When to stop putting money into a car?

whippet

The clutch died on my 2011 Superb Estate yesterday.

It was the original clutch and has just done 380,000km so a good run. The master and slave cylinder along with flywheel need changing.

It also is due a new belt and water pump.

The car has practically no market value and is a second car in the household .. it’s there to transport dogs etc and as a general workhorse. It won’t do near as much mileage as it has done historically.

Over the years I’ve put very little money in to it apart from servicing ... 6 month ago I did some of the rubbers and new disks all round.

It is still a lovely car to drive ... if I give up on it I’ll need another estate to replace it with an have a budget of about €15k ... there isn’t a whole lot out there that tickles my fancy and at that budget you’d nearly need to have the guts of 2k budgeted for something going wrong.

So .. do I plough money in to a valueless car that I know the history of with a new clutch, belt etc or jump ship and spend 15k on a 5-6 year old unknown ......

I must say I’m leaning towards keeping it

kippy

whippet wrote: »

The clutch died on my 2011 Superb Estate yesterday.

It was the original clutch and has just done 380,000km so a good run. The master and slave cylinder along with flywheel need changing.

It also is due a new belt and water pump.

The car has practically no market value and is a second car in the household .. it’s there to transport dogs etc and as a general workhorse. It won’t do near as much mileage as it has done historically.

Over the years I’ve put very little money in to it apart from servicing ... 6 month ago I did some of the rubbers and new disks all round.

It is still a lovely car to drive ... if I give up on it I’ll need another estate to replace it with an have a budget of about €15k ... there isn’t a whole lot out there that tickles my fancy and at that budget you’d nearly need to have the guts of 2k budgeted for something going wrong.

So .. do I plough money in to a valueless car that I know the history of with a new clutch, belt etc or jump ship and spend 15k on a 5-6 year old unknown ......

I must say I’m leaning towards keeping it

At 9 years old, and knowing it's full history I would definitely be keeping it.
What cost are u looking at to fix and replace those parts? Couple of k max?
No brainer for me.

whippet

kippy wrote: »

At 9 years old, and knowing it's full history I would definitely be keeping it.
What cost are u looking at to fix and replace those parts? Couple of k max?
No brainer for me.

I’m looking at about €1700 all in .... I still love the car and it’s the complete opposite to our other car (G20 330e MSport Plus!!) ...

It is a no brainier I suppose just need reassurance !

Allinall

whippet wrote: »

The clutch died on my 2011 Superb Estate yesterday.

It was the original clutch and has just done 380,000km so a good run. The master and slave cylinder along with flywheel need changing.

It also is due a new belt and water pump.

The car has practically no market value and is a second car in the household .. it’s there to transport dogs etc and as a general workhorse. It won’t do near as much mileage as it has done historically.

Over the years I’ve put very little money in to it apart from servicing ... 6 month ago I did some of the rubbers and new disks all round.

It is still a lovely car to drive ... if I give up on it I’ll need another estate to replace it with an have a budget of about €15k ... there isn’t a whole lot out there that tickles my fancy and at that budget you’d nearly need to have the guts of 2k budgeted for something going wrong.

So .. do I plough money in to a valueless car that I know the history of with a new clutch, belt etc or jump ship and spend 15k on a 5-6 year old unknown ......

I must say I’m leaning towards keeping it

I would absolutely keep it.

In much the same situation myself, with a 14 year old car, whick I've had for 10 years.
My plan is to keep it, and allow for maybe €1.5k per year in maintenance.

If it looks like it's going to be more than that, I will get rid and spend ~€25k on another to keep for 10+ years.

The new car would cost me €2.5k in depreciation per year, plus routine maintenance only ( hopefully), so I'm putting off that additional cost for as long as possible.

Rows Grower

whippet wrote: »

The clutch died on my 2011 Superb Estate yesterday.

It was the original clutch and has just done 380,000km so a good run. The master and slave cylinder along with flywheel need changing.

It also is due a new belt and water pump.

The car has practically no market value and is a second car in the household .. it’s there to transport dogs etc and as a general workhorse. It won’t do near as much mileage as it has done historically.

Over the years I’ve put very little money in to it apart from servicing ... 6 month ago I did some of the rubbers and new disks all round.

It is still a lovely car to drive ... if I give up on it I’ll need another estate to replace it with an have a budget of about €15k ... there isn’t a whole lot out there that tickles my fancy and at that budget you’d nearly need to have the guts of 2k budgeted for something going wrong.

So .. do I plough money in to a valueless car that I know the history of with a new clutch, belt etc or jump ship and spend 15k on a 5-6 year old unknown ......

I must say I’m leaning towards keeping it

Better the devil you know.

Why spend 15 grand on something that will at best do the same job as something you need only spend an awful lot less on?

TheW1zard

whippet wrote: »

I’m looking at about €1700 all in .... I still love the car and it’s the complete opposite to our other car (G20 330e MSport Plus!!) ...

It is a no brainier I suppose just need reassurance !

Your willing to spend 15k but not 1.7k!?
Give your car some tlc! :-)

boombang

I would have thought that you'd get a decent second hand replacement Superb estate from the with much less mileage from the UK for 15k that will likely give plenty more years of worry free motoring.

That said, is a clutch not the sort of item that you would expect to have to replace after mega miles and therefore isn't necessarily the beginning of a series of crippling bills of knackered car?

kippy

whippet wrote: »

I’m looking at about €1700 all in .... I still love the car and it’s the complete opposite to our other car (G20 330e MSport Plus!!) ...

It is a no brainier I suppose just need reassurance !

It's a no brainer if you ask me.
Buy someone elses unknown problems or repair your own.
Again 9 years isn't that old. Granted a lot of mileage but it's a solid car.

whippet

boombang wrote: »

I would have thought that you'd get a decent second hand replacement Superb estate from the with much less mileage from the UK for 15k that will likely give plenty more years of worry free motoring.

That said, is a clutch not the sort of item that you would expect to have to replace after mega miles and therefore isn't necessarily the beginning of a series of crippling bills of knackered car?

I was only looking at Irish cars initially and hadn’t started look at Uk cars as yet. The other kicker is that if I were to buy I don’t want a diesel .. I’d want petrol .. and there are next to none of this vintage in petrol !

Looks like I’ll go for at least 500,000km and see what happens !!

whippet

TheW1zard wrote: »

Your willing to spend 15k but not 1.7k!?
Give your car some tlc! :-)

The car always got TLC !!! It has never let me down until yesterday !! Serviced on the button and never abused .. it still reruns about 60mpg (tracked on Fuelly) ..

TrailerBob

Keep it.. made the same decision here with a 09 Kuga last month, it's a known variable... Likewise could have bought something a few years newer, but pot luck really. It's a lower risk, and then if something does happen, you're likely to say, ah sure it owes me nothing, and replace it then.

twin_beacon

whippet wrote: »

I’m looking at about €1700 all in .... I still love the car and it’s the complete opposite to our other car (G20 330e MSport Plus!!) ...

It is a no brainier I suppose just need reassurance !

you are not going to get a replacement car that you the history of for €1700. I'd say get it fixed and keep it.

screamer

I wouldn’t keep it. My experience of older cars is that once they start giving trouble, they keep giving trouble and money pits. You’ll also see your insurance rise considerably as it goes over 10 years of age.

colm_mcm

screamer wrote: »

I wouldn’t keep it. My experience of older cars is that once they start giving trouble, they keep giving trouble and money pits. You’ll also see your insurance rise considerably as it goes over 10 years of age.

A timing belt reaching its interval isn’t a sign that the car is unravelling. A clutch going at 380k isn’t any indication on how bad the rest of the car is either.

Henry Ford III

You'll never stop putting money into a car.

screamer

colm_mcm wrote: »

A timing belt reaching its interval isn’t a sign that the car is unravelling. A clutch going at 380k isn’t any indication on how bad the rest of the car is either.

No, that’s true, but I find once they start then the next thing goes, then the next.... car parts have a lifespan and as it’s all made at the same time, it tends to start going at the same time. if you’re happy to keep putting money into it, fine go ahead. I’ve done it before and never again.

whippet

putting it in to perspective over the 380,000km what I have put in to this car outside of normal servicing is:

1x TB and Waterpump at interval
1x set of discs
3x set of pads
1x New bi-xenon bulb (surprising expensive)
1x brake light bulb
1x rear bumpstops
1x ABS sensor

In total all that work came in to about €2.5k

So putting €1.7k for a new TB & Waterpump and Clutch shows that over the years the car has been rock solid. I will trust this one more than I would picking up a 2013 520d estate or similar.

Miscreant

Do the work and keep it. Better the devil you know and all that jazz....


.

BrianD3

You can't have it all, everything is subject to (sometimes flawed) market forces and none of us can predict the future or the lifespan of a complex mechanical device like a car.

What I'm getting at is - if you want a similar car under full manufacturer warranty that will have none of those wear and tear issues, you're talking about 30+ grand on a new one, not 15 grand.

Now if you have only 15 grand to spend, you could get a brand new Dacia Logan MCV for that. It would be very much a downgrade on a Superb but it may be big enough for the dogs etc.

I have a Megane with over 500k kms on it that is family owned from new and am regularly weighing up my options. Recently I had a timing belt change and a new alternator and don't regret spending the money. For various reasons related to my personal life, I wasn't able to fart around with trying to get a used alternator or to use an indy garage so I brought it a main dealer for both jobs. The mechanic's eyes nearly popped out of his head when he saw the mileage - in Ireland, who changes a timing belt on a car with 500k, let alone bringing it to main dealer!

Mooooo

What mileage will you be putting on it and what type of driving?. If it's gonna be doing very low mileage I'd consider changing. It would prob develop more issues at low mileage than average use. If it'll be doing low miles change if not keep would be my opinion. Regular maintenance and average miles would prob keep it going fine

whippet

it will be average enough mileage but will not be short journeys .. the PHEV does all the short trips in our house now.

ice.cube

whippet wrote: »

The clutch died on my 2011 Superb Estate yesterday.

It was the original clutch and has just done 380,000km so a good run. The master and slave cylinder along with flywheel need changing.

It also is due a new belt and water pump.

The car has practically no market value and is a second car in the household .. it’s there to transport dogs etc and as a general workhorse. It won’t do near as much mileage as it has done historically.

Over the years I’ve put very little money in to it apart from servicing ... 6 month ago I did some of the rubbers and new disks all round.

It is still a lovely car to drive ... if I give up on it I’ll need another estate to replace it with an have a budget of about €15k ... there isn’t a whole lot out there that tickles my fancy and at that budget you’d nearly need to have the guts of 2k budgeted for something going wrong.

So .. do I plough money in to a valueless car that I know the history of with a new clutch, belt etc or jump ship and spend 15k on a 5-6 year old unknown ......

I must say I’m leaning towards keeping it

I would hold on to it too.

You said yourself that is is practically worthless as it stands. Would you take €1,700 for it after the works are completed? I would imagine you value it somewhat more then than considering how good of a car it has been to you. Something could go wrong with anything you buy once the warranty runs out.

If it wasn’t a second car, and somewhat of a workhorse I would probably be changing it.

BrianD3

BrianD3 wrote: »

Now if you have only 15 grand to spend, you could get a brand new Dacia Logan MCV for that. It would be very much a downgrade on a Superb but it may be big enough for the dogs etc.

Not a car snob but even the dogs would turn their nose up at a Dacia !

advertsfox

Definitely do the work, it's a bargain if you think about it esp. if its driving well. Treat it to a full valet and keep driving. You know it's history and for 380K being done, its not asked for anything else any other car would need. Post some pictures will you? I'm too curious now about how the inside / outside would look after this much use

Allinall

Deleted User wrote: »

Not a car snob but even the dogs would turn their nose up at a Dacia !

That's what they said about Skoda 15 years ago.

Fabio

advertsfox wrote: »

Definitely do the work, it's a bargain if you think about it esp. if its driving well. Treat it to a full valet and keep driving. You know it's history and for 380K being done, its not asked for anything else any other car would need. Post some pictures will you? I'm too curious now about how the inside / outside would look after this much use

The valet will actually make it feel new. Good idea!

whippet

Fabio wrote: »

The valet will actually make it feel new. Good idea!

it actually get valeted every 6 weeks or so !! so the interior is spotless - having a clean interior on an old car makes it feel new and comfortable


..the drivers seat has leather worn on the side as to be expected and the steering wheel has obvious wear on it ... and the driver's floor mat has a nice even hole in it for my right heel - as it it was made for it !!

The body isn't in great nick - plenty of little bangs and bruises but that doesn't bother me - as long a tyres are good, all bulbs work and doors open and close I don't car what it looks like !!

slave1

whippet wrote: »

The body isn't in great nick - plenty of little bangs and bruises but that doesn't bother me - as long a tyres are good, all bulbs work and doors open and close I don't car what it looks like !!

Keep her, can you imagine the annoyance of a ding on a new to you car in perfect body nick whereas a ding on your current baby is another piece of character

boombang

I know you might not be able to get to the North with the car as it is now, but does anybody know if there are big savings to be had from getting big work done there?

whippet

boombang wrote: »

I know you might not be able to get to the North with the car as it is now, but does anybody know if there are big savings to be had from getting big work done there?

The car is gone on a flat bed to where its been serviced since new - so i never even considered sending it anywhere else even though i'm only 45 mins from Belfast !!

I have no interest in saving a couple of hundred quid with someone I don't know - i've never been let down before by this garage so on a big job i'd like to leave it with them

Uncle Pierre

Mooooo wrote: »

If it's gonna be doing very low mileage I'd consider changing.

For what it's worth, I'd actually have the opposite view. If it was me and all I wanted was a reliable second car that would only be used occasionally and would sit on the driveway most of the time, I'd rather spend €1,700 on something I've had from new than take a €15,000 punt on something unknown.

OP, sounds like you've taken exceedingly and exemplary good care of that car so far, and this would strengthen my opinion that the right thing to do would be to keep it.

All cars cost money, new cars cost more than old ones, depreciation being the massive cost which a lot of People don't consider when buying a new car, it cost whatever you pay + depreciation + interest.

Old car will always cost much much less, depends on what you want. Save money ? keep it and do the required work.

380,000 Kms is 286,000 miles should easily go for another 160,000 kms. Once the engine is sound.

My advice would be get a compression test done to give a good indication of the condition of the engine and if it's good then keep it if your objective is to save money. If the compression test fails you could be looking at a lot more money to rebuild part of the engine, piston rings, valves and all that and that might require reconsideration, if the compression test fails I would not spend the monty on clutch and flywheel if you're not prepared to get the rest of the work done.

Allinall

Deleted User wrote: »

All cars cost money, new cars cost more than old ones, depreciation being the massive cost which a lot of People don't consider when buying a new car, it cost whatever you pay + depreciation + interest.
...............

.

Just on this.

It costs what you pay, or depreciation. Not both.

If you buy a car for €20k, and drive it until it's worthless, it has cost you one €20k, not two.

Allinall

Allinall wrote: »

Just on this.

It costs what you pay, or depreciation. Not both.

If you buy a car for €20k, and drive it until it's worthless, it has cost you one €20k, not two.

True, that's if you buy and drive until it's worthless a lot of People don't.

colm_mcm

Your equation still doesn’t add up though

Allinall

Deleted User wrote: »

True, that's if you buy and drive until it's worthless a lot of People don't.

It holds true even if you don't drive it into the ground.

Buy a car for €25k, sell it after 5 years for €10k.

Net spend on the car is €15k, which is also the depreciation cost.

There's only one €15k cost, though.

Could be thinking about PCP too much perhaps ? lol

Mad_Mike

No matter how little you think it's worth despite the mileage, you just want it to use as a second car
If you were to go out and try buy the same car as a second car and buying something TOTALLY unknown it will cost at least 6 grand, maybe 7

Consider it as buying a second car for €1,700, but a car that you know absolutely EVERY detail about
That has to be a bargain!

I would do the compression test first to see if it's worth spending that kind of money on it.

ExMachina1000

whippet wrote: »

The car always got TLC !!! It has never let me down until yesterday !! Serviced on the button and never abused .. it still reruns about 60mpg (tracked on Fuelly) ..

Sounds like it's well worth keeping. It didn't really let you down either when you think about it. It's just scheduled maintenance and worn out consumable parts. Its normal

whippet

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I would do the compression test first to see if it's worth spending that kind of money on it.

That horse has bolted ... I’ll have it back on Monday morning with a new clutch. What’s involved in doing a compression check ?

I track the economy on fuelly and it’s been consistent over the last 200,000km I’ve be tracking it so I’m sure the engine is somewhat in decent knick.

It’s the last big bill I’ll pay one it ... so let’s see how much noting €1700 gets me


I’ve promised myself if it lasts longer than my eldest dog (the only one who really needs a big low boot) .. it will be replaced with a Golf R or GTI !

whippet

whippet wrote: »

That horse has bolted ... I’ll have it back on Monday morning with a new clutch. What’s involved in doing a compression check ?

I track the economy on fuelly and it’s been consistent over the last 200,000km I’ve be tracking it so I’m sure the engine is somewhat in decent knick.

It’s the last big bill I’ll pay one it ... so let’s see how much noting €1700 gets me


I’ve promised myself if it lasts longer than my eldest dog (the only one who really needs a big low boot) .. it will be replaced with a Golf R or GTI !

Just googled quickly

https://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/how-to/a8520/cars-101-how-to-do-a-compression-test-14912158/

Ah hopefully you'll be grand once it was well maintained.

CoBo55

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I would do the compression test first to see if it's worth spending that kind of money on it.

If it's starting on the button hot or cold and doing 60+ mpg I'd doubt it's down on compression.

CoBo55

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Just googled quickly

https://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/how-to/a8520/cars-101-how-to-do-a-compression-test-14912158/

Ah hopefully you'll be grand once it was well maintained.

Completely useless guide, it bears no relationship to a diesel engine compression test. The pressures involved in a diesel are colossal there's no room for error or you can bugger things up royally.

whippet

CoBo55 wrote: »

If it's starting on the button hot or cold and doing 60+ mpg I'd doubt it's down on compression.

The only time it never turned over on first touch of the key was when I let the battery drain over Xmas a few years back .. ever closed the boot properly and it was sitting for 3 weeks.

It’s actually still on the original battery!

3d4life

whippet wrote: »

...It’s actually still on the original battery!

Who here would replace that battery before it fails ?


( If funds allowed I would - I hate it when things dont work )

creedp

Allinall wrote: »

I would absolutely keep it.

In much the same situation myself, with a 14 year old car, whick I've had for 10 years.
My plan is to keep it, and allow for maybe €1.5k per year in maintenance.

If it looks like it's going to be more than that, I will get rid and spend ~€25k on another to keep for 10+ years.

The new car would cost me €2.5k in depreciation per year, plus routine maintenance only ( hopefully), so I'm putting off that additional cost for as long as possible.

Same here with 12 yo smax with just under 300k km. Lots of work done over years - TB, front strut, DMF & clutch, starter motor, rear suspension brushing, new exhaust 2 calipers and discs / pads all round. Last year drove into flood and water entered engine but once cylinders were dried out it was ok although its runs a bit rough and is a bit smokey on start up but fine once it heats up. Have been looking at getting a 2016 version but would have to shell out approx €26k for one and debating if worth it. Do a 700km round trip fairly regularly and starting to think about reliability of car as it ages.

galwaytt

whippet wrote: »

That horse has bolted ... I’ll have it back on Monday morning with a new clutch. What’s involved in doing a compression check ?

I track the economy on fuelly and it’s been consistent over the last 200,000km I’ve be tracking it so I’m sure the engine is somewhat in decent knick.

It’s the last big bill I’ll pay one it ... so let’s see how much noting €1700 gets me


I’ve promised myself if it lasts longer than my eldest dog (the only one who really needs a big low boot) .. it will be replaced with a Golf R or GTI !

Look at it this way: if you bought a brand new one it'd cost you 500 a month.

So, if your 1700 gets you less than 4 months down the road you've lost nothing.

And as for buying a newer one in the UK ? The clutch on that could go tomorrow and you'd then be down 1700 AND the price of the car...


Keep your Superb. Revel in the fact its the cheapest car on the road

Iodine1

An awful lot of talk about buying in uk, as the answer to everything. They're used cars too and break down too. A local lad had a 2016, 6 months after buying he was looking for a new engine. There's always a risk. Your car is not unreliable, the jobs listed are to be expected. If only tipping around and it's a good car, I would certainly be keeping your car.

whippet

New clutch .. new belt .. washed ... valeted .... and delighted to have it back on the road.

Dogs got a run down the beach ... keeping this was the right decision .... unless ....

LFC Murphy

whippet wrote: »

New clutch .. new belt .. washed ... valeted .... and delighted to have it back on the road.

Dogs got a run down the beach ... keeping this was the right decision .... unless ....

How much?