You Cannot Criticize Finance Ministers

Markus Antonius

Is it just me, or is Paschal Donohue getting away with murder as finance minister?

Every interview he does he puts his nose up in the air and talks down in his "matter-of-fact" condescending tone at everyone, especially tax paying citizens.

Presenters don't challenge him on anything. Everyone treats him as though he's some kind of financial prodigy, as if the country would sink down a hole if he left his position.

And yet all he does is raise tax year after year and defend private companies hiding their profits away here.

Yesterday it was announced that Bank of Ireland, AIB and PTSB collectively utilized 493 million in losses to offset against their corporation tax bill. And yet Prodigy Paschal comes out saying - Poor banks, we couldn't let them have such a dent in their profits AND be expected to pay corporation tax now could we? And yet private citizens can't offset investment losses off income tax/PAYE!

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2021/0311/1203470-aib-boi-and-ptsb-used-loss-reliefs-worth-almost-500m/


It's a joke!!

People are getting their houses stripped away from them for being late on their high interest mortgage payments. Individual investors take on huge risk, only to have their profits fleeced by an ancient CGT system.

"VAT going back up to 23%"
"Taxes will have to rise and borrowing to fund services be brought under control after Covid" - https://www.independent.ie/business/finance-minister-donohoe-warns-taxes-will-rise-after-covid-40160291.html

For the last 10 years every tax hike was because of the 2008 financial collapse. Now for the next 10 years every tax hike will be because of Covid.

Why people vote him in is beyond me, he is a thundering disgrace!

ShyMets

Markus Antonius wrote: »

Is it just me, or is Paschal Donohue getting away with murder as finance minister?

Every interview he does he puts his nose up in the air and talks down in his "matter-of-fact" condescending tone at everyone, especially tax paying citizens.

Presenters don't challenge him on anything. Everyone treats him as though he's some kind of financial prodigy, as if the country would sink down a hole if he left his position.

And yet all he does is raise tax year after year and defend private companies hiding their profits away here.

Yesterday it was announced that Bank of Ireland, AIB and PTSB collectively utilized 493 million in losses to offset against their corporation tax bill. And yet Prodigy Paschal comes out saying - Poor banks, we couldn't let them have such a dent in their profits AND be expected to pay corporation tax now could we? And yet private citizens can't offset investment losses off income tax/PAYE!

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2021/0311/1203470-aib-boi-and-ptsb-used-loss-reliefs-worth-almost-500m/


It's a joke!!

People are getting their houses stripped away from them for being late on their high interest mortgage payments. Individual investors take on huge risk, only to have their profits fleeced by an ancient CGT system.

"VAT going back up to 23%"
"Taxes will have to rise and borrowing to fund services be brought under control after Covid" - https://www.independent.ie/business/finance-minister-donohoe-warns-taxes-will-rise-after-covid-40160291.html

For the last 10 years every tax hike was because of the 2008 financial collapse. Now for the next 10 years every tax hike will be because of Covid.

Why people vote him in is beyond me, he is a thundering disgrace!

I think its just you

Smee_Again

Pascal has a stutter or a speech impediment and that’s why his manner of speak is quite unique.

As for his performance as Finance Minister I’d say up to now it’s been ok, not great but not bad considering the disaster he inherited.

Tax hikes to pay for COVID are a terrible idea though and if he does hike taxes then I’ll change my verdict to poor.

As for people losing their homes, not enough are and that’s one reason rates are so high.

eggy81

Markus Antonius wrote: »

Is it just me, or is Paschal Donohue getting away with murder as finance minister?

Every interview he does he puts his nose up in the air and talks down in his "matter-of-fact" condescending tone at everyone, especially tax paying citizens.

Presenters don't challenge him on anything. Everyone treats him as though he's some kind of financial prodigy, as if the country would sink down a hole if he left his position.

And yet all he does is raise tax year after year and defend private companies hiding their profits away here.

Yesterday it was announced that Bank of Ireland, AIB and PTSB collectively utilized 493 million in losses to offset against their corporation tax bill. And yet Prodigy Paschal comes out saying - Poor banks, we couldn't let them have such a dent in their profits AND be expected to pay corporation tax now could we? And yet private citizens can't offset investment losses off income tax/PAYE!

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2021/0311/1203470-aib-boi-and-ptsb-used-loss-reliefs-worth-almost-500m/


It's a joke!!

People are getting their houses stripped away from them for being late on their high interest mortgage payments. Individual investors take on huge risk, only to have their profits fleeced by an ancient CGT system.

"VAT going back up to 23%"
"Taxes will have to rise and borrowing to fund services be brought under control after Covid" - https://www.independent.ie/business/finance-minister-donohoe-warns-taxes-will-rise-after-covid-40160291.html

For the last 10 years every tax hike was because of the 2008 financial collapse. Now for the next 10 years every tax hike will be because of Covid.

Why people vote him in is beyond me, he is a thundering disgrace!

They’re all the one.

Eric Cartman

We’re already seeing the effects of a tax induced brain drain, theres too much pressure on the middle classes and high earners, our corporation tax has to remain at 12.5% to keep our FDI driven economy afloat.

The only reasonable thing to do is cut spending.

martingriff

Markus Antonius wrote: »

Is it just me, or is Paschal Donohue getting away with murder as finance minister?

Every interview he does he puts his nose up in the air and talks down in his "matter-of-fact" condescending tone at everyone, especially tax paying citizens.

Presenters don't challenge him on anything. Everyone treats him as though he's some kind of financial prodigy, as if the country would sink down a hole if he left his position.

And yet all he does is raise tax year after year and defend private companies hiding their profits away here.

Yesterday it was announced that Bank of Ireland, AIB and PTSB collectively utilized 493 million in losses to offset against their corporation tax bill. And yet Prodigy Paschal comes out saying - Poor banks, we couldn't let them have such a dent in their profits AND be expected to pay corporation tax now could we? And yet private citizens can't offset investment losses off income tax/PAYE!

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2021/0311/1203470-aib-boi-and-ptsb-used-loss-reliefs-worth-almost-500m/


It's a joke!!

People are getting their houses stripped away from them for being late on their high interest mortgage payments. Individual investors take on huge risk, only to have their profits fleeced by an ancient CGT system.

"VAT going back up to 23%"
"Taxes will have to rise and borrowing to fund services be brought under control after Covid" - https://www.independent.ie/business/finance-minister-donohoe-warns-taxes-will-rise-after-covid-40160291.html

For the last 10 years every tax hike was because of the 2008 financial collapse. Now for the next 10 years every tax hike will be because of Covid.

Why people vote him in is beyond me, he is a thundering disgrace!

High interest mortgages?

IngazZagni

Well what financial experts are saying he's awful?

It's true we have one of the most progressive tax systems in Europe were minimum wage earners pay almost no tax. That's almost unheard of and yet anyone earning over 35-39k pays around 50% tax from there.
Yet I don't know any party that thinks we should reward the middle class more. Varadker hinted at it but didn't really act on it. Slight raising of thresholds probably didn't even keep up with inflation.

It's also wrong to say that repossessions are high here. It takes years to repossess a house. Much longer than other Countries and this is just one of many reasons why interest rates are high.

listermint

Eric Cartman wrote: »

We’re already seeing the effects of a tax induced brain drain, theres too much pressure on the middle classes and high earners, our corporation tax has to remain at 12.5% to keep our FDI driven economy afloat.

The only reasonable thing to do is cut spending.

Cut spending and our economy would plummet, no offence intended but it's that type of bollixoloy after 2010 that lengthened the depression.

The only country subscribing to that medicine now is the uk and well..... Look at the calibre of leadership there

biko

I recall Biffo (Brian Cowen) getting a lot of criticism.

Who is having their house reefed off them? This is the only country in the world I know of where you can not pay your mortgage and get to keep your house.

ulster

Markus Antonius wrote: »

.

Why people vote him in is beyond me, he is a thundering disgrace!

Because there's hardly any real alternative to FFG. People can vote Sinn Fein in, but they won't be any better. We've no credible alternative unless someone can create a new centre ground party that's got good policies and switched on people.

Gunmonkey

Markus Antonius wrote: »

Yesterday it was announced that Bank of Ireland, AIB and PTSB collectively utilized 493 million in losses to offset against their corporation tax bill. And yet Prodigy Paschal comes out saying - Poor banks, we couldn't let them have such a dent in their profits AND be expected to pay corporation tax now could we? And yet private citizens can't offset investment losses off income tax/PAYE!

Why should they not be able to offset loses against corp tax? Thats a provision allowed to all corporations to stop a business that suffers a loss within a year being driven further down by forcing a company that didnt make any money to pay tax.

Put it another way; if you had a personal income of €0 (due to low income and statutory deductions), should you have to pay tax? Tax on what? Income tax is tax on earned income, corp tax is tax on the profits of a corporation so how are they going to pay tax on a negative income?

And why the hell would you be allowed to offset investment loses against income tax? They are two completely separate sources of income with their own tax structure and rates. Just because you lost money on stocks doesnt mean you shouldnt have to pay income tax.

And no, an incorporated bank is not the same as an individual in terms to investment income, so no "How come they get to do it wah wah wah!"

Natterjack from Kerry

I think that is a testament to the high quality of Finance Ministers that we have had for decades now, consistently regardless of parties in power.
While we have had some serious nincompoops in many ministries, those there, at least seem to have the sense to put quality in charge of the purse strings.

Faugheen

Personally think he's one of the better cabinet ministers. Doesn't dress everything up and speaks as a matter of fact rather than with a ****load of cliches.

dontmindme

We've had economic growth during a global pandemic.

colm_mcm

Markus Antonius wrote: »

It's a joke!!

People are getting their houses stripped away from them for being late on their high interest mortgage payments.

Are you talking about evictions?

jams100

Markus Antonius wrote: »

Is it just me, or is Paschal Donohue getting away with murder as finance minister?

Every interview he does he puts his nose up in the air and talks down in his "matter-of-fact" condescending tone at everyone, especially tax paying citizens.

Presenters don't challenge him on anything. Everyone treats him as though he's some kind of financial prodigy, as if the country would sink down a hole if he left his position.

And yet all he does is raise tax year after year and defend private companies hiding their profits away here.

Yesterday it was announced that Bank of Ireland, AIB and PTSB collectively utilized 493 million in losses to offset against their corporation tax bill. And yet Prodigy Paschal comes out saying - Poor banks, we couldn't let them have such a dent in their profits AND be expected to pay corporation tax now could we? And yet private citizens can't offset investment losses off income tax/PAYE!

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2021/0311/1203470-aib-boi-and-ptsb-used-loss-reliefs-worth-almost-500m/


It's a joke!!

People are getting their houses stripped away from them for being late on their high interest mortgage payments. Individual investors take on huge risk, only to have their profits fleeced by an ancient CGT system.

"VAT going back up to 23%"
"Taxes will have to rise and borrowing to fund services be brought under control after Covid" - https://www.independent.ie/business/finance-minister-donohoe-warns-taxes-will-rise-after-covid-40160291.html

For the last 10 years every tax hike was because of the 2008 financial collapse. Now for the next 10 years every tax hike will be because of Covid.

Why people vote him in is beyond me, he is a thundering disgrace!

Presenters don't challenge anyone on anything these days, Vincent Browne was the only one who ever done a good job on this, the others are just parrots for the government/establishments.

Very few people have their houses taken away in Ireland, more people probably should have their houses repossessed, that might give more cause for a reduction in interest rates for everyone else.

In terms of Paschal himself, I'd say he has done an ok job, I wish he was more vocal about our unsustainable spending right now, my guess is he'd get a good telling off if he was to speak out about it. Still don't think that should stop him. Anyway he has a very good CV so if he wanted more money he'd have no problem walking into a big corporation and getting the same, if not more money. I think your problem is more with the media not asking harder questions and pursuing them rather than with Paschal himself?

AndrewJRenko

IngazZagni wrote: »

Well what financial experts are saying he's awful?

It's true we have one of the most progressive tax systems in Europe were minimum wage earners pay almost no tax. That's almost unheard of and yet anyone earning over 35-39k pays around 50% tax from there.
Yet I don't know any party that thinks we should reward the middle class more. Varadker hinted at it but didn't really act on it. Slight raising of thresholds probably didn't even keep up with inflation.

It's also wrong to say that repossessions are high here. It takes years to repossess a house. Much longer than other Countries and this is just one of many reasons why interest rates are high.

There's more to tax than just income tax. Everyone pays tax.

AndrewJRenko

Eric Cartman wrote: »

We’re already seeing the effects of a tax induced brain drain, theres too much pressure on the middle classes and high earners, our corporation tax has to remain at 12.5% to keep our FDI driven economy afloat.

The only reasonable thing to do is cut spending.

What effects of the brain drain are you seeing?

Eric Cartman

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

What effects of the brain drain are you seeing?

We've a hiring crisis in medicine, engineering and finance where companies cannot attract high level talent because the tax regime is too harsh here

Jinglejangle69

Another day another FG bashing thread.

Must be 5 at this stage.

People seem obsessed. Bizarre.

beachhead

Pasquale has professionalised talking out of both ends in a condescending voice.He'll be gone after next election so no need to worry/heart attack too much

AndrewJRenko

Eric Cartman wrote: »

We've a hiring crisis in medicine, engineering and finance where companies cannot attract high level talent because the tax regime is too harsh here

Strange how they've continued to stay here and move here, with Dublin being the preferred base for financial organisations escaping London because of Brexit.

ThunbergsAreGo

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Another day another FG bashing thread.

Must be 5 at this stage.

People seem obsessed. Bizarre.

I am a should be FG voter.

The party is a shambles at the moment and they stand for nothing bar soundbites and appeasing other interests, NGOs etc. Its always someone elses fault with them.

I actually like Pascal

ThunbergsAreGo

dontmindme wrote: »

We've had economic growth during a global pandemic.

Which shows how little GDP means to the general population, large swathes of whom are out of work.

Wanderer78

Markus Antonius wrote:

For the last 10 years every tax hike was because of the 2008 financial collapse. Now for the next 10 years every tax hike will be because of Covid.

Fiscal conservative finance ministers are lethal, you d have to wonder if they'll ever figure out that their fundamental economic theories and beliefs are pure sh1te, have little or no meaning in the real world, there's actually no need to be raising taxes for such things, just roll the damn debt away ffs! People have to stand up at some stage about this nonsense

smurgen

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Another day another FG bashing thread.

Must be 5 at this stage.

People seem obsessed. Bizarre.

It's almost like they've been running the country the last decade or something.

Wanderer78

smurgen wrote: »

It's almost like they've been running the country the last decade or something.

have they?

suicide_circus

Deleted User wrote: »

Who is having their house reefed off them? This is the only country in the world I know of where you can not pay your mortgage and get to keep your house.

Financial basket case of a country.

smurgen

Wanderer78 wrote: »

have they?

When it suits them. When it's doesn't they'll just blame Europe or whoever else.

Anyway comments on Davy are alarming.it seem like he's happy to sweep it all under the carpet and the self regulation he's hinting at from Davy to NTMA is a joke in light of what's happened. Maybe the links between himself and Davy should be looked at.

""But it will be one of many factors they will look at, and I would imagine what would be one of the biggest factors will be absolute clarity from Davy that the kinds of incident that did occur could not occur again in the future. Particularly, of course, in relation to business that the Irish State would do with Davy."

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-40242923.html

Wanderer78

suicide_circus wrote: »

Financial basket case of a country.

....and since theres a backup plan, if such situations do arise, i.e. a functioning public housing system, this is simply disgraceful!

suicide_circus

Wanderer78 wrote: »

....and since theres a backup plan, if such situations do arise, i.e. a functioning public housing system, this is simply disgraceful!

Well quite, another aspect in which we are a basket case.

Wanderer78

suicide_circus wrote: »

Well quite, another aspect in which we are a basket case.

so by any chance is this the reason why we simply cannot repo houses?

ExMachina1000

Pascal actually has a proven track record pre politics. A shrewd and intelligent man.

Dont believe me? Look it up.

suicide_circus

Wanderer78 wrote: »

so by any chance is this the reason why we simply cannot repo houses?

Partly. It's also a colonial hangover i think.

Wanderer78

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Pascal actually has a proven track record pre politics. A shrewd and intelligent man.

Dont believe me? Look it up.

...only that neoclassical economics is not just largely nonsense, its also dangerous

ExMachina1000

Wanderer78 wrote: »

...only that neoclassical economics is not just largely nonsense, its also dangerous

Buzzwords backed by nothing.

Wanderer78

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Buzzwords backed by nothing.

really! backed by decades of respected research and actual data

ExMachina1000

Wanderer78 wrote: »

really! backed by decades of respected research and actual data

Yes really.

Red flag research.

Wanderer78

ExMachina1000 wrote: »

Yes really.

Red flag research.

what are you talking about now? no actual research from actual researchers in actual respected institutions

I'll never have any mass on a Fine Gael finance minister, but if you offered me a Paschal Donohoe every time Fine Gael/Fianna Fáil are in government, I'd shake your hand right now.

Wanderer78

Deleted User wrote: »

I'll never have any mass on a Fine Gael finance minister, but if you offered me a Paschal Donohoe every time Fine Gael/Fianna Fáil are in government, I'd shake your hand right now.

...so maintaining the same is gonna change things by......

Wanderer78

Wanderer78 wrote: »

...so maintaining the same is gonna change things by......

Re-read what I wrote.

Wanderer78

Deleted User wrote: »

Re-read what I wrote.

sorry im not sure what you re getting at?

Wanderer78

Wanderer78 wrote: »

sorry im not sure what you re getting at?

I have no expectations of anything changing with a Fine Gael finance minister, but I'd take Donohoe over the likes of Cowen or Noonan.

Wanderer78

Deleted User wrote: »

I have no expectations of anything changing with a Fine Gael finance minister, but I'd take Donohoe over the likes of Cowen or Noonan.

theres actually little or nothing between them all, all from the same school of thought

Eric Cartman

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Strange how they've continued to stay here and move here, with Dublin being the preferred base for financial organisations escaping London because of Brexit.

The corporate entities, their call centres , emea contact centres etc... absolutely, but the executive teams are still resident in the uk, bvi, malta, channel islands etc.. because of our tax regime.

Recruiting here is hard for these roles because the person who would be happy with £100k a year in the uk would need about €180k here to have the same lifestyle

The J Stands for Jay

Markus Antonius wrote: »

Yesterday it was announced that Bank of Ireland, AIB and PTSB collectively utilized 493 million in losses to offset against their corporation tax bill. And yet Prodigy Paschal comes out saying - Poor banks, we couldn't let them have such a dent in their profits AND be expected to pay corporation tax now could we? And yet private citizens can't offset investment losses off income tax/PAYE!

Private citizens can offset their investment losses against investment gains, and even carry them forward to offset against future profits, similar to what the banks are doing.

The J Stands for Jay

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

Which shows how little GDP means to the general population, large swathes of whom are out of work.

I don't actually know anyone who's out of work. A good few are working more than ever these days.

_Kaiser_

McGaggs wrote: »

I don't actually know anyone who's out of work. A good few are working more than ever these days.

It probably depends on your circle of friends. Most of mine still are too but they're in tech jobs.

But a few others who were part time, in retail or hospitality haven't worked for most of the last year.

The J Stands for Jay

Eric Cartman wrote: »

The corporate entities, their call centres , emea contact centres etc... absolutely, but the executive teams are still resident in the uk, bvi, malta, channel islands etc.. because of our tax regime.

Recruiting here is hard for these roles because the person who would be happy with £100k a year in the uk would need about €180k here to have the same lifestyle

I don't think we should be competing with islands who rely entirely on being a tax haven (we'll stick with being just a little bit of a tax haven).