Railway lines in USA - no fences?

Geuze

I see on US railways that there often aren't fences either side of the track.

Anybody could walk from the street or road onto the tracks.

Whereas here I see fences and wonder why?

Is it because:

(1) we have more livestock - I suspect this is the case.

(2) we have a different legal system, and so people would sue IE even if it's the people's fault to get injured

(3) trains go slower in the USA?

L1011

Railway lines in many other countries outside Ireland and the UK have no fences, including relatively fast lines.

Less compo / blame culture

Geuze

Yes, I took the train to Rothenburg in Bavaria, and can recall no fences between line and farmers fields.

No hedges, ditches, you could just walk from field to track.

GT89

L1011 wrote: »

Railway lines in many other countries outside Ireland and the UK have no fences, including relatively fast lines.

Less compo / blame culture

It this was discussed on an another thread here. Seems it's more to do with Victorian era laws to prevent livestock wandering onto the tracks rather to prevent people coming onto the track in the case of rural areas. Most European countries would have railway lines fenced off in built up urban areas.

https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057649763/18

L1011

Plenty of European cities where urban lines are barely if at all fenced. Helsinki comes to mind unless they retrofitted it

Victorian laws can be removed very easily

GT89

L1011 wrote: »

Plenty of European cities where urban lines are barely if at all fenced. Helsinki comes to mind unless they retrofitted it

Victorian laws can be removed very easily

I don't remember railway lines in Berlin, Paris or Rome being exactly easily acessible to the general public. Likely something that vafies from place to place.

Del.Monte

Won't somebody think of these people https://www.irishfencing.com/palisade-fencing/ who would surely go to the wall if it wasn't for CIE and their fetish for fencing.

whisky_galore

GT89 wrote: »

I don't remember railway lines in Berlin, Paris or Rome being exactly easily acessible to the general public. Likely something that vafies from place to place.

It doesn't stop the taggers and street "artists".

GT89

whisky_galore wrote: »

It doesn't stop the taggers and street "artists".

Nor around Connolly

Irish_peppa

I had noticed this too but had assumed it was simply to do with money resources and the tens of thousands of miles of rail and multiple crossings It would costs huge amounts to properly fence off and put in proper safe level crossings. Hmmm interesting

Deagol

I would think it might be because Irish farmers tend to gravitate more to keeping livestock that could wander into the line whereas I think tillage is more common in Europe mainland etc?

In the UK lots of line is fenced off because 3rd rail power supply is lethally dangerous. Overhead is much more common in Europe - in fact I don't think 3rd rail is used at all outside UK but open to be corrected on that.

whisky_galore

Deagol wrote: »

I would think it might be because Irish farmers tend to gravitate more to keeping livestock that could wander into the line whereas I think tillage is more common in Europe mainland etc?

In the UK lots of line is fenced off because 3rd rail power supply is lethally dangerous. Overhead is much more common in Europe - in fact I don't think 3rd rail is used at all outside UK but open to be corrected on that.

Lots of factory farming on Continental Europe.
You could travel hundreds of miles without seeing a single cow in a field.

As mentioned before, lines in the UK were fenced off historically long before 3rd rail.

GT89

Deagol wrote: »

In the UK lots of line is fenced off because 3rd rail power supply is lethally dangerous. Overhead is much more common in Europe - in fact I don't think 3rd rail is used at all outside UK but open to be corrected on that.

Third rail is only used in the South East of England on the commuter lines in and out of London. The rest of the UK is either Overhead wires or diesel only.

donvito99

Del.Monte wrote: »

Won't somebody think of these people https://www.irishfencing.com/palisade-fencing/ who would surely go to the wall if it wasn't for CIE and their fetish for fencing.

Yes, damn those CIE imbeciles and their obsession with making the railway more safe.

L1011

GT89 wrote: »

Third rail is only used in the South East of England on the commuter lines in and out of London. The rest of the UK is either Overhead wires or diesel only.

Plus Liverpool area on a few lines.

Markcheese

Could it have something to do with when the railway lines were built , ?
The railway companies agreed to fence off farmland when putting their line across it ?
Dunno about urban lines though ..

whisky_galore

donvito99 wrote: »

Yes, damn those CIE imbeciles and their obsession with making the railway more safe.

You can have a fence without an over the top ugly prison yard thing. This country is destroyed with palisade fencing and it does little to keep out anyone determined to get in.

Okon

GT89 wrote: »

Third rail is only used in the South East of England on the commuter lines in and out of London. The rest of the UK is either Overhead wires or diesel only.

As well as the main Merseyrail lines (already mentioned), the Isle of Wight also uses 3rd Rail DC... but it was of course part of the old Southern Region which did cover most of the South East of England, I only [pedantically] mention it as it doesn't go in/out of London.

tabbey

Railway companies were obliged by the legislation under which they were constructed, to maintain fencing for the safety of livestock.
Until recently, the Irish railway operator did so using fencing appropriate to the task. It was unobtrusive but effective.
Today railway fences in Ireland are often of the industrial palisade variety designed to keep out John Gilligan and his Ilk. They do not prevent people from walking into the track from platform ends, nor serve any useful purpose. They are a blot on the landscape. They prevent tourists from enjoying the scenery, encouraging them to travel by road instead. They are a waste of money which could be spent on something beneficial to the company and the passenger.

GT89

Okon wrote: »

As well as the main Merseyrail lines (already mentioned), the Isle of Wight also uses 3rd Rail DC... but it was of course part of the old Southern Region which did cover most of the South East of England, I only [pedantically] mention it as it doesn't go in/out of London.

Yes that's been a bit pedantic as that's more a light rail type operation. I know it's probably officially considered heavy rail but it is a very short stretch of line that's of little relevance to the UK National Rail network. Either way third rail is not exactly widespread in the UK it's like saying electrication is the norm in Ireland even though in reality only a small stretch of line is electrified here.

Working class heroes

Del.Monte wrote: »

Won't somebody think of these people https://www.irishfencing.com/palisade-fencing/ who would surely go to the wall if it wasn't for CIE and their fetish for fencing.

Can you verify/back up this claim please?

Working class heroes

tabbey wrote: »

Railway companies were obliged by the legislation under which they were constructed, to maintain fencing for the safety of livestock.
Until recently, the Irish railway operator did so using fencing appropriate to the task. It was unobtrusive but effective.
Today railway fences in Ireland are often of the industrial palisade variety designed to keep out John Gilligan and his Ilk. They do not prevent people from walking into the track from platform ends, nor serve any useful purpose. They are a blot on the landscape. They prevent tourists from enjoying the scenery, encouraging them to travel by road instead. They are a waste of money which could be spent on something beneficial to the company and the passenger.

Is this legislation still valid?

Limpy

Thank fexk, or we wouldn't of got the movie Stand by Me.

Irishphotodesk

Working class heroes wrote: »

Can you verify/back up this claim please?

It was a joke comment made by the poster.... It wasn't a claim that the company would actually go bust.

I and I'm guessing other posters could see this, and I believe it was obvious by the reference to the Simpsons style comment "won't somebody please think of the children...."

Working class heroes

Irishphotodesk wrote: »

It was a joke comment made by the poster.... It wasn't a claim that the company would actually go bust.

I and I'm guessing other posters could see this, and I believe it was obvious by the reference to the Simpsons style comment "won't somebody please think of the children...."

I’ll await his reply if you don’t mind. Thanks.

Markcheese

Working class heroes wrote: »

Is this legislation still valid?

Don't see why not .. the rails are still there ! ( Well ,some places)
A few years back Irish rail built a large overpass on the lower glanmire road in cork ,to serve a dozen or so houses , major construction ,had to build out into the river , why ? Because the houses predated the railway line , and when the line was built the company promised 2 permanently manned crossings . 2 guys , 3 shifts a day ,7 days a week ,you get the picture and can imagine the annual cost,
The residents were offered a crossing controlled from kent station ( nearby ) . nope
because it was all agreed in 18 whatever

Wildsurfer

Boundaries in Ireland have to be fenced as we graze animals outdoors whereas animals on the continent would be housed indoors due to the summer heat, and crops are grown and harvested to be fed to those animals. Why it has to be 6' high palisade fencing I'm not sure but is probably a safety issue as normal sheep or electric fencing would be less robust and would entail alot more ongoing maintenance.

whisky_galore

Wildsurfer wrote: »

Boundaries in Ireland have to be fenced as we graze animals outdoors whereas animals on the continent would be housed indoors due to the summer heat, and crops are grown and harvested to be fed to those animals. Why it has to be 6' high palisade fencing I'm not sure but is probably a safety issue as normal sheep or electric fencing would be less robust and would entail alot more ongoing maintenance.

Why it has to be palisade is because it's cheap and nasty.

irish_goat

There's no fence on the trainline going through Wexford town is there not?

MrMusician18

In parts of the US the liability for fencing often lies with the owner of the land that is trying to keep the animals out, rather than farmers to keep the animals in.

It may simply be that it is too expensive for rail companies to fence entire lines and that they just manage the risk in other ways.

silver2020

Here's this reason
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/tram-surfing-girl-who-suffered-brain-injury-defends-550000-settlement-37439597.html

Renegade fucwits and the legal profession will look for any angle to pull the golden slot machines of the court system here

Del.Monte

irish_goat wrote: »

There's no fence on the trainline going through Wexford town is there not?

Thanks for mentioning that - no doubt contractors will be engaged by CIE once they find forgotten Wexford on the network map.

Working class heroes

irish_goat wrote: »

There's no fence on the trainline going through Wexford town is there not?

That's correct.
I can recall an incident in which one person lost an arm and a leg surfing the train along the quay there. Allowing for the stupidity of this I'm sure this would not have happened if the proper fencing was in place, however, I'm sure there is some legal reason why there is none along these parts.

Working class heroes

silver2020 wrote: »

Here's this reason
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/tram-surfing-girl-who-suffered-brain-injury-defends-550000-settlement-37439597.html

Renegade fucwits and the legal profession will look for any angle to pull the golden slot machines of the court system here

Cant argue with that...

dowlingm

irish_goat wrote: »

There's no fence on the trainline going through Wexford town is there not?

isnt the speed limit on the quay something like 5mph because of that?

Del.Monte

dowlingm wrote: »

isnt the speed limit on the quay something like 5mph because of that?

True, the quay badly needs fencing which would allow 75mph running on a nice straight stretch. Realistically it doesn't matter as that part of the Rosslare line won't last much longer and a greenway won't need fencing.

whisky_galore

silver2020 wrote: »

Here's this reason
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/tram-surfing-girl-who-suffered-brain-injury-defends-550000-settlement-37439597.html

Renegade fucwits and the legal profession will look for any angle to pull the golden slot machines of the court system here

Should the Luas be fenced off now?

Jamie2k9

Isn't Wexford quay offically a tram line, hence no fencing.

Its not needed unless there is has been a lot of near misses reported by drivers.

True, the quay badly needs fencing which would allow 75mph running on a nice straight stretch. Realistically it doesn't matter as that part of the Rosslare line won't last much longer and a greenway won't need fencing.

I don't think the line allows above 70 currently, putting fencing along the quay will acheive nothing. 20-25mph max when you consider trains arriving/departing Wexford.

Del.Monte

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Isn't Wexford quay offically a tram line, hence no fencing.

Its not needed unless there is has been a lot of near misses reported by drivers.



I don't think the line allows above 70 currently, putting fencing along the quay will acheive nothing. 20-25mph max when you consider trains arriving/departing Wexford.

I was being sarcastic.

Zebra3

whisky_galore wrote: »

Should the Luas be fenced off now?

And roads!!! :pac:

Board Walker

We lived in a house in South Holland and our driveway was parallel with the line into Vlissingen. Double track, if a 2L bottle of 7up fell out of my hands it could end up on the track. Pre iPhone days so no photo