Argos can't see fault in tv

SureYWouldntYa

Bought a tv in Argos a couple weeks ago, only last week when watching football did i notice a problem with the tv, when anyone hits the ball its like lag with the ball or a bit of motion blur, very annoying and very hard to watch football with, I've also noticed it with anything fast moving on screen

Thought Argos would be happy to give a refund once I explained the issue, but they asked to hold it for the evening to see the issue themselves. Got a call earlier from manager saying she couldn't see anything wrong, asked if i could come in and show her the issue, I did and despite pointing out the issue to them it was hard to see what the problem was so couldn't approve a refund, they asked to hold on to it longer and perhaps bring the issue to the manufacturer

I don't think they'll see the issue even with the extra time, while its the sort of thing you'll clearly see when sitting down to watch the game, setting it up in the corner of a storeroom isn't the same

What might my options be with this? Do I have any recourse if they can't see the issue but I definitely can

L1011

What brand of TV is it?

SureYWouldntYa

Hitachi. Not the best brand obviously

theteal

Any motion settings to be played with?

SureYWouldntYa

theteal wrote: »

Any motion settings to be played with?

Tried all the changes from many a google and youtube searched, never helped

Gatling

It's likely not a fault just a budget TV ,
Also your tv service provider could also be part of the problem especially sky who have ****e standard on their package ,

L1011

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

Hitachi. Not the best brand obviously

Hitachi TVs are not made by Hitachi - they're Turkish junk.

Design 'feature' then. Cheap TV = motion blur.

I'd also look for any pixel processing features, if any, and turn them all off. Cheap junk processing is worse than none.


There is no way to make the zombie brands problem go away, but the amount of consumers who see a "proper" brand and assume they're getting a suitable product from it is huge. Sharp, Grundig, Toshiba etc are all ruined for consumer electronics.

SureYWouldntYa

Gatling wrote: »

It's likely not a fault just a budget TV ,
Also your tv service provider could also be part of the problem especially sky who have ****e standard on their package ,

It's annoying cause I also have a Bush that was cheaper again but no such problem

I'd mainly use IPTV through an android box, was hoping it was a bad stream but I've also tried watching football on the apps on the tv and a PS4 and its the same no matter the source

L1011 wrote: »

Hitachi TVs are not made by Hitachi - they're Turkish junk.

Design 'feature' then. Cheap TV = motion blur.

I'd also look for any pixel processing features, if any, and turn them all off. Cheap junk processing is worse than none.

There is no way to make the zombie brands problem go away, but the amount of consumers who see a "proper" brand and assume they're getting a suitable product from it is huge. Sharp, Grundig, Toshiba etc are all ruined for consumer electronics.

Didn't know that, I wouldn't keep up to date on details of all tv brands, I know LG, Samsung and Sony would be near the top end

I'll stay away from the zombie brands so when I' getting a new one, there's no way I'm keeping this tv, if Argos don't take it I'll get rid on Adverts for hopefully a small loss

JohnC.

The Turkish company, Vestel, have even made lower end TVs for the big brands. I think LG, Samsung and Sony haven't used them though.

Xterminator

If you are sure its faulty you can pay for an independent engineers report to get proof, and backu your assertion.

If you have bought a cheap/crap tv, and its working as designed, then it is essentially a change of mind situation, where you dont have rights legal rights.

However there is still store policy

If you bought it online you had 14 days under distance selling regulations - you could have sent it back.

Argos have a change of mind policy, but some products are exempted so you will have to check with them about

"AFTERSALES, RETURNS, REFUNDS & EXCHANGES
Changed your mind? Don't worry. Our hassle-free returns guarantee means quick and easy returns within 30 days. "

If its more than 30 days - then either you prove its faulty or you try to win them over wiht your best smile. Ask them really nicely and tell them your their best customer but the tv is just not as good as you hoped and see if you can get them to provide you with an exchange as a gesture of goodwill.

lomb

Philips TVs aren't made by Vestel and are reasonably priced with good processing. Vestel are terrible on motion picture rendition

antix80

Op, you can't call it a fault. It's just a compromise from buying cheap. It's probably fine for cartoons or soaps.

If you were sold a tv not fit for purpose you'd have a case but picking a tv off the shelf and hoping it meets your needs isn't the same thing.

If the tv was on display in the shop showing perfect motion for football and you bought the same tv and it didn't have the same quality you'd be entitled to return it

Or if a shop made claims like the tv was 4k and it was only HD.

I'd suggest connecting a laptop via hd and get high definition footage of a match and see how it looks (to rule out problems with the device that you're currently using)

antix80

lomb wrote: »

Philips TVs aren't made by Vestel and are reasonably priced with good processing. Vestel are terrible on motion picture rendition

I bought a budget Philips 32 inch for the bedroom and immediately was disappointed by the sound and screen brightness/contrast. That's the problem when you're spolied from watching a 50.inch Samsung.
Need to manage expectations

Sleeper12

Argus are famous. For taking items back without any fuss. It's one of the main reasons why people use them.

Maybe technology has changed but I seem to remember that the refresh rate (I think) can cause the issue you described. If memory serves anything with a refresh rate below 100 can cause the issue. If your TV has a low refresh rate & is advertised as low then you won't have much come back.

Someone will come along and tell me I have the terminology I used is all wrong and maybe all modern tvs have a higher refresh rate.

If there wasn't any difference in the quality of the 350 euro tv & the 3500 euro tv then we'd all buy the cheaper one. I wonder if its just to be expected on cheaper models?

Sleeper12

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Argus are famous. For taking items back without any fuss. It's one of the main reasons why people use them.

Maybe technology has changed but I seem to remember that the refresh rate (I think) can cause the issue you described. If memory serves anything with a refresh rate below 100 can cause the issue. If your TV has a low refresh rate & is advertised as low then you won't have much come back.

Someone will come along and tell me I have the terminology I used is all wrong and maybe all modern tvs have a higher refresh rate.

If there wasn't any difference in the quality of the 350 euro tv & the 3500 euro tv then we'd all buy the cheaper one. I wonder if its just to be expected on cheaper models?

Totally agree, within same brand, higher spec models have better picture quality. I have a few Samsung’s, definite picture difference between higher spec models and lowers. But then the lower specs were a lot cheaper.

Sarn

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Argus are famous. For taking items back without any fuss. It's one of the main reasons why people use them.

From my experience, once the item is within warranty. Otherwise you’ll have to get a report on what the issue is. I gave up trying to get one for a faulty microwave, that stopped working after 13 months (half of which was in storage).

Cork_Guest

Have you tried throwing the sales of goods act at them? Sounds as though it is not ‘fit for normal purpose’ so at minimum I’d be asking for a replacement.

Gooey Looey

What source is your football?

runawaybishop

Cork_Guest wrote: »

Have you tried throwing the sales of goods act at them? Sounds as though it is not ‘fit for normal purpose’ so at minimum I’d be asking for a replacement.

Motion blur on cheaper TVs doesn't mean they aren't fit for purpose.

Cork_Guest

runawaybishop wrote: »

Motion blur on cheaper TVs doesn't mean they aren't fit for purpose.

The OPs purpose of the TV is to watch soccer, to which the atV can’t cope with the speed, so not fit for the OPs purpose. Argos should therefore offer to replace the unit for a better one at additional cost or refund the payment.

Or are you just saying tough luck and your hard earned money’s gone, suck it up?

runawaybishop

Cork_Guest wrote: »

The OPs purpose of the TV is to watch soccer, to which the atV can’t cope with the speed, so not fit for the OPs purpose. Argos should therefore offer to replace the unit for a better one at additional cost or refund the payment.

Or are you just saying tough luck and your hard earned money’s gone, suck it up?

It is fit for purpose, the fact that the op selected a TV that doesn't suit his purpose doesn't change that.

antix80

Cork_Guest wrote: »

The OPs purpose of the TV is to watch soccer, to which the atV can’t cope with the speed, so not fit for the OPs purpose. Argos should therefore offer to replace the unit for a better one at additional cost or refund the payment.

Or are you just saying tough luck and your hard earned money’s gone, suck it up?

He can still watch football. Just from the ground rather than the stand.

Cork_Guest

runawaybishop wrote: »

It is fit for purpose, the fact that the op selected a TV that doesn't suit his purpose doesn't change that.

You’ve literally proved my point. The op selected a tv that doesn’t suit his purpose, therefore not fit for purpose. You must work for a retailer with that attitude, which seems to me is, the consumer can get shafted.

Cork_Guest

Cork_Guest wrote: »

The OPs purpose of the TV is to watch soccer, to which the atV can’t cope with the speed, so not fit for the OPs purpose. Argos should therefore offer to replace the unit for a better one at additional cost or refund the payment.

Or are you just saying tough luck and your hard earned money’s gone, suck it up?

Perfect for watching chess though.

duffman13

Cork_Guest wrote: »

You’ve literally proved my point. The op selected a tv that doesn’t suit his purpose, therefore not fit for purpose. You must work for a retailer with that attitude, which seems to me is, the consumer can get shafted.

You've literally proved the other posters point. The OP selected the TV that doesn't suit his purpose. That is not the retailers fault. Argos are usually excellent for returns

Cork_Guest

Cork_Guest wrote: »

You’ve literally proved my point. The op selected a tv that doesn’t suit his purpose, therefore not fit for purpose. You must work for a retailer with that attitude, which seems to me is, the consumer can get shafted.

Suit his purpose, and not fit for purpose are two different things. Not much point in buying a 1.1L car if you want to compete with 6L ones in a drag race.

antodeco

The purpose of the TV is to display a screen. If it's not a high enough quality as advertised, than yes, but this needs to be shown.

Also, it can't be based upon an individual's requirement for it to be fit for purpose. I'd love my TV to change everyone's face in anything I watch, to mine, but it doesn't. Am I entitled to a refund? *And before you accuse me, no I don't work in retail, I don't work in electronics or anything to do with manufacturers

Sleeper12

Cork_Guest wrote:

The OPs purpose of the TV is to watch soccer, to which the atV can’t cope with the speed, so not fit for the OPs purpose. Argos should therefore offer to replace the unit for a better one at additional cost or refund the payment.

This is stretching consumer law way beyond reality.

If OP wanted to watch football without blur then he should buy one with specs that cover fast moving objects. Maybe he did. I don't know. I can't buy a hatchback & my purpose is to go off roading and claim it not fit for purpose because it won't go off road without getting stuck in the mud. It's not what his purpose is. It's whatever the tv is designed for

gabe1977

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

It's annoying cause I also have a Bush that was cheaper again but no such problem

I'd mainly use IPTV through an android box, was hoping it was a bad stream but I've also tried watching football on the apps on the tv and a PS4 and its the same no matter the source

Am i right in assuming your just using different devices to play the stream but the stream is the same source.
I have the same issues on my TV when playing IPTV streams but if I watch through sky there are no such issues.
I would try the tv connected to a sky box or aerial and see what the motion blur is like then. I'd hazard a guess that it wouldn't be an issue then.

Cork_Guest

Surprised there’s so many saying tis the OPs fault....and we wonder why we’re ripped off so much in the country.

joeysoap

L1011 wrote: »

Hitachi TVs are not made by Hitachi - they're Turkish junk.

Design 'feature' then. Cheap TV = motion blur.

I'd also look for any pixel processing features, if any, and turn them all off. Cheap junk processing is worse than none.


There is no way to make the zombie brands problem go away, but the amount of consumers who see a "proper" brand and assume they're getting a suitable product from it is huge. Sharp, Grundig, Toshiba etc are all ruined for consumer electronics.

+1

A good few years ago I visited Waters electrical ( Culloville) looking for a tv. Was shown a few models when I mentioned that my current tv ( Ferguson) was over 20 years and showing no signs of packing up, the salesman asked me how much I paid for it. And I said about 400 pounds and he said ‘ that’s probably the equivalent of 1,000 pounds now, do you want to spend that kind of money? I fancied a Mitsubishi and he said Mitsubishi wasn’t made by Mitsubishi and was a rubbish tv.( that I would be putting on a skip in 5 years as it couldn’t be repaired economically ). I genuinely can’t remember what I bought but I voluntarily brought it to the recycling centre a few years ago and replaced it with a flat screen one. It was still working fine. But I do remember it weighed a ton

Cork_Guest

Cork_Guest wrote: »

Surprised there’s so many saying tis the OPs fault....and we wonder why we’re ripped off so much in the country.

That is assumed, if you want to watch fast sports, buy a TV with the spec that matches the picture quality you want.

Cork_Guest

Sleeper12 wrote: »

This is stretching consumer law way beyond reality.

If OP wanted to watch football without blur then he should buy one with specs that cover fast moving objects. Maybe he did. I don't know. I can't buy a hatchback & my purpose is to go off roading and claim it not fit for purpose because it won't go off road without getting stuck in the mud. It's not what his purpose is. It's whatever the tv is designed for

Minimum basic requirement of a TV is to be able carry out its function to a satisfactory level. Soccer isn’t a new thing, so if it cannot keep up with the kicking of a ball then it’s not fulfilling its basic function.

I’m not saying hitachi and Argos should be hailed in front of the courts and put to death, in just saying give her man a refund or replacement and be done with it.

kirving

An IPTV box is not a suitable test bed for a TV. It is subject to poor connection, compression, unknown image processing on both the transmission and recieving end.

I had last generation UPC box (not Horizon), can't remember the brand, but it completely destroyed picture quality of RTE 2 HD (watching football) - so much so that I used the TV's own SaorView tuner which did a perfect job.

Cork_Guest

Cork_Guest wrote: »

Minimum basic requirement of a TV is to be able carry out its function to a satisfactory level. Soccer isn’t a new thing, so if it cannot keep up with the kicking of a ball then it’s not fulfilling its basic function.

I’m not saying hitachi and Argos should be hailed in front of the courts and put to death, in just saying give her man a refund or replacement and be done with it.

It is fulfilling its basic function, just not to the ops expectation. That does not make it unfit for purpose.

Cork_Guest

Dav010 wrote: »

That is assumed, if you want to watch fast sports, buy a TV with the spec that matches the picture quality you want.

Yep! So Argos refund or replace and all is well. They don’t say, ah well sure the 6 o’clock news is grand so what’s yer problem! That’s BS. Maybe the OP made a mistake, maybe there’s a genuine fault, either way that’s why retailers have return policies and why there’s a sales of goods act in the first place.

Kevin Irving

Kevin Irving wrote: »

An IPTV box is not a suitable test bed for a TV. It is subject to poor connection, compression, unknown image processing on both the transmission and recieving end.

I had last generation UPC box (not Horizon), can't remember the brand, but it completely destroyed picture quality of RTE 2 HD (watching football) - so much so that I used the TV's own SaorView tuner which did a perfect job.

Same as that, have ****tv, quality is less than sky box.

Cork_Guest

Dav010 wrote: »

It is fulfilling its basic function, just not to the ops expectation. That does not make it unfit for purpose.

Please post the basic functionality specs for TVs that show what is required to watch soccer without stutter and blur. Thanks

Also, who DOESNT expect any TV to be able to show the programs it receives to a decent standard? That’s like saying that it’s grand my car doesn’t steer in a straight line all the time because it was cheap!

Cork_Guest

Cork_Guest wrote: »

Please post the basic functionality specs for TVs that show what is required to watch soccer without stutter and blur. Thanks

Also, who DOESNT expect any TV to be able to show the programs it receives to a decent standard? That’s like saying that it’s grand my car doesn’t steer in a straight line all the time because it was cheap!

Please show me where every TV must meet the purchasers expectations.

Your car should steer in a straight line, but it doesn’t have to go from 0 to 60 in 5 seconds.

Cork_Guest

Dav010 wrote: »

Please show me where every TV must meet the purchasers expectations.

Urgh. So you can’t and you embarrass yourself more with a question for a question. I’m not getting dragged down to your level.

If your expectations of standards of things are so low, then you’ve bigger problems.

Cork_Guest

Cork_Guest wrote: »

Urgh. So you can’t and you embarrass yourself more with a question for a question. I’m not getting dragged down to your level.

If your expectations of standards of things are so low, then you’ve bigger problems.

Before the op does anything else, he/she should try connecting TV to a sky box with a good HDMI cable, then see if quality is better than a steaming source.

My expectations are higher when I buy items with better specs.

kirving

Cork_Guest wrote: »

If your expectations of standards of things are so low, then you’ve bigger problems.

Lets be realistic, the IPTV is unlikely to be a Fire stick with NowTV and excellent WiFi and broadband.

Rubbish in = rubbish out.

At least get the basics right (high quality satellite with no processing on the box) and then we have a good baseline to compare.

Doesn't matter if you have a Ferrari or a Focus, if you put crap fuel in, it will perform worse.

0xzmro3n4y7lb5

Dav010 wrote: »

Please show me where every TV must meet the purchasers expectations.

Your car should steer in a straight line, but it doesn’t have to go from 0 to 60 in 5 seconds.

He didn't say expectation, he said you must be able to show the programmes it receives to a decent standard.

I think that's what most people expect. I don't think people think I have to get xyzy spec if i want to see a football in motion.

Everyone expects to see the football and not a blur move across the screen no matter what price a tv is because the basic function of a tv is to show you the moving picture.

Cork_Guest

Dav010 wrote: »

Before the op does anything else, he/she should try connecting TV to a sky box with a good HDMI cable, then see if quality is better than a steaming source.

My expectations are higher when I buy items with better specs.

The IPTV box was new information, but that isn’t my point. Consumers have rights which some including yourself seem at pains to put last, and in turn give more power by normality to the retailer.
All that does is disserve the rest of us. Cash is king and all being a sheep does is keep the consumer down and the retailer in a position where we can be ripped off through lack of competition and by people not standing up.

Cork_Guest

Kevin Irving wrote: »

Lets be realistic, the IPTV is unlikely to be a Fire stick with NowTV and excellent WiFi and broadband.

Rubbish in = rubbish out.

At least get the basics right (high quality satellite with no processing on the box) and then we have a good baseline to compare.

Doesn't matter if you have a Ferrari or a Focus, if you put crap fuel in, it will perform worse.

As I said. The IPTV was new information, but that isn’t what I’ve got an issue with.

We get ripped off in this country compared to others because we don’t have the population and therefore there aren’t retailers in competition giving us the lowest prices and the best deals and therefore the luxury of ‘ah you’re not happy, right well let’s see if we can get you a better TV for a little extra or if not here’s your money back because I need you as a return customer rather than go to my competitor’

Having the attitude that it’s the OPs fault and so he’s lost his money and stuck with it does all of us no favours!

Cork_Guest

Cork_Guest wrote: »

As I said. The IPTV was new information, but that isn’t what I’ve got an issue with.

We get ripped off in this country compared to others because we don’t have the population and therefore there aren’t retailers in competition giving us the lowest prices and the best deals and therefore the luxury of ‘ah you’re not happy, right well let’s see if we can get you a better TV for a little extra or if not here’s your money back because I need you as a return customer rather than go to my competitor’

Having the attitude that it’s the OPs fault and so he’s lost his money and stuck with it does all of us no favours!

I had IPTV, got rid of it, even though I have high spec Samsung TV and 150MB bb, the picture was crap and unreliable. As I said, plug a HDMI cable direct to sky box before you go shouting about consumer rights.

Incidentally, ****tv on firestick is much better, not as good as direct from sky box though.

Sleeper12

Cork_Guest wrote:

Minimum basic requirement of a TV is to be able carry out its function to a satisfactory level. Soccer isn’t a new thing, so if it cannot keep up with the kicking of a ball then it’s not fulfilling its basic function.

If you buy a budget pc it will be siht for gaming. Games have been out since the 70s /80s. Not being able to play games on doesn't make it fit for purpose. If fact some 4k tvs can't keep up with high end games. Again this doesn't mean that they aren't fit for purpose.

OP also says that it's hard to see that it's not preforming as well as he likes. He doesn't seem surprised that the shop doesn't see the fault. Read reviews on budget tvs and you will often read about motion blur on fast moving objects

Cork_Guest

Sleeper12 wrote: »

If you buy a budget pc it will be siht for gaming. Games have been out since the 70s /80s. Not being able to play games on doesn't make it fit for purpose. If fact some 4k tvs can't keep up with high end games. Again this doesn't mean that they aren't fit for purpose.

OP also says that it's hard to see that it's not preforming as well as he likes. He doesn't seem surprised that the shop doesn't see the fault. Read reviews on budget tvs and you will often read about motion blur on fast moving objects

A PCs primary function is not gaming, it isn’t even a secondary function, hence the fact that there are specific gaming consoles for gaming. Please point me towards these sport specific monitors, as they won’t be TVs at that point and I’ll be all over it, great for the rugby and I’m sure they’ll handle Netflix. Thanks.

Gooey Looey

Cork_Guest wrote: »

A PCs primary function is not gaming, it isn’t even a secondary function, hence the fact that there are specific gaming consoles for gaming. Please point me towards these sport specific monitors, as they won’t be TVs at that point and I’ll be all over it, great for the rugby and I’m sure they’ll handle Netflix. Thanks.

That depends on the PC, plenty build PCs just for gaming

SureYWouldntYa

Kevin Irving wrote: »

An IPTV box is not a suitable test bed for a TV. It is subject to poor connection, compression, unknown image processing on both the transmission and recieving.

I know an IPTV isnt the best source, which is why i tried looking at football on youtube for reference and i see the same thing. Iv used the android box on a Bush tv from Argos and there’s no such issue, its this tv thats the problem

It might be a cheap tv but im asking to watch football on it, its a basic thing surely. Im not looking for a refund because im getting 28 instead of 30 fps on the PS4

Argos said they’ll only automatically refund something if its unused, otherwise has to be a fault

Im not surprised they arent seeing the fault while testing it in store because they’re watching it for a few seconds in the back room, if it was a ‘more obvious’ fault like a black line that you’d see on anything I’m sure they’d have been fine

Cork_Guest

Gooey Looey wrote: »

That depends on the PC, plenty build PCs just for gaming

Yes they do. People pay huge amounts of money to build or buy gaming specific PCs, massive CPUs and CPUs, flash disk and ultra fast DIMMs.
They don’t just so they can watch YouTube and send a few emails. And any old PC with 8mb broadband at home will stream YouTube to a decent standard.

People buy TVs to watch any channel is receives from a broadcaster to a decent enough standard.