Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

Villa05

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120244423#Comment_120244423

Lagging data v current future trends

Market also heavily distorted by investment funds, Government, ahbs etc

Reduction in high salaried big tech employees may influence investment fund activity

realitykeeper

Four days ago, RTE reported that companies are having difficulty recruiting staff because they cannot find housing. This is yet another reason to evict defaulters immediately (as opposed to letting them continue to occupy houses for years into their delinquency). The reason defaulters default is because they can`t pay but a working person could pay. So kick out the defaulter, sell the house and the person with the job could buy it. The evictees could muddle along just like others have to i.e. the renters, the homeless, those living with their Moms and such like. At least it would solve the problem for companies trying to recruit and retain staff.

Of course, companies could offer to pay their new recruits more but if all companies did that, it would not solve the problem as it does not increase the housing supply and in any case it would make Ireland`s cost of labour uncompetitive.

I doubt that banks will start evicting defaulters en masse though. Anti eviction legalities, and other government ploys to prevent houses going on the market will stay in place. Keeping houses off the market is the government`s way of keeping house prices high. The government will sacrifice anything, including the country`s competitiveness on the alter of maintaining elevated house prices.

realitykeeper

A single person who has been delinquent on their mortgage for years has greater security of tenure than a large family with children who are renting and who are a few months in arrears. Why? Because evicting a person with a mortgage means the house has to be sold and that would put downward pressure on house prices. The government does not want that and neither does their quango NAMA.

ingo1984

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120244633#Comment_120244633

Witness this first hand in my company since this time last year. Large financial multi national. Lost count of the amount of successful job applicants both graduates and experienced who ultimately turned down job offer due lack of affordable rental accommodation in the locality. I feel these people will ultimately end up emigrating.

The company resorted to bringing in workers from an offshore office in Asia and putting them up in hotels. None of them last longer than six months as who wants to live in a hotel and work.

Existing staff are now leaving in their droves (myself included) as we are so under resourced, 12 hour days are now the norm.

Its a situation that will get a lot worse across multiple organisations and industries.

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120244740#Comment_120244740

Evictions don't really drive up supply.

The people evicted have to either buy another house, or, more likely, join the housing lists so the government provides them with another house.

deirdremf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120242219#Comment_120242219

Of course I appreciate that most people in the country live outside the Dublin area, it was my way of saying that his comments don't apply to a substantial percentage of people in Ireland, in particular people living in and around Cork and Galway as well as Dublin.

I just checked your time on Google maps, they say 1 hour to 1 hours 50 from Athboy to Westmoreland St., and if you leave at 7:30 am you'll arrive at 9:20 am. Slightly quicker is you avoid the M3!

deirdremf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120244633#Comment_120244633

Where will you house the defaulters?

You see the problem is that the state doesn't build much in the way of social housing any more, so it's easier for the state not to kick defaulters out, while those with the lolly can find and pay for somewhere else.

Of course, the business about the defaulters is really just a way of finding someone else to blame for the government's policies. Like in the years after the crash in 2008.

J_1980

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120243470#Comment_120243470

Hardly surprising.

Matches what I’m seeing (new developments selling out, record prices for similar houses) etc.

Only exception are properties that need substantial work. Even the biggest idiot kind of realises now that a full refurb is NOT a “100k job”.

realitykeeper

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120245038#Comment_120245038

Evictions do increase supply to buyers, i.e. people who pay their mortgages. Defaulters don`t pay their mortgages. I get that an evicted defaulter has to live somewhere, so this is really a question of who has to live with their Mom. As things stand, people saving for mortgages have to live with their moms but mortgage defaulters don`t.

realitykeeper

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120245153#Comment_120245153

Yes but the government policy is that defaulters can remain delinquent for years on end which is not normal anywhere else on the planet or for that matter, anytime in history. The longer mortgage defaulters are allowed to remain delinquent, the longer young people saving for their mortgage have to stay living in their Mom`s house. If someone has to live with their Mom, shouldn`t it be the guy who is not paying his mortgage?

Obviously the government is just trying to prevent houses going on the market because they want house prices to stay high. After all, how is their quango NAMA to make a profit without such market manipulation to keep house prices high.

deirdremf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120245211#Comment_120245211

Ma, Mam, Mammy, Mother, Mum and Mummy are all used commonly in Ireland.

Mom? Makes you look like a Yank!

realitykeeper

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120245232#Comment_120245232

I know, I`m a Paddy too but I prefer to say Mom. Mam is common (please don`t say I sound like a Brit now).

herbalplants

Here we go again confirmed for March

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/2023/02/15/christine-lagarde-reaffirms-intention-for-half-point-march-hike/

fliball123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120245680#Comment_120245680

Q3 2023 to Q2 2024 are going to be the litmus test for a recession in this country. The government must be praying the MNCs keep our GDP up as this metric is really painting over the cracks of what is going on in the country its what is pointed at all the time with regards to how brilliant we are doing as a country and when GNP or a measure without the MNCs corpo taxes is measured Ireland is really struggling.

mcsean2163

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120245232#Comment_120245232

I'm from Dublin use Mom too. Don't know why....

Villa05

The state responsible for letting buildings go into a state of disrepair while local community groups and building contractors offering finance and workers to help renovate them for housing war refugees.

Why would the state sit on its hands in such circumstances

http://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2023/0216/1356935-most-buildings-needing-work-for-ukrainians-unsuitable/

OEP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120245232#Comment_120245232

Mom is common in Cork, and Kerry I think. From the Irish Mhaim (Wom)

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120244755#Comment_120244755

I'll give you another story. I was talking to a relation teaching in one of the well known "working class" areas of Dublin. (Not the leafy southside)

She told me they have three posts available for teachers and cant get them filled, and can't even get people to apply for them.

So I said what do you do, you can't leave a clas without a teacher?

They have to take the support teachers that are supposed to be there for kids that need extra help and use them in regular classes.

We are storing up huge problems for the future because primary kids with extra needs that need early intervention are being left behind because of ridiculous accommodation costs.

dontmindme

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/9-coach-house-square-ballintyre-hall-ballinteer-dublin-16-county-dublin/4678919

What am I missing? Property on g00gle maps is so obviously a North/South facing terraced property yet from the above ad...

Living/Dining Room - 5.4m (17'9") x 3.5m (11'6")

Beautiful, light filled room with that perfect east/west orientation benefiting from early morning sun to the front and perfect sun sets on the enclosed private courtyard to the rear.

Dante

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120245232#Comment_120245232

Most people I know use mom including myself...

realitykeeper

Mortgage defaulters in this country are often delinquent for years on end. And there are a lot of them. In fact, in the years following the housing crash , as many as 300,000 were delinquent. The number is of delinquencies today is growing again.

So my question is why should they get to live for free in houses belonging to bailed out banks when those houses are needed by people who are saving and who have to live with their parents in the meantime?

If the people who are not paying their mortgages were evicted, they could live with their parents and free up houses for people who are prepared to make the mortgage payments.

The government is happy to keep properties off the market so prices stay high but I am not sure first time buyers are happy living with their parents and I doubt their parents planned on having their kids still living with them well into adulthood.

Villa05

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120247961#Comment_120247961

A factor I've never heard discussed, which I feel is a major issue is the following

When the state is funding something, business feel they can charge extortionate rates and get away with it. Its a bit like going into car repair shop and you get 1 quote if your paying for it while a completely different extortionate quote if the insurance company is paying.

I often wonder who's creaming from this and why? Is it

I'm paying so much tax, here's my chance to get some back

The state and there apparatus are clowns and I can charge what I like

Good old fashioned corruption. Contracts given to politically friendly individuals/companies and they get a licence to rip off the taxpayer.

State contracts administratively and regulatory burdensome

I'm sure there is mix of all these reasons, it would be beneficial to examine which one is the most dominant

lordleitrim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120248207#Comment_120248207

Your post is reinforced by this article here too. I could never figure out why council built 2 bed apartments cost over half a million but comparable ones on Daft in similar post code areas often cost half the price. As always, taxpayers money is never accountable....

Imagine trying to compete with the council on the bidding of a property...

Dublin City Council pays 40% over the odds for construction of social housing, audit finds

https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/dublin/2023/02/15/dublin-city-council-pays-40-over-the-odds-for-social-housing-audit-finds/

dontmindme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120248207#Comment_120248207

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120248550#Comment_120248550

Follow the money...

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120248036#Comment_120248036

What do they use her for?

herbalplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120248550#Comment_120248550

Exactly why is the tax payer's money not accountable! There is so much waste in units run by government money.

Not to mention seems like every year there is a war or disaster somewhere and we pay for it... Why not put the cash into the run down not fit for purpose health system.

Timing belt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120245232#Comment_120245232

have always used ‘mom’ and it’s quite common outside of Dublin.

dontmindme

Would have always been Ma, Mam, Mammy when I was growing up with any of the kids of the wealthier families using Mum and Mummy. Mom is a complete Americanism IMHO.

L1011

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120248154#Comment_120248154

No one bit when you posted this yesterday. Go get a blog if you wish to rant at thin air

Villa05

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120247686#Comment_120247686

The state says fesability study would take 9 months. Local estate agent says should take no longer than 3 days. Building currently laid out ideally for emergency accomodation. Add in the financial and workers offer from construction firm and local volunteers.

Works and usage would add significant value to a state asset plus offset payments made to private sector hotels as opposed to the current situation where the building is left to deteriorate

https://www.rte.ie/radio/radio1/clips/22213988/