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United Ireland Poll - please vote

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,547 ✭✭✭ Blaaz_


    De valera had a massive international political campaign to end partition in the 1950s,the frustration at being strung along lead to the border campaign


    Diplomacy simply deosnt work with the british,how anyone could look on at way they carryon with brexit and still regard them as trustworthy is perplexing for its level of detacthment from borne-reality



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,641 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly


    Yes, because when the UK left the EU, the Brits invaded Belgium to force the issue?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,547 ✭✭✭ Blaaz_


    Mate,yous are asking why the ira didnt try diplomacy prior to defending their communities


    Its a waste of time,the british strung the home-rule movement along for 40 years

    Strung de valera along for decades....there conduct around brexit should been of suprise to noone with a rudimentry knowledge of irish history,theres a reason nationlists demanded usa oversight into the gfa......


    quite why you still gleefully believe they can be approached diplomacly is beyond me,they been same with 100s of years,it wont ever work with em,sooner their rule is gone from our island the better,



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,641 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly


    Oh, the hardman keyboard warrior is out in force tonight.

    Tell us, if diplomacy doesn't work today, what should we do? Go back to blowing up shops and bars?



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,547 ✭✭✭ Blaaz_


    No hardman warrior,the war is over....just simple facts and logic...


    your naivity and innocence in face of over-whelming long term historical evidence is perplexing,feeling need to engage in personal insults only serves to highlight lack of depth in your arguement.....do you guys still honestly believe the british are trustworthy??



    I think what is being done as regards getting the supreme court in uk to nail down requirements for a border poll is good,as its obvious to me that it'll pass and in best interest of all on the island



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  • Registered Users Posts: 54,041 ✭✭✭✭ FrancieBrady



    I live on the border mark, I can see with my my eyes where the wrong side of history is every single day. Just driving to Cavan will spell it out for you. You should try visiting the place that occupies your thoughts so much some time, and stop channeling others..



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,041 ✭✭✭✭ FrancieBrady


    The International Court of Justice and the UN GeneraL Assembly found against them in relation to their illegal takeover of the Chagos Island, what did the British do? They refused to recognise the court. 😁

    And we are on the 'wrong side of history'...we are the 'keyboard warriors'????



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,641 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly


    Did you ever hear of Gandhi?

    What war did he wage for Indian Independence?

    What war did the SNP wage for Scottish Independence?

    If the 'war' is over how will we get a UI, given that NI is still part of the UK?



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,641 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly




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  • Registered Users Posts: 54,041 ✭✭✭✭ FrancieBrady


    It's an entirely bizarre view of the actual history.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,641 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly


    My response was to Blazz who stated that the only way to get your way with the British is via violence.

    Gandhi makes this claim null and void.

    There is a clear agenda at play with some posters that state that the PIRA had no choice to kill the women and children that died at their hands as if it was inevitable. That is why the usual crew hate people like John Hume, because he offered an alternative, a non-violent alternative.

    This is all about writing and controlling the history of today, so they can shape the narrative of tomorrow. It is so so obvious.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,547 ✭✭✭ Blaaz_


    Did you ever hear of mandela,ever hear of castro....this is a fun game


    Since yous such a fan of gandhi....wasnt the reason the british withdrew because they had nothing left to extort from.that colony....which was richest country in world when they took over,by time of withdrawl in 1940s,average male life expencancy was 27??.....pretty much par the course for british rule anywhere,hence why the 6 counties are among poorest regions in northern europe,their deeds would shame all the devils in hell



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,041 ✭✭✭✭ FrancieBrady


    John Hume FAILED up until he made a solo run and had talks with Adams. Fact.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,547 ✭✭✭ Blaaz_


    What exactly did john hume achieve in terms of reunification?...bloke gave decades in westminister


    What exactly did he achieve in terms of ending internment,stop and search policies and saturation on ground with troops and ruc?


    How many murders by collusion did talking in westminister achieve


    He gave decades following yous diplomacy,what did it achieve until the british were forced to the negociation table via military stalemate,they will entertain you forever and day with diplomacy,but it achieves fcuk all....otherwise they wouldnt strung home rule parties along for 40 years?



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭ Fionn1952


    But India didn't achieve independence without violence is my point, Mark. Violence was very much a part of India's struggle for independence, as of course were Gandhi's non-violent means. We don't have the time-altering capabilities to establish if India would've achieved independence with purely the non-violence pushed by Gandhi in isolation. We can of course speculate, but if we're sticking to facts, India did not achieve independence without violence, it achieved independence with a great deal of violence unfortunately.

    To accuse others of attempting to rewrite history when you're doing the same yourself is quite hypocritical.

    We've interacted enough at this point that I'm sure you're aware I'm not among the cohort who tries to defend the PIRA, but I do have the lived experience of being in the North during the Troubles enough to understand how and why they came about.

    I had all the time in the world for John Hume, but much like the India situation, we can only speculate if his non-violent approach alone would've actually secured Unification or if it would've even got us to the civil equality point we reached with the GFA, or indeed somewhere in between.

    All we can say factually about the North is that the mixture of violent and non-violent means that did occur

    a) didn't achieve Unification and

    b) did achieve equal rights for the CNR population of NI.

    Acknowledging the historical reality of the situation rather than speculating doesn't make me any sort of apologist for the PIRA, but addressing the point Blazz made, what we do know is that in both of the examples we've discussed so far, violence was indeed one tool used to, 'get their way' with the British, and we have thusfar no examples of times were anyone got their way without violence. That isn't a statement of support for violence from me to be clear.



  • Registered Users Posts: 458 ✭✭ Speedline


    Look, even wee Jeffery has admitted that the Tory government has fcuked ni over, and he's British himself. If the British government can **** their own people over without a second thought, they would fcuk anyone over.



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,041 ✭✭✭✭ FrancieBrady


    Not just once either - yet still we have the partitionists and Unionists defending them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,630 ✭✭✭ Fionn1952


    Edward Carson always comes to mind when I think of the Tory attitude towards NI. Even the most brass necked could hardly argue that Carson was just pushing Republican propaganda!


    A hundred years on and little has changed.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10,104 ✭✭✭✭ Junkyard Tom


    Ending partition is the beginning of the solution. I'm not sure what country you live in but the one I live in is Ireland and it has unification as its destination. As for Brexiters, you Paritionists are their bedfellows, you think if you get your way you get to keep the privileges that have been bestowed upon you by those who removed the colonisers by force. You won't, of that I assure you.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,641 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly




  • Registered Users Posts: 10,641 ✭✭✭✭ markodaly




  • Registered Users Posts: 5,547 ✭✭✭ Blaaz_


    No evidemce,theres not an appitode for a poll either🤔


    Unless one is to take the fact NI voted remain in brexit and has long since diverged from rest of uk politically or census results expected to show cathilic majority


    Almost as if opioion pieces,which stray from facts and logic are merely poor quality propaganda pieces



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,041 ✭✭✭✭ FrancieBrady


    'We'll tell you what you can talk about' journalism? 😁



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,146 ✭✭✭ Brucie Bonus


    This is interesting. It figures the average punter will follow their pocket even if not particularly for or against a UI.

    Almost two-thirds of people in Northern Ireland believe that Brexit has increased the likelihood of Irish unity, according to a social attitudes survey.

    Well done DUP.



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,041 ✭✭✭✭ FrancieBrady


    In the context of there being no plan presented they are very encouraging figures.



  • Registered Users Posts: 27,150 ✭✭✭✭ end of the road




    Gandhi most certainly doesn't make the fact stated null and void, and hume's alternative was not successful.

    the fact is, just like indian independence and irish independence, the struggle for a functioning state with equality for all in northern ireland could only be achieved via an uprising, the only ones responsible for that were successive british governments.

    julian the journalist asange is innocent, free julian the journalist.



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