Drilling through red bricks

chewed

hi, looking for some advice. I'm trying to drill 4 holes into the outside red brick back wall on my house (to mount an auto rewind hose unit).

I'm struggling to drill the holes and don't appear to be making much progress. I have a proper drill (on hammer) and think I have the correct masonry drill bits, but wanted to check if there's anything else I should be doing?

blueskys

Ideally you should use an sds drill here, your drill might not be powerful enough..

I know some will of the old boys here will disagree but you need an sds drill for any sort of masonry.

Is it one of the the big hose lock ones ?
I have one and it was a nighmare to get it solid.
the have it set up for scabby little screw holes but the thing is getting pulled on all the time.

CoBo55

What's happening? Is the drill slipping in the chuck? Have both holes stopped at the same depth?

GreeBo

Yeah SDS will eat through it, but any masonry bit also should, how old is the bit, it might have lost its cutting edge?

mickdw

Ya an sds drill would fly through but that should do it too.
Tighten the crap out of the chink when you put bit in and make sure its spinning the right way, not reversed

CoBo55

mickdw wrote: »

Ya an sds drill would fly through but that should do it too.
Tighten the crap out of the chink when you put bit in and make sure its spinning the right way, not reversed

Surely he hasn't the drill turning in reverse:D..please say it isn't so.... Have mercy on that poor old chink:D

Luke774

GreeBo wrote: »

Yeah SDS will eat through it, but any masonry bit also should, how old is the bit, it might have lost its cutting edge?

Is a SDS drill better then a hammer drill ?

10-10-20

What depth are you getting stuck at? 3 /4 cm? Both the same?
Does the drill sound like it's in hammer-action mode (do you have the noise reverberating all over the house?), or could it be worn out?
Typically if you are getting stuck, it's the bit rather than the drill.
If that bit is getting stuck, use a smaller bit as a pilot and then go in with that ~10mm bit afterwards.

CoBo55

Luke774 wrote: »

Is a SDS drill better then a hammer drill ?

An sds drill is a hammer drill, the drill bits have slots along the shank that hold them in the chuck so they can never slip in the drill. The biggest problem I've had with my sds drill is stopping yourself drilling right through the wall!!! Best money you'll ever spend.

GottaGetGatt

chewed wrote: »

hi, looking for some advice. I'm trying to drill 4 holes into the outside red brick back wall on my house (to mount an auto rewind hose unit).

I'm struggling to drill the holes and don't appear to be making much progress. I have a proper drill (on hammer) and think I have the correct masonry drill bits, but wanted to check if there's anything else I should be doing?

That's not an SDS bit, off to Hardware store you go.

chooseusername

GottaGetGatt wrote: »

That's not an SDS bit, off to Hardware store you go.

Not much point putting an SDS bit in that drill!

loyatemu

CoBo55 wrote: »

An sds drill is a hammer drill, the drill bits have slots along the shank that hold them in the chuck so they can never slip in the drill. The biggest problem I've had with my sds drill is stopping yourself drilling right through the wall!!! Best money you'll ever spend.

it's not just the more secure bit that makes the difference, SDS also has a longer hammer action, it's pounding it's way into the wall much harder.

you can get a mains-powered SDS drill for €50, if you're drilling into concrete or brick on even a semi-regular basis, it's a good investment, there's no comparison with a regular hammer drill.

chewed

10-10-20 wrote: »

What depth are you getting stuck at? 3 /4 cm? Both the same?
Does the drill sound like it's in hammer-action mode (do you have the noise reverberating all over the house?), or could it be worn out?
Typically if you are getting stuck, it's the bit rather than the drill.
If that bit is getting stuck, use a smaller bit as a pilot and then go in with that ~10mm bit afterwards.

Yes, about that depth and it's not going any further. On the left side there are sparks as well, so am hitting something very solid in the brick!

I might get some new drill bits anyway as the ones I have are very old.

I'll also look into getting a decent SDS drill.

listermint

For this application, just get a new masonry bit. You should not need to buy an SDS to drill through red brick. Pissing money away. My cordless bosch hammer would eat this up and its most certainly not SDS. A good bit and make sure hammer is activated properly.

GottaGetGatt

chooseusername wrote: »

Not much point putting an SDS bit in that drill!

A ball ache

GreeBo

Mad question, but are you 100% they are solid red bricks and not just facers over something else?
(Either way a new drill bit, SDS or otherwise, should get through it, an SDS drill + bit will just make it faster.)

Alun

I was thinking the same, I've drilled holes in normal red brick with a cordless drill in hammer mode with no problems at all. The fact that he says he's getting sparks from one hole makes me think there's something else behind them.

Cerco

chewed wrote: »

Yes, about that depth and it's not going any further. On the left side there are sparks as well, so am hitting something very solid in the brick!

I might get some new drill bits anyway as the ones I have are very old.

I'll also look into getting a decent SDS drill.

I would be concerned if I saw sparks coming from red brick on the wall of the house. Best to try and find out what it might be. Perhaps others on here would hazard a guess?
An SDS drill is capable of some damage so be careful.

Bluefoam

I've put a few holes in red bricks recently and in the past. Standard cordless hammer drill and the cheapo masonry bits that came with it 5 years ago still doing the job...

I reckon I'd get through tough concrete with a new high quality bit... SDS would be useful going through a larger depth, like if you were drilling from an inside wall through to the outside...

fred funk }{

Is the drill in hammer mode or just drill?


Hammer make distinctive loud fast hammer noise. What you have should eat into that brick no problem.

NewClareman

Cerco wrote: »

I would be concerned if I saw sparks coming from red brick on the wall of the house. Best to try and find out what it might be. Perhaps others on here would hazard a guess?
An SDS drill is capable of some damage so be careful.

I agree - hacking at this with an SDS drill could cause serious damage. I would suggest that the op tries to find out more about the build, before continuing. It is highly likely that this is facing over block, or concrete. He could also be hitting support steel work.

The concern here is that regular red bricks are not strong and facing bricks are mainly for the finish. I would be wary of mounting a hose housing, or anything else that could exert force, on either. A far safer approach would be to align the mounting holes with the mortar between the bricks, and drill through that. If you must drill through brick you should drill holes towards the centre, rather than near the edge, as shown. That's your best chance of not splitting the brick, especially when force is applied.

NewClareman

NewClareman wrote: »

I agree - hacking at this with an SDS drill could cause serious damage. I would suggest that the op tries to find out more about the build, before continuing. It is highly likely that this is facing over block, or concrete. He could also be hitting support steel work.

A far safer approach would be to align the mounting holes with the mortar between the bricks,

Is this going to be another how to mount a tv on a stud wall thread ?
Hacking & serious damage with a 6mm hole?
Mounting into mortor joints?

The answer to this mans problem is in the first reply

CoBo55

BrownFinger wrote: »

Is this going to be another how to mount a tv on a stud wall thread ?
Hacking & serious damage with a 6mm hole?
Mounting into mortor joints?

The answer to this mans problem is in the first reply

Exactly, buy, borrow or hire a decent drill and bit, drill required amount of holes, end of thread.

I recently bought a Bosch Easyimpact 550W impact drill for 60 euro at Woodies. Superb drill that requires a mains energy supply, so none of that hauling batteries back and forth for a charge. The drill can cut through a lot more than butter!



The drill could easily appear in a modern take on the Jules Verne novel: Journey to the Centre of the Earth!:pac:

NewClareman

BrownFinger wrote: »

Is this going to be another how to mount a tv on a stud wall thread ?
Hacking & serious damage with a 6mm hole?
Mounting into mortor joints?

The answer to this mans problem is in the first reply

I'm sure you're an expert tradesman, and know when, and how, to use SDS drills.

However, the OP is obviously less experienced, given he came to this forum looking for advice. As I'm sure you know, an SDS drill is not required to drill through red brick. The problem is whatever he is hitting behind it. He could go at this hammer and tongs, with a powerful drill, and cause damage.

Have a good day.

looksee

I'm so glad I drilled all the holes for vine eyes in the garden wall, and put shelves up in the house and all the other stuff I've done recently, before reading that I needed to replace my bog standard Black and Decker with the slightly dodgy chuck and the Lidl masonry bits.

listermint

NewClareman wrote: »

I'm sure you're an expert tradesman, and know when, and how, to use SDS drills.

However, the OP is obviously less experienced, given he came to this forum looking for advice. As I'm sure you know, an SDS drill is not required to drill through red brick. The problem is whatever he is hitting behind it. He could go at this hammer and tongs, with a powerful drill, and cause damage.

Have a good day.

I think its more sensible not to ask people to spend money they dont need. not everyone has endless budgets. Any drill with a hammer action should cut red brick. The Bit at the front being the number one concern.

GreeBo

BrownFinger wrote: »

Is this going to be another how to mount a tv on a stud wall thread ?
Hacking & serious damage with a 6mm hole?
Mounting into mortor joints?

The answer to this mans problem is in the first reply

Not if he is getting sparks it isnt, if the bit & drill can make a 1cm deep hole then they can make a 5cm deep hole too, so there is something else going on.

Red bricks are a piece of piss to drill into.

the_pen_turner

What colour is the dust. If its red the whole way it's probably just crap bit or very hard brick or both. . It the red stopped and went grey it could be veneer stone

chooseusername

Could they be faced engineering bricks judging by the deep raked joints?

Mango Joe

This is redbrick not inch-thick titanium plate.

Any homeowner with the usual few drill bits and a half decent drill should be able to manage drilling into some redbrick without having to go shopping for an expensive SDS drill and bits they will most likely never use again.

My guess is that the drill bit which although it looks to be in reasonable shape isn't that sharp and its spinning in the holes generating heat and making the problem worse. You can get a smooth bowl shape at the pit of the hole where the heat melts the redbrick and you get an almost ceramic like surface - I'm no materials scientist but I suspect its silicas in the material that melt and do this.

Buy 2 new bits for a tenner - they'll be used in time anyhow so no harm to have spares.

Then perhaps first try to first drill the holes using a smaller masonry drill bit - Chances are it's one in the set you've never used before as its an odd size and it will be sharper.

Usually then you'll be seconds widening the hole with the correct sized bit.

Also try and drill in shortish productive bursts - where you're seeing dust come out and then pause for a bit to allow the drill bit to cool.

PS As another poster mentioned above - This unit will be habitually pulled in multiple directions for the duration of its existence - Definitely consider buying heavier screws and rawl plugs (= a larger drill bit too!) than the lads in China threw into the box - They won't give 2 ****'s when its hanging sideways off your back wall !!!

witnessmenow

Mango Joe wrote: »

This is redbrick not inch-thick titanium plate.

Any homeowner with the usual few drill bits and a half decent drill should be able to manage drilling into some redbrick without having to go shopping for an expensive SDS drill and bits they will most likely never use again.

My guess is that the drill bit which although it looks to be in reasonable shape isn't that sharp and its spinning in the holes generating heat and making the problem worse. You can get a smooth bowl shape at the pit of the hole where the heat melts the redbrick and you get an almost ceramic like surface - I'm no materials scientist but I suspect its silicas in the material that melt and do this.

Buy 2 new bits for a tenner - they'll be used in time anyhow so no harm to have spares.

Then perhaps first try to first drill the holes using a smaller masonry drill bit - Chances are it's one in the set you've never used before as its an odd size and it will be sharper.

Usually then you'll be seconds widening the hole with the correct sized bit.

Also try and drill in shortish productive bursts - where you're seeing dust come out and then pause for a bit to allow the drill bit to cool.

PS As another poster mentioned above - This unit will be habitually pulled in multiple directions for the duration of its existence - Definitely consider buying heavier screws and rawl plugs (= a larger drill bit too!) than the lads in China threw into the box - They won't give 2 ****'s when its hanging sideways off your back wall !!!

I do think there is something strange that the redbrick is being so stubborn, and probably should drill fine with any hammer drill, I'm not sure I agree with the anti SDS stance though.

I would consider myself an average DIYer (at best!) and I would not be without an SDS drill. I was using a cheap mains one from Aldi for a long time (think it was E50) but recently moved to a Worx cordless one (was 75 GBP from amazon, without batteries though) and its done a power of work since we got it. Bits for it are pretty cheap from building providers (E2 or E3 for standard sized ones)

looksee

witnessmenow wrote: »

I do think there is something strange that the redbrick is being so stubborn, and probably should drill fine with any hammer drill, I'm not sure I agree with the anti SDS stance though.

I would consider myself an average DIYer (at best!) and I would not be without an SDS drill. I was using a cheap mains one from Aldi for a long time (think it was E50) but recently moved to a Worx cordless one (was 75 GBP from amazon, without batteries though) and its done a power of work since we got it. Bits for it are pretty cheap from building providers (E2 or E3 for standard sized ones)

I don't think anyone is anti SDS - I may get around to getting one for myself eventually, its the idea that anyone would go out and buy a new drill as the first response to a problem bit of drilling.

loyatemu

looksee wrote: »

I don't think anyone is anti SDS - I may get around to getting one for myself eventually, its the idea that anyone would go out and buy a new drill as the first response to a problem bit of drilling.

this is the DIY forum, of course the first and best solution is more tools!

10-10-20

Back on pointe, I was wondering if the OP could have hit wall-ties, but the holes near the mortar and you shouldn't hit them twice in 5cm.
OP, at the risk of making swiss-cheese out of your wall, what happens if you drill the mortar?
To fix the mortar afterwards, just use a mix of sand:cement at 5:1 to make up a filler. Press-in and smooth-off.

witnessmenow

looksee wrote: »

I don't think anyone is anti SDS - I may get around to getting one for myself eventually, its the idea that anyone would go out and buy a new drill as the first response to a problem bit of drilling.

I could be wrong (see my comment about average DIYer at best) but I believe it is the right tool for the job though. I don't think there is any harm suggesting that there is a better tool. Maybe overkill to get a new drill for only two holes, but just making the point that I wouldn't be without one at this stage and also responding the point that the bits are expensive (the drill is obviously a bit of an outlay though)

I must admit though, I saw the op and the first couple of posts, and I also saw the post I replied to, I did not read all the thread in between where it seems like my point was already made multiple times!

chewed

Thanks everyone for the tips and advice. I went out and bought a new set of SDS masonry bits and managed to get the 4 holes drilled. I also wore down 3 drill bits in the process with brute force!

Dr Turk Turkelton

You shouldn't have worn out 3 drill bits drilling those bricks. This is what they look like from the top. The 3 holes would have mortar in them from building them.

NewClareman

chewed wrote: »

Thanks everyone for the tips and advice. I went out and bought a new set of SDS masonry bits and managed to get the 4 holes drilled. I also wore down 3 drill bits in the process with brute force!

I'm glad it worked out for you. What kind of dust did you get, when you hit the hard part?

Pete123456

Can I ask is it reasonable to consider trying to drill a hole through facing brick and the 4 inch block behind it at a 45 degree angle or steeper? Or is this too much hardship? Wouldn’t be any bigger than about 10mm to run a cat 5e cable up the cavity. I have a lend of an sds drill and bits.

Should I start with a smaller bit first?

greasepalm

Pilot hole can be handy as less stress on drill.

fred funk }{

chewed wrote: »

Thanks everyone for the tips and advice. I went out and bought a new set of SDS masonry bits and managed to get the 4 holes drilled. I also wore down 3 drill bits in the process with brute force!

There's something very wrong with this. As part of my work I've been drilling holes into all sorts or masonry with all sorts or drills for 25 years.

Those bricks aren't difficult to drill into even with a basic DIY non-sds drill.

I suspect your drill wasn't on the masonry setting so was just spinning the bit in the brick, this would explain the bits burning out. I also, suspect you bought SDS bits but put them into a non-SDS drill.

rob316

OP keep a look out in lidl for a corded sds drill for future jobs. They are about 30 quid and will breeze through any wall.

I just took a look at the OPs picture again.
I didn't realize that there was more at the bottom of the pics,
You need to scroll down to see it.

listermint

Exposed !! :P