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Transfer of Land

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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,111 ✭✭✭PMBC


    mickdw wrote: »
    Outline planning and full planning are two distinct things and one does not follow the other.
    You refer to 'decision to grant' and 'final grant'.
    I wouldnt follow your advice though.
    They are basically telling revenue - i know nothing about planning or site value - yet have applied and got a favourable decision already in the bag.

    Is there a time period specified in regulation/legislation between the 'decision to grant' and the 'planning permission'? Based on no objections received after the (first) decision.
    My memory of old is that it was four weeks/a month?
    Thanks in advance.


  • Registered Users Posts: 46,083 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    PMBC wrote: »
    Is there a time period specified in regulation/legislation between the 'decision to grant' and the 'planning permission'? Based on no objections received after the (first) decision.
    My memory of old is that it was four weeks/a month?
    Thanks in advance.
    You are correct, it is 28 days although it can take up to another week for the Council to issue the final grant.


  • Registered Users Posts: 185 ✭✭Baoithin66


    Sorry to jump in on this but I have a related question. Currently going through the process of transfer a site from farm. site has been marked on land reg map showing site with marked and area calculated to the middle of the public road. My solr agrees this is the correct approach. Land Owners solr is looking for a map with marking to the hedge at the edge of the road. Anyone I ask says we have the map marked correctly and the sellers solr does not know what they are at or are only used to dealing with town sites. Both myself and landowner just want to get the deal done. Any advice or pointers to where I can get a definitive answer.


  • Registered Users Posts: 782 ✭✭✭Dolbhad


    Baoithin66 wrote: »
    Sorry to jump in on this but I have a related question. Currently going through the process of transfer a site from farm. site has been marked on land reg map showing site with marked and area calculated to the middle of the public road. My solr agrees this is the correct approach. Land Owners solr is looking for a map with marking to the hedge at the edge of the road. Anyone I ask says we have the map marked correctly and the sellers solr does not know what they are at or are only used to dealing with town sites. Both myself and landowner just want to get the deal done. Any advice or pointers to where I can get a definitive answer.

    I’m not sure if it differs around the country but I find in Cork, in the country side the markings of map usually went to half way in the road and for city, you’d see it just at the roadway. It’s usually because in the countryside, it’s less likely to be a public road so back in the day, when legals were abit loose on the right of ways in writing, you’d own half the road for access and the neighbour across of you owns half for access. So in reality you would always consent to them using your half and vice versa.

    Pros and cons though - if you own half the roadway, even if it’s a public road, if an accident happens, you would be sued. Happened to an uncle of mine where although it was a public road, he was registered owner of the footpath and part of the road. A person injured themselves and successfully sued him and the local authority.


  • Registered Users Posts: 46,083 ✭✭✭✭muffler


    Dolbhad wrote: »
    Pros and cons though - if you own half the roadway, even if it’s a public road, if an accident happens, you would be sued. Happened to an uncle of mine where although it was a public road, he was registered owner of the footpath and part of the road. A person injured themselves and successfully sued him and the local authority.
    I doubt if that happened ... not if it was a public road.


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  • Registered Users Posts: 782 ✭✭✭Dolbhad


    muffler wrote: »
    I doubt if that happened ... not if it was a public road.

    It did happen - I’ve no clue why you would think it’s made up. If you look up land direct and look at any public road, you will see it’s rarely registered in the local authorities names unless most of the buildings were at one point registered in the local authority names.

    Even estates which has been taken over by the Council, the estate roads are still generally registered to the original builder.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,706 ✭✭✭chooseusername


    Dolbhad wrote: »
    It did happen - I’ve no clue why you would think it’s made up. If you look up land direct and look at any public road, you will see it’s rarely registered in the local authorities names unless most of the buildings were at one point registered in the local authority names.

    Even estates which has been taken over by the Council, the estate roads are still generally registered to the original builder.
    So, if I own the pavement and half the road, am I responsible
    for repair to the pavement and potholes in the road outside my house?
    What if the pothole is right in the middle of the road,
    do I repair the whole hole or just my half?
    It's a public road by the way.


  • Subscribers Posts: 41,586 ✭✭✭✭sydthebeat


    So, if I own the pavement and half the road, am I responsible
    for repair to the pavement and potholes in the road outside my house?
    What if the pothole is right in the middle of the road,
    do I repair the whole hole or just my half?
    It's a public road by the way.

    no you dont, and no your not.

    when suing, solicitors include every single party that they think could be involved.

    as land reg maps often include "ownership" to include to the middle of the road, even public, then solicitors will include the name of the "owner" in law suits.

    in the example above, the only way the uncle could have been deemed culpable is if they carried out unauthorised works to that portion of land in front of their house and somehow made it unsafe.

    even if they did, its highly unlikely any house owner will have public liability insurance which would cover that aspect of a home, and therefore the homeowner isn't insured.

    in order then to achieve a pay put, the other parties named in the action (the local authority) who actually have public liability insurance, will be found liable for 100% of any award... even if they are actually found to be only 1% at fault.

    the joys of the irish legal / insurance scam system


  • Registered Users Posts: 782 ✭✭✭Dolbhad


    It wasn’t 50% liability - the Council has more liability. The issue was an injury was caused by a manhole which was on the footpath registered to the Uncle. He had nothing to do with the manhole - the Council carried out works to it but didn’t put the cover on it correctly and injury happened. As previous poster said, the solicitors will join everyone they can think of to the party. But they were the registered owner, although a public road, and were deemed to have some responsibility. Although no public liability insurance, home insurance covered it but think he had declared the footpath for it.

    I hadn’t come across it before (and I’ve a legal background myself) but it’s some part of old but still activate legislation I think that even if he wasn’t joined to the proceedings, as the registered owner, the Council could join you as a co defendant.

    Anyway, all I was trying to point out as the possible reasons why solicitors might say own half the road (for right of way access) or not own half the road (liability issues). Obviously the person will follow the advice of their solicitor so would be handy for the OP to figure out the reason why so they can see if an agreement can be made to move things on.


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