Wife speaking her native language to our kids and I feel alienated

LegacyUser

Hello Good People,

I know I should be speaking with my Wife about these things rather than posting about it online but I needed to get my thoughts down on paper first and perhaps get some advice and perspective, which would be greatly appriciated.

My ( late twenties ) wife ( early twenties ) of 3 years and I have two girls together, a 3 year old and a newborn. I am Irish, she is from eastern Europe.

It was a whirlwind romance. Married after barely two years, first kid after 3 and now another. I have always wanted a Family and couldn't be happier on that front, becoming and being a Husband and Father is the best thing to every happen to me.

Naturally I always understood that my Wife's native language is not English. However, she has lived here a lof of her life so is completely fluent in English. Her family live here too. She always speaks her native language around them though as they still struggle with it.

My issue ? ( I hate using the word issue ); She speaks her native language to both our kids constantly. Not just a little bit, it's the entire time. I feel alienated and an outsider as a Parent when she does this. I have no idea what shes saying or what they are saying back. In principle and back in the early days I was thinking this would be great, my kids learning two languages natively growing up. They are like sponges at this age. Fast forward 3 years and my Daughter answers me in her Mothers native language even if I speak in English to her. I have made every effort to learn the language and can understand some sentences and most words but it's not an easy language to learn. I have been as opened minded and patient as possible. Put myself in her shoes. Understanding she wants to maintain her heritage with our kids, I am totally ok with that but I had hoped we'd take a hybrid approach. 50/50. That's not the case.

I talk to my kids in English all of the time. I read them Bed time stories, she reads them stories in her language. They call out for the books in my wifes language more than they do with English which then means she's reading to them more.

I just feel a little lost and not entirely included in the parenting of my girls.

I have brought it up a few times, she says she'll try speak English more but it never lasts. I have not brought it up too often because I honestly feel like an ass.

Advice welcomed, thank you

Loveinapril

To be honest, I would probably let this one go. Most bi- lingual families I know have each parent speak their own native language with the kids,my brother's family included. I think it might be the best way to teach them. You live in Ireland so your childrens' whole lives will be through English soon (school, friends, hobbies and clubs etc.). This is the most they will ever hear their mother's language so why not have them learn when they are learning language in general?!

Dav010

Consider if you lived in Eastern Europe, wouldn’t you want to teach your kids how to speak English even if your wife didn’t speak it?

Ranjo

It's a great thing to grow up native tongue of two languages. I suggest that you get on board and learn the language, it is part of your family. You don't need to get fluent but enough to not feel alienated.

As the kids get older they will change to speaking mostly English as they spend more time with other kids.

Tom Mann Centuria

Do bring it up again, I think if you say what you've said here, to your wife, there nothing arsey about it.

screamer

My dad is not Irish, but fluent in English too. He never taught us his language, the only time we’d hear it was when he was on the phone to his family, and we equally felt alienated, so I know how you feel.
Looking back as an adult now I can see though, my dad was correct, he told us as kids you’ll never live there, the language will be of no use to you all and better to know your own languages well. ( my dad is from very far away and a little used language these days).
I know exactly the alienation you feel and speak about and I wouldn’t let it go, it’s not right to feel excluded in your own family. I’d let your wife know how it makes you feel, and see if you can have some rules around when which language is spoken, as in if you’re all there, English, if she’s there with the kids herself work away in polish. However, if it’s that strongly a thing for your wife, maybe you need to learn a cupla focail of your wife’s language too, as a compromise.

Alun

I used to work in a European institution in Germany where we had staff from all over Europe working, and many of those were couples from different countries. So you'd have, for example, an English / French couple with kids attending a school in Germany. The advice from everyone was always to be consistent with language use, and for each parent to communicate with the children in their own native language. Children are very versatile and quick to learn at that age and can grow up bilingual or even trilingual without actually realising it. If you're not consistent, and switch languages, it can cause confusion, and problems down the line.

Mrs OBumble

Why haven't you learned at least the basics of her language, so that you can communicate with her family?

dvdman1

Im in a very similar situation, my wife speaks her native tongue all the time to my kids...

What I've done, is set myself up as the advanced english language tutor.
Yes my wife speaks great english but she doesnt have the full articulation daddy the native speaker has haha
I teach the long articulate language to my kids, ill deliberately use interesting and rare descriptive words. My kids love this as they speak them back to mammy and she becomes lost.

TheBlackPill

Same situation my house. Perfectly.cool with it. Only.problem is the wife's home culture is a cultural wasteland. The kids will not be using their second language to read great works of literature, but the second language greatly increases their options. >50 million speakers and no westerners(count on two hands)speak the language

Tombo2001

My brothers wife did same, but kids never ended up learning the language...

I can see why she is doing it. It is a sensitive issue, handle with care.

irelandrover

Does your wife stay at home and mind the children? Or are they in daycare?

We are in the same situation. We live abroad and my wife speaks the local language. I only speak English. We have a rule that when the three of us are together we speak English. My child still speaks far more Dutch as that's what she hears in daycare. If we go on holiday its all English and then English becomes her first language.

I think once your child starts school her English will become her main language. I think it would br unreasonable that you don't want your wife speaking her language with the children but a rule that when ye are altogether that ye speak English is fair enough.

Gruffalux

The best thing is for you to go all out and learn the language even if it is difficult. You are in your 20s and still at a good plastic stage for learning. I try to learn new languages sometimes, most recently Danish, but it doesn't help that remembering why I came into a room can sometimes be a challenge these days! Less of the procrastination - learn the language.

Tombo2001

TheBlackPill wrote: »

Same situation my house. Perfectly.cool with it. Only.problem is the wife's home culture is a cultural wasteland. The kids will not be using their second language to read great works of literature, but the second language greatly increases their options. >50 million speakers and no westerners(count on two hands)speak the language

She's a geordie?

TheBlackPill

Fortunately not. Filipina. Great people but their country has been historically treated badly and exploited.. ie islamic rule, then 400 year of spanish colonialism, then 4 years of Japanese savagery, and lately a client state of the yanks. Think of irish culture post famine and before the Gaelic revival

Treppen

On a tangent. But your daughter's will have an easy H1 if they take the language in the leaving cert.

Yellow pack crisps

A speech language expert will always tell you that one parent should speak their native language to their as children as should the other, less confusing for the child, the kids mature and once they start school etc they morph back in to the language of the country they are living in with the added benefit of maintaining a second language. This is a brilliant thing when they are in education doing exams etc. Guaranteed A as they can take their second language as a subject, also it’s a well known fact that once you have a second language it’s easier to learn a third etc. Honestly OP I’d leave it as it’s beneficial to your kids. That’s a sacrifice we sometimes are told about when having kids. If your relationship with your wife is good otherwise then you have no real reason to stop it, it will be worth it when you have bilingual kids.

osarusan

My perspective as an Irish father married to a Japanese woman who has lived in both countries. We went through the same issues to some extent, although it wasn't contentious like yours seems to be.

Firstly, as long as you are in Ireland then once they go to school, English will take over completely, no matter what your wife does.



I'd leave it to be honest, for a couple for reasons. Firstly, there are real cognitive benefits to bilingualism in infancy, not only in terms of ability to learn even more languages, but also, it activates more regions of the brain and increases general cognitive reserve, and it's even speculated that it can delay the effects of conditions like dementia.

Secondly, it's completely reasonable for her to want them to learn her native language, to be able to communicate with your wife's family, to be more comfortable on trips to her home country, and so on.

Keep doing what you are doing, read and talk to them as much as possible, they are soaking it all up even if they are more comfortable in her native language at the moment. As long as you stay in Ireland, their development as native speakers of english is a certainty. In a few years the issue will by trying to maintain their proficiency in their mother's native language, and all the time put in now (even if you feel excluded in a way) will show its value then.

There is a theory in France that certain dialects didn't die out because the mothers in those areas speak to their children in the language they were spoken to as a child. Not sure how true that is but it makes sense. Personally think you have the capacity to learn the language if this is a real issue for you, it's not like the kids can have a very advanced knowledge of it yet. Surely you can manage to learn enough to read a few kids books?

The real challenge will be when you get the kids into the local gaelscoil, then you can have your revenge.... (joking-ish).

Idle Passerby

I don't think it's fair to ask a mother not to speak her native tongue to her children, especially when they are so young. Like others have said, English will become their main language once they start school.

You say you've tried to learn it yourself, your eldest is only 3. I'm sure you could become fluent enough to carry a conversation with a 3 year old without too much difficulty.

JPup

My opinion is that you should not ask your wife to speak her native language less often around the kids. That is unreasonable and would be bad for her and the children and would it really even be better for you? You need to spin your thinking on this around 180 degrees and try to see the positives. As others have said, it's great for the kids to be learning a second language so young. It expands their mind and will make it much easier for them to connect with your wife's family and culture as they get older.

From your point of view there is one very obvious solution staring you in the face. Learn the language! You don't want to be the dummy in the room at family weddings in years to come with everyone else speaking a language that you don't understand. Not trying to be harsh but there's no reason at all you can't pick up at least a good level of comprehension if you try. It'll be good for you too. When you hit a certain age, it's all too easy for us to close our minds to new ideas so pushing your brain in this way would be beneficial for you more generally. Sign up for an online course, download the duolingo app and ask your wife to help you to read some of the kiddie books you have around the house. Once covid has passed, try to take an hour's lesson once a week with a native speaker who isn't your wife. You'll pick it up in no time.

Your wife is absolutely correct. The kids will benefit from this approach and will not only bilingual but will probable master additional languages easier.

Instead of feeling left out, try learning some or make it inclusive.

My wife speaks Spanish to the kids. Despite years of trying, I'm still useless beyond the basics. Guess who translates for me? My 6 and 8 year olds. They jump from one to the other, feel great doing something others struggle with and love being so helpful to their thick father when he ventures out alone.

Of course I survive without them, I'm not that bad but it's a nice experience with my kids who I only see sparingly.

Atlantic Dawn

Your wife has the correct approach, I think it's great, why haven't you picked it up? I've 2 friends with kids married to foreign women and both are at a good level of fluency in that language now too, they love having the language when interacting with the wife's family back in their country.

Atlantic Dawn

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Your wife has the correct approach, I think it's great, why haven't you picked it up? I've 2 friends with kids married to foreign women and both are at a good level of fluency in that language now too, they love having the language when interacting with the wife's family back in their country.

People always say this but languages are a skill like all others. I can't speak any other language but have tried many because as you say, it's a great ability to have. I spent 3 years in Spain, attended classes and still can't get it. I'm excellent at other things though.

Emme

OP have you learnt any of your wife's language? She is right to raise your children bilingual. They will not be a the disadvantage most Irish children are when it comes to learning languages later in life. They will find it easier to pick up other languages now they are bilingual.

My advice: let your wife continue with the children as she is and learn some of her language yourself.

Xterminator

Hi Op

I think it is great for the kids if your wife speaks her native language and they are raised bi-lingual. I wont bther quoting sources but suffice it to say it is good for their cognitive development.

It is good for your wife to feel that connection to her home and culture and share that bond with your children. That it is as it should be.

the only downside is how it affects you and how it makes you feel. I think you need to change your mindset. I would advise you start a language course to pick up the language conversationally then you won't be as excluded.

I would point out your wife speaks both languages, and i presume she would like to visit her home at some stage? The whole family would benefit from your participating in this part of your children's life, and not just sitting passively on the sidelines looking in and feeling left out.

strandroad

You are excluding yourself by not learning your family's language - your thinking is that it is your wife's language, but it is and will remain your childrens' language too. They all speak it and you should learn it. How come don't you have enough to understand simple repetitive child friendly dialogue yet?

It is recommended practice for each native speaker parent to communicate with children in their native tongue, your wife is not doing anything unusual at all!

Sardonicat

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Why haven't you learned at least the basics of her language, so that you can communicate with her family?

He has

Thelonious Monk

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Your wife has the correct approach, I think it's great, why haven't you picked it up? I've 2 friends with kids married to foreign women and both are at a good level of fluency in that language now too, they love having the language when interacting with the wife's family back in their country.

We don't know the language, if it's Spanish or French or something I would expect someone to try at least but Asian languages, well I've never met any westerner who can speak any Asian language, far easier said than done.
Anyway my brother's kid is Colombian and the ma speaks Spanish and he speaks English and Spanish and it doesn't seem to cause any issues.
I don't really get why you have a problem with the whole thing OP, it's good for the kids brain to learn 2 languages at an early age.

Emme

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

We don't know the language, if it's Spanish or French or something I would expect someone to try at least but Asian languages, well I've never met any westerner who can speak any Asian language.
Anyway my brother's kid is Colombian and the ma speaks Spanish and he speaks English and Spanish and it doesn't seem to cause any issues.
I don't really get why you have a problem with the whole thing OP, it's good for the kids brain to learn 2 languages at an early age.

I think his wife is Polish. That is a difficult language so it's best the children learn it as early as possible.

cannotlogin

School is likely to takeover in the long run & English will become the main language.

If your wife can teach them so easily, why can't she teach you too. Aim to become fluent in her language too, learn at that same page as the kids if it seems overwhelming to learn faster.