Gay man being persistent (I am heterosexual), I'm concerned about a confrontation

LegacyUser

For the first while I could shrug this off, some homosexual dude developed a crush on me (me being 100% heterosexual), no big deal.

He'd just approach and try and engage me in conversation, I'd nod and try and end it as soon as possible, or try to throw in the phrase, "yeah me and my girlfriend....." etc, you get the idea.

Just avoid the dude basically.

More recently he's become increasingly shameless however.
It's simply not the type of situation where we can chat and I outline, "I would be tremendously appreciative if you didn't creep on me sexually" etc

Basically last time we crossed paths he stepped too far inside my space and put his hand on my shoulder (in a kind of caressing motion) whilst saying "hey man", with this really creepy feel about him.

It's getting to the point where I'm going to have to drop the cool exterior and basically let this dude know to back off except, I know the only way he'll actually get the message is, reluctant as I am to say this, with violence.

I get the distinct impression he enjoys being kind of creepy and pushing boundaries in a way he knows is unacceptable.

So anyways, like I described, that last time he got too close, I almost DID lose it and if he didn't scram pronto (which he did as soon as he felt my anger), there may have been an unpleasant scene right there.

The only thing I'm concerned about is, a potential public confrontation cause, no one wants to see that.

Any advice?

I guess that's all I can request at this point?
Experiences with this? Any kind of advice on how to manage it?

PS - I'm just going to add here that, it's possible that my presentation doesn't discourage him either being attracted to me or thinking that I might be gay myself (even though again, I am exclusively heterosexual - I have no problem with gay dudes, so long as they respect that's not me).

I like to take care of myself, the unkempt cave man appearance doesn't appeal to me.
Regardless, it's no excuse for predatory behavior.

El_Duderino 09

The Times wrote: »

If you were a woman and you stood up to a creep no one would think any less of you. You'd probably be hailed as a hero. Why should it be any different for you?

Tell him to **** off

Or tell him that you're not interested without losing the cool.

The guy seems to not be taking subtle ways of saying 'no' for an answer, so OP does need to be explicit and say they're not interested and it's making them uncomfortable. Telling them to Fcuk Off would be the Corronation St., chavvy way to deal with a situation that makes you uncomfortable. Doing it politely and with an even temperament would be the more effective way to start.

El_Duderino 09

The Times wrote: »

Bollocks. You wouldn't say that if op were female.

Of course I would. I'd always say to start by saying explicitly that they're not interested and the behaviour is making them uncomfortable. Going from zero to 'fcuk off!' is ridiculous, chavvy behaviour without even trying the direct and even tempered approach - like an adult

The OP's username for this thread is "don't want trouble". Taking them at their word then the simplest approach is to be direct and not make a bigger deal out of it than is necessary. So start by being direct and explicit. If they respond to that then great, no trouble. If they don't respond to that then the fcuk off might be necessary.

Sardonicat

The Times wrote: »

Bollocks. You wouldn't say that if op were female.

Absolutely. This guy is a creep, pure and simple. He already knows OP isn't interested. Stop being polite OP. 'Don't touch me! I dont want to talk to you. Fuk off!' Same as I (female) would do if a guy was creeping on me.You've been polite, you've dropped the hints. He knows his actions are unwanted and he's doing it in purpose. Call him out.

El_Duderino 09

The Times wrote: »

Oh come on, op is deeply uncomfortable with this and the guy is obviously a creep. You can't be polite to these types.

Your 'just be polite to guy who wants to sexually assault you bro' advice is nonsense.

The guy want's to sexually assault the OP? If that's the case then the OP should have said so.
Abuse of quotation marks aside, I still think the OP should start with an explicit expression of their position. If they feel they are in danger of sexual assault then they should act accordingly, but since they haven't said that they feel in danger of sexual assault then it's difficult for us to infer that (well, it's difficult for me to infer it. You seem to be able to infer these things without evidence).

OP, if you don't want a confrontation or drama and you don't think you're in danger of sexual or physicals assault, then do it the normal way and start by just tell the guy you're not interested.

zoobizoo

I've had this while staying in a hostel sharing a room with a gay guy who was hitting on me for a few days.

I asked him politely to stop as I wasn't gay and wasn't interested.

I woke one night .... the duvet was rolled back and he was about to go down on me.

Thats when the politeness ended. I shouted at him, jumped out of bed, cornered him but didn't get physical.... I went back to bed and got him kicked out the next day.


OP. It's time for you to take a less polite approach. No smile. No chat. No mention of flirting just a "i don't like you. I've no interest in talking to you. Don't engage with me again" and leave it at that.

Sardonicat

zoobizoo wrote: »

I've had this while staying in a hostel sharing a room with a gay guy who was hitting on me for a few days.

I asked him politely to stop as I wasn't gay and wasn't interested.

I woke one night .... the duvet was rolled back and he was about to go down on me.

Thats when the politeness ended. I shouted at him, jumped out of bed, cornered him but didn't get physical.... I went back to bed and got him kicked out the next day.


OP. It's time for you to take a less polite approach. No smile. No chat. No mention of flirting just a "i don't like you. I've no interest in talking to you. Don't engage with me again" and leave it at that.

God, that's a horrible thing to go through!

El_Duderino 09

zoobizoo wrote: »

I've had this while staying in a hostel sharing a room with a gay guy who was hitting on me for a few days.

I asked him politely to stop as I wasn't gay and wasn't interested.

I woke one night .... the duvet was rolled back and he was about to go down on me.

Thats when the politeness ended. I shouted at him, jumped out of bed, cornered him but didn't get physical.... I went back to bed and got him kicked out the next day.


OP. It's time for you to take a less polite approach. No smile. No chat. No mention of flirting just a "i don't like you. I've no interest in talking to you. Don't engage with me again" and leave it at that.

They haven't tried an explicit polite approach yet. always start with that.

I can only imagine a thread on Boards where a man comes on to a woman and advice to her is to go straight to telling him to fcuk off without even explicitly telling him she's not interested. That's just crazy stuff especially considering the OP has said they don't want drama.

I suppose the thing to do is ask the OP if they feel in danger. OP, do you feel in danger from this guy?

screamer

You’re far too polite, and some assholes are spurned on by the challenge of what they can’t have. Tell him you’ve no interest, and to stay away from you. If he does this again, down to the Garda station and make a formal complaint. He might get the message then.

breezy1985

Why can I not see the OPs profile. Is that something we can lock?

zoobizoo

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

They haven't tried an explicit polite approach yet. always start with that.

I

Sorry, I thought I read that he had.

Always start with the polite approach.

Sardonicat

zoobizoo wrote: »

Sorry, I thought I read that he had.

Always start with the polite approach.

It doesn't say anywhere he hasn't. The creep hasn't overtly come onto him which makes it awkward to knock back directly . But he is making op uncomfortable and op says he gets the impression that he gets off on making him uncomfortable.

breezy1985

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I suppose the thing to do is ask the OP if they feel in danger. OP, do you feel in danger from this guy?

The OP seems to have conveniently disappeared

LegacyUser

Sardonicat wrote: »

It doesn't say anywhere he hasn't. The creep hasn't overtly come onto him which makes it awkward to knock back directly . But he is making op uncomfortable and op says he gets the impression that he gets off on making him uncomfortable.

This exactly.

It's like, if I were to gauge his thought process, he sees me as a target, playing hard to get.

His deviant state of mind makes the process fun for him.

I like the "report to law enforcement" comment cause, mainly because I also get the sense that, if I do end up striking him reflexively, if I know dudes like this, just to f**k with he, he'd be the one filing a complaint against me.

Deviancy is a tricky characteristic to deal with, especially when another person is horny and wants what they feel they've got coming and/or are entitled to.

Does that sound disgusting?

Yes?

Good, it should - now you all know how I feel being a heterosexual man being harassed by a creepy predatory gay dude (just FYI, I've known some cool as hell gay dudes, it's the predatory gay dudes I've got a problem with).

This is, although it's harassment to me, he hasn't crossed the line far enough to get me anything I can substantiate a law enforcement complaint with.
I can't just walk into a garda station and say, "there's this predatory gay dude has been trying to come onto me and last week he put his hand on my shoulder....".
He's clever enough to push it, but not cross that line.

And as correctly identified, if I did approach him "formally" and even did go so far as saying "f**k off", for him and his deviancy, it's all a game.
It'd probably just make him hotter.

Is here any good way to deal with this?

I simply can't help but get the feeling he'll keep probing, just to f**k with me if nothing else.


PS perhaps worth mentioning that I had an episode like this previously also and, the dude was a sicko who seemed to become completely infatuated with me.
Eventually he committed property damage to my stuff, presumably out of spite, so I reported him for that and the police took over from there, was never a problem since that.

But it had to come to that, and it sucks, as well as being stressful.

LegacyUser

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

They haven't tried an explicit polite approach yet. always start with that.

I can only imagine a thread on Boards where a man comes on to a woman and advice to her is to go straight to telling him to fcuk off without even explicitly telling him she's not interested. That's just crazy stuff especially considering the OP has said they don't want drama.

I suppose the thing to do is ask the OP if they feel in danger. OP, do you feel in danger from this guy?

I feel like it's intensely disrespectful, creepy, deliberately harassing and an invasion of my space.

The primary danger I feel is the fear of me becoming involved in a physical confrontation with him where the I become the bad guy, in the eyes of a bystander and/or law enforcement.

And I distinctly feel he'd push it this far, just to f**k with me.

Sardonicat

Predators are an issue, gay or straight, male or female. Experience has taught me the best approach is to call it out. 'I don't like you. I don't want to talk to you. Go away' . He might make a bit of noise but don't engage him further. He's relying on you being polite and not making a fuss. Subvert that presumption and watch him deflate and scurry away.

El_Duderino 09

DontWantTrouble wrote: »

I feel like it's intensely disrespectful, creepy, deliberately harassing and an invasion of my space.

The primary danger I feel is the fear of me becoming involved in a physical confrontation with him where the I become the bad guy, in the eyes of a bystander and/or law enforcement.

And I distinctly feel he'd push it this far, just to f**k with me.

So you’re not suggesting you’re in danger from him, but you might be in danger of flying off the handle and hitting him or something similar?

Between talking about going to the Guards and talking about hitting him, has it even occurred to you to just tell him you’re not interested and their behaviour makes you uncomfortable, without the drama of law enforcement or violence? Just the normal way to tell anyone something they don’t want to know?

You seem to be assuming he’s only doing all this to mess with you. Maybe he is (in which case just saying you’re not interested will have no effect. Or maybe he’s a normal guy who would take a firm, explicit “no” at face value in the first case nothing would change, in the second (much more usual) case, it would solve your problem.

ILoveYourVibes

You have to get over your fear of public confrontation if you don't want people to over step the mark with you.


Its the same with women unfortunately with men who are boderline cases but sly about it.

Just say you are not interested in getting to know him.

JustAThought

Unwanted sexual overtones always a problem - but when it is coming from all same sex even more so IMO . The OP has not said where these advances are being made? In a circle of friends that now includes him? In a gym? In work? Do you have people in common? Context from the OP would be really helpful here in determining an appropriate response.

ILoveYourVibes

JustAThought wrote: »

Unwanted sexual overtones always a problem - but when it is coming from all same sex even more so IMO . The OP has not said where these advances are being made? In a circle of friends that now includes him? In a gym? In work? Do you have people in common? Context from the OP would be really helpful here in determining an appropriate response.

I agree.

Is this work ..i was presuming it is ...i mean you don't have to be around people unless its work really. You choose your circle.

Also the issue for the OP is its not strictly sexual harassment ..yet. So he feels he can't do anything.

In my experience you have to be nasty with someone like this. Let them know you are not a victim and you will make life hard for them.

s1ippy

DontWantTrouble wrote: »

This exactly.

It's like, if I were to gauge his thought process, he sees me as a target, playing hard to get.

His deviant state of mind makes the process fun for him.

I like the "report to law enforcement" comment cause, mainly because I also get the sense that, if I do end up striking him reflexively, if I know dudes like this, just to f**k with he, he'd be the one filing a complaint against me.

Deviancy is a tricky characteristic to deal with, especially when another person is horny and wants what they feel they've got coming and/or are entitled to.

Does that sound disgusting?

Yes?

Good, it should - now you all know how I feel being a heterosexual man being harassed by a creepy predatory gay dude (just FYI, I've known some cool as hell gay dudes, it's the predatory gay dudes I've got a problem with).

This is, although it's harassment to me, he hasn't crossed the line far enough to get me anything I can substantiate a law enforcement complaint with.
I can't just walk into a garda station and say, "there's this predatory gay dude has been trying to come onto me and last week he put his hand on my shoulder....".
He's clever enough to push it, but not cross that line.

And as correctly identified, if I did approach him "formally" and even did go so far as saying "f**k off", for him and his deviancy, it's all a game.
It'd probably just make him hotter.

Is here any good way to deal with this?

I simply can't help but get the feeling he'll keep probing, just to f**k with me if nothing else.


PS perhaps worth mentioning that I had an episode like this previously also and, the dude was a sicko who seemed to become completely infatuated with me.
Eventually he committed property damage to my stuff, presumably out of spite, so I reported him for that and the police took over from there, was never a problem since that.

But it had to come to that, and it sucks, as well as being stressful.

I get the impression that he knows you won't reciprocate his advances but still makes them. You do not respond positively but he persists.

These are the hallmarks of a predator. Even if he won't explicitly get the satisfaction he wants from you, he is getting off on the fact he can have an emotional impact on you at all.

I would echo the advice of others to very explicitly but calmly lay down the law next time; in front of others point out his inappropriate behaviour -

"Eh s1ippy, could you just move your arm there, I'm not comfortable when someone is that close to me."

Definitely don't give him a rise because he may want to actually have a confrontation so he can gaslight you - I think that's what gaslighting is anyway, where you are accused of being the one in the wrong when somebody else has set you up.

He sounds like a dangerous person to be around in general, I would keep well away from him whenever you can. Completely gross making sexual advances towards somebody who is clearly not into it. It's pretty pathetic that you'll have to politely spell this out for him but some people are absolutely sad like.

ILoveYourVibes

s1ippy wrote: »

that you'll have to politely spell this out for him but some people are absolutely sad like.

He will or could just deny this. Deny deny deny.

I mean he knows the guy is straight. So something else is going on here.

He sounds like a dangerous person to be around in general, I would keep well away from him whenever you can.

This.

OP if you don't work with him avoid him.

JustAThought

Or maybe he is naturally more gregarious and touchy feeley - look at the Brazillians, or Spanish - how they interact physically is totally different -again context is everything.

Also Rather than being a creep
or passive agreasive he could be just mortified that he made the wrong call on the OP’s sexuality and is just playing it friendly to cover having embarassed himself by making an advance. - as opposed to lurking in the background of the group or never making eye contact etc.
It must be quite hard meeting someone same sex and although attitudes (and the laws!) have changed it still must be a big leap - lets face it - with prejudices and natural fears I’d say you could never be sure how it could end or whether you coild be ridiculed or shunned as a consequence. Maybe this is why the guy is overcompensating - to show nothing is wrong & its friends and buddies as usual - slaps on the back and whatnot. Overcompensating.

I have to say I wouldn’t like or feel comfortable being hit on by someone of the same sex and I imagine it would lead to awkered scenarios if you were to keep meeting up. As it stands unless its work in which the OP coild be in trouble depending on how he addresses it, the biggest loser is most likely be the guy who hit on the OP - especially of it is a curcle of friends or social group of all heteosexuals. . Small wonder he is trying so hard to rormalise and keep things moving along in an overcompensated, perhaps too forced way - but it can’t be easy. Its hard enough putting yourself out there and being rejected when you are not gay, than doing it and getting it wrong, when you are ( and the other person isn’t) . OUCH.

ILoveYourVibes

JustAThought wrote: »

Or maybe he is naturally more gregarious and touchy feeley - look at the Brazillians, or Spanish - how they interact physically is totally different -again context is everything.

I would think the OP knows the difference.

And even if the guy is touchy feely ...it doesn't mean he has the right to be touchy feely if someone isn't feeling it.

And anyway....we are meant to be 2 meters right now.

JustAThought

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I would think the OP knows the difference.

And even if the guy is touchy feely ...it doesn't mean he has the right to be touchy feely if someone isn't feeling it.

And anyway....we are meant to be 2 meters right now.

Yes i know - hence the cultural question & remark re Brazillians! The OP has given no input re the circumstances of meeting - given their virulent hatred of this person that seems odd. As I keep saying - context is important. OP has now mentioned this is the second time around being targeted for an unwanted gay relationship /attraction - the first time with violence. Again, this seems odd. Unspecified context also - how did the first guy gain access to destroy his property? And where is he meeting up with frequency the now second guy? Sounds odd overall. Maybe their gadar is on overdrive - assuming the OP is not hanging with a mixed crowd or gay bars where they might get the wrong input? Gay bars are superfriendly and social - easy to get a message wrong in that context.

Rubberchikken

Where are you meeting these men?
Once seems like bad luck but twice makes me wonder.

440Hertz

Just tell him firmly to back off and you’re not interested.

Unfortunately, some people - gay, straight, male or female simply don’t get the message because they’re sex pests.

If that doesn’t work, just remove yourself from his company. It’s sexual harassment type pestering behaviour.

Personally, I was driven around the twist by a woman who wouldn’t take no for an answer. She would get into my personal space, even sitting on my lap. Kept tussling my hair. Kissing me and even grabbed my crotch and trying to kiss me on the lips (pre covid)

I know there’ll be lads on here will laugh that off, but she was horrible and it’s extremely annoying to be constantly pestered when I’ve said no.

I’m gay and when she did get ignored she reacted with a homophobic rant and that was followed by “I bet I could turn you...”

There are some people out there who don’t seem to understand when they’ve crossed a line.

Be very firm and direct.

ILoveYourVibes

Rubberchikken wrote: »

Where are you meeting these men?
Once seems like bad luck but twice makes me wonder.

This is actually true.

Some places ....have bad vibes ..some people too. They attract pests or just plain bad people.

Like attracts like.

LegacyUser

OP do you work with this person or they live local and you bump into them while out? How you keep interacting with him is important as there's different approaches to dealing with them.

If its work environment and you've told them to stop and they haven't you need to speak to HR.

If they work in a business you are a customer in you need to speak to their manager.

If this is just some random guy you bump into in town you need to ignore them and if they keep pushing themselves on you, just raise your voice a little higher so others can hear 'Hey man I already told you I'm not interested, back off' Don't mention not being gay etc as he could try and twist as you being homophobic Don't engage with them otherwise. If they keep pushing report them to the staff of what ever space you are in, if its on the street tell them you will report them to the Guards.

As a woman I've had to deal with a lot of guys who didn't get the f*ck off message. At first I was like yourself OP, didn't want to make scene, trying to be direct but also quite as to not draw attention etc but it just doesn't work. You have two types of people who do this OP those who think its funny to make others uncomfortable and either don't know or don't care how uncomfortable it makes you and the more dangerous predator ones and sadly its really hard to tell the difference as both will claim it was just a joke when you call them out but you just have to direct and it has to be public unfortunately

Tig98

Something doesn't seem right about all this, but anyway

I don't know why anyone would psych themselves up for physical violence when they haven't even been direct with the person yet. Tell him flat out you do not appreciate his advances because you are not gay, and that his touchy feely nature is making you deeply uncomfortable. Bring it to HRs attention, or of anyone else who is around a lot.

Beechwoodspark

I had issues with some women over the years who over stepped the line but also Worked with an older gay guy who “took a shine” to me.

It escalated from originally this guy giving me his life story then it progressed to the one or two funny comments to full on innuendo and “what he wanted to do with me” etc.

Had a quiet word with our mutual boss and it ended there but awkwardly, about a year later the gay guy approached me and my friends in a bar at Christmas and told me how much he liked me and “it’s a shame you’re straight eh eh”.

I had moved employers at that stage so I told him to just leave me alone then later that night he wanted to buy me and my friends a round of shots.

Basically he was v drunk and acting stupid.

Havnt seen him in a long time.

zoobizoo

Rubberchikken wrote: »

Where are you meeting these men?
Once seems like bad luck but twice makes me wonder.

Is this what victim blaming is?

I was heavily hit on by a man in his 40s while on a family holiday when I was 16. He tried to get me drunk. I was sitting with my dad at the time.

I was hit on again aggressively at a house party when I was 21 I think.

I was politely hit on at a gay club a couple of years after....no problem there.... I politely declined and I explained I was straight. All very friendly and respectful.

Then there was the hostel story that I described earlier.

Maybe rhe OP is a good looking guy and has had a couple of unlucky incidents with some people.

Beechwoodspark

The worst I heard was a friend of mine (straight) was out one night with his girlfriend and her gay friends

She encouraged them to feel up my friend and gave out to him for protesting it. Ffs like!

She’s now his ex by the way !!

Beechwoodspark

Can you imagine if the genders were reversed in the above situation !!!

LegacyUser

Cheers for the responses.

Instead of quoting, let me respond to the main gaps to fill:

- Don't work him (it'd be easier if I did cause I could just report him to management).

When this happens, it's on the street in public typically. He'll actually call from afar to get my attention, things like that.
Then start waving like a love sick puppy.

One day I saw someone waving at me but didn't recognize who so, instinctively waved back but, when I looked and realized who it was, the dude has this horrible deviant sexual grin on his face.

- As to the "tell him you're not gay" advice, you got to understand, deviancy expects this.

Really what I know would be most effective would be what happened previously, report him to an authority figure of some kind, like his boss or law enforcement.

But I'd have to wait until he crosses a more serious line to do that.

I think speaking to his employer is probably the most effective approach, maybe if one more serious'ish incident goes down like he puts his hands on me, one more explicit move etc.

Yeah, I think that's the best thing to do.

- And the comment, why does this keep happening to me?

I have no good answer. I mean, how to explain, ever watch prison film where there's one vulnerable dude who's like, a target for sexual predators?

I'm not physically vulnerable in terms of size etc but, I guess there's something about me that either makes these dudes think I am, and it seems to turn them on?


I've already addressed one such incident with law enforcement, and I was very satisfied with the result (basically no more harassment).

So I guess bringing this to the attention of a higher authority in some capacity vs being direct with the dude (deviant, he expects me to be direct, WANTS that even, cause you know he's got the, as one poster pointed out, "it was only a joke" line prepared).

ManOfMystery

It happened me on a night out about a year ago. We were in a group of about 8 work colleagues, one of whom was a junior working for me. He was gay - not that it ever came up, I don't care what persuasion people are. I have gay family members and other gay friends/colleagues. As the night wore on he arranged to meet a few of his personal friends along the way as they were also out and about in that vicinity. To cut a long story short, the groups ended up splitting off as people got more drunk and it ended up with me, 2 other work colleagues and one of my junior guy's personal friends - who was very obviously gay. For reasons known only to himself, he decided to tag along with us, who he'd never met before.

He literally spent the better part of 90 mins in my personal space. If I went to the toilet, he had to go to. If I went to the bar, he walked with me. If I moved to a slightly different standing spot to talk to someone, he moved with me. I'm straight, married and made zero attempts to encourage any of this - in fact, as it went on, I asked him a few times to give me some space. My other colleagues kept making bemused faces at me but no-one wanted to be rude.

Eventually I had enough when he put his arm around my waist and told him in no uncertain terms that if he didn't get his hand off me and stay at least 50 feet out of my personal space, I was going to knock his teeth down his throat. I'm not a violent person and don't particularly like hostility, but I was getting worried at this stage that if he couldn't read the signals, he might make a lunge at me.

As I said, I don't particuarly care what sexual persuasion people are. But there does seem to be a small contingent of gay males who are utterly convinced that some of us straight ones are secretly gay and just need to realise it.

440Hertz

It’s not a gay or straight thing. It’s a consent and cop on thing and it’s why universities have pushed out the idea of consent classes.

I’ve been literally stalked by a woman for 3 years, which began in my last year of secondary school and nearly destroyed my undergraduate degree as she started turning up outside lectures, following me to the library and wouldn’t stop no matter what I did. It got to the stage I stopped going to college as I couldn’t avoid her and I started failing modules.

It’s a good few years ago now, but at the time (early 2000s) the authorities were beyond useless, particularly as it was a woman stalking a man. I was even told by various people that I was being inconsiderate as she obviously has mental problems and I was going to cause her a lot of hurt by taking it further legally.

I’ve heard stories from the 1970s about how bad guys were then. One of my relatives was telling me about guys following her around, “making passes” at her and basically behaviour that would get you arrested nowadays.

Unfortunately, some people don’t have much cop on about lines & what’s appropriate or where the limits are. They don’t flirt or seem to understand how social interaction works, so it becomes a pursuit issue instead of a flirting thing.

I mean someone getting flirty is not an issue. They know when they aren’t getting the signals back and drop it. It’s that % who simply don’t get that when someone says no, they mean no.

stargazer 68

Okay Im obviously an idiot here - He tries to make conversation with you, he waves at you in the street and he touched your shoulder?
And you think you will get violent with him if he does it again, you have called him a deviant and you want to report him to someone i.e his boss or the Guards?

Well OP unless you have a bit more than that they will show you the door.

I understand that he makes you uncomfortable but unless there are more serious incidents that you haven't mentioned he just comes across as a friendly guy!

Hannibal_Smith

Mod Note

Bertiebomber I've deleted your post. If you have nothing constructive to offer, spare us from your rants.

Thanks

HS

B.A._Baracus

Sorry for the long post...
I had an experience like this. I too am straight.

I was 20 years old and was on a night out with people from work. We were all pretty drunk going from pub to pub and we went to the Viper Room on the quays here in Dublin.
We were all outside in little groups chatting before we went in. Some gay older guy comes over to me and starts chatting. I am friendly chatting back but I'm just waiting on my friends. Had no interest in chatting beyond just being polite.

There were taxis parked right beside the pub. So he starts linking arms with me saying "come on home with me.. get into the taxi" as he's trying to pull me into the taxi. I broke away pushed him hard to the ground. Bouncer comes over and says what's going on. I say he's gay and that he was trying to bring me into taxi. Bouncer walks away.

Do I regret it? No.
Would I do things differently today? Yes. As now I wouldn't put it past someone like that to call the guards and get me arrested for assault. Claiming he was being playful. Surprised he did not. But maybe he just realised he crossed a line.

Another thing is when I pushed him he went flying. Luckily for him he tucked his chin so his head didn't smack off the ground. Imagine if he hurt himself - que an ambulance and the guards. If he seriously landed on his head. What? Manslaughter charges over some gay bloke not taking a hint? No thanks.

As for how I would handle it today? I'd raise my voice, let everyone hear how I am not gay, I am not going home with you, now let go of me.... Should he still be at it, I'd grab him force him to let me go.


So op be careful. If you hit him he could be the sort to realise how wrong his ways were with you and that would be that... Or he couldnt dial 999 quick enough. Especially the fact you'll be rejecting his advances to boot (the ego of some)

Making a stink and creating drama is better than being charged.

bertiebomber

just shout help sexual harassment happening here !

440Hertz

OP, you also suggested you would report him to his employer. If this is occurring outside your workplace, reporting him to an unrelated 3rd party, particularly his employer is an extremely bad idea as you will step straight into slander issues. It’s not a HR issue between colleagues and it’s not occurring in his capacity representing his employer.

There’s a line between someone who is just being overly flirty and someone who isn’t getting the message at all. So sometimes you just have to be extremely direct, firm and blunt, but reacting in anger or threatening isn’t advisable at all.

I would start by just saying: “I think our wires are crossed. I’m not gay and I’m not interested in you like that.”

It’s very possible you’re dealing with someone who isn’t very able to read subtleties.

My advice if someone’s refusing to stop when they’ve clearly had a signal and been told that you’re not interested is:

1) Withdraw from contact with them. Don’t just ignore them but actively avoid contact. Walk away. Move table. Do not engage in any further interaction or conversation.

At the moment, we have no social lives anyway due to COVID-19, so just ignore all electronic communication. The 6 week lockdown might be an excellent cooling off period.

2) If it’s a social media issue, block them & report anything that’s threatening that is breech of T&Cs

3) If it’s a serious and persistent issue, talk to the Gardaí. They’re a lot better at dealing with harassment issues than they used to be.

LegacyUser

440Hertz wrote: »

Unfortunately, some people don’t have much cop on about lines & what’s appropriate or where the limits are. They don’t flirt or seem to understand how social interaction works, so it becomes a pursuit issue instead of a flirting thing.

I mean someone getting flirty is not an issue. They know when they aren’t getting the signals back and drop it. It’s that % who simply don’t get that when someone says no, they mean no.

I'm strongly of the opinion this is the issue also.

Basically folk who have some character and are more comfortable expressing themselves and thus interacting etc.

And then folk who have no fluidity to their character what so ever, and they have to be unbecoming/deviant/obscene in terms of how they express themselves.

I've lived with gay dudes in the past and it was completely cool.
One dude made an extremely mild pass at me one time and I laughed it off, he immediately got the message and we went back to hanging out.

It's the dudes that are persistent and creepy, I think they become predatory because they fail at otherwise interacting and expressing themselves, I'd imagine probably frustration subsequently gets the better of them.

It's pretty awful to have to be around.


To the other comment beneath this, I would have nothing to offer law enforcement currently and yes I know, I would get laughed out the door, which is why I said I'd have to wait until he did something more explicit/obscene, which I don't really want the perv to do, frankly.

That's why it's such an awkward situation, and creepy.

So really all I can do is avoid the dude, wait for him to cross the line with something sufficient to report him on, or have a repeat of the situation where he makes uncomfortable moves without crossing the line and I respond with anger (hopefully not violence but, if he didn't come to his senses and quickly get out of my space like he did last time, violence was going to happen).

In fact it was exclusively his sense that I was prepared to engage him violently that caused him to smarten up and scram most recently.

JustAThought

DontWantTrouble wrote: »

I'm strongly of the opinion this is the issue also.

Basically folk who have some character and are more comfortable expressing themselves and thus interacting etc.

And then folk who have no fluidity to their character what so ever, and they have to be unbecoming/deviant/obscene in terms of how they express themselves.

I've lived with gay dudes in the past and it was completely cool.
One dude made an extremely mild pass at me one time and I laughed it off, he immediately got the message and we went back to hanging out.

It's the dudes that are persistent and creepy, I think they become predatory because they fail at otherwise interacting and expressing themselves, I'd imagine probably frustration subsequently gets the better of them.

It's pretty awful to have to be around.


To the other comment beneath this, I would have nothing to offer law enforcement currently and yes I know, I would get laughed out the door, which is why I said I'd have to wait until he did something more explicit/obscene, which I don't really want the perv to do, frankly.

That's why it's such an awkward situation, and creepy.

So really all I can do is avoid the dude, wait for him to cross the line with something sufficient to report him on, or have a repeat of the situation where he makes uncomfortable moves without crossing the line and I respond with anger (hopefully not violence but, if he didn't come to his senses and quickly get out of my space like he did last time, violence was going to happen).

In fact it was exclusively his sense that I was prepared to engage him violently that caused him to smarten up and scram most recently.

TBH I think you are far too extreme in your responses and thinking - particularly for someone who has lived and shared a household with gay men. This guy waves to you on the street and has put his hand in a pally way on your shoulder in the street - none of this justifies your extreme conclusions or proposed outcomes. If you attacked this man or tried to destroy him through his work you would more likely find yourself in prison or up on a hate crime or defamation charge.

southstar

JustAThought wrote: »

TBH I think you are far too extreme in your responses and thinking - particularly for someone who has lived and shared a household with gay men. This guy waves to you on the street and has put his hand in a pally way on your shoulder in the street - none of this justifies your extreme conclusions or proposed outcomes. If you attacked this man or tried to destroy him through his work you would more likely find yourself in prison or up on a hate crime or defamation charge.

I agree...something doesn't add up here....not sure what exactly..he comes across this guy occasionally outside work/ on street..can't he just ignore him/brush him off/tell him to piss off if necessary... he's not a gogo dancer in The George ffs...I was beginning to wonder.

440Hertz

I think you’ve been offered pretty solid advice to just ignore him. If you’re not interested in someone, you’re not interested in them and if they don’t get the message, that’s their problem not yours.

What I’m not understanding is that you don’t work with him, you don’t share a house or any other context which would force you to interact with him, so the obvious solution to this is just walk away from it.

I get that there are obnoxious people out there. I’ve certainly encountered my fair share, but you have repeatedly used the term “deviant” in reference to this guy. It’s a very loaded word and tends to utterly reek of homophobia in that context and you’re talking about violent reactions to someone who, from what you’ve said here, has basically been a bit of a pest, but nothing more serious.

You should be direct with him and explain that you’re not gay and not interested, but I just think you should also look at this in pretty much the same way as you would if an annoying woman you’d no interest in were pushing her luck a bit too far with you.

Unless there’s some significant lines being crossed, like actual stalking, sexual harassment or assault, it is what it is - unwanted flirting and the solution to that is to be firm about your lack of interest and walk away.

Also where someone is giving you unwanted attention, it’s always best to simply withdraw from interaction with them. That is the first and most effective thing you can do.

Macu17ab

Sardonicat wrote: »

Absolutely. This guy is a creep, pure and simple. He already knows OP isn't interested. Stop being polite OP. 'Don't touch me! I dont want to talk to you. Fuk off!' Same as I (female) would do if a guy was creeping on me.You've been polite, you've dropped the hints. He knows his actions are unwanted and he's doing it in purpose. Call him out.

Bit of a reach coming to that conclusion after he “dropped the hints” - men typically are more direct with these things, and should be.

I’m 90% certain this could be sorted with a chat which you initiate pro-actively so as to avoid an emotional response after he has over-stepped.

Tell him exactly how you feel, and if he oversteps in a physical way, then a relative physical response from you would be warranted i.e a push as a response to him “caressing” your shoulder as opposed to giving him a Batista bomb.

Also, i’m not sure what you are assuming about his capabilities to respond to your desires to act violently, as you seem quite confident when talking about it - but you may want to consider that he could put you on your back(open to interpretation) if you were to escalate things.

Violence is rarely appropriate these days.

Hannibal_Smith

Mod Note

OP you've been given excellent advice here if you wish to try resolve your situation. I don't think there is much more that posters can say, other than either speak to the person involved, or avoid them. Violence is not a solution.

I'm going to close the thread there.

Thanks to all who offered help and advice.

HS