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Ransomware & HSE

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 695 ✭✭✭ DaSilva


    I know this is a weird take for a lot of people and I know a lot of people are really invested in crypto so I expect backlash.

    I think the cryptocurrency is half the problem here, it facilitates these criminals. I understand there is little governments can do about them though, banning doesn't really have any effect. If the value of all these cryptos plummeted though, I think ransomware attacks would be far less lucrative. Pipe dream though I understand.


  • Registered Users Posts: 25,620 ✭✭✭✭ Wanderer78


    There's just some complete arseholes on this planet, I understand some could be extremely poor, and some are just simply cnuts, another sh1t storm our health system has to deal with, hopefully this might force them to update our system now


  • Registered Users Posts: 25,620 ✭✭✭✭ Wanderer78


    DaSilva wrote:
    I think the cryptocurrency is half the problem here, it facilitates these criminals. I understand there is little governments can do about them though, banning doesn't really have any effect. If the value of all these cryptos plummeted though, I think ransomware attacks would be far less lucrative. Pipe dream though I understand.


    Cryptos regularly experience pump and dumps anyway, nature of that beast


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,511 ✭✭✭ whippet


    DaSilva wrote: »
    I know this is a weird take for a lot of people and I know a lot of people are really invested in crypto so I expect backlash.

    I think the cryptocurrency is half the problem here, it facilitates these criminals. I understand there is little governments can do about them though, banning doesn't really have any effect. If the value of all these cryptos plummeted though, I think ransomware attacks would be far less lucrative. Pipe dream though I understand.

    I see your point - however the value of Bitcoin etc would have little bearing - it's the existence of a currency that is easy to hide is the problem. Regardless of the value of bitcoin they would just look for enough of it to make it worth their while.

    Also - getting the encryption keys back through paying a ransom is only half the battle - the rebuild of systems is crippling


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,212 ✭✭✭ The J Stands for Jay


    Didn't this happen to the HSE about 3 years ago? I wonder what lessons they learned from it?


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  • Registered Users Posts: 25,620 ✭✭✭✭ Wanderer78


    whippet wrote:
    I see your point - however the value of Bitcoin etc would have little bearing - it's the existence of a currency that is easy to hide is the problem. Regardless of the value of bitcoin they would just look for enough of it to make it worth their while.

    Bitcoin isn't a currency at all


  • Registered Users Posts: 939 ✭✭✭ Badly fukt


    Nonsense, crypto isn't easier to hide, it's all recorded on the blockchain in fact harder to hide


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,511 ✭✭✭ whippet


    Badly fukt wrote: »
    Nonsense, crypto isn't easier to hide, it's all recorded on the blockchain in fact harder to hide

    if that is the case why haven't we seen these hackers tracked down and prosecuted - if there is a money trail surely it would be easy.

    We only hear of the big cases like the HSE etc but there are thousands of companies every day getting hacked and paying ransom


  • Registered Users Posts: 25,620 ✭✭✭✭ Wanderer78


    whippet wrote:
    We only hear of the big cases like the HSE etc but there are thousands of companies every day getting hacked and paying ransom

    Some nice revenge hacks on YouTube, they definitely don't like it when the shoes on the other foot


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,291 ✭✭✭✭ Catmaniac


    Knowing how fragmented our HSE systems are, there has patently been lack of overall investment in IT here. It's not a bit surprising this has happened, especially at a time when vaccine rollout has been an added demand and one that has brought attention to potential exploitation.

    Somebody told me how they were trying to register on the portal for the vaccine for three days back and couldn't succeed, so that is likely enough symptomatic of an overall opportune attack on HSE.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 939 ✭✭✭ Badly fukt


    whippet wrote: »
    if that is the case why haven't we seen these hackers tracked down and prosecuted - if there is a money trail surely it would be easy.

    We only hear of the big cases like the HSE etc but there are thousands of companies every day getting hacked and paying ransom

    Simply because they are a step above the normal criminal, professionals. Crypto itself is recorded and transparent.


  • Registered Users Posts: 626 ✭✭✭ conor_mc


    Badly fukt wrote: »
    Nonsense, crypto isn't easier to hide, it's all recorded on the blockchain in fact harder to hide

    Anonymous ownership is one of the key “benefits” of crypto’s. That’s why nobody knows who Satoshi whatsisname actually is.

    Every currency is underpinned by an economy... in this case, the global criminal economy.

    And don’t even get me started on the stupidity of burning millions of tons of coal to “mine” the stuff in the midst of an existential climate crisis.

    It’s a cancer on global society.


  • Registered Users Posts: 303 ✭✭ .42.


    Are the HSE still using redundant OS like Windows XP?


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,291 ✭✭✭✭ Catmaniac


    whippet wrote: »
    if that is the case why haven't we seen these hackers tracked down and prosecuted - if there is a money trail surely it would be easy.

    We only hear of the big cases like the HSE etc but there are thousands of companies every day getting hacked and paying ransom

    Could be a solely a mischief attack by cnut who knows the vulnerabilities of the systems.


  • Registered Users Posts: 939 ✭✭✭ Badly fukt


    conor_mc wrote: »
    Anonymous ownership is one of the key “benefits” of crypto’s. That’s why nobody knows who Satoshi whatsisname actually is.

    Every currency is underpinned by an economy... in this case, the global criminal economy.

    And don’t even get me started on the stupidity of burning millions of tons of coal to “mine” the stuff in the midst of an existential climate crisis.

    It’s a cancer on global society.

    Cash has anonymous ownership, I've no idea how much you have, you've no idea how much I have. If I gave you some nobody would know


  • Registered Users Posts: 939 ✭✭✭ Badly fukt


    .42. wrote: »
    Are the HSE still using redundant OS like Windows XP?

    No mostly windows 7 though which is also end of life


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,753 ✭✭✭ touts


    If one person dies as a result of the health systems being down it should be treated as murder and an act of terrorism.

    After the attack on the oil pipeline in the US I suspect those bastards will be getting a visit from Seal Team 6 anyway. Don't know if it is the same terrorist group who attacked the US but clearly this has stepped up and we need to step up our response accordingly.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,511 ✭✭✭ whippet


    these attacks normally come in via a phishing email ... in which the user clicks on a link and they are in .... spend a few days looking around and encrypting fileshares - looking to see if they can see the backups and encrypt those also - and when they think they have done enough push the button and say - 'hey give me loads of bitcoin and you can get the encryption keys'


  • Registered Users Posts: 10,864 ✭✭✭✭ Calahonda52


    Catmaniac wrote: »
    Knowing how fragmented our HSE systems are, there has patently been lack of overall investment in IT here. It's not a bit surprising this has happened, especially at a time when vaccine rollout has been an added demand and one that has brought attention to potential exploitation.

    Somebody told me how they were trying to register on the portal for the vaccine for three days back and couldn't succeed, so that is likely enough symptomatic of an overall opportune attack on HSE.

    under investment is one thing, poor passwords, social engineering, inside job, back doors, lax admin controls etc is another issue.
    The portal delay is a different issue


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,291 ✭✭✭✭ Catmaniac


    Badly fukt wrote: »
    No mostly windows 7 though which is also end of life

    That's like where I worked in local authority, Windows 7. Public services always go for the cheapest available anything, not the most cost-effective in the long run.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 626 ✭✭✭ conor_mc


    Badly fukt wrote: »
    Cash has anonymous ownership, I've no idea how much you have, you've no idea how much I have. If I gave you some nobody would know

    Agreed, but it was bulky and awkward. And difficult/dangerous for criminals to collect a ransom.


  • Registered Users Posts: 21,291 ✭✭✭✭ Catmaniac


    under investment is one thing, poor passwords, social engineering, inside job, back doors, lax admin controls etc is another issue.
    The portal delay is a different issue

    Password updates had improved greatly by the time I retired. Earlier it was plain hilarious.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,893 ✭✭✭ PokeHerKing


    DaSilva wrote: »
    I know this is a weird take for a lot of people and I know a lot of people are really invested in crypto so I expect backlash.

    I think the cryptocurrency is half the problem here, it facilitates these criminals. I understand there is little governments can do about them though, banning doesn't really have any effect. If the value of all these cryptos plummeted though, I think ransomware attacks would be far less lucrative. Pipe dream though I understand.

    Ah yes I long for the days before cryptocurrencies when there was no crime, ransoms or money laundering. Those were the days


  • Registered Users Posts: 31,773 ✭✭✭✭ is_that_so


    under investment is one thing, poor passwords, social engineering, inside job, back doors, lax admin controls etc is another issue.
    The portal delay is a different issue
    That sounds likes a whole lot of entities, not just the HSE and they all have the same weak link - people. The only positive here is that the HSE is not long out of the paper pile and can revert to it to recover from this.


  • Registered Users Posts: 695 ✭✭✭ DaSilva


    Ah yes I long for the days before cryptocurrencies when there was no crime, ransoms or money laundering. Those were the days

    I know crypto isn't the cause of crime and unrelated to most crime, but don't you think ransomware attacks become far more expensive and risky for the attacker if cryptocurrencies are not an option?


  • Registered Users Posts: 5,753 ✭✭✭ touts


    Ah yes I long for the days before cryptocurrencies when there was no crime, ransoms or money laundering. Those were the days

    Anti money laundering laws and policies were making a difference. It may not have been perfect but it WAS making a difference. Cryptocurrencies have completely bypassed and undermined those laws and policies and most of their early appeal was precisely for that. Those who trade in these unregulated and untraceable "currencies" remind me of the lad who likes a hit of cocaine but only at the weekend and insists he doesn't support the drug trade.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,893 ✭✭✭ PokeHerKing


    DaSilva wrote: »
    I know crypto isn't the cause of crime and unrelated to most crime, but don't you think ransomware attacks become far more expensive and risky for the attacker if cryptocurrencies were not an option for the attackers?

    I've genuinely no idea. Id have to see some sort of stats on the subject. Have they increased with cryptos or just increased in line with our technological age?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,979 ✭✭✭ CorkRed93


    This is good for bitcoin!


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,511 ✭✭✭ whippet


    I've genuinely no idea. Id have to see some sort of stats on the subject. Have they increased with cryptos or just increased in line with our technological age?

    I'm in IT for over two decades and I have yet to come across a ransomware attack where the attackers asked for a wire transfer or bank notes


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,893 ✭✭✭ PokeHerKing


    touts wrote: »
    Anti money laundering laws and policies were making a difference. It may not have been perfect but it WAS making a difference. Cryptocurrencies have completely bypassed and undermined those laws and policies and most of their early appeal was precisely for that. Those who trade in these unregulated and untraceable "currencies" remind me of the lad who likes a hit of cocaine but only at the weekend and insists he doesn't support the drug trade.

    I mean Revolut probably aided in the exchange of money for drugs. So what? Most new technologies aid humans for good or bad depending on their use. Crypto is definitely traceable but whether its worth the current hassle for law enforcement is another matter.

    Banks are still by a country mile the biggest facilitators of illegal money.


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