Joyriding

Big Gerry

Anyone over a certain age will remember that joyriding was a big problem in Dublin back in 1990s.

But you never hear about joyriding any more.

I wonder why that is.

Did the Gardai and the courts clamp down on Joyriding ?

Atlantic Dawn

Immobilisers were introduced by law in 1996 for all new cars sold, this pretty much killed off joyriding as it meant hotwiring a car was no longer possible.

Japanese imports are still popular for joyriding as they mostly have no immobilizers and any fool could rob one.

Big Gerry

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Immobilisers were introduced by law in 1996 for all new cars sold, this pretty much killed off joyriding as it meant hotwiring a car was no longer possible.

Japanese imports are still popular for joyriding as they mostly have no immobilizers and any fool could rob one.

But if scumbags want to rob a car they can put a stick into someones letter box and take the car keys if they are near the door.

They can also buy cheap bangers that are on their last legs and use them to joyride.

Some people will even give their old cars away for free because its costs them money to get rid of them.

Atlantic Dawn

Big Gerry wrote: »

But if scumbags want to rob a car they can put a stick into someones letter box and take the car keys if they are near the door.

Yes but that takes relative skill, most scum are trying to go about the hotwire route. Most people now would not leave their key within letterbox fishing distance.

It's usually nearly-dead donedeal bangers for €200 that they use nowadays. Scumbags are still at it, albeit many have moved to motorbikes, scramblers and quads as the Gardai haven't a hope of catching them.

Del2005

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Yes but that takes relative skill, most scum are trying to go about the hotwire route. Most people now would not leave their key within letterbox fishing distance.

They'll just break in if they really want it and you'd be surprised how lax a lot of people are about security.

I live in Tallaght and you still have a bit of joyriding. Plenty of cars go past my place wayyyy to fast to be the owner driving.

Big Gerry

Big Gerry wrote: »

Anyone over a certain age will remember that joyriding was a big problem in Dublin back in 1990s.

We had a far lower rate of murder offences back then, so I suppose the moral panic shifted towards joyriding and bank robberies. Those are still pretty common. Well, joyriding is. Bank security has improved in leaps and bounds, but when it happens, it no longer captures public imagination.

Mr.Sir

Social housing has stopped the joy riding. Gone are the days of the council houses.

Big Gerry

Mr.Sir wrote: »

Social housing has stopped the joy riding. Gone are the days of the council houses.

I don't see the connection there ?


We still have a lot of scumbags just like we did in the 90s.

jimmycrackcorm

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Immobilisers were introduced by law in 1996 for all new cars sold, this pretty much killed off joyriding as it meant hotwiring a car was no longer possible.

Japanese imports are still popular for joyriding as they mostly have no immobilizers and any fool could rob one.

I left my car unlocked one night and someone did some damage trying to hotwire it. I couldn't understand how they thought they could do it this given immobilizers have been out so long. Just makes me think joyriders have a very low IQ.

Mr.Sir

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

I left my car unlocked one night and someone did some damage trying to hotwire it. I couldn't understand how they thought they could do it this given immobilizers have been out so long. Just makes me think joyriders have a very low IQ.

That’s the drugs.

Until 2001 the temporary theft of a car was in fact not a crime.

The change in law and better security has reduced it but plenty of areas still have regular events.

FintanMcluskey

Joyriding still happens in the worst parts of Dublin

It’s just not reported on as much

Mr.Sir

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Until 2001 the temporary theft of a car was in fact not a crime.

The change in law and better security has reduced it but plenty of areas still have regular events.

Yes 2000 we could temporarily borrow a car and give it back.

Strumms

Big Gerry wrote: »

But if scumbags want to rob a car they can put a stick into someones letter box and take the car keys if they are near the door.

They can also buy cheap bangers that are on their last legs and use them to joyride.

Some people will even give their old cars away for free because its costs them money to get rid of them.

Most of us wouldn’t be that naive to leave them on a hall table... especially if we had no porch that locked.

I’ve always kept my car keys in the drawer near my bed as a habit... the most expensive thing I own, I’m going to make sure it remains mine...

kirving

Strumms wrote: »

I’ve always kept my car keys in the drawer near my bed as a habit...

Can't recommend that at all. If someone is prepared to break into my house to steal the keys, they can have them, and hopefully leave me sleeping.

Much better to wake up to a load of insurance paperwork, than a guy in my room with a hot kettle.

begbysback

I seen a newspaper report of joyriding in Dublin round the early 1900s or thereabouts, when cars were first introduced to Ireland. It was actually fairly well off people stealing them back then.

begbysback

kirving wrote: »

Can't recommend that at all. If someone is prepared to break into my house to steal the keys, they can have them, and hopefully leave me sleeping.

Much better to wake up to a load of insurance paperwork, than a guy in my room with a hot kettle.

Why, do they threaten to make ye a cup of tea?

pgj2015

Strumms wrote: »

Most of us wouldn’t be that naive to leave them on a hall table... especially if we had no porch that locked.

I’ve always kept my car keys in the drawer near my bed as a habit... the most expensive thing I own, I’m going to make sure it remains mine...

Apparently they don't even need to get your keys these days. They can copy the signal from your keys from outside onto a key they have. so you have to take the batteries out of your key at night or put them in a metal box.

Jacob13

Big Gerry wrote: »

Anyone over a certain age will remember that joyriding was a big problem in Dublin back in 1990s.

But you never hear about joyriding any more.

I wonder why that is.

Did the Gardai and the courts clamp down on Joyriding ?

The answer is the security in cars today and since the early 00s is way better. In the 80s 90s you could rob a brand new Honda, mazda, Toyota etc with a vice grips and flat head. I grew up in blanchardstown/ mulhuddart and in the 90s nissan Micras, civics or colts were popular stolen cars. Flashing as we'd call it . A mitzie space wagon was great in a feild .

Wibbs

pgj2015 wrote: »

Apparently they don't even need to get your keys these days. They can copy the signal from your keys from outside onto a key they have. so you have to take the batteries out of your key at night or put them in a metal box.

A metal tea caddy or the microwave. Job done. Faraday cage for the win.

FintanMcluskey

kirving wrote: »

Much better to wake up to a load of insurance paperwork, than a guy in my room with a hot kettle.

Wibbs wrote: »

A metal tea caddy or the microwave. Job done. Faraday cage for the win.

Criminals demanding refreshments after breaking in

Some neck

Atlantic Dawn

kirving wrote: »

Can't recommend that at all. If someone is prepared to break into my house to steal the keys, they can have them, and hopefully leave me sleeping.

Much better to wake up to a load of insurance paperwork, than a guy in my room with a hot kettle.

The kettle thing is an old wives tale, how long would it take someone to make excessive noise to smash in to your home, turn on the lights in the kitchen, fill the kettle with water, turn it on, wait 2-3 minutes for it to boil, walk upstairs to you in your bedroom while you wait patiently doing absolutely nothing for 7 or 8 minutes from the time of the first noise.

kirving

The kettle might be a stretch alright, but being woken up for the keys is not unheard of for particularly nice cars stolen to order.

Atlantic Dawn

kirving wrote: »

The kettle might be a stretch alright, but being woken up for the keys is not unheard of for particularly nice cars stolen to order.

Yes if they want it they can pretty much take it. I don't know what's the best approach, leave the keys downstairs with them knowing you have kind of invites theft, bring them upstairs could bring them up to take them.

begbysback

Think it was something like 20k cars stolen a year back in the 80s, I would guess Ford where greatly to blame there, they manufactured cars with keys that would actually open and start other Ford cars with a little persuasion.

Atlantic Dawn

begbysback wrote: »

Think it was something like 20k cars stolen a year back in the 80s, I would guess Ford where greatly to blame there, they manufactured cars with keys that would actually open and start other Ford cars with a little persuasion.

Yes my father mentioned this before, what the hell were they thinking.

Mr.Sir

Mr.Sir wrote: »

Yes 2000 we could temporarily borrow a car and give it back.

Correct because the act of theft was created under section 4, criminal justice (theft and fraud offences) act 2001.

In 2000 you had larceny under the larceny act 1916 which contained within it's definition "permanently deprive it's owner".

Theft was both permanent and temporary.

Big Gerry

A Lamb Named Miltiades! wrote: »

We had a far lower rate of murder offences back then, so I suppose the moral panic shifted towards joyriding and bank robberies. Those are still pretty common. Well, joyriding is. Bank security has improved in leaps and bounds, but when it happens, it no longer captures public imagination.

Bank robberies is another crime you don't hear much about anymore.


I suppose criminals moved online because it was safer for them to rob/scam people online than to carry out armed robberies.

corner of hells

Jacob13 wrote: »

The answer is the security in cars today and since the early 00s is way better. In the 80s 90s you could rob a brand new Honda, mazda, Toyota etc with a vice grips and flat head. I grew up in blanchardstown/ mulhuddart and in the 90s nissan Micras, civics or colts were popular stolen cars. Flashing as we'd call it . A mitzie space wagon was great in a feild .

Young lads were doing basic engineering courses in ANCO , the old FAS and learning how to make barrel poppers along with a little auto electrics, so in fact the government was responsible for the joyriding epidemic.

Thats what my pal Jeff told Gardai just before they kicked the bollix out of him after he wrecked a Carina 2 in a field in Lucan.

Big Gerry

Big Gerry wrote: »

I don't see the connection there

Where do you hear of scumbags joyriding? It's almost exclusive to social housing estates.

Big Gerry

Big Gerry wrote: »

Bank robberies is another crime you don't hear much about anymore.


I suppose criminals moved online because it was safer for them to rob/scam people online than to carry out armed robberies.

You will notice the same names of famous bank robbers as the godfathers of the Irish drug business.

You don't get shot by Gardai for selling drugs and the sentences were more lenient.

Now it's cash in transit and tiger kidnappings but you will get 10 years for 10 grand. Compare that to a dealer

Big Gerry

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

You will notice the same names of famous bank robbers as the godfathers of the Irish drug business.

You don't get shot by Gardai for selling drugs and the sentences were more lenient.

Now it's cash in transit and tiger kidnappings but you will get 10 years for 10 grand. Compare that to a dealer

You're correct if someone is selling drugs they can operate completely under the radar which would not be the case if they were carrying out big Martin Cahill style heists.

wally79

A Lamb Named Miltiades! wrote: »

We had a far lower rate of murder offences back then, so I suppose the moral panic shifted towards joyriding and bank robberies. Those are still pretty common. Well, joyriding is. Bank security has improved in leaps and bounds, but when it happens, it no longer captures public imagination.

Your comment interested me so I looked it up

I’m not sure how good this source is but it shows not much difference in murder rate from 90s to now

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/IRL/ireland/murder-homicide-rate

Strumms

kirving wrote: »

Can't recommend that at all. If someone is prepared to break into my house to steal the keys, they can have them, and hopefully leave me sleeping.

Much better to wake up to a load of insurance paperwork, than a guy in my room with a hot kettle.

I doubt many people in the course of trying to steal a motor vehicle from a house, end up in the owners bedroom with a kettle, unless they are trying to steal their teabags too... the old sound of a boiling kettle downstairs following broken glass might be a risky maneuver on the thief’s part.

I worked hard for my possessions, I’m just not willing to have someone take them with ease...

Atlantic Dawn

In Japan it must be 30 years hard labour for robbing a car that they are not arsed fitting immobilizers that must cost circa €100 in the grand scheme of building a car.

Oranage2

Had someone try to steal my car, they couldn't because of the immobilizer, didn't stop them smashing the inside up and basically writing the car off.

One of the main reasons I've left Ireland, there's just far too much scum, anyone living in a council estate or even near one are at a high risk of having their hard earned possessions stolen or damaged just for ****s and giggles and there's hardly any consequence to the scumbag.

Del2005

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

The kettle thing is an old wives tale, how long would it take someone to make excessive noise to smash in to your home, turn on the lights in the kitchen, fill the kettle with water, turn it on, wait 2-3 minutes for it to boil, walk upstairs to you in your bedroom while you wait patiently doing absolutely nothing for 7 or 8 minutes from the time of the first noise.

It's easier for them to pick up a steak knife and threaten you or your kids. A lot of burglaries happen when the home is occupied

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-20426590.html



Leave the keys downstairs out of sight of the doors and windows but in an obvious place if someone is inside.

Hangdogroad

It was a big problem in Cork in the 80s and 90s, they specifically opened Spike Island as a prison to jail joyriders. There are a number of factors as to why it declined. The trend towards so called company cars, newer cars are more difficult to break into and hotwire. Areas that were joy riding hotspots have had traffic calming measures like speed bumps installed.

Wanderer78

Oranage2 wrote:

One of the main reasons I've left Ireland, there's just far too much scum, anyone living in a council estate or even near one are at a high risk of having their hard earned possessions stolen or damaged just for ****s and giggles and there's hardly any consequence to the scumbag.

The only problem with the consequently approach, it doesn't really work, such behaviour can only truly be tackled by having functioning critical services and systems, in particular a health service, so.......

whisky_galore

Wanderer78 wrote: »

The only problem with the consequently approach, it doesn't really work, such behaviour can only truly be tackled by having functioning critical services and systems, in particular a health service, so.......

You need to have consequences for the people who are given all the incentives and services, but still can't be told.

Wibbs

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

In Japan it must be 30 years hard labour for robbing a car that they are not arsed fitting immobilizers that must cost circa €100 in the grand scheme of building a car.

A different culture where car theft is pretty low down on the list of crimes. On that score Ireland is pretty good actually.



Luxemburg is kinda mad. Never in a million years would I have pointed to Luxemburg as a hotbed for car theft. Maybe because it has a large mass of non residents moving in and out of the place on a daily basis? Weird though.

Joyriding has declined massively because of better car security. It was daftly easy to steal a car in the pre built in immobiliser days and third party car security was almost always sloppily fitted and easy enough to bypass, even the big name stuff like Clifford.

I'd reckon it's also declined because it became less "fashionable", less of a thing overall. Back in the mid 00's I was chatting with a mate who was a guard at the time and he was telling me of a recent upswing in thefts of Toyota Starlets of all things. Some scumbag or other had found an easy way to get into and steal them and this had spread like a meme among the scumbags and suddenly it was open season on Starlets. He had noticed that sort of thing before with different models of cars that would become the thing to steal and then that would pass to another model.

Another thing that likely reduced the crime was the increased availability of really cheap cars that a bunch of guys could buy for a couple of hundred quid and go nuts in. No tax or insurance or any of that of course.

On the money front, it's easier and less risky now to steal the catalytic convertors than the car itself and they're essentially untraceable.

The joke is the evolution of the technology of car security has started to make cars easier to steal again. Keyless entry a biggie. OBD ports being too accessible another(program new keys). Cheap tech from China that can clone keys and all that. A new BMW with keyless entry is a lot easier to steal than a BMW from 20 years ago.

Wanderer78

whisky_galore wrote: »

You need to have consequences for the people who are given all the incentives and services, but still can't be told.

serious, we ve already been doing this?

Fake Scores

Anyone fishing keys or breaking into houses is taking high end cars destined for a chop shop. Expensive parts valuable. Breaking into houses is for making money. They can play gran turismo on their ps4 when they go home.

whisky_galore

Wanderer78 wrote: »

serious, we ve already been doing this?

We have been doing neither tbf.

Mr.Sir

It’s stealing cats now not the animal type. Ironically dags are hot items too.

wally79

wally79 wrote: »

Your comment interested me so I looked it up

I’m not sure how good this source is but it shows not much difference in murder rate from 90s to now

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/IRL/ireland/murder-homicide-rate

Oh that's interesting! Thanks. I think that site is reliable. As far as I can see, they're using CSO data. My theory is well and truly scuttled.

This is by the way, but when I was looking for historical crime stats I came across a good chart expressing the murder rate in Ireland against NI. Look what happens in the north when the republican struggle kicks off around 1970. We see a small rise in murder rates near-about that time, but much of our rise, otherwise, can probably be put down to population increase/ urbanisation.

Wanderer78

whisky_galore wrote: »

We have been doing neither tbf.

show me a country that has effectively implemented the 'consequences' approach successfully?

biko

Deleted User wrote: »

It's usually nearly-dead donedeal bangers for €200 that they use nowadays. Scumbags are still at it, albeit many have moved to motorbikes, scramblers and quads as the Gardai haven't a hope of catching them.

What we need

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3uafz0BIBQ

the beer revolu

Hangdogroad wrote: »

It was a big problem in Cork in the 80s and 90s, they specifically opened Spike Island as a prison to jail joyriders. There are a number of factors as to why it declined. The trend towards so called company cars, newer cars are more difficult to break into and hotwire. Areas that were joy riding hotspots have had traffic calming measures like speed bumps installed.

But we've been informed that joyriding wasn't illegal until 2001.
They must have been illegally locking those lads up on Spike Island. A big legal case about to happen, no doubt!

McCrack

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Correct because the act of theft was created under section 4, criminal justice (theft and fraud offences) act 2001.

In 2000 you had larceny under the larceny act 1916 which contained within it's definition "permanently deprive it's owner".

Theft was both permanent and temporary.

S112 Rta 1961