When's calving starting 2021

whelan2

Started at 4.30am an fr 4513 bull.



MOD: I've started off a new thread, for a new year, keeping the OP of the original, just seemed right.

Old thread here.

Lime Tree Farm

whelan2 wrote: »

Started at 4.30am an fr 4513 bull.

Lovely -

you'll have to start a new thread and lead the way into 2021

greysides

TTT.

French Toast

One of our few Salers likely to calf this week, off the slatts and on to straw tonight. Lost her calf last year so hoping for better this time round.

Lady Haywire

Cow due the end of December still holding on here
Heard roaring from the shed at 6am (I sleep with the window open) so went down to see what was up. Bull having a field day roaring at a heifer in the pen opposite him. Ass :pac:

bogman_bass

Due to start Valentine’s Day here

Dunedin

12/21 calved here. So far so good. 🀞🀞🀞🀞🀞🀞🀞

whelan2

greysides wrote: »

TTT.

Sorry was too busy watching liverpool being bet at home for the first time in 4 years :eek:

whelan2

Lady Haywire wrote: »

Cow due the end of December still holding on here
Heard roaring from the shed at 6am (I sleep with the window open) so went down to see what was up. Bull having a field day roaring at a heifer in the pen opposite him. Ass :pac:

Is it not freezing with the window open. Another calf here last night. Nothing happening at 2am, fr heifer calf up and sucking at 5.30am

dohc turbo2

French Toast wrote: »

One of our few Salers likely to calf this week, off the slatts and on to straw tonight. Lost her calf last year so hoping for better this time round.

My first for 21 like ur story ,bought some incalf heiffers last year , one for some reason never opened up , side door and lost calf , she calved herself two nights ago with a lovely bull

Lady Haywire

whelan2 wrote: »

Is it not freezing with the window open. Another calf here last night. Nothing happening at 2am, fr heifer calf up and sucking at 5.30am

Prefer a cold room & a couple of duvets instead of a stuffy room. Also means lazy arse here doesn't have to get up to let the cats in

Gudstock

A few sucklers here, 9 so far, all good so far touch wood.
The interesting ones:

1. Maiden heifer AI'd twice 6 weeks apart and appeared to be covered by the bull at least once more actually held to the first AI. Lovely AA heifer calf.

2. Two maiden Sims (30 months) calved to Saler PZB. Bull and heifer, the bull needed slight assistance to get the head out but came easy then. Haven't had salers before but these are very large, much heavier and bigger than AAs on other maidens. I was expecting same size as easy AAs?

3. I have a fourth calver LMxHE springing to my SI stockbull, a week to time by my records. She is showing a prolapse when she lies down. She never had any issues to date. On hay for a few weeks. Any advice?

Limestone Cowboy

Gudstock wrote: »

A few sucklers here, 9 so far, all good so far touch wood.
The interesting ones:

1. Maiden heifer AI'd twice 6 weeks apart and appeared to be covered by the bull at least once more actually held to the first AI. Lovely AA heifer calf.

2. Two maiden Sims (30 months) calved to Saler PZB. Bull and heifer, the bull needed slight assistance to get the head out but came easy then. Haven't had salers before but these are very large, much heavier and bigger than AAs on other maidens. I was expecting same size as easy AAs?

3. I have a fourth calver LMxHE springing to my SI stockbull, a week to time by my records. She is showing a prolapse when she lies down. She never had any issues to date. On hay for a few weeks. Any advice?

Keep the pen clean and don't bull her again would be mine. Have kept them before and it gets worse every year in my experience. I had one last year that stayed doing it after she calved.

Gudstock

How did she go during calving?

patsy_mccabe

I've had them here over the years showing some bit of prolapse before calving. They all calved ok, but I got rid of them after. I hate to see it.

tanko

Gudstock wrote: »

A few sucklers here, 9 so far, all good so far touch wood.
The interesting ones:

1. Maiden heifer AI'd twice 6 weeks apart and appeared to be covered by the bull at least once more actually held to the first AI. Lovely AA heifer calf.

2. Two maiden Sims (30 months) calved to Saler PZB. Bull and heifer, the bull needed slight assistance to get the head out but came easy then. Haven't had salers before but these are very large, much heavier and bigger than AAs on other maidens. I was expecting same size as easy AAs?

3. I have a fourth calver LMxHE springing to my SI stockbull, a week to time by my records. She is showing a prolapse when she lies down. She never had any issues to date. On hay for a few weeks. Any advice?

I'd expect Salers to be bigger framed and a bit heavier than easy calved AA calves but they're usually a bag of bones when they're born so easily calved.
There's always a chance that you'll have to help a heifer with a bull calf, once he came easy that's the main thing.
PZB might be a bit harder calved than other Saler bulls, something like Knottown Roy might be better for heifers.

I wouldn't be too worried about the cow with the prolapse, she'll probably calve away without problems, as LC says better keep the pen clean for her and keep an eye on her when she's calving.

whelan2

8 calves now
3 Angus heifers
4 fr bulls
1 fr heifer

Limestone Cowboy

Anyone else think there is a couple in this lady, she got stuck in the crush last November before I put them to the winterage and she wouldn't be the biggest cow in the place. Have only had a few sets of twins here in my memory. Gone fierce bulky looking in the last fortnight.

Dunedin

Limestone Cowboy wrote: »

Anyone else think there is a couple in this lady, she got stuck in the crush last November before I put them to the winterage and she wouldn't be the biggest cow in the place. Have only had a few sets of twins here in my memory. Gone fierce bulky looking in the last fortnight.

She looks fleshy for twins. For experience is the one that looks like twins will horse out a big bull calf and the least expected one will throw 2 little bucks the size of big lamb

Limestone Cowboy

Dunedin wrote: »

She looks fleshy for twins. For experience is the one that looks like twins will horse out a big bull calf and the least expected one will throw 2 little bucks the size of big lamb

That was my experience of the few we had over the years too. She's not as fleshy as she looks in the pic either. There's something big in there anyway either way, I'll find out soon enough. She's the first cow I ever had to get stuck in the crush.

liosnagceann75

Limestone Cowboy wrote: »

Anyone else think there is a couple in this lady, she got stuck in the crush last November before I put them to the winterage and she wouldn't be the biggest cow in the place. Have only had a few sets of twins here in my memory. Gone fierce bulky looking in the last fortnight.

Looks like twins. 1st friesian cow calved Friday with twin belgium blue bulls. Cow wasn't scanned to twins. She'd gone shook lately. Had a job getting a rope around one of the legs. Jacked a big calf and calf dead. Left the cow rest and came back later to check her and a second calf wrapped in the womb. Learnt a lesson to check cows for a second calf. Going to change my scanner as well. He's not picking up on twins

tanko

That's a serious belly, you'd swear it was photoshopped. If it's only one calf it'll be huge. I'd be expecting twins, maybe even triplets:D.
Has she long left to go?

As for scanning, are any scanners able to predict twins. Do they have to be scanned at a particular stage in pregnancy to pick them up?

whelan2

liosnagceann75 wrote: »

Looks like twins. 1st friesian cow calved Friday with twin belgium blue bulls. Cow wasn't scanned to twins. She'd gone shook lately. Had a job getting a rope around one of the legs. Jacked a big calf and calf dead. Left the cow rest and came back later to check her and a second calf wrapped in the womb. Learnt a lesson to check cows for a second calf. Going to change my scanner as well. He's not picking up on twins

How far on were they when scanned? Hard to pick them up when over 4.5 months

White Clover

tanko wrote: »

That's a serious belly, you'd swear it was photoshopped. If it's only one calf it'll be huge. I'd be expecting twins, maybe even triplets:D.
Has she long left to go?

As for scanning, are any scanners able to predict twins. Do they have to be scanned at a particular stage in pregnancy to pick them up?

Between 35 and 70 days is ideal. Any more than 70 days, when the foetus is bigger, there could be one hiding behind the other if you know what I mean. No matter who is scanning them, they won't see the second foetus then.

liosnagceann75

whelan2 wrote: »

How far on were they when scanned? Hard to pick them up when over 4.5 months

Will check my dates later. Was probably over 4.5 months.

White Clover

liosnagceann75 wrote: »

Looks like twins. 1st friesian cow calved Friday with twin belgium blue bulls. Cow wasn't scanned to twins. She'd gone shook lately. Had a job getting a rope around one of the legs. Jacked a big calf and calf dead. Left the cow rest and came back later to check her and a second calf wrapped in the womb. Learnt a lesson to check cows for a second calf. Going to change my scanner as well. He's not picking up on twins

How many days was the cow incalf when scanned?
If heavy incalf, its difficult to pick up twins.

liosnagceann75

White Clover wrote: »

How many days was the cow incalf when scanned?
If heavy incalf, its difficult to pick up twins.

Cow was served on the 19th April and scanned on the 26th September

whelan2

liosnagceann75 wrote: »

Cow was served on the 19th April and scanned on the 26th September

Ye, just one of those things. We've all been there. Twins are a disaster on the cow.

liosnagceann75

whelan2 wrote: »

Ye, just one of those things. We've all been there. Twins are a disaster on the cow.

When should I be scanning?

whelan2

liosnagceann75 wrote: »

When should I be scanning?

Anytime after 28 days. Look it doesn't work out for the early cows when you scan later on but you are trying to catch late cows too. We scan early Sept here.

Mac Taylor

Christ I’d say twins, mind you From the ones that carried twins here you’d hardly tell. I have one scanned to twins will start given her a bit of tlc. Scanner picked her up at 4.5 months

Sugarbowl

Limestone Cowboy wrote: »

Anyone else think there is a couple in this lady, she got stuck in the crush last November before I put them to the winterage and she wouldn't be the biggest cow in the place. Have only had a few sets of twins here in my memory. Gone fierce bulky looking in the last fortnight.

I have a cow similar to yours - showed it to the vet when he was around. Was too late to check but he said twins are the better outcome than having 1 huge calf inside her. Told me to feed her ration daily as she needs the energy for the 2 calves and it would have no impact on the size of the calf at this stage. When is she due?

patsy_mccabe

Limestone Cowboy wrote: »

Anyone else think there is a couple in this lady, she got stuck in the crush last November before I put them to the winterage and she wouldn't be the biggest cow in the place. Have only had a few sets of twins here in my memory. Gone fierce bulky looking in the last fortnight.

She's huge. I'd be expecting and hoping for twins.
Neighbour here had a cow past week that had gone very big. I said to him its either a big bull or twins. Turned out she had a big, but not huge, heifer.

Limestone Cowboy

tanko wrote: »

That's a serious belly, you'd swear it was photoshopped. If it's only one calf it'll be huge. I'd be expecting twins, maybe even triplets:D.
Has she long left to go?

As for scanning, are any scanners able to predict twins. Do they have to be scanned at a particular stage in pregnancy to pick them up?

I didn't scan them and don't have a time for her but she's starting to soften a bit, still a good fortnight in her yet though at least I'd be thinking. I got everything scanned last year and half them this year and he was fairly on the ball with them but I did them very early. I scanned after 8 weeks of breeding and again at about 14-15 weeks for the ones that didn't show the first time. Think the earlier they are done the more accurate it is.

charolais0153

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

She's huge. I'd be expecting and hoping for twins.
Neighbour here had a cow past week that had gone very big. I said to him its either a big bull or twins. Turned out she had a big, but not huge, heifer.

Some of them can have a lot of water inside them , you'd expect twins with that cow though in my opinion,she's showing very wide cos she a smaller type of cow

tismesoitis

Just in after another calving fr heifer by fr5593.
Don't want to jinx myself ... but very unusual start this year
22 calved
7 by sexed fr semen 6 heifers 1 bull
11 by conventional fr semen 8 heifers 3 bulls
And 4 Saler Bulls
Waiting for the fr bulls to start flowing.

jd_12345

Having serious issues here with heifers not settling down to calve. Not overly big calves but out of 5 heifers calved now 4 have had dead calves 😭😭😭 They could be slightly fat but I’m slow to go cutting back the feed now as they’ll nearly all be calving over the next few weeks. Would it be a mineral shortage? Calcium shortage? On about 1.5kg of an oat based easy calver nut, minerals on silage and mineral licks blocks.
Will ring vet first thing in am.
The calves aren’t swollen or yellow looking and are a good size. All friesian calves. Calves are coming out and a big sliver of fluid coming out. Water in the ear. Rubbing the belly with straw. Catching them up to clear any fluid( I know that’s controversial)
Any ideas?

whelan2

Do you use iodine in the water pre calving?

Say my name

jd_12345 wrote: »

Having serious issues here with heifers not settling down to calve. Not overly big calves but out of 5 heifers calved now 4 have had dead calves 😭😭😭 They could be slightly fat but I’m slow to go cutting back the feed now as they’ll nearly all be calving over the next few weeks. Would it be a mineral shortage? Calcium shortage? On about 1.5kg of an oat based easy calver nut, minerals on silage and mineral licks blocks.
Will ring vet first thing in am.
The calves aren’t swollen or yellow looking and are a good size. All friesian calves. Calves are coming out and a big sliver of fluid coming out. Water in the ear. Rubbing the belly with straw. Catching them up to clear any fluid( I know that’s controversial)
Any ideas?

Are they slow and lazy to calve?
Are they calving themselves or have you intervened in each calving?
Had you much potassium spread for the growing silage crop?

jd_12345

whelan2 wrote: »

Do you use iodine in the water pre calving?

No. Never have but will look into it. Thanks very much!

whelan2

jd_12345 wrote: »

No. Never have but will look into it. Thanks very much!

It's great for get up and go in calves. 1cc per cow of lugols iodine in the drinker.

jd_12345

Say my name wrote: »

Are they slow and lazy to calve?

I would say slow and not really opening up. I suppose they're fairly lazy

Say my name wrote: »

Are they calving themselves or have you intervened in each calving?

We are intervening. Interestingly, the only live one calved herself on the cubicles. The rest we calved on straw. Was looking online there and saw that walking through them too often can be harmful. Theres times during the day we would be walking through them in the cubicles every 2 hours.

Say my name wrote: »

Had you much potassium spread for the growing silage crop?

Not massively. First cut gets about 3 bags/acre of 18-6-12 and maybe slurry for second cut. One of the main silage fields wasn't managed great and just got slurry, 10-10-20 and a bit of CAN for the second cut. Haven't tested the silage.

White Clover

jd_12345 wrote: »

I would say slow and not really opening up. I suppose they're fairly lazy


We are intervening. Interestingly, the only live one calved herself on the cubicles. The rest we calved on straw. Was looking online there and saw that walking through them too often can be harmful. Theres times during the day we would be walking through them in the cubicles every 2 hours.


Not massively. First cut gets about 3 bags/acre of 18-6-12 and maybe slurry for second cut. One of the main silage fields wasn't managed great and just got slurry, 10-10-20 and a bit of CAN for the second cut. Haven't tested the silage.

If not opening up, it's most likely a selenium deficiency.
Enquire from your Vet about getting some blood samples analysed.

Say my name

jd_12345 wrote: »

I would say slow and not really opening up. I suppose they're fairly lazy


We are intervening. Interestingly, the only live one calved herself on the cubicles. The rest we calved on straw. Was looking online there and saw that walking through them too often can be harmful. Theres times during the day we would be walking through them in the cubicles every 2 hours.


Not massively. First cut gets about 3 bags/acre of 18-6-12 and maybe slurry for second cut. One of the main silage fields wasn't managed great and just got slurry, 10-10-20 and a bit of CAN for the second cut. Haven't tested the silage.

A few years back we had fat cows calving.
Especially montbeliarde cows were effected. Slow to calve and then down with milk fever.
If they're slow to calve, the calf can swallow fluid and smother.

Turns out it was an excess of potassium in the silage coupled with being overconditioned.
If they've too much potassium their body and blood is not able to metabolize calcium from their bones pre calving.
I think it's chlorine and sulphur is the opposite of potassium (and sodium) in anion exchange in the body.

Had a neighbour had cows always lazy to calve. He was just blaming them for being lazy and waiting for intervention.
Calves were fine. But he paired back his potassium application on silage ground and ever since calvings improved.
This would be a high natural soil potassium area.

Say my name

And there's another one too.

Excess Zinc supplementation can increase the risk of milk fever and trouble at calving.

Hard Knocks

Say my name wrote: »

A few years back we had fat cows calving.
Especially montbeliarde cows were effected. Slow to calve and then down with milk fever.
If they're slow to calve, the calf can swallow fluid and smother.

Turns out it was an excess of potassium in the silage coupled with being overconditioned.
If they've too much potassium their body and blood is not able to metabolize calcium from their bones pre calving.
I think it's chlorine and sulphur is the opposite of potassium (and sodium) in anion exchange in the body.

Had a neighbour had cows always lazy to calve. He was just blaming them for being lazy and waiting for intervention.
Calves were fine. But he paired back his potassium application on silage ground and ever since calvings improved.
This would be a high natural soil potassium area.

Agree with your point
Noticed doing soil samples, P could vary from 1 to 3 but K was always a high 4
Sadly it’s hard to get super Phos locally and compounds are high K and low P

Say my name

Hard Knocks wrote: »

Agree with your point
Noticed doing soil samples, P could vary from 1 to 3 but K was always a high 4
Sadly it’s hard to get super Phos locally and compounds are high K and low P

I'm able to get a fertilizer with the same phosphorus and potassium levels.
Target sell it to me.
It might be worth enquiring if target is available locally.
A lot of wexford is high in potash. So they sell and bag mixtures with equal p and k.

GrasstoMilk

Test your silage for mins is best way to figure out what's lacking or what's excessive in it
Do it here every year

We spread a good bit of potash here and never an excess in silage, big fan of 0 7 30

Get the yield too so it uses it up fairly well

dar31

jd_12345 wrote: »

No. Never have but will look into it. Thanks very much!

I'd get iodine into them straight away. Its cheap and effective. Works within in 24hrs.
Tablets in water but need suitable through in calving area and access to no other water, or I used to use topical iodine. Ordinary iodine squirted on udder isn't much use.
Typical signs of lack of iodine or lazy calving, calf dead or alive while calving and dead before they hit the ground.

FeelTheBern

whelan2 wrote: »

Do you use iodine in the water pre calving?

If you’re giving dry cows minerals on the silage and blocks, and the heifers can access it (as opposed to being bullied away by cows) then imagine they should be ok for iodine unless a very severe issue. On the milk fever, heifers usually much better at mobilising calcium from bones than old cows - so would expect it would be your older fatter cows which would have issues as opposed to heifers.

Possible as well that could be an infectious agent - partic if only heifers affected as new to cows - do you vaccinate for Lepto?

As this certainly isn’t normal, my advice would be to get your vet out and follow their advice regarding blood tests etc to try to get to the bottom of it.

Gawddawggonnit

jd_12345 wrote: »

Having serious issues here with heifers not settling down to calve. Not overly big calves but out of 5 heifers calved now 4 have had dead calves 😭😭😭 They could be slightly fat but I’m slow to go cutting back the feed now as they’ll nearly all be calving over the next few weeks. Would it be a mineral shortage? Calcium shortage? On about 1.5kg of an oat based easy calver nut, minerals on silage and mineral licks blocks.
Will ring vet first thing in am.
The calves aren’t swollen or yellow looking and are a good size. All friesian calves. Calves are coming out and a big sliver of fluid coming out. Water in the ear. Rubbing the belly with straw. Catching them up to clear any fluid( I know that’s controversial)
Any ideas?

Green hay ad lib if you can get your hands on it. It must be green.
Grass silage with a high inclusion of clover or better still pure clover silage. Both green hay and clover are very heavy with phosphate.