Has anyone watched seaspiricy on Netflix?

tom1ie

Ok so the fishing industry seams to be responsible for destroying the worlds oceans by overfishing and polluting the seas.
According to this doc nearly 50%of plastic pollution in the ocean is old fishing nets and gear.
If we don’t have a healthy ocean with healthy fish stocks humans are fairly fooked.
Discuss.

begbysback

Watched it as far as finding out that we need whales for oxygenating they planet, they assist in the generation of something like 80% of the worlds oxygen, or something like that.

Turned it off then when I seen the guy starting to turn into a plastic Greta thunberg

Yurt2

Not to go China-bashing too much, but China's voracious appetite for seafood as they have got wealthier is probably a tipping point. Their fishing fleet is all over the globe and not adhering to fishing regulations whatsoever.

tom1ie

Yurt! wrote: »

Not to go China-bashing too much, but China's voracious appetite for seafood as they have got wealthier is probably a tipping point. Their fishing fleet is all over the globe and not adhering to fishing regulations whatsoever.

Documentary seemed to insinuate they were plundering African waters also.

Temptamperu

I had to turn it off it was making me racist.

Potential-Monke

I don't eat fish, so for once I'm not part of the problem!

Thelonious Monk

The sea is f*cked much like much of our land is f*cked from intensive agriculture and chemicals. The world is f*cked. Don't have kids.

Temptamperu

Potential-Monke wrote: »

I don't eat fish, so for once I'm not part of the problem!

Do you use plastics?

Thelonious Monk

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

The sea is f*cked much like much of our land is f*cked from intensive agriculture and chemicals. The world is f*cked. Don't have kids.

I agree. I think I’ll be wanting to get off in 30 or 40 years. Which, be coincidence, is probably about when I am due to.

Potential-Monke

Temptamperu wrote: »

Do you use plastics?

I do my best to avoid, but it can't be 100% avoided because products, such as some foods, come in plastic. Anyway, not to derail the thread, but me recycling plastic will not sort the problem. Producers should be told, not advised, told to stop using plastic and find an alternative. What alternative? That sounds like a them problem.

If your question is do I throw plastic into the ocean? No. If a recycling company or bin company does, again not my fault. If companies stopped wrapping stuff in plastic, this problem would only be limited to the fishermen thinking they can leave old nets, etc in the ocean.

I'm not perfect, but I don't willingly throw rubbish into the ocean.

tom1ie

Temptamperu wrote: »

Do you use plastics?

Seems to be a small part of the problem though.
Industrial fishing is what’s causing the majority of the plastic pollution.
It’s something crazy like plastic straws account for 0.1% of plastic pollution yet discarded plastic fishing nets account for 50% of pollution, yet there’s no sanctions on the fishing industry.

NIMAN

It was a hard watch, mostly for the irritating guy who made it.

But some serious points raised, I wonder why the fishing industry is so sacred that this is all kept under wraps?

py2006

Conspira-sea would have worked better

Your Face

"The sea was angry that day, my friends - like an old man trying to send back soup in a deli" - Confucius

gussieg

made me cry the whale hunt in finland or norway or wherever they wear those jumpers. And i truly did not know that fish do NOT produce the omega 3, it comes frm algae they eat. Organic linseed oil has as much omega 3 in it, and the rest of the omegas are obtainable from plants etc.

fritzelly

begbysback wrote: »

Watched it as far as finding out that we need whales for oxygenating they planet, they assist in the generation of something like 80% of the worlds oxygen, or something like that.

Was like what, so had to check it out and they help indirectly - not that the Chinese care. There's responsible fishing and there's raiding the oceans for everything you can get

Thelonious Monk

We can go on about the Chinese like we do with climate change etc but look at Europe. There are sea beds in Ireland completely ruined by trawling and dredging for clams and prawns etc. The Mediterranean is the most overfished sea in the world.
In the case of Ireland, the number of salmon returning to the coast is estimated to have collapsed from some 2 million in the late 1970s to about 250,000 in recent years. My dad used to spend summers in Connemara in the 60s and the rivers were full of salmon, it's not like that now.
Clifden beach in Connemara is currently closed due to pollution from septic tanks.
We're all in this destruction of the planet together.

Wibbs

Sea trout numbers have collapsed too. Both them and salmon numbers crashing is down to salmon farms in estuaries and the like. But such farms make a lot of money and provide local employment so governments have been extremely resistant to restrict them. Always follow the money. Beyond that we have other environmental problems in our waterways. I grew up fly fishing for trout in various rivers and lakes around Ireland and though there are more regulations and more rivers have been cleaned up compared to the bad old days I've very much noticed negative environmental changes on many of the rivers I've fished throughout my life. Insect life would be one of them. IE the variety of fly life has definitely narrowed, even on rivers that look cleaner than they did. Where before I might need say ten different types of artificial flies to match the natural throughout a fishing season, these days I could reduce that by at least a third if not more. Why is this happening? Farming practices could be part of it. Insecticides used that wash into the rivers and streams. One thing I noticed was a change in of all things cow pats in fields. 30 years ago they would be alive with hazes of flies and would break down rapidly back into the soil. Thes days I see much less of that and they're more likely to dry out than break down. Increased housing near waterways and the run off from that another possible reason. Given that half of all plastics ever produced have been produced in the last twenty years is probably having an effect across the environment.

Solutions? TBH the only solutions I can see is a) reduce the worldwide human population and b) get off our collective consumerist economy and mindset. IMHO wind power and leccy cars and all that will make some difference, but until we reduce our human footprint and rampant consumerist mindset, they're only pecking at the edges. Since I was born - and I'm not that old - the world population has doubled. That's mad enough, but over the same time we as a species and as individuals consume and throw away so much more than our grandparents did. We tend to consider them to be less "green" and more polluting, but they really weren't compared to the generations that followed.

Even in very simple ways they were "greener". Ireland brought in a charge on plastic bags and that's good, but our grandparents used paper bags or long term use shopping bags off the bat. Baby's nappies were cloth, milk and other drinks came in glass bottles, clothes were as often repaired rather than thrown away, fridges, washing machines, TV's and a phone in a house would last decades, now we upgrade our mobile phones yearly. The other major problem is a deliberate lack of repairability. This is market driven, as business wants us to keep feeding the consumer model so we get our dopamine hit from the "new". So much of what we buy can't be easily repaired, or repaired at all and/or spares can't be got or are deliberately made so expensive you just go and buy the new thing. And the same companies pimping this BS are near guaranteed to also promote how "green" they are on their plastic coated cardboard box with lots of plastic bags within that your "new" came in. Essentially we're all being bullshítted to, just to make more and more money for a tiny number of already obscenely wealthy people and the environment is paying dearly for it.

Thelonious Monk

The solutions could be a moratorium on certain types of fishing in Europe for a period of time like they did in Newfoundland after the cod stocks collapse, if not all fishing, keeping non European boats out of our waters somehow, and of course eating far less seafood.
I still eat fish sometimes but nearly all the fish in our fishmongers these days is either farmed or imported from the seas around the world, and prawns from Argentina and Indonesia and Nicaragua. I can't eat that stuff without feeling guilty.
The industry needs to be shut down, it's on a suicide mission the way it's going. I don't care if jobs are lost some things are more important.

Anecdotal evidence - I used to go mackerel fishing off Dalkey in the early 90s, we'd pull in 80 mackerel which we'd be eating for months after. Last time we went about 10 years ago didn't get one bite. The lads I rent the boats off told us no one was getting mackerel that year. It's probably even worse now. Mackerel was also taken off the list of sustainable fish not too long ago. It's all f*cked.

Wallet Inspector

py2006 wrote: »

Conspira-sea would have worked better

It was right fecking there, damn them!

Thelonious Monk

"Conspirasea" doesn't work because it only works in written form. Seaspiracy works spoken and written.

riffmongous

Are you guys saying sea- spiracy or seas-piracy?

I'm not convinced yet if measures need to be taken to reduce population growth.. I'd assume there's a very unequal geographical distribution table of population versus consumption, anyone got any figures?

My assumption would be that western populations are already slowing down their population growth but are increasing their consumption, while the areas with high population growth have, at the moment, low levels of consumption. Better to focus entirely on consumption levels everywhere imo, and try make sure there is sustainable consumption in the areas with high population growth.

Thelonious Monk

riffmongous wrote: »

Are you guys saying sea- spiracy or seas-piracy?

I'm not convinced yet if measures need to be taken to reduce population growth.. I'd assume there's a very unequal geographical distribution table of population versus consumption, anyone got any figures?

My assumption would be that western populations are already slowing down their population growth but are increasing their consumption, while the areas with high population growth have, at the moment, low levels of consumption. Better to focus entirely on consumption levels everywhere imo, and try make sure there is sustainable consumption in the areas with high population growth.

Yeah this is it, even though population levels are levelling off in rich countries, they're consuming more and more. One of us in Ireland probably consumes as much as 200 Eritreans or whatever.

Land use is important, we could feed the world easily using far less land if we wanted, we would just need to shift to foods that use the least amount of land, the rest could be given back to nature.

Realistically we'll carry on like the locusts that we are and then start firing rockets at each other when resources become scarce and water becomes toxic worldwide.

Happy Easter everyone!

Banana Republic 1

tom1ie wrote: »

Ok so the fishing industry seams to be responsible for destroying the worlds oceans by overfishing and polluting the seas.
According to this doc nearly 50%of plastic pollution in the ocean is old fishing nets and gear.
If we don’t have a healthy ocean with healthy fish stocks humans are fairly fooked.
Discuss.

That’s 100% right.

antimatterx

I don't eat animals, and that is probably the best I can do. But the Japanese treatment of Dolphins and other sea life made me sick. The government pulling out of an agreement not to hunt certain species disgusts me.

Banana Republic 1

Potential-Monke wrote: »

I don't eat fish, so for once I'm not part of the problem!

No but you live in the EU it’s not just the Chinese that fish.

Thelonious Monk

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

No but you live in the EU it’s not just the Chinese that fish.

And it's not just fishing that is destroying marine habitats. The amount of raw sewage that pumps into the sea and our rivers in Ireland is disgraceful.

Banana Republic 1

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

And it's not just fishing that is destroying marine habitats. The amount of raw sewage that pumps into the sea and our rivers in Ireland is disgraceful.

#watercharges

tom1ie

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

And it's not just fishing that is destroying marine habitats. The amount of raw sewage that pumps into the sea and our rivers in Ireland is disgraceful.

Agreed, however the largest problem seems to be the fishing industry by far.
Bycatch is a sickening phenomenon of “sustainable” fishing.

tom1ie

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

#watercharges

Absolutely needed tbh. We need to stop pumping sewage into the ocean, we need to stop consuming so many resources, wether it be plastic, fish, energy, fossil fuels, water etc.

Will it happen? Probably not until it’s too late imho.

Banana Republic 1

tom1ie wrote: »

Absolutely needed tbh. We need to stop pumping sewage into the ocean, we need to stop consuming so many resources, wether it be plastic, fish, energy, fossil fuels, water etc.

Will it happen? Probably not until it’s too late imho.

#capitalism

arctictree

A group of us go fishing a couple of times a year and hire a boat from a port on the south coast. We catch enough fish to do our freezer for the year. Totally sustainable. The skipper says he makes more from taking lads out on day trips then his brother makes on a large trawler from the same port, where he catches thousands of fish a day, has to throw most of it back dead (bycatch/quotas) and gives most of his money to the Arabs (oil) and the banks. There is something seriously wrong with that industry. And don't get me started on ' Dolphin Safe!

Dakota Dan

tom1ie wrote: »

Ok so the fishing industry seams to be responsible for destroying the worlds oceans by overfishing and polluting the seas.
According to this doc nearly 50%of plastic pollution in the ocean is old fishing nets and gear.
If we don’t have a healthy ocean with healthy fish stocks humans are fairly fooked.
Discuss.

Didn’t watch it but I can confirm that it’s a load of bollox to push the climate agenda.

Dakota Dan

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

The sea is f*cked much like much of our land is f*cked from intensive agriculture and chemicals. The world is f*cked. Don't have kids.

What are your qualifications in agriculture to make that claim?

Yurt2

Here comes the angry farmer brigade (a minority in the industry at this stage thankfully). Ticked off at inspectors making sure our rivers and water table aren't fouled by their god-given right to do whatever they please.

LessOutragePlz

Dakota Dan wrote: »

What are your qualifications in agriculture to make that claim?

Come on, you don't need any agricultural qualifications to make that claim.

Just look at how much of the Amazon rainforest is being destroyed every year for agriculture use among other things.

SafeSurfer

tom1ie wrote: »

Ok so the fishing industry seams to be responsible for destroying the worlds oceans by overfishing and polluting the seas.
According to this doc nearly 50%of plastic pollution in the ocean is old fishing nets and gear.
If we don’t have a healthy ocean with healthy fish stocks humans are fairly fooked.
Discuss.

I always find it interesting that figures such as “50% of plastic pollution in the ocean is old fishing nets and gear” become the accepted figures simply because they are the ones presented in an easily consumed format such as a Netflix documentary.
Many think this is a definitive figure because it was on TV.

A good book which touches on similar topics is Outlaw Ocean by Ian Urbina.

There are huge issues involved in overfishing and sea pollution which seem insurmountable but can be tackled if the political will is there.

The ocean eco system is interconnected and interdependent. Salmon stocks are under pressure from predation by sea birds such as cormorants moving in land and preying on salmon parr and smolts because the seas have been denuded.
Farmed salmon is responsible for sea lice infestation of wild salmon and also requires unsustainable amounts of wild fish to feed millions of farmed fish. It is a filthy industry. How it can ever be labeled as “organic” brings the whole organic labelling regime into disrepute.

Dakota Dan

LessOutragePlz wrote: »

Come on, you don't need any agricultural qualifications to make that claim.

Just look at how much of the Amazon rainforest is being destroyed every year for agriculture use among other things.

Turn off the television and social media I supposed you still believe that the Amazon forests are the lungs of the earth.

Banana Republic 1

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Didn’t watch it but I can confirm that it’s a load of bollox to push the climate agenda.

I don’t know Homer Simpson, I’ve never met Homer Simpson but Homer Simpson has ruined my life.

Thelonious Monk

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Didn’t watch it but I can confirm that it’s a load of bollox to push the climate agenda.

You farmers are just unbelievable

Wibbs

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

You farmers are just unbelievable

Farmers have tightened up their practices in a big way over the last few decades. Increasing urbanisation, the increase in the consumerist throwaway society, more plastics and other non recycled and non recyclable stuff is in my humble the bigger problem and that's far more down to us in general as consumers. Though the market doesn't actually give us much choice in the matter and peddles a "green" marketing bullshít to salve our consciences.

Thelonious Monk

Wibbs wrote: »

Farmers have tightened up their practices in a big way over the last few decades. Increasing urbanisation, the increase in the consumerist throwaway society, more plastics and other non recycled and non recyclable stuff is in my humble the bigger problem and that's far more down to us in general as consumers. Though the market doesn't actually give us much choice in the matter and peddles a "green" marketing bullshít to salve our consciences.

I was referring the one above who seems to be implying the polluting of our oceans and overfishing and horrible fishing practices are all a climate change hoax. Also maybe they tightened up practices but our rivers are more polluted now than ever and you can guess what the main cause of that is.

99nsr125

tom1ie wrote: »

Documentary seemed to insinuate they were plundering African waters also.

That's because they are

completedit

Turned it off because the narrator sounded Australian and I despise that type of surfer eco-warrior type. Then realised he's from Kent. I will watch it but how do people constantly find themselves shocked by what shows up in these documentaries? We've known about this stuff for years, adding emotional and suspenseful music doesn't change that.

The only solution appears to be a retreat towards the local. Globalisation has been a powerful force for the eradication of poverty but it seems like it's now experiencing diminishing marginal returns.

We have to radically change our mindset. Overfishing is just one of the many symptoms of a bigger problem. The food industry seems ripe for these investigations but all sectors and industries contribute to the problem. Everything we do, given the technology available is on a scale that we cannot sustain.

Thelonious Monk

completedit wrote: »

Turned it off because the narrator sounded Australian and I despise that type of surfer eco-warrior type. Then realised he's from Kent. I will watch it but how do people constantly find themselves shocked by what shows up in these documentaries? We've known about this stuff for years, adding emotional and suspenseful music doesn't change that.

The only solution appears to be a retreat towards the local. Globalisation has been a powerful force for the eradication of poverty but it seems like it's now experiencing diminishing marginal returns.

Because most people don't think/care about where their food comes from and the impact it has. That is why these pop documentaries can be good for getting messages across to the masses.

Wibbs

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Also maybe they tightened up practices but our rivers are more polluted now than ever and you can guess what the main cause of that is.

I'm not sure it is the farmers T. Or if it is it's newer insecticides and the like that are causing more issues than believed or admitted. Hell, it's not that long ago when stuff like DDT was game ball, controls on land run off were pretty much nil, yet rivers and lakes were in many cases not nearly as environmentally impacted as they have become in the last few decades.

tom1ie

Dakota Dan wrote: »

Turn off the television and social media I supposed you still believe that the Amazon forests are the lungs of the earth.

Lungs of the earth are the phytoplankton that live in the sea.
The same sea we are giving a good hard ****ing to.

tom1ie

arctictree wrote: »

A group of us go fishing a couple of times a year and hire a boat from a port on the south coast. We catch enough fish to do our freezer for the year. Totally sustainable. The skipper says he makes more from taking lads out on day trips then his brother makes on a large trawler from the same port, where he catches thousands of fish a day, has to throw most of it back dead (bycatch/quotas) and gives most of his money to the Arabs (oil) and the banks. There is something seriously wrong with that industry. And don't get me started on ' Dolphin Safe!

Very good.
This is the way to do it if you ask me.
I will probably look into this when restrictions allow.
Won’t be buying “sustainable” tuna again!

completedit

Just in terms of Chinese overfishing. Arguably is it only overfishing because you have to catch for their huge population? In per capita terms is it that bad? I feel countries like China get a hard time whereas countries like Ireland and the fishermen here are depicted as brave and noble 'men of the sea', whereas the Chinese are viewed as malevolent heartless capitalists.

Thelonious Monk

Wibbs wrote: »

I'm not sure it is the farmers T. Or if it is it's newer insecticides and the like that are causing more issues than believed or admitted. Hell, it's not that long ago when stuff like DDT was game ball, controls on land run off were pretty much nil, yet rivers and lakes were in many cases not nearly as environmentally impacted as they have become in the last few decades.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/just-20-of-ireland-s-rivers-are-pristine-down-from-500-in-1980s-1.4110018

It has gotten considerably worse

corkgsxr

Ali Tabrizi is the director.

He made similar films about eating meat.


Basicly its a manipulated shock documentary to push veganism.