a crowd like MM..

Trail Breaker carried out the work on the Woccas.

MM gave out to us for cycling on the fire road in Tibradden, we were cycling uphill so was certainly not the speed that upset them.

Tenzor07

nak wrote: »

Trail Breaker carried out the work on the Woccas.
MM gave out to us for cycling on the fire road in Tibradden, we were cycling uphill so was certainly not the speed that upset them.

Just seen them all parked up around the aerials doing the work around fairy castle, cos they had put notices on their cars with MM printed on them...

No, certainly wasn't the speed, but your mode of transport which did the upset..

bucketybuck

Your man on that Facebook page is some clown.

Constantly parroting: "The sequence of events as outlined above point to a conclusion!", now thats a fella with a poor grasp of logic.

I especially like the non-apology:"[this paragraph has been removed as it has been misinterpreted by many readers]"
Its not that it was wrong, no, it's just that people misinterpreted it. :rolleyes:

nak

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Just seen them all parked up around the aerials doing the work around fairy castle, cos they had put notices on their cars with MM printed on them...

No, certainly wasn't the speed, but your mode of transport which did the upset..

They did do the bit up to fairy castle from the masts.

Tenzor07

bucketybuck wrote: »

Your man on that Facebook page is some clown.Constantly parroting: "The sequence of events as outlined above point to a conclusion!", now thats a fella with a poor grasp of logic.
I especially like the non-apology:"[this paragraph has been removed as it has been misinterpreted by many readers]"
Its not that it was wrong, no, it's just that people misinterpreted it. :rolleyes:

I don't know any mountain biker that goes around with power tools in the forest to cut things up...

nak

Tenzor07 wrote: »

I don't know any mountain biker that goes around with power tools in the forest to cut things up...

Plus you would need to know where the tools were stored. Did they just leave them lying around in the woods?

Tenzor07

nak wrote: »

Plus you would need to know where the tools were stored. Did they just leave them lying around in the woods?

Was covered up with a tarp near where they were digging whatever new trail MM is building.... After they reported some kids for building a trail to Coillte then the next day they found the tools all cut in half..

deandean

I don't believe any MTBers damaged those tools. A more likely cause:
After the 'tip-off' from MM, Coillte or their contractors went up to destroy the jump under construction. Which they did.
They found a load of hand tools in the area and they made the decision to chop the handles off so they couldn't be used for making further MTB trails / jumps.
I feel bad for MM for the loss of their tools and fair dues to them for the work they do.
But there is something of an an anti-MTB bias in MM, and they jumped to the wrong conclusion here.

John_Rambo

deandean wrote: »

I don't believe any MTBers damaged those tools. A more likely cause:
After the 'tip-off' from MM, Coillte or their contractors went up to destroy the jump under construction. Which they did.
They found a load of hand tools in the area and they made the decision to chop the handles off so they couldn't be used for making further MTB trails / jumps.
I feel bad for MM for the loss of their tools and fair dues to them for the work they do.
But there is something of an an anti-MTB bias in MM, and they jumped to the wrong conclusion here.

^^^ this 100%... Way to much confidence displayed here in the destruction of someone else's property, had to be backed up in a (misplaced) official capacity. Who carries enough tools and battery power on a day trip to the hills to carry out that much damage and have the time to do it in such a patient & blithe fashion?

I'm a hillwalker and there's no way this was carried out by casual hill users.

Unfortunately, it's unlikely the crew, realising their mistake are going to put their hand up, but seeing the backtracking on FB there may have been a hint of culpability in the upper echelons of the WAY to many do gooders.

saccades

nak wrote: »

Trail Breaker carried out the work on the Woccas.

MM gave out to us for cycling on the fire road in Tibradden, we were cycling uphill so was certainly not the speed that upset them.

I loved the woccas - never head over that direction anymore because the trail is so ruined.

(Although I suspect I'd be a lot more comfortable with the 29er compared to the 26" I last took that way).

fatbhoy

nak wrote: »

Trail Breaker carried out the work on the Woccas.

MM gave out to us for cycling on the fire road in Tibradden, we were cycling uphill so was certainly not the speed that upset them.

Yeah? What exactly was the context and what exactly did they say?

nak

fatbhoy wrote: »

Yeah? What exactly was the context and what exactly did they say?

Just general annoyance at our presence, cycled past them on the fire road where they had a load of vehicles parked and said hello. Grumpy responses all round about being for walkers only. Just expect it now.

Dude in Ticknock going around giving out to everyone now too, even on the fire roads. Charmers

Report of a cable on the Ravensdale trail https://www.lmfm.ie/news/lmfm-news/warning-issued-after-mountain-biker-narrowly-escaped-hitting-a-neck-high-cable-on-ravensdale-trail/

iwillhtfu

Deleted User wrote: »

Report of a cable on the Ravensdale trail https://www.lmfm.ie/news/lmfm-news/warning-issued-after-mountain-biker-narrowly-escaped-hitting-a-neck-high-cable-on-ravensdale-trail/

He was lucky although a tad worrying that he left it in place. Hopefully no one else come upon it at speed. Some people are nuckin futs.

smacl

nak wrote: »

Just general annoyance at our presence, cycled past them on the fire road where they had a load of vehicles parked and said hello. Grumpy responses all round about being for walkers only. Just expect it now.

Dude in Ticknock going around giving out to everyone now too, even on the fire roads. Charmers

I cycle all the fire roads in the area regularly and haven't had any issues yet but no doubt will do soon enough. A number of routes have been closed of and marked as private, top of Kilmashogue lane into the forest and Carthy's castle climb up to the Hellfire. I reckon this is down to the upsurge in hill walkers in the area over covid and the once quiet trails are getting busier by the day. I'm very much of a live and let live type but don't have much time for those getting possessive about what are shared public spaces. Life's too short for that nonsense.

Stark

Similar thing happened on a few walks in my local neighbourhood. They used to pass through farmers fields and a blind eye was turned. But then covid happened and routes that maybe had a couple of people a day using them now had dozens so the farmers started erecting barriers/private land signs etc. Shame to see the Carthy's castle climb closed off.

nak

Carthy's Castle climb seemed to be closed off last spring after people camping up there leaving a mess and opening gates.

Furze99

Live and let live could be a useful motto. MTB riders should keep off well used walking trails and likewise walkers should keep off MTB tracks. Unfortunately there are a few assholes on both sides, e.g. saw a couple of lads riding a narrow walking boardwalk recently and they seemed to expect everyone else to step and let them pass. Another side of this is liability where there are accidents and MTB riders are more vulnerable to this. If I was a private land owner and lads were building trails on my land, I'd be shifting them on pronto. Whether invited or not, who would want to expose yourself to big claims if someone ends up in a wheelchair. On public lands like Coillte, the tax payer is likely exposed.

iwillhtfu

I was up in the gap the other day and apparently they're opening several more trails up the hill passed the uplift drop off. This will be bringing more trails into walking areas and ticknock which already has issues with people on trails.

Funnily enough some gob****es in a car decided to drive up and park at the start of Byrner and have themselves a picnic. The mind boggles with some folk.

mad turnip

iwillhtfu wrote: »

I was up in the gap the other day and apparently they're opening several more trails up the hill passed the uplift drop off. This will be bringing more trails into walking areas and ticknock which already has issues with people on trails.

Funnily enough some gob****es in a car decided to drive up and park at the start of Byrner and have themselves a picnic. The mind boggles with some folk.

The uplift point has also been extended. I don't think I've yet seen any walkers on the new afterburner, seems to be more of an issue with euroskeptic or skyline.

iwillhtfu

mad turnip wrote: »

The uplift point has also been extended. I don't think I've yet seen any walkers on the new afterburner, seems to be more of an issue with euroskeptic or skyline.

Yeah I've never had the misfortune of coming upon any at speed thankfully. Although bizarrely enough I nearly got taken out of it by a dog at the gap as its owners crossed on the bridge they thought it would be a great idea to let the dog walk under it probably saving its paws but feck sake it would've been a bad ending had I been a second sooner as I was moving.

Tenzor07

iwillhtfu wrote: »

Funnily enough some gob****es in a car decided to drive up and park at the start of Byrner and have themselves a picnic. The mind boggles with some folk.

Is that even possible? A private car with a family?

To to get up to that road you have to have access to the gates I would have thought and know your way up...

ec18

iwillhtfu wrote: »

I was up in the gap the other day and apparently they're opening several more trails up the hill passed the uplift drop off. This will be bringing more trails into walking areas and ticknock which already has issues with people on trails.

Funnily enough some gob****es in a car decided to drive up and park at the start of Byrner and have themselves a picnic. The mind boggles with some folk.

GAP must be building on their land though not the coillte forest?


Ticknock at the weekend there was trail runner on devils elbow after the climb.....oblivious to any danger running on a separate track same on blaxin saddles i think, family standing on the trail......

Tenzor07

Furze99 wrote: »

Live and let live could be a useful motto. MTB riders should keep off well used walking trails and likewise walkers should keep off MTB tracks.
Unfortunately there are a few assholes on both sides, e.g. saw a couple of lads riding a narrow walking boardwalk recently and they seemed to expect everyone else to step and let them pass. Another side of this is liability where there are accidents and MTB riders are more vulnerable to this. If I was a private land owner and lads were building trails on my land, I'd be shifting them on pronto. Whether invited or not, who would want to expose yourself to big claims if someone ends up in a wheelchair. On public lands like Coillte, the tax payer is likely exposed.

Question for you, where do you think MTB'ers rode their bikes before Coillte knocked up a few tracks?

Also when riding a bike on narrow boardwalks it takes someone walking exactly 10 seconds to step to the side and let the biker pass. Whereas a biker would have to stop at a suitable/safe point, dismount, lift the bike to the side and await the walkers to pass and believe me there's a LOT more walkers and groups of walkers around the hills these days.

Well, that's a separate issue, we live in "Claim Culture Ireland" where you can get €50,000 for slipping on grass.

iwillhtfu

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Is that even possible? A private car with a family?

To to get up to that road you have to have access to the gates I would have thought and know your way up...

Yeah I wouldn't have thought it possible myself but they managed it somehow. I guess with all the work going on up above and the guys trying to keep tabs on lads coming through from ticknock, (which I spotted a good few doing) they found an entry

iwillhtfu

ec18 wrote: »

GAP must be building on their land though not the coillte forest?


Ticknock at the weekend there was trail runner on devils elbow after the climb.....oblivious to any danger running on a separate track same on blaxin saddles i think, family standing on the trail......

I think there might have been a bit of a reciprocal agreement in exchange for the tree felling that took place. It certainly appears to be more coillte land

iwillhtfu

Furze99 wrote: »

Another side of this is liability where there are accidents and MTB riders are more vulnerable to this. If I was a private land owner and lads were building trails on my land, I'd be shifting them on pronto. Whether invited or not, who would want to expose yourself to big claims if someone ends up in a wheelchair. On public lands like Coillte, the tax payer is likely exposed.

Yet I'm not aware of any claims submitted by MTBers but certainly a couple of well covered claims by walkers slipping on trails. I get your point about liability but clearly the supposed safer method of transit carries more risk. Perhaps we should ban walkers from these board walks :D

Hurrache

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Also when riding a bike on narrow boardwalks it takes someone walking exactly 10 seconds to step to the side and let the biker pass. Whereas a biker would have to stop at a suitable/safe point, dismount, lift the bike to the side and await the walkers to pass and believe me there's a LOT more walkers and groups of walkers around the hills these days.

Well, that's a separate issue, we live in "Claim Culture Ireland" where you can get €50,000 for slipping on grass.

In fairness at many board walk locations stepping off often involves shin deep bog. It's bad form for an MTB'er to expect someone on foot to give way particularly at times and locations when you're bound to meet some.

Tenzor07

iwillhtfu wrote: »

Yeah I wouldn't have thought it possible myself but they managed it somehow. I guess with all the work going on up above and the guys trying to keep tabs on lads coming through from ticknock, (which I spotted a good few doing) they found an entry

That's nuts! The hills of Dublin and Wicklow have literally never been as busy as of late, families out in shorts/tees and flip flops going for open mountain walks and in forests.. never seen anything like it in decades..

iwillhtfu

Tenzor07 wrote: »

That's nuts! The hills of Dublin and Wicklow have literally never been as busy as of late, families out in shorts/tees and flip flops going for open mountain walks and in forests.. never seen anything like it in decades..

They were promptly escorted off once the guys realised what was going on.

Tenzor07

Hurrache wrote: »

In fairness at many board walk locations stepping off often involves shin deep bog. It's bad form for an MTB'er to expect someone on foot to give way particularly at times and locations when you're bound to meet some.

Don't think it's bad form at all, and like I said it's very easy if you're walking to step off the boardwalk for a few seconds to let someone pass, and it's a heck of a lot quicker for all involved too.

Having said that I would do everything to avoid the boardwalks and only go their during the week...

Hurrache

Same here, during the week it's relatively quiet, but wouldn't use any of the boardwalks when on a bike regardless.

Tenzor07

Hurrache wrote: »

Same here, during the week it's relatively quiet, but wouldn't use any of the boardwalks when on a bike regardless.

These boardwalks are definitely trouble!

https://www.thejournal.ie/wicklow-way-lawsuit-2717464-Apr2016/

Working class heroes

Tenzor07 wrote: »

These boardwalks are definitely trouble!

https://www.thejournal.ie/wicklow-way-lawsuit-2717464-Apr2016/

That was fecked out on appeal. And rightly so.

JazzyJ

iwillhtfu wrote: »

I think there might have been a bit of a reciprocal agreement in exchange for the tree felling that took place. It certainly appears to be more coillte land

Going by the Coillte maps it would appear to be so.

https://www.coillte.ie/media/2017/01/kilmashogue_tiknock_all_routes.pdf

sprucemoose

i remember seeing a lot of anti-rambler jokes when i used to read MBUK back in the early 00s, kinda starting to understand where they were coming from now

knucklehead6

Tenzor07 wrote: »

These boardwalks are definitely trouble!

https://www.thejournal.ie/wicklow-way-lawsuit-2717464-Apr2016/

If you're gonna have a pop at walkers remember that the VAST majority of us were disgusted at that award, and rightly rejoiced when it was overturned.

As for cycling on the boardwalk and expecting me to step off for you? I'll step off a boardwalk for ANYONE on an ascent, be that on a bike, or foot. Its good manners and good etiquette to give the right of way to a 'climber'. But don't expect it as your god given right... remember, you are a lot more vulnerable on your bike than a bolshy walker whos decided he/she isn't getting off the boardwalk.

Tenzor07

knucklehead6 wrote: »

If you're gonna have a pop at walkers remember that the VAST majority of us were disgusted at that award, and rightly rejoiced when it was overturned.
As for cycling on the boardwalk and expecting me to step off for you? I'll step off a boardwalk for ANYONE on an ascent, be that on a bike, or foot. Its good manners and good etiquette to give the right of way to a 'climber'. But don't expect it as your god given right... remember, you are a lot more vulnerable on your bike than a bolshy walker whos decided he/she isn't getting off the boardwalk.

Everyone was relieved when that award was overturned.. Have never heard of a MTB'er claiming.. Example of which is the GAP bike park which has been open 5 years claim free from MTB'ers.

And don't worry I can spot the sorts, been encountering them on the trails since the 1990's..

iwillhtfu

Working class heroes wrote: »

That was fecked out on appeal. And rightly so.

It was indeed and as you say rightly so but my point still stands. Interesting someone mentioned an assumed given right of way when you see the reports of walkers and dogs being denied access to hills followed by the I'll go where I like brigade.

I'd like to think no one assumes a right of passage or that someone would be thick headed enough to try prove a point by denying someone passage knowing a bad result for either or both.

knucklehead6

Tenzor07 wrote: »

Everyone was relieved when that award was overturned.. Have never heard of a MTB'er claiming.. Example of which is the GAP bike park which has been open 5 years claim free from MTB'ers.

And don't worry I can spot the sorts, been encountering them on the trails since the 1990's..

ahem....

https://www.harpermacleod.co.uk/hm-insights/2016/november/court-rules-in-catastrophic-cycling-accident-case-who-is-to-blame-for-injury/

ec18

knucklehead6 wrote: »

ahem....

https://www.harpermacleod.co.uk/hm-insights/2016/november/court-rules-in-catastrophic-cycling-accident-case-who-is-to-blame-for-injury/

ahem....have you an example from Ireland?

knucklehead6

ec18 wrote: »

ahem....have you an example from Ireland?

Tenzor never stated explicitly he wanted an example from Ireland! :P:pac:

ec18

knucklehead6 wrote: »

Tenzor never stated explicitly he wanted an example from Ireland! :P:pac:

would be logical that discussing outdoor activities in Ireland that might be where examples should be? no?

We could all google hill walker compo claim and pick one from US, UK, europe to prove our point.....

knucklehead6

ec18 wrote: »

would be logical that discussing outdoor activities in Ireland that might be where examples should be? no?

We could all google hill walker compo claim and pick one from US, UK, europe to prove our point.....

jaysus, talk about missing a light hearted point....

I think the accepted phrase on boards is


WHOOOOOOSH

Lemming

How wide are those boardwalks? They don't appear to be particularly wide, certainly not to accommodate two people side by side, so what happens when a walker meets a walker, i.e. who steps off into the bog?

I ask because if the boardwalks are not particularly wide enough for more than one person, then arguments about bikes vs. walkers are a bit moot since walkers vs. walkers would most likely also be an issue (I'm getting visions of two particularly bolshy walkers doing a bout of Gladiators to decide who has to step out of the way, with walking sticks for puggle sticks with a third walker refereeing in their finest Scottish accent impersonation; "Contestant, reeeeady! Gladiator, reeeeady")