Rodenticide Usage

LuFI

Hi,

I am doing some research in relation to a college project. Would greatly appreciate it if you could answer any of the following questions:

1. What is your approximate annual expenditure on rodenticides & pesticides (and how large is your farm)?
2. Are rodent infestations a regular concern on your farm?
3. How would you feel about implementing a natural approach to rodent control (e.g. through attracting birds of prey (barn owls etc.) to your farm) and would you be willing to partake in a trial run which uses this natural approach?

I greatly appreciate your input!

Bass Reeves

Usually use about one large bucket of rodenticide. It costs about 90-100 euro for 10kgs. Farm is 65 ISH acres.I finish 60-70 cattle per year

I would be slow to consider depending on wildlife. I have seen the build up of rats in a farm yard. You are looking at a situation where when they breed fast you could have 40-50 in the yard area in a short timeframe.

I have considered these new rat killers (A24) but cost is a huge prohibiting factor. I estimate I would need 6-8 to protect my farm yard

https://www.checkfrank.ie/goodnature-a24-automatic-rat-and-mouse-trap/2208162?utm_source=google&utm_medium=shopping&utm_campaign=adwords&dfw_tracker=39269-2208162&gclid=EAIaIQobChMImd3_laSy8AIV-IFQBh0XMgn0EAQYASABEgJ3RfD_BwE]

At 150-200/machine you are looking at a cost of 1-1.5k. I think to protect owls the department and the wildlife conservation bodies should come together to help us use them.instead of bait

If vat was reclaimable it would bring cost into the 8-1250 bracket. If it was grant aid on top it would bring cost down to 5-750 bracket.

Jb1989

Up to roughly 5 Cats here doing pest control.
Don't notice vermin when they are about.
Range of 250 odd euro a year on cat feed in lidl to feed them on the side.
Receipt used in tax returns as expense.

_Brian

Stopped using poison years ago after finding a dead owl 😞

Cats now and no rodent problems at all.

Charolois 19

I never used poison, was trapping with kill traps for a good few years and I found I caught a few birds by mistake, switched to live catch traps, still get the odd bird that can be safely released, rats get the bucket , and if it's picked up by a bird and eaten after no harm to it,

Only thing is if I was away for a day or two I do unset all the traps if they arnt going to be checked regularly

Dinzee Conlee

Charolois 19 wrote: »

I never used poison, was trapping with kill traps for a good few years and I found I caught a few birds by mistake, switched to live catch traps, still get the odd bird that can be safely released, rats get the bucket , and if it's picked up by a bird and eaten after no harm to it,

Only thing is if I was away for a day or two I do unset all the traps if they arnt going to be checked regularly

What kinda traps are these Charolais?

I didnt use much poison, but this year, was over-run with rats. Had to use poison...

Charolois 19

Dinzee Conlee wrote: »

What kinda traps are these Charolais?

I didnt use much poison, but this year, was over-run with rats. Had to use poison...

https://www.handyhardware.ie/Rentokil-Rat-Cage-Trap-FR28_p_63520.html?gclid=CjwKCAjwhMmEBhBwEiwAXwFoEahuLl1g-nJwj1LpCDy7l5kOFEeqXEswbaQtJ5xQRfNrmsHd-yycFBoC47wQAvD_BwE

That's the ones I have, didn't think I paid that much for them at the time tho?

Bass Reeves

Jb1989 wrote: »

Up to roughly 5 Cats here doing pest control.
Don't notice vermin when they are about.
Range of 250 odd euro a year on cat feed in lidl to feed them on the side.
Receipt used in tax returns as expense.

I do the same for the cat and dog at home. I even no put it up on the conveyer belt ahead of the shopping and pay for it with the farm card and keep the receipts separate. If I buy any tools I do the same

thefareast

Don't use poison here either, too many buzzards and kites around in case of secondary poisoning. I use live traps similar to what was posted, I think I caught around 40-50 rats over the winter. I usually dump them in the same spot and usually after a couple of days something has taken them away.

I keep the yard as clean as possible which helps but the field of wild bird cover beside it does not. I have been meaning to put up an owl box so I might knock one up when I get the chance and I will definitely be claiming for cat food as a farm expense henceforth.

kevthegaff

Seeing a good few around, are the traps dangerous with kids around

jimini0

Have not used poison in years. I hate the stuff. It's great at killing vermin but it's the damage it does after it kills the rat or mouse. Also seen a dead owl which used to perch on a tree nearby. Since then no poison has been laid. Have a stray cat that sleep in the straw bales. I only use a small bags of cattle and sheep meal. They are all stored in barrels with kids so no big rodent problem. The cat gets a small bit of cat for a couple of times a week to keep it around the place. It's very satisfying when it leaves you a present at the door. A small mouse there this eve.

thefareast

kevthegaff wrote: »

Seeing a good few around, are the traps dangerous with kids around

The cage ones I have wouldn't be, it's a little plate at one end connected to a bar that holds the cage door up. Any pressure on the plate and the door slides shut, there's no springs.

Birdnuts

Haven't used any for 20 years - as well as protecting local wildlife like Owls etc., I had a bad experience with poisoned rats dying in wall cavities and stinking the place out for months on end along with a bluebottle infestation:(, never again!!

Stihl waters

Took me a long time to realise poisoning doesn't stop at the dead rat or mouse, 2 cats here with bells on, I find rodents dont like to make a home near the cats so they're doing the job, I dont mind rats or mice but they're not welcome around the yard or sheds

ruwithme

Charolois 19 wrote: »

https://www.handyhardware.ie/Rentokil-Rat-Cage-Trap-FR28_p_63520.html?gclid=CjwKCAjwhMmEBhBwEiwAXwFoEahuLl1g-nJwj1LpCDy7l5kOFEeqXEswbaQtJ5xQRfNrmsHd-yycFBoC47wQAvD_BwE

That's the ones I have, didn't think I paid that much for them at the time tho?

What little treat do you hang inside to encourage entry?i had one of them here beside laided posion all winter in the hope of catching something. Not a bite.

Donald Trump

_Brian wrote: »

Stopped using poison years ago after finding a dead owl 😞

Cats now and no rodent problems at all.

Cats kill a lot of wild birds as well!

Birdnuts

Donald Trump wrote: »

Cats kill a lot of wild birds as well!

Some do alright - but it tends to be the commoner garden species near houses, whereas the likes of BarnOwls are much rarer, so any loss from the likes of secondary poisoning is of much more signficance for the overall population of that species.

Charolois 19

ruwithme wrote: »

What little treat do you hang inside to encourage entry?i had one of them here beside laided posion all winter in the hope of catching something. Not a bite.

I dont really use anything preticular, what ever has gone state in the press, old lump of cheese or biscuits, peanut butter works well tho, I just leave them somewhere I've seen there travelling, one place I've never caught many for some reason is along the feed bins?

I have a few guinne fowl around the place and there supposed to be a deterrent, they apparently kill rats or mice, never seen or found one from.them tho

Some people say rasher works well, ive never tried tho

blue5000

Birdnuts wrote: »

Haven't used any for 20 years - as well as protecting local wildlife like Owls etc., I had a bad experience with poisoned rats dying in wall cavities and stinking the place out for months on end along with a bluebottle infestation:(, never again!!

Have had this too, a lump of charcoal is supposed to capture the smell.

No rat bait laid on the farm here for years, maize silage used to be a disaster for rats when we had it. Barn owl and foxes taking care of them now. Bait box in the yard is just for bordbia:rolleyes:.

The Danimal

Rodent infestations are problem for me and am trying to find ways to deal without chemicals so I would like to know if barn owls can help with this

Braindebear

Rodents can be a problem for us, would look to change from poison. Costs are hefty and saw a few dead birds over the years. Would look to other methods if it suited

DaFitzy

My nephew has mentioned to me about how using poisons is bad for birds and animals in the area, on my mind whenever I use them now. If there was an alternative I'd definitely give it a go

archer22

blue5000 wrote: »

Have had this too, a lump of charcoal is supposed to capture the smell.

No rat bait laid on the farm here for years, maize silage used to be a disaster for rats when we had it. Barn owl and foxes taking care of them now. Bait box in the yard is just for bordbia:rolleyes:.

Yep Foxes are great Rat killers, loads of videos of them online killing Rats, also Stoats deserve a mention.

wrangler

We used to depend on neighbours cats to control vermin and then a Bord Bia inspector specified either use rat poison or worm dose the cats . so we put down the poison. Don't know if it was the poison or what but the cats died
Anyway our neighbour said that we must be doing something right with all the little birds around, some of the robins even talk to him in the garden, he goes in for minding nature and thinks he's an expert.
Any way I said to him that the cats being gone were the reason for all the little birds around.he didn't like that, I often saw his cats devouring the birds eggs , they'd clear a farm so they would.

They have cats again and teh little birds are gone

Charolois 19

Australia has a massive cat problem that's put a clatter of wild animals to extinction, I think cats were estimated to kill 1.5/1.6 billion wild animals a year, can't remember exactly the figure but it was staggering

Jb1989

Charolois 19 wrote: »

Australia has a massive cat problem that's put a clatter of wild animals to extinction, I think cats were estimated to kill 1.5/1.6 billion wild animals a year, can't remember exactly the figure but it was staggering

Rural east Australia has a massive mouse problem atm.
Them cats could be on the payroll.

Stihl waters

wrangler wrote: »

We used to depend on neighbours cats to control vermin and then a Bord Bia inspector specified either use rat poison or worm dose the cats . so we put down the poison. Don't know if it was the poison or what but the cats died
Anyway our neighbour said that we must be doing something right with all the little birds around, some of the robins even talk to him in the garden, he goes in for minding nature and thinks he's an expert.
Any way I said to him that the cats being gone were the reason for all the little birds around.he didn't like that, I often saw his cats devouring the birds eggs , they'd clear a farm so they would.

They have cats again and teh little birds are gone

You can blame cats for some of the bird loss but we as farmers have a lot to answer for, taking natural habitat that existed 30 to 40 years ago and turning it into grazing whilst replacing nothing and cutting back hedges and new growth with a vengeance even on internal bounds of land which makes no sense to me
Repeated failed initiatives from the EU has us where we see today, it's a bit hypocritical to blame cats now when we have access to poison which widespread use for years has killed raptors and predators.
Cats have been with humankind for thousands of years but it's only recently the wildlife populations have been dying out in Ireland, this is a loss of habitat problem rather than a feline one, neutering cats will help improve the situation but not if wildlife has nowhere to live

wrangler

Stihl waters wrote: »

You can blame cats for some of the bird loss but we as farmers have a lot to answer for, taking natural habitat that existed 30 to 40 years ago and turning it into grazing whilst replacing nothing and cutting back hedges and new growth with a vengeance even on internal bounds of land which makes no sense to me
Repeated failed initiatives from the EU has us where we see today, it's a bit hypocritical to blame cats now when we have access to poison which widespread use for years has killed raptors and predators.
Cats have been with humankind for thousands of years but it's only recently the wildlife populations have been dying out in Ireland, this is a loss of habitat problem rather than a feline one, neutering cats will help improve the situation but not if wildlife has nowhere to live

Well the cats clear the hedges here, just after seeing my dog picking up a dead premature chick in the yard and throwing it down in the grass an rolling on it same as she does in fox ****e, the cats are hunting the hedges now full time, they love the eggs, these people could have up to 20 cats
We live in a peninsula bounded by motorway fencing here with a road on three sides and our fox doesn't take lambs if we leave the dead ones out for him sothe disappearance of the birds is as noticeable as the appearance of them for a few years

Birdnuts

Charolois 19 wrote: »

Australia has a massive cat problem that's put a clatter of wild animals to extinction, I think cats were estimated to kill 1.5/1.6 billion wild animals a year, can't remember exactly the figure but it was staggering

It all depends if cats or their Wild relatives were ever native to a region - in Scotland they have the native Wild Cat which is likely to have existed here too in the past, along with the likes of Lynx etc. Therefore bird populations would have evolved naturally to deal with such predation. The problem in Australia is that cats(of any sort) were never native there and only appeared when Europeans arrived about 200 years ago. Therefore native mammals and birds were simply not adapted to deal with them hence the carnage since(and its not just cats - foxes,rats, stoats etc have all done as much damage there and NZ as they too were introduced by White settlers)

Bog Man 1

I have two remote places on the farm I dump spilled grain or floor sweepings from around the grain dryer . This is to encourage rats that are not going to be poisoned . There would be several rat burrows near these dumps
These Rats provide feed for the Buzzards and owls . I have been doing this for a few years and there are fewer rats around the yard because we have more predators hunting them . We keep the yard fairly clean and would have used several buckets of poison each winter . We have bait points around the yard and the outer most ones are eaten first and generally the inner ones are seldom touched . The rats always follow the same route into the yard .

2018na

Bog Man 1 wrote: »

I have two remote places on the farm I dump spilled grain or floor sweepings from around the grain dryer . This is to encourage rats that are not going to be poisoned . There would be several rat burrows near these dumps
These Rats provide feed for the Buzzards and owls . I have been doing this for a few years and there are fewer rats around the yard because we have more predators hunting them . We keep the yard fairly clean and would have used several buckets of poison each winter . We have bait points around the yard and the outer most ones are eaten first and generally the inner ones are seldom touched . The rats always follow the same route into the yard .

That’s seems to be a pretty good idea in fairness. I think if you try and depend on cats and predators alone you would literally be overwhelmed by rats in a matter of months. All I have here is a henhouse and about 1 acre beside a long term maize field. Always one or two feral cats about and would never see a winter without rat activity. This is in a place with very little hiding places or natural cover for rats. It’s fair to see that any farm provides a perfect habitat for rats even if you never actually see them.

_Brian

2018na wrote: »

That’s seems to be a pretty good idea in fairness. I think if you try and depend on cats and predators alone you would literally be overwhelmed by rats in a matter of months. All I have here is a henhouse and about 1 acre beside a long term maize field. Always one or two feral cats about and would never see a winter without rat activity. This is in a place with very little hiding places or natural cover for rats. It’s fair to see that any farm provides a perfect habitat for rats even if you never actually see them.

We stopped using poison and have two cats and have less mice and rats than lever and that’s with kids throwing out feed to chickens etc.

Natural predators go out looking for the vermin 24*7*365, your block of poison sits there hoping they will leave the bag of meal alone and stumble across it.

2018na

_Brian wrote: »

We stopped using poison and have two cats and have less mice and rats than lever and that’s with kids throwing out feed to chickens etc.

Natural predators go out looking for the vermin 24*7*365, your block of poison sits there hoping they will leave the bag of meal alone and stumble across it.

The place is literally overun with rabbits which by the way I love to see. Feral cat spends his day stalking them. Once in a blue moon might catch a small one and your telling me that a cat will keep on top of a rat population. Not a hope in hell’s chance poison poison and more poison whilst changing the type every now and then. There dying in the burrows you rarely see a poisoned rat above ground

Stihl waters

2018na wrote: »

The place is literally overun with rabbits which by the way I love to see. Feral cat spends his day stalking them. Once in a blue moon might catch a small one and your telling me that a cat will keep on top of a rat population. Not a hope in hell’s chance poison poison and more poison whilst changing the type every now and then. There dying in the burrows you rarely see a poisoned rat above ground

There's no amount of education will teach someone with your mentality, hopefully the next generation will have a bit more cop on than ours and the crowd that went before us

2018na

Stihl waters wrote: »

There's no amount of education will teach someone with your mentality, hopefully the next generation will have a bit more cop on than ours and the crowd that went before us

You can talk about education and your theory’s on rats but I am telling you you would be over ran with rats without poison. Have you heard any stories of them getting into House’s in cities like Dublin through broken sewage and drainage systems. I have even known of them being in a shed where a man kept ferrets. Natural predators and education my bollocks

wrangler

2018na wrote: »

You can talk about education and your theory’s on rats but I am telling you you would be over ran with rats without poison. Have you heard any stories of them getting into House’s in cities like Dublin through broken sewage and drainage systems. I have even known of them being in a shed where a man kept ferrets. Natural predators and education my bollocks

I find you do what you have to do, it's not on to let rats overrun your farm,
They're vermin and they carry disease

Birdnuts

2018na wrote: »

You can talk about education and your theory’s on rats but I am telling you you would be over ran with rats without poison. Have you heard any stories of them getting into House’s in cities like Dublin through broken sewage and drainage systems. I have even known of them being in a shed where a man kept ferrets. Natural predators and education my bollocks

Thats a receipe for disaster in terms of resistance etc. Already there is evidence that the likes of Storm is now less effective from heavy/over use

Bog Man 1

2018na wrote: »

You can talk about education and your theory’s on rats but I am telling you you would be over ran with rats without poison. Have you heard any stories of them getting into House’s in cities like Dublin through broken sewage and drainage systems. I have even known of them being in a shed where a man kept ferrets. Natural predators and education my bollocks

We had a talk from I think rentokil and if you just stay throwing out poison you will always have a problem . We have the yard reasonably clean and have blocked up places where they can hide or access sheds . They have a few routes that they use to get into the yard and we have bait points on these routes . We seldom or ever have poison in the inner most bait points eaten . If the poison in the outer points is not eaten I know the inner ones are not going to be eaten . We even put trail cameras out to see what was going on .
A local factory puts out chocolate and only uses poison if it is eaten . This is what is coming down the line for farmers and only for the supermarkets and catering industry poison would be banned .

_Brian

Stihl waters wrote: »

There's no amount of education will teach someone with your mentality, hopefully the next generation will have a bit more cop on than ours and the crowd that went before us

Yea.
One hopes wisdom comes with age but there’s no guarantee.

Dinzee Conlee

I don't know - we wouldn't have used poison much here. There are cats, and we have a good few buzzards around...

But this winter, the place was over run with rats. If you were in the shed for any few minutes, you would see them darting about. There was maybe a foot or so of dung in one part, and they had tunnels going through it.
I tried traps, but didnt work - so poison was my only option...

It worked and fairly quick too. Put it down in a silage roll with wire as I think Base suggested, replenished when empty. Went from being over-run to not having any in a few weeks...

Wouldn't be a fan of poison, but at times its necessary I think...

PoorFarmer

I got one of the A24 traps in january cos I could see a pathway worn by the gate next to where I was feeding a few heifers on the outfarm. Never actually saw a rat but I wouldnt have much time to spend around the yard. Just checked the counter on it yesterday and it had 20 strikes. I've only seen one dead rat near it but I have noticed the neighbours cat hanging around the location alot. Is a good piece of kit but definitely on the expensive side. Will look at getting a couple for the home place this winter as there would be alot more foodstuff around there.

_Brian

Regarding cats, female cats are by far superior hunters.

Birdnuts

PoorFarmer wrote: »

I got one of the A24 traps in january cos I could see a pathway worn by the gate next to where I was feeding a few heifers on the outfarm. Never actually saw a rat but I wouldnt have much time to spend around the yard. Just checked the counter on it yesterday and it had 20 strikes. I've only seen one dead rat near it but I have noticed the neighbours cat hanging around the location alot. Is a good piece of kit but definitely on the expensive side. Will look at getting a couple for the home place this winter as there would be alot more foodstuff around there.

I got some "Tomcat" traps online and have to say they are very good. Had a rat issue near the compost heap 2 years back and they took out the colony within a few weeks. Used choclat chip cookies as bait, which they obviously found irresistable;)

blue5000

Mod note; 2018na don't post on this thread again.