Online relationship coaches

fran38

My girlfriend just recently broke up with me and in desperation I turned to those relationship coaches that you see all over Youtube. Most of them suggest you go down the 'No Contact' route to win your ex back. I did this but lasted three days and texted her those needy clingy texts....groan!
Anyway, in your experience, do these guys work? In terms of the advice they give out? Or are they charlatans/snake oil salesmen?

Idle Passerby

If they're claiming they can fix a total strangers broken relationship, then yes, that's a charlatan. If they're giving standard advice on how to get over a breakup, thats probably more legitimate.

If she doesn't want to be with you anymore there isn't much you can do to win her back. Leave her alone and try to move on.

2 fast

I went to one and she really helped me bring about a better relationship with myself and taught me how to first be self compassionate and love myself.

There is great ones but be careful. Read real reviews from people done go for the glitchy one.

Augme

You would be much better off visiting a therapist who will help work on your own issues. A relationship coach is just going to take you away from dealing with the real issues, which is you.

The one you went to definitely sounds like a charlatan. It's the advice you would hear an older teenager give to a younger teenager. Cringe.

eviltwin

An online relationship coach doesn't know the first thing about you or your girlfriend or the reason you broke up so is not exactly a reliable source of advice. Some of what they say may have merit but you aren't going to get specific advice to your personal issue.

Suggesting mind games like ignoring someone to win them back is not how a professional would work. Manipulation has no place in an adult relationship.

You've texted her and I presume she knows you want to try again so respect her and leave it at that. If she wants to talk to you she knows where you are.

Maybe take this time to reflect on what led to the breakup and what you can learn from it.

leggo

I remember years ago I was dealing with a broken heart following a bad break-up and it sounds like you did the same thing I did and just Google a bunch of feelings you were having to see how to get past them. The thing that stood out to me then was that you could spot the crap from the credible stuff a mile off. A good way to filter it is if the word “bro” would fit in the sentences they write or not. :pac:

As someone said already, if the advice is focused on you recovering and managing your feelings then it’s probably at the very least somewhat decent, if it’s focused on how you manipulate them and get reactions that end in them liking you again, being jealous etc then it’s almost definitely crap. If you’re looking at spending money, spend it on a qualified therapist you’ve found through your GP’s recommendation or through websites like IACP.ie. These are the only people qualified and worth your money. The rest, even if it sounds good at first, will only leave you with bigger problems in the long run because you’re following bad advice.

Take it from someone who’s been where you are, from Googling everything to sending needy texts: though it may feel like the only solution to your feelings is getting your ex back, it’s really REALLY not. What you need to learn to do is to deal with the emotions that are causing you to panic, go to Google in search of an answer and text her. Why you’re doing all of this is, first and foremost, because you’re resisting these emotions and trying to ‘fix’ them through Google, texts etc. Stop resisting them, stop fighting.

Your relationship ended and that’s sad. That sadness needs to run its course before it’ll go, so let it. Cry your eyes out if you need to. Listen to sad music or do whatever you need to let it out, the same way when you have a bad cold you need to sneeze and blow your nose until all the nasty stuff is gone. If you’re finding it tough to bring that sadness up to the brim, you need to accept that the relationship is over. Assume it’s not going to be fixed and the person is not going to be in your life going forward. Feel all the emotions you need to feel until then, and that can take weeks/months to do but it’ll only take longer if you resist it. Then when you feel ready, start planning your life without this person, fill the holes left in your current life by building a new plan and routine. This is all tried and tested and it WILL work. But if you need to understand it further in the hope that it doesn’t happen again, dealing with a therapist to talk it all through will be invaluable to you too and that can be part of your new life and recovery all at the same time. Good luck OP.

completedit

No contact is not meant to manipulate; its meant to be about moving on and looking out for you. If an ex comes back and there's something to be salvaged then that's something to deal with but it's not meant to be the end goal.

Op, it's only natural you'd try to get your ex back. That's normal. It's not gonna do anything though which I think you knew but we're hoping that something you'd day would sway her.

Tork

Are these relationship coaches a variation on the "pick up artist" guys? If they are, then excuse me while I vomit in a bucket. The idea that you can somehow manipulate somebody into going out with you is offensive. Women aren't some sort of object that can be controlled if you use enough cunning to bring them into line. Going to one of these guys with the intention of getting your ex back is disrespectful to her. She had her reasons for breaking up with you and it is a decision she wouldn't have reached without a lot of thought. Let her go and accept that this was never going to work.

eviltwin

completedit wrote: »

No contact is not meant to manipulate; its meant to be about moving on and looking out for you. If an ex comes back and there's something to be salvaged then that's something to deal with but it's not meant to be the end goal.

Op, it's only natural you'd try to get your ex back. That's normal. It's not gonna do anything though which I think you knew but we're hoping that something you'd day would sway her.

The OP clearly states the no contact is a tactic to get his ex back. I imagine it’s based on some notion that she will be so incensed by him not begging her to reconsider that she’ll forget what made her end things on the first place and come running. So mind games and as I stated that’s not how adult relationships should be.

completedit

It does make sense though. Like if a guy likes a girl, giving her space makes sense. I think the goal is that eventually the girl will have some perspective and perhaps extending an olive branch as a precursor to reconciliation. Its not really manipulation. Ultimately the control is in the dumpers hand. There's nothing wrong with that. It just probably won't work.

2 fast

Tork wrote: »

Are these relationship coaches a variation on the "pick up artist" guys? If they are, then excuse me while I vomit in a bucket. The idea that you can somehow manipulate somebody into going out with you is offensive. Women aren't some sort of object that can be controlled if you use enough cunning to bring them to work.

I dont get how you are comparing a coach to a pick up artist! A good relationship coach will help you to work on yourself and develop self compassion etc. Then your relationship with you and what will compliment you.
Maybe look up one the relationship coach.

Tork

I'm sorry but I really can't understand what you're saying there

leggo

completedit wrote: »

It does make sense though. Like if a guy likes a girl, giving her space makes sense. I think the goal is that eventually the girl will have some perspective and perhaps extending an olive branch as a precursor to reconciliation. Its not really manipulation. Ultimately the control is in the dumpers hand. There's nothing wrong with that. It just probably won't work.

That’s an attempt to play a game and manipulate someone, though, you’re just rationalising it. You don’t do something for someone you care about because you have a ‘goal’ in mind.

The only goal in a situation like this should be having an honest conversation, reaching a resolution, then accepting and dealing with that resolution. Anything else is a slippery slope that leads you to where the OP is and worse.

completedit

Nah not buying that. If you're dumped you very well may still like and love the person. Relationships end for many reasons. Your exes reality may be skewed by many factors which led to the breakup. You can still love someone and keep them close and perhaps imagine one day reconciling. A healthy response is leaving it to them to find themselves. If they come back it was meant to be, if not, you didn't impose yourself on them. You gave them their space to heal and find solace in their decision. You can call that no contact but to me that's just a decent loving thing to do. Like I said, people aren't easily malleable. If the person has no interest in being with you, not contacting them will just push you further out of their mind to the point you become a distant memory. It's no more manipulative than whatever signals you gave in the initial days of the romance when you both fell for one another. It's not even manipulative at all. To describe it as such is rediculous.

What's the alternative? Badger them to profess your love and beg to take them back? This may not be coy or manipulative but I think the dumper would much prefer the no contact approach. By definition, if you maintain your feelings for the ex but respect their decision you should be doing no contact. Are you supposing that people just shut off as soon as a relationship ends?

I know in my situation having broke up 4 months ago, I still imagine us together again. There were many valid reasons for her to end it but similarly many good parts. I haven't messaged her since she dumped me because she closed off communication by unfriending me. Of course, realistically I don't imagine us back together but the one thing preventing me messaging her is the belief that any attempt to reach out will definitely not be helpful to her or me. I'm not trying to manipulate her because she either has residual feelings or doesn't. That's for her to make her mind up.

leggo

completedit wrote: »

Of course, realistically I don't imagine us back together but the one thing preventing me messaging her is the belief that any attempt to reach out will definitely not be helpful to her or me. I'm not trying to manipulate her because she either has residual feelings or doesn't.

You say your actions are entirely based on your hopes of provoking a desired reaction from her, you specifically say it’s the ‘one thing’ that’s motivating you to not contact her. Exact wording. Describing manipulative behaviour then saying “I’m not trying to manipulate her” doesn’t whitewash it, it’s like saying “I’m not racist but...” then saying something racist. You are. Otherwise the ‘one thing’ preventing you from contacting her wouldn’t matter. You’re not respecting her wishes, you’re respecting her wishes only because you feel that might give you a chance at getting her back. You literally said so yourself.

The reason this possibly appears confusing to you is because this stuff is tied in with self-esteem: when people don’t believe they are inherently ‘enough’ to make others happy, the position they adapt is that they must do certain things or act certain ways to attract others instead of just communicating openly and honestly. That gap is where these ‘relationship coaches’ clean up. Because this is normal to people with low self-esteem, since self-esteem is something built in early development, they assume this is normal to everyone. It’s not, it’s manipulative and when you’re on the other end of it people feel and see through it.

The hope you’re clinging onto that this will have a positive result is also stopping you from accepting the full reality that the relationship is over and beginning your own healing. This kinda stuff going unchallenged will be incredibly damaging for the OP to read now because it’s that acceptance that he needs to start dealing with, not people rationalising their own denial.

completedit

I didn't actually say that. I said 'it won't be helpful for her or me'. The decision is in the other person's hands. That's not manipulation; manipulation would be be failing to let them get on with their own life, bombarding them with texts trying to guilt trip them into staying with you. If we were all completely rational unemotive agents we would shut off immediately after a breakup and jump to the next 'better' person, but that isn't what happens. We all hurt, some longer than others. I read something before that introverted people deal with heartbreak longer because for us, letting people in is much more difficult. Makes sense.
There has to be an element of skill or something used as leverage to coerce someone to do something they don't want to do. The mere act of not doing anything, otherwise known as 'no contact' when they don't want you to do anything does not suggest at manipulation.

bitofabind

I think breakups are those pivotal life events where there's a fork in the road and the path that you choose will determine your health and happiness down the line.

You can choose to ignore, avoid and run from the very real emotional pain you're in and create a whole host of repeatable issues down the line. Unhealthy dating patterns, self-destructive beliefs and habits, low self esteem etc. Or you can choose to deal with the feelings without trying to escape or control them and learn the very valuable and underrated life skill of emotional regulation which will set up you for more self-acceptance, resilience and maturity down the line.

Here's my advice: choose the second one. Right now you're going with the first, trying to put off the gut-wrenching heartache of losing someone you thought would be in your life forever. Googling stuff and trying to delegate the work of recovering to external sources, many of whom will be clowns and cons who pray on vulnerable people like this. Here's the thing though, at some stage we all have to look ourselves in the eye and deal with our life choices and you've got a golden opportunity to get ahead of the curve here and become someone who doesn't run or self-destruct when things get hard. Become someone who says ok, this is hard, but I'll just let it be hard without trying to control anything and something better will emerge around the corner.

Here's something we're not told often enough. Uncomfortable feelings can suck, hurt, drain you from the inside out, but they're just...feelings. They have a beginning, middle and end. They don't kill you. We can do hard sh1t like this.

completedit

bitofabind wrote: »

I think breakups are those pivotal life events where there's a fork in the road and the path that you choose will determine your health and happiness down the line.

You can choose to ignore, avoid and run from the very real emotional pain you're in and create a whole host of repeatable issues down the line. Unhealthy dating patterns, self-destructive beliefs and habits, low self esteem etc. Or you can choose to deal with the feelings without trying to escape or control them and learn the very valuable and underrated life skill of emotional regulation which will set up you for more self-acceptance, resilience and maturity down the line.

Here's my advice: choose the second one. Right now you're going with the first, trying to put off the gut-wrenching heartache of losing someone you thought would be in your life forever. Googling stuff and trying to delegate the work of recovering to external sources, many of whom will be clowns and cons who pray on vulnerable people like this. Here's the thing though, at some stage we all have to look ourselves in the eye and deal with our life choices and you've got a golden opportunity to get ahead of the curve here and become someone who doesn't run or self-destruct when things get hard.

Here's something we're not told often enough. Uncomfortable feelings can suck, hurt, drain you from the inside out, but they're just...feelings. They have a beginning, middle and end. They don't kill you. We can do hard sh1t like this.

Just for the record, this is what I believe too.

OP, some channels on Youtube that I like and recommend are 'dating guy' and 'School of Life'. These have both helped me have perspective and develop my own understanding of myself and the relationship over the past 4 months. Not sure how your relationship ended but mine was abrupt; no ''closure'' and it just left me more confused than it had to because my ex could have easily just outlined very obvious reasons for moving on. The last thing she said was that she couldn't think about it 'right now' and then deleted me. The 'right now' probably fed into my sense that the relationship was over but there was a chance of reconnection after some time. I wish she hadn't done that. However, the two channels above have given me some perspective. they're not for everyone but I've found them helpful. I think of them as a guide to, as opposed to outsourcing your recovery

wiggle16

Mod:

Okay that's enough general discussion. Please have advice when posting and address it to the OP.

This has been happening quite a bit in PI of late - I'd ask that posters please be conscious of the above when posting.

Thanks

fran38

OP here. Thank you all for your considered and very helpful advice. Apologies for letting the thread grow legs without my input but as ye will all appreciate. the last week and a bit has been so terribly raw, and it continues to be raw and stark.
I have to agree with the posters who say the 'No Contact' rule is not a form of manipulation. How can it be? when its about letting your ex get on with life and allowing he/she to come to terms with their own loneliness due to your absence without your interference. And if your ex comes to the conclusion at some point that breaking up with you was a bad idea or was a great idea, then so be it. But you need to allow your ex the space and freedom to make those decisions without your needy/clingy interference.
IMO relationship coaches often speak in generalized/black and white terms. They make out that giving your ex space is, by its very nature, enough to have youre ex scrambling for the mobile phone and franticly messaging you to make amends. What they miss is the fact that your ex will have a support network of family and friends who have her back, to offer soothing words of encouragement. "Yes you made the right decision" or "He's a bastard anyway, well rid" that type of thing. My ex is always on WhatsApp to her family (Separated parents, daughters, cousins etc and don't you know they're getting a one sided distorted view as to why she broke up with me. Similarly me, I have friends and family I reach out to about this and even though I really try to give a balanced view of things, my boys and girls are going to support me by offering those soothing words of comfort I crave at this time.
In terms of no contact, you'd imagine I was good at taking my own advice right?.....WRONG!! I lasted no contact for three days, finally texting her in desperation on NYE at midnight. "Happy New Year Elaine" I wrote on WhatsApp. She replied within minutes wishing me the same and not giving any hint whether a reconciliation was on the cards. " I wish we could celebrate the new year together" I needlingly wrote, "Sorry about that, you're a nice man but no". She's a Brazilian so most of our communication including texts are through translate. What followed was three days of intermittent texts back and forth. I cringe at the thought of allowing myself to look like a ****in' pussy. So I intend to go back into No Contact and as from 3.30pm yesterday I haven't texted her, nor commented on Facebook posts by her family/friends. I will give her the breakup, allow her the space to either miss me or not. The outcome is undetermined but its not looking good. **** it, lets do this

fran38

completedit wrote: »

Just for the record, this is what I believe too.

OP, some channels on Youtube that I like and recommend are 'dating guy' and 'School of Life'. These have both helped me have perspective and develop my own understanding of myself and the relationship over the past 4 months. Not sure how your relationship ended but mine was abrupt; no ''closure'' and it just left me more confused than it had to because my ex could have easily just outlined very obvious reasons for moving on. The last thing she said was that she couldn't think about it 'right now' and then deleted me. The 'right now' probably fed into my sense that the relationship was over but there was a chance of reconnection after some time. I wish she hadn't done that. However, the two channels above have given me some perspective. they're not for everyone but I've found them helpful. I think of them as a guide to, as opposed to outsourcing your recovery

Watching Dating Guy now. Thanks for that.

Tork

If your ex girlfriend is Brazilian, is there any chance she wanted a visa?

Hannibal_Smith

OP I think no matter where your advice comes from, if you want it to work you have to follow it. If relationship coaches believe their methods work, you have to follow those methods.

That said, I don't know what type of relationship coach you sought advice from, but it sounds like it's advice that would be given to a couple who are trying a bit of space to help them come back together? Therefore there has to be two people with the same idea of getting back together at some point?

Your ex ended the relationship. So I would imagine the advice to give her space to win her back does not apply here? If you're following advice in the hope that the situation will change, of course you're going to break and be so impatient that you jump the gun.

I would completely back the idea of no contact, not to win her back, but to get yourself passed the limbo you're in. It sounds like she put a full stop and not a comma to your relationship and finding a way of accepting that, hard as it maybe, will serve you better in the long run.

fran38

Tork wrote: »

If your ex girlfriend is Brazilian, is there any chance she wanted a visa?

Yes she did. I started a thread on this some months ago, went looking for it but cant find it.
Yes she had an agenda, but it suited my agenda as well. She's a crackin' find and I want to settle down anyway. Now, the question is would she have left me once her visa was granted or not is another topic. And its covered extensively in that thread I mentioned so with respect I dont intend to go over it a second time her.

Idbatterim

Is the reason for rekationship ending sonething you could or coukd have could easily address op or is it more complicated ?

fran38

Idbatterim wrote: »

Is the reason for rekationship ending sonething you could or coukd have could easily address op or is it more complicated ?

[snipped] has mentioned in the past that she is very sad to be apart from her family back in Brazil. She has daughters and grandchildren who speak to her constantly on WhatsApp every day. They are a great support to her in her homesickness.
We were attempting to get around her homesickness by getting married in Brazil so she could apply for a spousal visa so she could travel back and forth whenever she liked. (I dont need lectures on the rules of visas etc as it doesnt matter now thank you).
So, what changed? We were going to move in together. I said that she would have to pay a portion of rent as i would have to give notice to my lodger who obviously is paying me rent. I raised that issue two months ago. She said at the time that she cannot pay what I was asking for but would pay something towards bills, food, cook and keep the house tidy. I relented thinkning that there is some value in having a hot meal handed up to me when i returned from work. She raised that last week as the main source of her concern as well as other stuff that , tbh is so petty it doesnt warrant a mention here. She's nitpicking, trying to blame me for the breakup, that its my fault etc.
The real reason I suspect is that she wants to return home. She tried to go home at the start of the pandemic but the airline she has the ticket with (i dont know who that is) cancelled so she said she can use that at the end of February.
In our back and forth texts the last few days, she has relented a tad and has said that she will think about this some more. Gut feeling is that shes stringing me along and fully intends to leave.

YellowLead

Look, if you are cool with a relationship where somebody just wants a visa out of you, and in return you get your house cleaned by a ‘cracker of a find’ etc - there’s a billion more out there waiting for guys like you. Sorry if that sounds harsh but it’s coming across that way a little...

fran38

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=114987367

First thread for a bit of context. Im really exposing my private life here so lads, be gentle.

fran38

YellowLead wrote: »

Look, if you are cool with a relationship where somebody just wants a visa out of you, and in return you get your house cleaned etc - there’s a billion more out there waiting for guys like you. Sorry if that sounds harsh but it’s coming across that way a little...

And there you have it folks, the very black and white nature of chat forum etc The nuanced nature of private, intimate relationships can be difficult to get across on these types of websites. Of course Im looking for a lot more than getting my house cleaned ffs but I mention that and its picked up upon straight away as the singular reason Im with this girl.

YellowLead

fran38 wrote: »

And there you have it folks, the very black and white nature of chat forum etc The nuanced nature of private, intimate relationships can be difficult to get across on these types of websites. Of course Im looking for a lot more than getting my house cleaned ffs but I mention that and its picked up upon straight away as the singular reason Im with this girl.

Apologies. But you did say you knew she was out for a visa and that was fine. You did say she was a cracker (presumably good looking) and that you didn’t need rent off her because she would clean.

But I am sorry - it seems you have low self esteem and are lonely (I had not read your previous thread) so are open to being used in this kind of mutually beneficial (on the surface) scenario. But guarunteed once the visa is intact she’d be off with another guy.

wiggle16

fran38 wrote: »

And there you have it folks, the very black and white nature of chat forum etc The nuanced nature of private, intimate relationships can be difficult to get across on these types of websites. Of course Im looking for a lot more than getting my house cleaned ffs but I mention that and its picked up upon straight away as the singular reason Im with this girl.

Mod:

OP, Personal Issues is an advice forum, and therefore you are going to get replies and opinions that might strike a nerve, which is exactly what it's designed for, it's supposed to make you think. It's up to you to have a thick skin when reading those responses.

Please bear the above in mind when posting in PI.

Updated: Thread reopened after discussion with OP