CS tyrannical boss

Its not that easy, id agree

But now id stop a long way short of claiming that pmds not achieved entries are stopping increments left right and centre

It is a part of the role to report and push back where work is overburdened, to remain steadfast and evidence this and to continue to seek resources or prioritisation on what gets done.

I think that theres too much "all or nothing" in the replies but most working relationships day-to-day in the service find a way to make these compromises without taking that absolutist approach.

And HR aren't there to manage workloads or deal with individual issues against managers- they are there to ensure policies are enacted and in any issue that arises they will be advising the manager long before they will the report. Thats their function, to see that managers manage within the lines.

Threatening managers with HR or the Union is old-fashioned stuff tbh.

Again- the OP seemed fairly new in the role, had said they were going to tackle a manager on behalf of the whole unit before seeing out their probation, the remarks had the manager psychologically profiled and diagnosed, i dont know im hearing warning bells here that suggest theres many avenues to resolution here but the OP needs to rein in their own approach first

typeAnotOK

typeAnotOK wrote: »

I am determined to tackle this problem. People like this just continue to go unchecked and damage other people's careers and confidence otherwise. Thanks again for the advice.

Even though this is a noble aspiration, it's a futile one. Right now you are in the work equivalent of an abusive relationship. Your boss isn't going to change and HR aren't likely to see things your way, and even if they did, what fix could they realistically enforce? Since you aren't going to leave, you need to fix what you can realistically fix.

I would say you need to focus on managing your relationship with your boss. Try to work out where the work flow is coming from and if there's a more appropriate department to deal with it. If possible focus on the efficiency of the various tasks so they can be completed faster. Try and impose a general order on the chaos they impose (and love, despite what they say, ime).

I have worked for people like your boss and honestly, the only way to win (and in my experience, I didn't win) is to play the long game as outlined by others here.

Good luck OP, hope you can find a lateral or upward move away soon.

What happens when you don't agree with tasks on your PMDS?

It goes to a first reviewer, usually the grade above you.

If it can't be agreed with them, it goes to a second reviewer, usually a grade above the first reviewer.

Usually the buck stops with the PO.

But what happens when the PO is the problem???

(eta)


So. Good luck with getting them to acknowledge via PMDS that the reason tasks are not achieved is because their staff is overburdened and under-rescourced when they keep taking on more tasks for the unit.

Its all very well in theory, but when you're actually in the situation and trying to deal with someone like the PO the OP describes, it's a different story.

thenightman

Suck up the year of probation, put yourself on the mobility list and keep an eye out for internal moves as well obviously. You'll more than likely get used to the way of doing things anyway. You won't win vs a PO either way.

Most departments involved in critical services are getting reamed since Covid. I'm clocking onaverage 7 hours a week extra that in theory can be banked as flexi, but will never be allowed to be taken on top of annual leave which is also restricted for us currently. Joys of CS.

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What happens when you don't agree with tasks on your PMDS?

It goes to a first reviewer, usually the grade above you.

If it can't be agreed with them, it goes to a second reviewer, usually a grade above the first reviewer.

Usually the buck stops with the PO.

But what happens when the PO is the problem???

(eta)


So. Good luck with getting them to acknowledge via PMDS that the reason tasks are not achieved is because their staff is overburdened and under-rescourced when they keep taking on more tasks for the unit.

Its all very well in theory, but when you're actually in the situation and trying to deal with someone like the PO the OP describes, it's a different story.

Again, rather akin to the previous point, this is a bit expansio ad absurdum (did i just invent that concept)

Sure in theory you could spin out the possibility forever like the above.

In reality what will happen is that a person aets out what they can and cannot get done, stands over it and requests prioritisation or instruction.

If the manager can demonstrate it was all doable before (or should be reasonably so) then theres an issue, sure- be that training or experience or whatever (i dont think we've seen the OP acknowledge that there might be a shortfall here but they are new to the role).

If work isnt going to be delivered, flag early and flag often and be prepared to stand over the attempts and decisions made and sure we could all speculate that there would be dire consequences on the individual but how often do you see that?

Id suggest rarely. Very rarely indeed tbh.

So you need to mind your own patch, ensure you're doing all you can and doing it well and defend that if it arises.

I dont think these are unreasonable or untypical asks, and at least in the CS you are a lot more insulated from the possible consequences of an unreasonable boss than in the private sector.

Awaaf

I have a bit of experience in these situations so a few thoughts for what they are worth but please bear in mind that I don’t fully know your situation.

Firstly, I am sorry to hear you are working in an ineffectively run unit which is overtasked (possibly to aid the career of the unit head). This is not a sustainable or efficient way to run things. You are correct to be concerned but finding a way out can be tricky.

First things first I would protect your health. Ideally you need to manage your workload/rest/diet/stress as best you can. If you can develop your skillset here it will bring lifelong benefits. Tap in to your support network to help manage this period. Great that you are using the EAS! Explain the situation and ask for help from the people you trust. Seeing as you are working from home and are working overtime can you take frequent short breaks to calm yourself?

Secondly you need protection if you are going to take a stand so completing probation is probably important in this regard but not as important as your health. If you get through probation you are then in a less vulnerable position and can revisit your strategy. HOWEVER, if at any stage the situation becomes untenable from a health point of view HEALTH MUST COME FIRST!

If you do go sick for a time, there is legislative protection (as far as I know) which can be used to counteract any attempts to use it against you. If they do use it against you fight like a dog obviously (use the union for this) but that’s for another day. Do keep records however and don’t rely on others to back you up. In fact, assume some will give evidence against you if it comes to making a formal complaint.

I wouldn’t give up your new grade as 1) you work hard 2) you like the CS 3) why should you! 4) you have earned it 5) if you do suffer any bullying for taking a stand in the future you hold those T+Cs , and 6) you can be sure the assholes wouldn’t!

From my experience it can be helpful to look at why the boss may behave like this and try to understand. This sounds a bit weird - to have compassion for a bully - but there is lots of evidence that it’s in many of us and can come out under stress particularly in under resourced situations. Is he being dumped on by his boss etc? Of course Psychopaths exist also and he may be one. If so exercise extreme caution. Developing compassion however is a help in lowering stress and anger levels and it doesn’t mean that you accept the situation long term.

During this period I would forget about solving the problem for anyone else. I wouldn’t confront the boss as your position is weakened temporarily (by being on probation etc.), also all others have failed and you are somewhat below par in any case. You won’t even be solving it for yourself until you are in a safer position. For now, you will just be bolstering your resources.

Once are in a less precarious situation you can decide what to do next. Get help with your strategy from people who know you and who you trust. Ultimately bear in mind that lots of people have seen a few types of workgroups and extrapolate advice from there – few have seen it all or can fully understand your setup. While you might like to change how the department is, it is not your call so unless you can persuade the boss to do so you will be undermining his legitimate authority by doing so – even if he is a major problem!

As regards strategy the moment you are in a less precarious position (i.e. day one post probation) you must establish strong but not impermeable boundaries. This is basically kick back politely at any inappropriate demands while listening out for unpleasant but reasonable demands. In general you shouldn’t kickback against the latter. If you can use this to establish a real dialogue between yourselves it could be quite transformative in the longer term but there are no guarantees.

You may have to establish boundaries while still on probation (as a last resort) if you become a target but you seem to have avoided this for now.

HTH

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Again, rather akin to the previous point, this is a bit expansio ad absurdum (did i just invent that concept)

Sure in theory you could spin out the possibility forever like the above.

In reality what will happen is that a person aets out what they can and cannot get done, stands over it and requests prioritisation or instruction.

If the manager can demonstrate it was all doable before (or should be reasonably so) then theres an issue, sure- be that training or experience or whatever (i dont think we've seen the OP acknowledge that there might be a shortfall here but they are new to the role).

If work isnt going to be delivered, flag early and flag often and be prepared to stand over the attempts and decisions made and sure we could all speculate that there would be dire consequences on the individual but how often do you see that?

Id suggest rarely. Very rarely indeed tbh.

So you need to mind your own patch, ensure you're doing all you can and doing it well and defend that if it arises.

I dont think these are unreasonable or untypical asks, and at least in the CS you are a lot more insulated from the possible consequences of an unreasonable boss than in the private sector.

I think your underestimating how much it happens. I've actually seen it happen where people have been totally screwed over in, denied increments and lost out on promotions in exactly the manner I've described above, all because of a demi-god PO, but maybe you have to see it to believe it.

In my experience, when it comes down to it, management / HR with ALWAYS take the word of the senior grade over the less-senior. ALWAYS.