Donald Trump discussion Thread IX (threadbanned users listed in OP)

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122167838#Comment_122167838

It astounds me how Trump never admits error, and people are ok with that.

I honestly believe that trump does not believe in failure or loss at all. There's only winning. There is no other option.

This alone must be a sign of mental instability. I firmly believe how we handle ourselves when we make an error shows our strength of character.

When have you ever seen him act contrite, or apologetic, or even admit a small mistake?

To me, that is not a sign of a good man or a positive role model in any way. Imagine if a child acted that way?

I.R.Y.E.D

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122167862#Comment_122167862

The reports of him falling asleep during his current hush money trial and the late night rants would lend support to those claiming he has dementia.

As for a script writer, there are plenty of people aligned with the gop who are capable of producing verbiage and there are also AI applications that can do the job

aloyisious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122176438#Comment_122176438

I think that for him to do otherwise would be [for him] an admission of failure, ergo; that he is a failure, something he could not [even in a once-off occasion] publicly admit to. It must be due, amongst other leanings, to his upbringing that he can't admit to a normal [I ***ed up] human failing. That being so, it's the bed he's made for himself and I'm not minded to help him smooth out its blankets.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122176506#Comment_122176506

It's beyond bizarre that his supporters don't see the refusal to admit failure as ironically enough, a huge failure

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122176643#Comment_122176643

These are the same people that buy merch with his mugshot on it as evidence that he will never surrender.

A Photograph of his *actual* surrender to police as evidence that he won't surrender.

Of course they won't see an inability to either accept or learn from his failures as the huge failure it actually is.

aloyisious

I'm waiting for Trump to renege on his deal for a debate [or two] with Biden. He's discussing the proposed CNN debate with his faithful while running down Biden and the CNN host.

Itssoeasy

That rally in the south bronx was so **** weird even for trump. He starts talking being able to wear pants and why he wears them, amongst other really odd things.

amandstu

Prosecution summing up now.

Apparently Trump is annoyed that they got to go last.

I assume this is just normal practice but you can (almost) sympathise with him that they get the last word.

Also his lawyer reprimanded by the judge for bringing up the prospect of jailing the dodderarian and told the jury to disregard it(unless they were salivating over it ,I suppose :-) )

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122195362#Comment_122195362

It's very normal.

amandstu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122195788#Comment_122195788

Thanks(I see ,though why Trump likes the uneducated.They swallow his misinformation the more gullibly)

aloyisious

There's a slightly amusing [if one is now cynical about the US political system] report in The Independent media site that there was a missing witness in the Trump trial [Allen Weisselberg] who was allegedly present at the meeting where the agreement between Trump and Cohen on the payments was reached. However, when Judge Merchan asked if either side wanted to call Weisselberg as a witness, they both declined. Judge Merchan even offered to have Weisselberg brought from Rikers Island prison to the court if either side wanted to call him as a witness for either side. Weisselberg is in prison on a 2nd term [this time perjury] and signed a deal with Trump's people for a $2m severance deal with Mr Trump that he would receive on the condition that he refused to “denigrate” the Trump Organization “verbally or in writing or any of its entities” by cooperating voluntarily with investigators.

It [according to the NYT] is possible that Trumps legal team are expected to argue in their closing argument that Weisselberg is the missing piece from the prosecution case and the case relies on the "untrustworthy" Cohen. One other person who could possibly clear the air is the person who declined to take the stand in his own defence, though doubtless aspersions could be cast on his honesty giving evidence on the stand.

amandstu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122195982#Comment_122195982

Didn't follow the Defence's closing arguments but how could they hold that against the Prosecution when they themselves declined to call him?

Again why did the Prosecution not mention the terms of the severance package insofar as it seems (to me at least) maybe to be an attempt to corrupt the justice system?

aloyisious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122196035#Comment_122196035

Possibly imagining they could pull a master stroke over the prosecution at this late stage in the trial, that they and they alone could get testimony or evidence of some helpful kind from Weisselebrg to befuddle the minds of the jury.

The prosecution probably didn't want to go down a Trump rabbit hole in respect of pay-deals between Trump and former employees of his, given the presence of Cohen as a prosecution witness.

In other news, the 2020 election count may not yet be done with as one of the Georgia defendants in the vote-rigging case against Trumpists has asked Judge McAfee hearing the case for permission to personally recount all of the 528,777 ballots cast in Fulton County. Harrison Floyd was the former head of Black Voices For Trump, claims this recount is necessary to prove that Trump actually won the election. Hope springs eternal in Trump legal-land.

Brussels Sprout

Wednesday's are off for that trial right? (I seem to recall Biden joking that he heard that Trump was free on Wednesdays)

So does that mean that the jury won't begin deliberations until tomorrow?

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122197947#Comment_122197947

I think that's the trial, i.e., the Judge/Courtroom/etc. Deliberations, which take place outside the courtroom, start today per Ap and CNN

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122197947#Comment_122197947

As far as I am aware they start this morning.

Apparently a good rule of thumb for deliberations is 1 day for each week of the trial - So that puts us at 4/5 days before a decision.

Brussels Sprout

I'm imagining a 12 Angry Men scenario developing except in this case the holdout is a crazed loon.

amandstu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122198034#Comment_122198034

Did anyone watch the Tony Hancock /Sid James version of the 12 Angry Men?

It was on BBC4 only a week ago but I can only find the audio on Youtube.

I think Hancock was better in his earlier performances and this was pretty good and carried no spare flesh.

duploelabs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122198017#Comment_122198017

I served on a jury for ten weeks, the deliberations were a day and a half

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122198352#Comment_122198352

There will obviously be exceptions , but that was the general guidance I read that was quoting a US Trial lawyer.

Clearly they could walk out after an hour with a verdict or they could still be there in a month.

But on balance ~4 Days is probably around where we'll likely see a decision

LambshankRedemption

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122198443#Comment_122198443

https://edition.cnn.com/videos/politics/2024/05/29/ty-cobb-donald-trump-prediction-hush-money-trial-ebof-digvid.cnn

He also predicts a judgement by Friday evening.

Mr.Nice Guy

Hate to say it but I reckon he'll get off. Just takes a few to dig their heels in and that's that.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122199342#Comment_122199342

Hung jury means re-trial in this case

aloyisious

Is my understanding correct that the jury can return guilty verdicts on some of the 34 charges and not all as long as those verdicts are unanimous OR is it that their verdict has to be a unanimous guilty verdict on ALL 34 charges?

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122200188#Comment_122200188

The former - Each charge is separate and he can be found guilty or innocent independently for each.

He will be found guilty of some of the charges for absolute certain , but those are the misdemeanor booking-keeping charges which are a fine and a slap on the wrists and will be ignored by everyone.

The important ones are the felony charges and those could go either way.

Do the jury believe Cohen even though he is a liar and a criminal?

Do they believe Hope Hicks and his assistant that he's a control freak and there's no chance in hell that Cohen would have gone on a solo run without Trumps approval and direct involvement?

amandstu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122199342#Comment_122199342

I think the NY jury pool will tell against him ,as well as the seemingly good job the Prosecution did of tidying up Cohen's lapse on the Schiller phone call.

Most people have their minds made up about the baby Tar Man and so maybe next time he should commit his crimes on friendlier ground.

I doubt he will be acquitted but of course a hung jury is very possible ,even if this would be an unusual outcome.

I wonder if a hung jury would be a punishment for our dodderarian in itself?(the ultimate TDS candidate)

aloyisious

I doubt that Trump, if he were found NOT guilty, would drop his public claims that "the case/jury-decision is rigged against me" claims, peculiar though that might seem, so I await his pronouncement on the jury when they return their verdict on him.

spacecoyote

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122200561#Comment_122200561

That is an interesting angle alright, though I guess he has an out on it. He can still claim that the system is rigged, but that the American people are honest and great and they saw through the sham trial, blah, blah, blah

Quin_Dub

Jesse Waters went to bat for him last night claiming that 2 of the Jurors were "DEI Plants" . Basically claiming that because the law firms they work for mention DEI on their webpages they would lose their jobs if they voted to acquit.

How he know where they work and the risks he puts them under by saying this stuff is a whole other question.

JESSE WATTERS (HOST): The jury has two lawyers on it who work in Manhattan corporate law firms with DEI all over their websites. They know the charges are Frankenstein, they went to law school, they know better.

But what do you think happens if they find Trump not guilty and show up to work next week? Corporate law firms in New York City are about as political a place as you can work, outside of politics. These types of firms all work for and donate to Democrats. Their reputations and their careers are in jeopardy.

It's pathetic.

robinph

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122200188#Comment_122200188

Think the 34 charges are not all entirely seperate though. It's a block of "did this bit wrong on X payments" and then "recorded X payments wrongly in this claim" and "lied about X payments on other form". So whilst there are 34 charges, there is only really a couple of different things to consider... Just multiplied by how many payments were made.