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Boiler doesn't work with error F9 in some mornings

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    #32
    Damien360
    Registered Users Posts: 6,266 ✭✭✭Damien360


    Seregwethrin wrote: »
    Something got stuck in my mind though. How come the pressure sensor might be faulty, so boiler faults F9 but I can see the right pressure on the boiler's digital screen?

    So it prints 1.4 bar etc right pressure but still faults F9?

    I’m not sure that the fault is actually low pressure or failure to see a pressure differential when the pump starts. For whatever reason, a higher pressure will allow the system see the slight increase in pressure when the pump starts before the boiler tries to ignite. So as the pressure sensor blocks more, you need more pressure on system to see the differential.


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    #33
    Seregwethrin
    Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭Seregwethrin


    Damien360 wrote: »
    I’m not sure that the fault is actually low pressure or failure to see a pressure differential when the pump starts. For whatever reason, a higher pressure will allow the system see the slight increase in pressure when the pump starts before the boiler tries to ignite. So as the pressure sensor blocks more, you need more pressure on system to see the differential.

    I see, so the process is more complicated than "just some pressure in system at any time"

    Thank you


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    #34
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    Seregwethrin wrote: »
    I see, so the process is more complicated than "just some pressure in system at any time"

    Thank you

    Yes, just because there is pressure in the system it doesn't mean everything is ok in that dept.


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    #35
    John.G
    Registered Users Posts: 3,466 ✭✭✭John.G


    Damien360 wrote: »
    I’m not sure that the fault is actually low pressure or failure to see a pressure differential when the pump starts. For whatever reason, a higher pressure will allow the system see the slight increase in pressure when the pump starts before the boiler tries to ignite. So as the pressure sensor blocks more, you need more pressure on system to see the differential.

    I do know that it is recommended on sealed systems that the EV is installed on the pump suction and as close to it as possible, the idea is that the pump suction will always be at the EV pressure and the pump discharge at the EV pressure+the pump head, this gives a higher average system pressure which helps to prevent air ingress where there are high system losses. So assuming a EV pressure of 1.5 bar then with the pump off the pump discharge pressure will also be 1.5 bar, as soon as the pump starts, the pump discharge will be 1.8 bar (assuming a pump head of 3M) so the pressure switch, if positioned here will detect this. It would be interesting to see where the pressure switch and EV connections are installed on these boilers or/and to see if there is a momentary jump in the boiler pressure when the pump starts. If the EV is installed at the pump discharge then the pump suction will be the EV pressure-the pump head and the discharge at the EV pressure, again interesting to see what change, if any, when the pump starts.


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    #36
    Seregwethrin
    Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭Seregwethrin


    I finally got in the good & quick plumber who serviced my boiler last summer.

    His solution was same as @Damien360 and he simply deactivated the boiler's pressure sensor (he called it pressure switch is broken not the sensor, dunno if they separate).

    He also told me I don't need the pressure sensor and the boiler can work even at 0 pressure :pac:

    I got a Sentinel X400 from Screwfix, I think equivalent of MC5.
    I will clean the system now.

    I also saw there is Sentinel X200 for boiler noise and then I will inhibit with X100.
    Hopefully they will help with the banging sound pipes are making.


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    #37
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    It will, but how will you now know when you have too little water in the system and the circulation pump is starting to get damaged from running dry?
    Unless you have a constant low pressure feed of water this is the risk you take by disabling the pressure switch.
    There is a huge difference in cost between replacing the circulation pump against the cost of replacing the pressure switch. In the time it took him to go through changing the settings he would have nearly finished changing the pressure switch.


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    #38
    Seregwethrin
    Registered Users Posts: 151 ✭✭Seregwethrin


    K.Flyer wrote: »
    It will, but how will you now know when you have too little water in the system and the circulation pump is starting to get damaged from running dry?
    Unless you have a constant low pressure feed of water this is the risk you take by disabling the pressure switch.
    There is a huge difference in cost between replacing the circulation pump against the cost of replacing the pressure switch. In the time it took him to go through changing the settings he would have nearly finished changing the pressure switch.

    He told me I'd know the pressure is low if the top of the radiators are cold.

    I am not comfortable without it too. I am sure there is a need for it as the manufacturers installed inside the boiler.

    I will clean the system first then ask him to install one. Though, he really sounded like I don't need it :pac:


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    #39
    K.Flyer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,565 ✭✭✭K.Flyer


    Seregwethrin wrote: »
    He told me I'd know the pressure is low if the top of the radiators are cold.

    That's genius!
    If the downstairs radiators are going cold due to lack of water and the boiler is higher than the rads, I'd imagine that the pump is struggling for water as well.
    Seregwethrin wrote: »
    I am not comfortable without it too. I am sure there is a need for it as the manufacturers installed inside the boiler.

    Yep, to warn you of low pressure in the system and protect the boiler components. Just a pity that the Glowworm pressure switch is not a good quality item.
    Seregwethrin wrote: »
    Though, he really sounded like I don't need it :pac:
    It'll be grand so :rolleyes:


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