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Woman crosses dual carriageway on foot, gets hit by car, gets €3.2M

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    #332
    Potential-Monke
    Registered Users Posts: 13,846 ✭✭✭✭Potential-Monke


    TallGlass2 wrote: »
    I asked earlier, out of interest. Might have got lost in the heat of the other comments !

    Can the driver sue the women?

    Yes. And I'd imagine would be somewhat successful, as it would be a civil case and the onus of proof/responsibility goes on the balance of probabilities.


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    #333
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,338 ✭✭✭jmreire


    Alias G wrote: »
    If the motorist was found to bear culpability, of course the judgement would be similar. The size of the award depends on facts that none of us are privvy to.

    I'm not so sure about that. On the continent, the roads and carriageways are for vehicles, and the footpaths are for pedestrians, and these laws are enforced. In Spain ( pre Covid) I remember stepping off the footpath in an Aldi supermarket, and a passing car nearly blew me off the road,,, the message was cristal clear....KEEP ON THE FOOTPATH!!! And after that experience, I did. Maybe some one else has their own continental driving / walking experiences? And as far as I know, in the US, its illegal to walk on the roads...its called JayWalking.


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    #334
    Gaoth Laidir
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    Alias G wrote: »
    Perhaps not in rural kildare as per your example. But in this instance, it would be far safer if the bus stop was served by a convenient means of crossing safely and efficiently.

    There is. A great big pedestrian bridge. If that wasn't there you'd have a point alright. <SNIP> decided not to use it, for the sake of 4 minutes' extra walking time.
    TallGlass2 wrote: »
    I asked earlier, out of interest. Might have got lost in the heat of the other comments !

    Can the driver sue the women?

    I sincerely hope so.


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    #335
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,433 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    TallGlass2 wrote: »
    I asked earlier, out of interest. Might have got lost in the heat of the other comments !

    Can the driver sue the women?
    For what? Emotional damage? Careless walking? There are questions over whether the driver was speeding, driving in the bus lane, and failing to brake. They didn't even attempt a defence so I doubt there was any hope of winning when they were being sued, they'd be mental to try to sue her.


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    #336
    Alias G
    Registered Users Posts: 789 ✭✭✭Alias G


    Gaoth Laidir wrote: »
    There is. A great big pedestrian bridge. If that wasn't there you'd have a point alright. Lazy bitch decided not to use it, for the sake of 4 minutes' extra walking time.

    I did say efficiently. Nothing efficient about getting dragged 1/4 of a kilometre out of your way. It is against best practice in urban design and more importantly, the consequence is that there will always be those who choose the short cut precipitating tragic events on occasion. We should be serving pedestrians needs in the vicinity of a town centre, not prioritising motor traffic.


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    #337
    Gaoth Laidir
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    I did it again. I measured the distance from the bus stop to the bridge and it's just 75 metres. Apparently that's still not close enough for some...


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    #338
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,338 ✭✭✭jmreire


    Gaoth Laidir wrote: »
    So should there be a pedestrian crossing at every bus stop along a dual carriageway?

    I'm flogging a dead horse at this stage. Your mind is made up. Personal responsibility means nothing anymore. You and others like you are fcuking up this country and it seems there's nothing I or anyone else can do about it.

    I just hope the driver sues the millionaire for damages herself.

    +100%. Personal responsibility is gone out the window...Its now big business in its own right, but in its aplication, it's closing down businesses left right and centre. Change and reform is being fought tooth and nails by all the vested interests. And now we have the interrupted business insurance claims kicking in....no matter how much of this liability has been passed on to EU or other external insurance company's ( who still have to agree to payouts ) like the 3.2 million in this case, it will fall back on the ordinary policy holders to pay up.


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    #339
    Gaoth Laidir
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    Alias G wrote: »
    I did say efficiently. Nothing efficient about getting dragged 1/4 of a kilometre out of your way. It is against best practice in urban design and more importantly, the consequence is that there will always be those who choose the short cut precipitating tragic events on occasion. We should be serving pedestrians needs in the vicinity of a town centre, not prioritising motor traffic.

    Ah here...

    On that crazy note I'm calling it a night.


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    #340
    breezy1985
    Registered Users Posts: 24,669 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    jmreire wrote: »
    I'm not so sure about that. On the continent, the roads and carriageways are for vehicles, and the footpaths are for pedestrians, and these laws are enforced. In Spain ( pre Covid) I remember stepping off the footpath in an Aldi supermarket, and a passing car nearly blew me off the road,,, the message was cristal clear....KEEP ON THE FOOTPATH!!! And after that experience, I did. .


    That is not an enforced rule that is a car almost running you over.


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    #341
    Alias G
    Registered Users Posts: 789 ✭✭✭Alias G


    Gaoth Laidir wrote: »
    I did it again. I measured the distance from the bus stop to the bridge and it's just 75 metres. Apparently that's still not close enough for some...

    As you know, it adds 250m to the distance in total. People will take a short cut for far less.


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    #342
    Sheep breeder
    Registered Users Posts: 1,982 ✭✭✭Sheep breeder


    The two woman involved in this accident only one made a decision, one to cross a dual carriageway in a built up area for to save time walking to the safe option of the foot bridge. The other driving along never intending to knock someone down doing a stupid thing crossing a dual carriageway. Both have ended up with health issues over one who made the decision intentionally.


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    #343
    kippy
    Registered Users Posts: 18,449 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    Alias G wrote: »
    As you know, it adds 250m to the distance in total. People will take a short cut for far less.

    So who is at fault when someone takes a shortcut?
    Who makes that decision?


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    #344
    Alias G
    Registered Users Posts: 789 ✭✭✭Alias G


    kippy wrote: »
    So who is at fault when someone takes a shortcut?
    Who makes that decision?

    I can repeat myself if you wish. The short cutter bears responsibility if it involves putting themselves at risk. I have never denied that. In this instance there was also blame attributable to the motorist. I think I'll go stand in the middle of the road myself if some one asks me to repeat that sentence again.


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    #345
    kippy
    Registered Users Posts: 18,449 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    Alias G wrote: »
    I can repeat myself if you wish. The short cutter bears responsibility if it involves putting themselves at risk. I have never denied that. In this instance there was also blame attributable to the motorist. I think I'll go stand in the middle of the road myself if some one asks me to repeat that sentence again.

    And who would have been responsible for stopping, looking for a safe place to cross, looking both ways, then making the decision that it was safe to cross the road?


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    #346
    Alias G
    Registered Users Posts: 789 ✭✭✭Alias G


    kippy wrote: »
    And who would have been responsible for stopping, looking for a safe place to cross, looking both ways, then making the decision that it was safe to cross the road?

    I have already answered this. Please make your point.


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    #347
    jmreire
    Registered Users Posts: 8,338 ✭✭✭jmreire


    breezy1985 wrote: »
    That is not an enforced rule that is a car almost running you over.

    Car was not within 20 or 25 feet of me...but I had stepped off the footpath, and the driver was telling me to get back on the footpath..so I did. I've lived in several different Countries, and I can tell you this much about most of them, step off the footpath, when you don't have a green light, and you get hit, tough luck. You will find yourself paying for any damage sustained by the vehicle.


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    #348
    the_syco
    Registered Users Posts: 37,295 ✭✭✭✭the_syco


    Alias G wrote: »
    We should be serving pedestrians needs in the vicinity of a town centre, not prioritising motor traffic.
    She got a bus that specifically doesn't go through the town.

    She got the 101x bus, which only serves that busstop once a day at 06:26

    Sunrise would have been at about 06:19 on that day. So the sun would've been very low at the time that the woman thought it was a good idea to cross the road.

    Someone mentioned that the driver was in the buslane; a few meters after the busstop, said lane is a "turn left" lane.


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    #349
    OMM 0000
    Registered Users Posts: 3,733 ✭✭✭OMM 0000


    jmreire wrote: »
    From a slightly different viewpoint,,,,,,had this accident happened identically in any other EU Country, would the judgement and the award have been the same?

    If it had happened in China, the driver would have reversed over the woman to make sure she's dead. The payout for killing someone is cheaper than their hospital bills.

    If this woman had died, I wonder would her family have been given 3.2 million? Probably not.

    Weird...


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    #350
    knucklehead6
    Registered Users Posts: 6,746 ✭✭✭knucklehead6


    TheChizler wrote: »
    I don't get the comments of stupidity for crossing there, when she was hit she was crossing a bus lane and two regular lanes to get to the central median just before a signal controlled roundabout where people should be slowing down from 80 anyway, that kind of setup is extremely common across the country and people wouldn't give two thoughts to crossing those places. It's not like she was sprinting blind across all 5 lanes in one go, or across a 120 km/h motorway. Has the word "dual-carriageway" blinded people? I'm not familiar with the area but the pedestrian bridge route would add a significant distance, I wouldn't reasonably expect people to use it to get to the bus stop. Typical of planning in this country that pedestrians are an inconvenient afterthought.


    It adds 300 metres. Far from a significant distance


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    #351
    Gaoth Laidir
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    the_syco wrote: »
    Does it say if she walked or ran across the road? https://goo.gl/maps/ZyWa5n7AwT4m3wXq6

    Also, does it state what time of the year & day it was?

    Thursday, April 17th, 2018. She was on her way to work as a retail assistant so I assume it was morning. Pavillions opens at 9 am.

    At nearby Dublin Airport it was raining lightly up to 6 am and became partly cloudy after that. There was no more rain. Winds were fairly light. No reason for her not to see and hear any cars coming as she ran out.


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    #352
    Castlekeeper
    Registered Users Posts: 1,705 ✭✭✭Castlekeeper


    knucklehead6 wrote: »
    CT Forum is that way.

    Is that the line they gave the troika?


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    #353
    kippy
    Registered Users Posts: 18,449 ✭✭✭✭kippy


    Alias G wrote: »
    I have already answered this. Please make your point.
    Sorry I may have missed that.

    Point is. Pedestrian made these decisions.


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    #354
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,433 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    knucklehead6 wrote: »
    It adds 300 metres. Far from a significant distance
    That's highly subjective, when driving it's insignificant but walking not so much, its another 4-5 minutes with the first part in the opposite direction to the direct route. Crossing the road is a much more attractive option IMO.


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    #355
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,433 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    the_syco wrote: »
    She got a bus that specifically doesn't go through the town.

    She got the 101x bus, which only serves that busstop once a day at 06:26

    Sunrise would have been at about 06:19 on that day. So the sun would've been very low at the time that the woman thought it was a good idea to cross the road.

    Someone mentioned that the driver was in the buslane; a few meters after the busstop, said lane is a "turn left" lane.
    Since when does the sun rise in the north east?


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    #356
    Gaoth Laidir
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    TheChizler wrote: »
    That's highly subjective, when driving it's insignificant but walking not so much, its another 4-5 minutes with the first part in the opposite direction to the direct route. Crossing the road is a much more attractive option IMO.

    It's 260 metres and the bridge is 75 metres from the bus stop. At a brisk walking pace (6 kph) it would take around 2.5 minutes extra.


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    #357
    Gaoth Laidir
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    TheChizler wrote: »
    Since when does the sun rise in the north east?

    At that date it rises in the east-northeast (070 °, or about 2.15 on a clockface). In June it rises in the northeast (047 °, 1:30 on a clockface).


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    #358
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,433 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    Gaoth Laidir wrote: »
    At that date it rises in the east-northeast (070 °, or about 2.15 on a clockface). In June it rises in the northeast (047 °, 1:30 on a clockface).

    http://suncalc.net/#/53.4528,-6.2166,18/2018.04.17/06:26

    Exactly and in that direction it would have been indirect and obscured by trees when the driver was in the position to spot her. Even even if the sun was a factor I can never understand how driving blind is used as an excuse, if the sun is in your eyes either fix your visor or slow down.

    I'm not arguing that Jodie is without fault, she may not have crossed the road in a safe manner, I just can't fault her for choosing to cross the road in that spot.


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    #359
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,433 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    Gaoth Laidir wrote: »
    It's 260 metres and the bridge is 75 metres from the bus stop. At a brisk walking pace (6 kph) it would take around 2.5 minutes extra.
    I know which way I'd be going if the traffic allowed. Other people have said people are always crossing there so I'm not alone.


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    #360
    Gaoth Laidir
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    TheChizler wrote: »
    http://suncalc.net/#/53.4528,-6.2166,18/2018.04.17/06:26

    Exactly and in that direction it would have been indirect and obscured by trees when the driver was in the position to spot her. Even even if the sun was a factor I can never understand how driving blind is used as an excuse, if the sun is in your eyes either fix your visor or slow down.

    I'm not arguing that Jodie is without fault, she may not have crossed the road in a safe manner, I just can't fault her for choosing to cross the road in that spot.

    A couple of hours after sunrise, if that's the time this occured given that she works in River Island, it would have been unobscured by the trees. I'm sure the driver could see the road ahead just fine but an idiot ran out from behind a hedge at the last second.

    She crossed the the road in an unsafe and illegal manner. The fact that you commend her for choosing that spot just speaks volumes about you. A footbridge ahead but she chooses a spot from behind a hedge just as a car was arriving. FFS


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    #361
    Gaoth Laidir
    Registered Users Posts: 8,219 ✭✭✭Gaoth Laidir


    TheChizler wrote: »
    I know which way I'd be going if the traffic allowed. Other people have said people are always crossing there so I'm not alone.

    I've passed there many times, even on busy Saturday afternoons, and have never had the problem of some idiot crossing there. I know it doesn't prove much but all Streetview imagery, taken at two different times (2017 and 2019), shows nobody crossing or even about to cross.


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