Getting a driveway & DCC Dishing

JohnRock

Hi,

Has anyone got a driveway added to their home which required dishing by DCC. I took a look on their website and they want planning permission approved first.

If you've been through the process what was the total cost and how long did it take?

Many thanks,

dazberry

I think it took maybe 2 - 3 weeks after I'd paid, and cost AFAIR €550 - this was 4 or 5 years ago now. They started on a Sunday morning at 8am - neighbours weren't best pleased The dishing itself was done over a couple of days, dug one day, concreted the next etc.

JohnRock

Thanks for this. How did you get planning permission? Can you recommend someone?

dazberry

We had applied for permission for a house extension and the driveway at the same time. We had used an architect in Blackrock (Dublin) because he was doing an extension on a house around the corner from us at the time. The majority of the work was obviously on the extension - which we never got to build in the end - so it might be over kill for just a drive way - I don't know - but I can p.m. you the details if you like?

D.

dazberry

To get the path dished, I had to go into DCC myself. I found the department and a grumpy guy came out, scribbled on my application, and told me to go down and pay in the lobby - and not to come back even if they tried to send me

JohnRock

If you wouldn't mind that would be great. You've been very helpful

Gumbo

dazberry wrote: »

To get the path dished, I had to go into DCC myself. I found the department and a grumpy guy came out, scribbled on my application, and told me to go down and pay in the lobby - and not to come back even if they tried to send me

Obviously after planning as,you have to produce this document.

Gumbo

JohnRock wrote: »

Hi,

Has anyone got a driveway added to their home which required dishing by DCC. I took a look on their website and they want planning permission approved first.

If you've been through the process what was the total cost and how long did it take?

Many thanks,

You don’t get planning for the dishing. The dishing is done on a public path so DCC do these works of production of a granted planning application to create or alter a vehicular entrance.

It’s a set fee of €788 if I recall correctly and that covers you for about 7 or 8 square meters. That should cover most Dublin dishes.

Now the hard part.
You have to get planning to create or alter a vehicular entrance. I’ve lodged a hundred of these over the years with about 95% success rate. The refusals were for people taking the mick and looking for weird, separate or larger entrances.

DCC will allow 3.6m max opening. This is written Into their development plan, but it’s taken into context with surround properties, lamp standards and existing mature trees.

Do you have an entrance you want to widen or do you have none at all and are looking to create one?

The issue to you here is that it’s a normal planning application so drawings required, newspaper ad, OSi maps etc
It takes 8 weeks from the date of lodgement to get a decision and 4 weeks after that for ABP appeals.

Marcusm

Isn't one of DCC's most overriding conditions that there not be a loss of any allocated disc parking spaces? Are you in an area with controlled parking? If yes, you may be on a road to nowhere.

AndrewJRenko

Be careful about the increased risk of flooding resulting from concreting over a garden.

Gumbo

Marcusm wrote: »

Isn't one of DCC's most overriding conditions that there not be a loss of any allocated disc parking spaces? Are you in an area with controlled parking? If yes, you may be on a road to nowhere.

If there’s Pay and Display outside, there’s a calculation that the council will ask for by condition and it’s based on the average income over a period of time for the meters there.

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Be careful about the increased risk of flooding resulting from concreting over a garden.

Most driveways will be gently sloped away from the dwelling. There should be no risk of flooding. This and the fact that the hard standing is conditioned to be permeable and there will always be a small green space left I would say the risk of flooding is quite low.

dazberry

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Be careful about the increased risk of flooding resulting from concreting over a garden.

One of the planning conditions for our driveway was to leave a gap at each side for drainage.

Marcusm

Gumbo wrote: »

If there’s Pay and Display outside, there’s a calculation that the council will ask for by condition and it’s based on the average income over a period of time for the meters there.

.

Are you sure about that as I can think of 10 or more applications around me over past 10 years (I have lived here for 5) which were declined on the grounds that policy is not to permit the removal of a pay/display space to facilitate an entrance for a driveway. There was no call for a contribution. The only successful application involved a combination of expensive surveys of the surrounding streets for months (to demonstrate lack of usage) together with an emotional plea (widower with 2 kids under 3).

Gumbo

Marcusm wrote: »

Are you sure about that as I can think of 10 or more applications around me over past 10 years (I have lived here for 5) which were declined on the grounds that policy is not to permit the removal of a pay/display space to facilitate an entrance for a driveway. There was no call for a contribution. The only successful application involved a combination of expensive surveys of the surrounding streets for months (to demonstrate lack of usage) together with an emotional plea (widower with 2 kids under 3).

Depends on location.
There are certain areas where the removal of the on street parking just won’t happen, Iona road in Glasnevin for example, and the streets around it.

I should have saved the reference I had but can’t find it now. It may be outdated by now though.

Marcusm

Gumbo wrote: »

Depends on location.
There are certain areas where the removal of the on street parking just won’t happen, Iona road in Glasnevin for example, and the streets around it.

I should have saved the reference I had but can’t find it now. It may be outdated by now though.

The is the standard bumpf which appears in the refusals I have seen. On its face, it is of fairly broad applicaiton to residential streets as opposed to estates. It would be pretty unusual for houses built prior to 50s/60s to have any level of drive ways. Some of the ones I have seen refused would have front gardens which could hold 20-30 cars (not that they ever would) such that I would see it as a fairly broadly based policy.

Section 17.40.11 of the Plan states that there will be a presumption against the
removal of on-street parking spaces to facilitate the provision of vehicular access to single dwellings in predominantly residential areas where residents are largely reliant on on-street car parking spaces.
The removal of an on-street communal car parking space to facilitate the provision of a private driveway is considered undesirable as it reduces the number of spaces available for residents, commercial/leisure uses and the wider community and is contrary to Dublin City Council’s policy .

kravmaga

JohnRock wrote: »

Hi,

Has anyone got a driveway added to their home which required dishing by DCC. I took a look on their website and they want planning permission approved first.

If you've been through the process what was the total cost and how long did it take?

Many thanks,

You will need an Architect or CAD engineer. see link, its all explained and fees etc

https://www.dublincity.ie/residential/transportation/road-maintenance-services/modify-footpath-allow-vehicular-access

Spanish Eyes

Funny enough, about ten or maybe more years ago we were considering widening the dishing on the road. There was a huge cherry tree on the verge between the houses and the council agreed it needed to come down. Neighbours happy about this too.

Anyway, the tree was removed. We went on holidays, and when we got back the dishing was done to include the space where the tree was. We were gobsmacked, but according to the foreman he said it was approved by the council members that all dishes in the area that were cracked or old would be replaced, and so they were. Those were the days when money was sloshing around, but I ain't complaining. This was SDCC.

Someone I knew got it done in the 90s. No planning needed and the council never sent a bill.

Gumbo

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Funny enough, about ten or maybe more years ago we were considering widening the dishing on the road. There was a huge cherry tree on the verge between the houses and the council agreed it needed to come down. Neighbours happy about this too.

Anyway, the tree was removed. We went on holidays, and when we got back the dishing was done to include the space where the tree was. We were gobsmacked, but according to the foreman he said it was approved by the council members that all dishes in the area that were cracked or old would be replaced, and so they were. Those were the days when money was sloshing around, but I ain't complaining. This was SDCC.

Sometimes you can be incredibly lucky.
Near me, one resident got wind that the council would be relaying the footpaths on his road in 6 months time. They had already started in and around Dublin 11, so his road was on the list in a particular order.

He rang me about getting a driveway. My advice was to get his planning in ASAP as the contractors doing the paths will only lay a dish where there was a vehicular entrance otherwise it was like for like.

So I got his planning in, then his 3 neighbours got informed and from one stretch of road I lodged 4 applications for vehicular entrances.

3 months later, planning granted. All 4 of them got the walls knocked down and new pillars etc into place. About 2 months after that the crew started on their road. They all got dishing free of charge because they had their entrances in places. They all saved about €800.

SouthWesterly wrote: »

Someone I knew got it done in the 90s. No planning needed and the council never sent a bill.

No planning required for dishing. It’s a roads department exercise. The planning is for the vehicular entrance in the boundary.

absolutegroove

If anyone has a driveway contractor recommendation I’d appreciate a PM.

I’m based in Dublin 7

Gumbo

absolutegroove wrote: »

If anyone has a driveway contractor recommendation I’d appreciate a PM.

I’m based in Dublin 7

The council do it.
No private contractors do it as the cost of the PI that had to be put forward and you have to pay a bond that’s returned 12 months later.

You won’t get a contractor to carry out this job for less that what DCC charge (€800).

absolutegroove

Apologies - my mistake.

The dishing has been done already.

I'm looking for recommendations for paving the driveway in cobblelock (PM's for recommendations in D7).

I've had a few people out to quote but I'm not sure about them.

Gumbo

absolutegroove wrote: »

Apologies - my mistake.

The dishing has been done already.

I'm looking for recommendations for paving the driveway in cobblelock (PM's for recommendations in D7).

I've had a few people out to quote but I'm not sure about them.

Garden paving really is a hit and miss trade.
Walk around Cabra and look for gardens you like.

Knock in and ask who done it and how long ago. Ask if there’s maintenance.
It’s the only way. The home owners won’t mind at all based on my experience of doing the same thing and then having someone knock at my door rolling it getting done.

A;ways good to hear of a laving contract that done a job 5 years ago still being in business today. I could name 10 “companies” that no longer exist for one reason or another. They seem to pop up, get real,busy during summer months when everyone is screaming for the work then they disappear.

absolutegroove

Thanks Gumbo

I have walked and asked around Cabra but as you said some contractors disappear but also the quotes can be crazy.

I’m on the lookout to get my back garden done with a patio (grey sandstone or natural stone) but I don’t think I’ll knock on the neighbours doors for that!! - lol

absolutegroove

absolutegroove wrote: »

Apologies - my mistake.

The dishing has been done already.

I'm looking for recommendations for paving the driveway in cobblelock (PM's for recommendations in D7).

I've had a few people out to quote but I'm not sure about them.

There is a guy on annamoe Road, can't remember the name of his company I know someone who got him to to some work. He did a good job at the time

Gumbo

absolutegroove wrote: »

Thanks Gumbo

I have walked and asked around Cabra but as you said some contractors disappear but also the quotes can be crazy.

I’m on the lookout to get my back garden done with a patio (grey sandstone or natural stone) but I don’t think I’ll knock on the neighbours doors for that!! - lol

The problem with patios and paving is that the cheap guys disappear and the expensive guys are expensive because they do it properly and are still in operation.

lucat

I'm in the process of buying a new house on a road that has on-street parking. In January 2020 the next door neighbours got planning for a driveway, which they've put in. But even though they park there, the street parking in front of the driveway has not yet been removed by DCC, so access is blocked! It's the most ridiculous sight to see their car blocked in by the street parking. I was wondering why DCC might not have removed it yet. Any ideas?

Gumbo

lucat wrote: »

I'm in the process of buying a new house on a road that has on-street parking. In January 2020 the next door neighbours got planning for a driveway, which they've put in. But even though they park there, the street parking in front of the driveway has not yet been removed by DCC, so access is blocked! It's the most ridiculous sight to see their car blocked in by the street parking. I was wondering why DCC might not have removed it yet. Any ideas?

Very strange!
Have they got into them about it’s removal?
Maybe they haven’t paid the contribution for the planning (if there’s one outstanding).

lucat

Gumbo wrote: »

Very strange!
Have they got into them about it’s removal?
Maybe they haven’t paid the contribution for the planning (if there’s one outstanding).

I don't know, I'm going to introduce myself on Sunday & I'll ask them then. It's a bit concerning though.

Marcusm

lucat wrote: »

I'm in the process of buying a new house on a road that has on-street parking. In January 2020 the next door neighbours got planning for a driveway, which they've put in. But even though they park there, the street parking in front of the driveway has not yet been removed by DCC, so access is blocked! It's the most ridiculous sight to see their car blocked in by the street parking. I was wondering why DCC might not have removed it yet. Any ideas?

I know plenty of places where street markings such as for bus stops and parking spaces remain after they have been neutralised by a driveway/dropped kerb. It’s unlawful to park in them and bock the entry/exit. The road markings do not overrule the dropped kerb/entrance.

lucat

Marcusm wrote: »

I know plenty of places where street markings such as for bus stops and parking spaces remain after they have been neutralised by a driveway/dropped kerb. It’s unlawful to park in them and bock the entry/exit. The road markings do not overrule the dropped kerb/entrance.

Really?! Most people probably don't know that. Why don't they just remove the markings when they drop the kerb? Paint over them or whatever has to be done.

JohnRock

Thank you for all the comments. I've made my application to DCC. There's a 4 month waiting list just for inspection. I'll let you know how it goes for anyone else who needs it done.

spurious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/116705288#Comment_116705288

Could it be a second car belonging to them?

thewiseowl12

Apologies for resurrecting an old thread.

Follow up query in relation to planning and dishing. Based in Cabra and put in for planning for vehicular access - followed all criteria in terms of keeping the opening no more than 3m, permeable driveway etc, and it has been refused because of a tree within 3.5m of the proposed dishing. The reply says that they don't wish to see precedent and there is no way I can satisfy that condition.

What galls me is that literally no house on the road has planning permission for their driveways (planner even noted this in decision, some are dished, some are not for whatever reason) and(!) that every tree on the road has dishing within 1m, including my neighbour, who is within 1m of the tree in question. So there is no precedent to set!

Grateful for advice on options - I've two weeks to appeal to an bord pleanala - its €220 and 18 weeks though.

Could I resubmit a planning application and cite all the examples on the road already! €35 and 8 weeks)

Thanks.

neris

Appeal it or an bord pleanala

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122392525#Comment_122392525

I’ve had 2 refusals for driveways in the last 15 years.

1 was a dangerous bend which I advised but client wanted to take the chance.

2 was because of the new Dublin City tree strategy. We were within 1m or so. I’ll have to check.

Basically the tree strategy now is a valid reason for refusing but previously they would allow tree relocation.

If you want to pm me the plan reg number I’ll take a look but you can ignore your neighbors examples as they are not legal precedents as they appear to be unauthorised. Unfortunately you are being penalized for going the correct route.

You can appeal of course but a new planning app will require some change to the previous one and obviously require new drawings, newspaper notice etc

thewiseowl12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122394458#Comment_122394458

Thanks Gumbo, really appreciate it and pm'd you there.

My reading of it is that the planner had no objection in principle, apart from a few conditions, but the tree policy scuppered it. In practice, there is no way I can meet the 3.5m rule due to the width of our garden.

There is also a communications box on the ground already adjacent to the tree so the root network is already being interfered with.