Star Trek Discovery S03E03 'People of Earth' - Discussion

liamtech

Looks like i will start this weeks discussion

My Own Opinion

A better episode than last weeks - however i really cannot get behind this story. Its contrived in the extreme, in my humble opinion

Clearly contrived destruction of the federation for Burnham -Discovery to rebuild entirely. Meant to believe that all Federation Ethos has broken down. So much so that they fire on their own systems colonies. Nice to see the Trill, which was unexpected. Again i would say it was better than last weeks episode, but i just dont find this story compelling or interesting at all.

Usual Complaint of course, the entire episode revolved around Burnham, her thoughts, OH MY GOSH she has been through a lot. I dont care. I realize i am starting to sound like a hater, but let me restate, i LOVED picard, and i thought Disco S1 was excellent, for a first season. I also generally liked Much of season two

But this story/plot is thoroughly contrived, not credible, and just plain silly. They are going for a 'MAD MAX' style Alpha Quadrant, similar to 'waterworld' too. "The Galaxy is ruined! One Ship/Women will bring everything together and rebuild the, blah blah blah"

Season 3 for me so far
Episode1 4/10
Episode2 3/10
Episode2 5/10

ilovesmybrick

Have to say I'm a small bit disappointed with this episode, which is surprising since Frakes ones are usually good. It felt a bit slow to get off it's feet, and there were a couple of scenes where the soundtrack feeled a little...twee maybe? Bit of a meh episode, not quite filler, but not far off it.

ilovesmybrick

Snap, just beaten to it by a previous thread, please feel free to remove mods!

What are ye watching this on (second thread). Not available on Netflix until tomorrow.

Banana Republic 1

ilovesmybrick wrote: »

Have to say I'm a small bit disappointed with this episode, which is surprising since Frakes ones are usually good. It felt a bit slow to get off it's feet, and there were a couple of scenes where the soundtrack feeled a little...twee maybe? Bit of a meh episode, not quite filler, but not far off it.

I watched Star Trek all my life and this iteration is total dog ****.

Banana Republic 1

[Deleted User] wrote: »

What are ye watching this on (second thread). Not available on Netflix until tomorrow.

I watched Star Trek all my life and this iteration is total dog ****.

Banana Republic 1

liamtech wrote: »

Looks like i will start this weeks discussion

My Own Opinion

A better episode than last weeks - however i really cannot get behind this story. Its contrived in the extreme, in my humble opinion

Clearly contrived destruction of the federation for Burnham -Discovery to rebuild entirely. Meant to believe that all Federation Ethos has broken down. So much so that they fire on their own systems colonies. Nice to see the Trill, which was unexpected. Again i would say it was better than last weeks episode, but i just dont find this story compelling or interesting at all.

Usual Complaint of course, the entire episode revolved around Burnham, her thoughts, OH MY GOSH she has been through a lot. I dont care. I realize i am starting to sound like a hater, but let me restate, i LOVED picard, and i thought Disco S1 was excellent, for a first season. I also generally liked Much of season two

But this story/plot is thoroughly contrived, not credible, and just plain silly. They are going for a 'MAD MAX' style Alpha Quadrant, similar to 'waterworld' too. "The Galaxy is ruined! One Ship/Women will bring everything together and rebuild the, blah blah blah"

Season 3 for me so far
Episode1 4/10
Episode2 3/10
Episode2 5/10

I watched Star Trek all my life and this iteration is total dog ****.

liamtech

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

I watched Star Trek all my life and this iteration is total dog ****.

MOD NOTE - perhaps we can combine the two open threads? Thanks in advance

On your Point, i think that is too harsh for now? I am not enthusiastic, but with the right 'revelation episode', this can work. And perhaps throw a new light on the season thus far.

I really do want to be enthusiastic but my main complaint is the story. I am tacitly and grudgingly used to the Burnham Centric nature of Disco. i dont like it, and i hope they improve/alter it to take a more traditional Trek approach

My primary argument is with the contrived nature of the story/plot. I was enthusiastic about seeing 31st Century trek. New Technologies, intergalactic travel. etc etc.. But they just have to have everything ruined, and the typical 'Michael Saves the Day' routine.

ilovesmybrick

liamtech wrote: »

MOD NOTE - perhaps we can combine the two open threads? Thanks in advance

Apologies liamtech, I hadn't seen your thread when I started the new one, if the mods can remove or combine them that would be great.

I'm hoping the next episode picks up the pace somewhat, I don't want to be getting to episodes 10/11 before we come across the federation again. I think Disco has picked up quite a bit since the first season, but it has the same pacing problems as the two seasons where it takes an inordinate amount of time to get to the meat of the season and by the end it feels quite rushed.

I am enjoying this season more, but I can see the next couple of episodes giving small tidbits of information without pushing the story forward enough for what are very short seasons. Based on the episode titles I'm guessing episode 7 is where we come across the remains of the Federation.

Spear

It seemed like it followed the same template as episode 2. Discovery intrudes on someone else's unhappy equilibrium, interferes and makes things slightly better, while paying lip service to the principles of the Federation.

At least there's some sense of a larger direction for the season of them searching out Starfleet.

Banana Republic 1

liamtech wrote: »

MOD NOTE - perhaps we can combine the two open threads? Thanks in advance

On your Point, i think that is too harsh for now? I am not enthusiastic, but with the right 'revelation episode', this can work. And perhaps throw a new light on the season thus far.

I really do want to be enthusiastic but my main complaint is the story. I am tacitly and grudgingly used to the Burnham Centric nature of Disco. i dont like it, and i hope they improve/alter it to take a more traditional Trek approach

My primary argument is with the contrived nature of the story/plot. I was enthusiastic about seeing 31st Century trek. New Technologies, intergalactic travel. etc etc.. But they just have to have everything ruined, and the typical 'Michael Saves the Day' routine.

Ah stop the whole arching plot is a complete joke written by woke idiots. Can you imagine riker doing what Burnham does, countermanding Picard or getting in a fist fight with Data.

There is a hatred of men which is constantly displayed throughout this show, they have emasculated Spock. The constant moving camera shooting dynamic is awful the “main” characters are pathetic, Tilly for example is written to appeal to snowflakes and burnham is no way likeable. This latest season is entirely contrived in my opinion to have two black characters as the leads in Star Trek, which is ground breaking when you consider that the original Star Trek had white guys “blacked up” to play sKlingons for example, an awful thing. But this puts everything that Star Trek has achieved into the garbage, Ben Sisko, Janeway, worf, le forge, all well written characters with a morale code that does not discriminate. Plus the many many episodes of there respective iterations that tackled numerous injustices.

Fine have a show with an agenda but write the damn thing so it at least does justice to the themes.

corkie

liamtech wrote: »

A better episode than last weeks

Nice to see the Trill, which was unexpected.

Definitely a better episode, compared to last week (which was a dragged out bore). This kept me engaged and at least they didn't spend too much time on recapping Michael's year.

I knew there where mentions of

'Trill' been in this season, but didn't expect it from this character.

. So got a nice surprise at the reveal.

Deleted User wrote: »

What are ye watching this on (second thread). Not available on Netflix until tomorrow.

It is released on CBS All Access (US) on a Thursday, so people here are watching not by legitimate methods.

Goodshape

Just 10 minutes into this.

Oh my god do they ever stop crying.

Goodshape

Thought that was awful to be honest.

Bunch of children on a star-ship crying about everything they encounter before condescending the locals with their holier-than-thou attitudes and exposition.

Meanwhile, of course, our singular hero slips away behind everyone's back and saves the day again.

Struggled to get through it.

liamtech wrote: »

Season 3 for me so far
Episode1 4/10
Episode2 3/10
Episode2 5/10

For me I think it's

Episode 1: 5/10
Episode 2: 7/10
Episode 3: 4/10

Episode 1 was fine but nothing special. Didn't feel like any Star Trek show or even like any show I'd choose to watch, but it wasn't bad.

Episode 2 wasn't great by any stretch but it was a decent episode of Star Trek.

Episode 3 was just not good.

Sleepy

Calling it now: there's no coincidence that BURN are the first four letters of Burnham's name.

ilovesmybrick

Goodshape wrote: »

Episode 1: 5/10
Episode 2: 7/10
Episode 3: 4/10

Yeah, I think that's exactly where I fall too in terms of the episodes. I think if the first twenty minutes of faffing about (especially the really overdone 'what if we do x from that time when y happened' or 'remember that madcap adventure we had' parts, they're fun, when used sparingly, here it was too much) we could have spent a small bit more time looking at what happened for Earth to drop out of the federation and what is happening there now. Just 5 minutes talking to the head of the Earth defence force or the head of Earth, whatever, would have really helped the episode and place us in the current political situation on Earth.

Sesshoumaru

Did Booker still have all their dilithium when he went on his merry way at the end?

sioda

That was awful just awful. Nothing to get engaged with at all.

The scene with the tree I mean come on where are they going with this season.

As a long time Trekkie I don't want to give up on this but tbh I can see this becoming meh I'll catch up on it rather than essential weekly viewing.

corkie

Sleepy wrote: »

Calling it now: there's no coincidence that BURN are the first four letters of Burnham's name.

Someone else shared the same theory in an earlier thread.

~Rebel~ wrote: »

I have this horrible dread about The Burn... this feeling they're going to do something really really stupid with it. Like, they'll have it be that Michael's time-suit flying back through the closing wormhole is what caused the spontaneous dilithium explosions at some point in the past. That it would initially have been called "The Burnham Effect". Which over time, became "The Burn".

^^^ Cross Thread quotes.

Rawr wrote: »

Book: The Federation is gone

Micheal: But...that is *impossible*

Book: No...it's gone.

Micheal: That's impossible!! It can't be gone! It's impossible.

^^^ Did we have a similar conversation in this episode as well?

Edit: - Lt. Cmdr. Paul Stamets comment at 6:10

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

Did Booker still have all their dilithium when he went on his merry way at the end?

It was teleported back to discovery before he left <<< Off Screen.

sioda wrote: »

The scene with the tree I mean come on where are they going with this season.

All they where missing in this scene was a statue/holographic of BoothBy

"The character Elisa Flores mentions that a hologram of Boothby is still maintained on Academy grounds through at least 2409. "


^^^ If you like the actor? All episodes of 'My Favorite Martin' are on youtube.

fritzelly

I thought it was an enjoyable episode with Star Trek doing what Trek does
Burnham wasn't even that annoying
Even the throwback to the tree I liked

Banana Republic 1

sioda wrote: »

That was awful just awful. Nothing to get engaged with at all.

The scene with the tree I mean come on where are they going with this season.

As a long time Trekkie I don't want to give up on this but tbh I can see this becoming meh I'll catch up on it rather than essential weekly viewing.

It became meh/ dog ****e in series 2. Last season Burnham had a fist fight with an Android/ cyborg and won. This season her iron man suit, #total ripe off, like so many other things in this turd of a show, crashes into and disables a space ship. Donald Trump could write a better script.

PirateShampoo

Did the Burn take all the White Men with it?

Optimus Prime

I liked the tree thing. I guess it’s the prize elm tree Picard carved his initials into. I’m pretty sure janeway said she used to sit under it reading too.

I like this season so far , don’t love it but like it.

still Far too many weird faces and frowns, crying and slow nodding from burnham. They are trying to reset for sure with the crew having more interaction etc. Even Saru saying Burnham feels different. Softer. Also what’s the odds the symbiote is Dax. Can’t remember the past lives etc ... am I the only one thinking it’s going to be dax ?

AMKC

Just watched it now. I do think the 1 year away for Micheal should have 10 years and it would have been much better. Definitly very slow to hey going but when it did it was ok. I still hate The Burn lart do and the ships all just blew up if there Warp cores were active hate that part.
Saru is really growing into his part although I thought he did not seem like he had enough of a presence in the last episode he done much better on this one.
I liked the tree part.

Only done the recap and pre titles bit so far but it’s bordering on nauseating with the big emotional speeches this week already.

OK, why has subspace communication collapsed?
Why would Earth be protecting just the planet and not the resource rich system?

Why would Titan colony not be able to radio/morse/smoke-signal Earth?

Would the raiders not have been better suited to be Vulcans trapped in Sol system?

Why did Michael have to save the day AGAIN?
Why did Michael risk all their dilithium, instead of taking a shuttle with some of it?
Why did we have Michael bestowing Captainship on Saru?

Why would Earth, of all places, not still have some Federation hidden network of agents?



Do they even pass the script to others, for a sense check, before shooting?
And can they, PLEASE, stop with the overdramatic breathless delivery?

AMKC

AMKC wrote: »

Just watched it now. I do think the 1 year away for Micheal should have 10 years and it would have been much better. Definitly very slow to hey going but when it did it was ok. I still hate The Burn lart do and the ships all just blew up if there Warp cores were active hate that part.
Saru is really growing into his part although I thought he did not seem like he had enough of a presence in the last episode he done much better on this one.
I liked the tree part.

If they did not want to have to go down making her look older just 3-5 years would have been plenty


No one changes THAT much in a year

Banana Republic 1

[Deleted User] wrote: »

OK, why has subspace communication collapsed?
Why would Earth be protecting just the planet and not the resource rich system?

Why would Titan colony not be able to radio/morse/smoke-signal Earth?

Would the raiders not have been better suited to be Vulcans trapped in Sol system?

Why did Michael have to save the day AGAIN?
Why did Michael risk all their dilithium, instead of taking a shuttle with some of it?
Why did we have Michael bestowing Captainship on Saru?

Why would Earth, of all places, not still have some Federation hidden network of agents?



Do they even pass the script to others, for a sense check, before shooting?
And can they, PLEASE, stop with the overdramatic breathless delivery?

The pass it to the ultra woke producers.

ilovesmybrick

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

The pass it to the ultra woak producers.

I'm sorry, but "woke" is a ludicrous charge to level at any Star Trek show. Every single series has tried to be socially progressive in it's own way, going right back to The Cage with Number One and having a woman in a command position. From the interracial kiss between Kirk and Uhura, the black and white Charons, the ethics of Data's right to self determination, the kiss between Dax and a previous hosts wife, the racism of twentieth century American in several DS9 episodes, the rise of jingoism and nationalism on Earth in Enterprise (& DS9 at the outset of the dominion), it goes on and on.

Dislike the Disco all you want, and I do have issue with how ham fisted some of this is in Disco, but if you're under the illusion that Star Trek has never been a show that engages with contemporaneous social issues then you may want to go back and rewatch these older series a bit more closely.

Banana Republic 1

PirateShampoo wrote: »

Did the Burn take all the White Men with it?

Ben Sisko, worf, Geordie Leforge, janeway, all well written characters with morale codes that didn’t discriminate.

Banana Republic 1

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

The pass it to the ultra woke producers.

While I agree that DSC is more social justice by committee coming across as forced at times, to think that being woke is new to Trek is very very blinkered.


Multi racial crew in TOS
TNG Female heads of security, medical, counselling. Black/Disabled Chief Engineer. Black actor following in as Head of Security

Black captain in DS9 with female 2nd and senior science officer
Voy woman captain, Native American 2nd, Asian heritage Ops, Black (Vulcan) tactical, mix race engineer.

ENT: Female 2nd, Asian heritage Comms, Black Helmsman

That's before you even get into the episodes in each series dealing with social issues of the day

Banana Republic 1

ilovesmybrick wrote: »

I'm sorry, but "woke" is a ludicrous charge to level at any Star Trek show. Every single series has tried to be socially progressive in it's own way, going right back to The Cage with Number One and having a woman in a command position. From the interracial kiss between Kirk and Uhura, the black and white Charons, the ethics of Data's right to self determination, the kiss between Dax and a previous hosts wife, the racism of twentieth century American in several DS9 episodes, the rise of jingoism and nationalism on Earth in Enterprise (& DS9 at the outset of the dominion), it goes on and on.

Dislike the Disco all you want, and I do have issue with how ham fisted some of this is in Disco, but if you're under the illusion that Star Trek has never been a show that engages with contemporaneous social issues then you may want to go back and rewatch these older series a bit more closely.

I have watched Star Trek all my live thanks very much. I posted the below earlier on in this thread not that read it.

“”Ah stop the whole arching plot is a complete joke written by woke idiots. Can you imagine riker doing what Burnham does, countermanding Picard or getting in a fist fight with Data.

There is a hatred of men which is constantly displayed throughout this show, they have emasculated Spock. The constant moving camera shooting dynamic is awful the “main” characters are pathetic, Tilly for example is written to appeal to snowflakes and burnham is no way likeable. This latest season is entirely contrived, badly, in my opinion to have two black characters as the leads in Star Trek, a woman in an iron man suite crashes into and disable a mans space ship come on.
It’s is ground breaking when you consider that the original Star Trek had white guys “blacked up” to play sKlingons for example, an awful thing. But this puts everything that Star Trek has achieved into the garbage, Ben Sisko, Janeway, worf, le forge, all well written characters with a morale code that does not discriminate. Plus the many many episodes of there respective iterations that tackled numerous injustices.

Fine have a show with an agenda but write the damn thing so it at least does justice to the themes.

pixelburp

Oh GOODY, another tedious diversion over that lazy 'effing reduction of "woke". What larks.

Banana Republic 1

pixelburp wrote: »

Oh GOODY, another tedious diversion over that lazy 'effing reduction of "woke". What larks.

If people actually looked up the definition instead of jumping on a high horse things might be a lot less tense.

pixelburp

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

If people actually looked up the definition instead of jumping on a high horse things might be a lot less tense.

I know full well what it means. It's just a topic that's boring and repetitive. You're just the latest user stomping in ranting about emasculation or whatever. It's like the office bore who always manages to steer a conversation back to Soros, or Brexit or whatever bee is in their butt. This is the umpteenth segue into "grr Trek is woke" and it's dull. Any intellectual value is spent at this stage

Back to the season, the Dilithium being the issue is ridiculous

They could have used the Omega particle forming a massive stable lattice, in the galactic core, but destabilising crashing warp travel galaxy wide. They could have specified that its subspace interference also affected Transwarp etc...
Would have stranded ships decades from help, causing same loss of fleets (and gradual death)

DSC spore drive would still give the massive advantage.

Banana Republic 1

pixelburp wrote: »

I know full well what it means. It's just a topic that's boring and repetitive. You're just the latest user stomping in ranting about emasculation or whatever. It's like the office bore who always manages to steer a conversation back to Soros, or Brexit or whatever bee is in their butt. This is the umpteenth segue into "grr Trek is woke" and it's dull. Any intellectual value is spent at this stage

No I’m saying to put out a terrible show that is based on one that has such a history is disappointing to say the least. Personally I regret coming back to this god awful forum as it’s so bitter and some times racist.

ilovesmybrick

Deleted User wrote: »

DSC spore drive would still give the massive advantage.

Though with the absolutely massive disadvantage that Discovery is woefully underequipped for the 31st century. Two torpedoes and they were left essentially defenceless (I'll do a bit of a handwave at how powerful their shields can be to even handle that.....)

I hope at some point this season they attempt some form of upgrading the ship, within reason, otherwise there's going to be an awful lot of running going on at the merest hint of trouble.

Also, I love the repair robots. It does get around the Voyager reset problem quite neatly, even if it's a retcon to canon. They're just cool, maybe exocomp precursors?

Goodshape

Probably best not to feed the trolls on these threads tbh. "Where'd all teh white males go though" ZZZZZzzzzzzz.

ilovesmybrick

ilovesmybrick wrote: »

Though with the absolutely massive disadvantage that Discovery is woefully underequipped for the 31st century. Two torpedoes and they were left essentially defenceless (I'll do a bit of a handwave at how powerful their shields can be to even handle that.....)

I hope at some point this season they attempt some form of upgrading the ship, within reason, otherwise there's going to be an awful lot of running going on at the merest hint of trouble.

Also, I love the repair robots. It does get around the Voyager reset problem quite neatly, even if it's a retcon to canon. They're just cool, maybe exocomp precursors?

I would imagine that Michael will have all kinds of upgrades to be performed.
This is one instance where she would, within confines of a story, have all the answers. She's been there for a year (again 5 would have been better) and had time to realise that Discovery needs massive upgrades and figure out what the ship can actually handle.

flazio

Repair droids. Always put me in mind of Burn-E when I see tech like that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2K9nJg1qdQ

Anyway liked the episode. Nice look between Saru and Burnham when the Earth captain warned they were in danger of waging war in the name of the Federation. The look just said "....again "
But they managed to do what Starfleet are supposed to do. Broker peace and negotiations, that's very Star Trek.
So it appears the subtitle for this season is "The Search for The Federation". I'm curious to see what happened to the Vulcans or the Klingons heck maybe the Ferengi are trading Dilthium like it's going out of fashion. Hopefully we'll see.

FutureGuy

I worked with a bunch of people before for 2 years. I didn't love them as ****ing family. Jesus.

Aside from that, good episode. They need to get on with it though.

flazio

FutureGuy wrote: »

I worked with a bunch of people before for 2 years. I didn't love them as ****ing family. Jesus.

Aside from that, good episode. They need to get on with it though.

Yeah, but you went home after work every day presumably. Try serving on a military mission for two years, or serving on a sea vessel sailing the world. In those instances, your workmates are your family.

Banana Republic 1

flazio wrote: »

Yeah, but you went home after work every day presumably. Try serving on a military mission for two years, or serving on a sea vessel sailing the world. In those instances, your workmates are your family.

Ya navy personnel regularly break down crying on duty.

Goodshape

Banana Republic 1 wrote: »

Ya navy personnel regularly break down crying on duty.

Yeah but Discovery is a science vessel, full of scientists. We know this because they keep saying it out loud, often during "tense and dramatic" military style confrontations.

Scientists, as everyone knows, are very excitable and emotional creatures.

Goodshape

Goodshape wrote: »

Yeah but Discovery is a science vessel, full of scientists. We know this because they keep saying it out loud, often during "tense and dramatic" military style confrontations.

Scientists, as everyone knows, are very excitable and emotional creatures.

That must be why I failed to get beyond degree level in both my courses.


Damn this stoic nature...

Banana Republic 1

Goodshape wrote: »

Yeah but Discovery is a science vessel, full of scientists. We know this because they keep saying it out loud, often during "tense and dramatic" military style confrontations.

Scientists, as everyone knows, are very excitable and emotional creatures.

There also known for their fist fighting and karate skills. 🀨

duffman13

Tedious episode. Little to no attention paid to the spore drive, Earth has amazing defenses but cant scan outside the solar system to see a ship magically appear. The peace process was bizarre, getting the lad to lower his shields was also bizarre.

I am struggling to stay with it. Again, great premise but needs a bit of a turn soon. If the Burn is short for the Burnham effect, I am done though :pac:

flazio

Did Michaels mother use the name "Burnham" as well? I'm suspecting she's "The Burn". Something to do with her appearance in the future caused the Dilthium boom boom.

FunLover18

I'm glad to see there was a hint of tension between Saru and Michael at the end but really it's ridiculous how much leeway she gets and it's a shame because if they actually dealt with it head on it might make for some interesting story and character development.

I agree with previous posters that one year is far too short a time for her to have gone through these changes, should've been 3/4.

Not sure The Burn name could have derived from Burnham though, didn't she say in the intro that The Burn happened 700 years after they left the past?

Banana Republic 1

FunLover18 wrote: »

I'm glad to see there was a hint of tension between Saru and Michael at the end but really it's ridiculous how much leeway she gets and it's a shame because if they actually dealt with it head on it might make for some interesting story and character development.

I agree with previous posters that one year is far too short a time for her to have gone through these changes, should've been 3/4.

Not sure The Burn name could have derived from Burnham though, didn't she say in the intro that The Burn happened 700 years after they left the past?

Girl meets boy by crashing her time travelling iron man suite into boys space ship, one can’t expect an substantial plot shake up at this point.