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Noam Chomsky of Ireland or Europe

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  • 17-08-2020 9:22am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 318 ✭✭howyegettinon1


    Ive been reading understanding power and listening to few of his talks. He does cover on affairs in europe but mostly concentrates on the states.
    I would like to get some names of people to listen to or read who have a similar views who cover Ireland and Europe
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  • Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 14,493 Mod ✭✭✭✭johnnyskeleton


    Ive been reading understanding power and listening to few of his talks. He does cover on affairs in europe but mostly concentrates on the states.
    I would like to get some names of people to listen to or read who have a similar views who cover Ireland and Europe

    As in someone who makes vague but impassioned speeches about how the elites are oppressing the masses, but without any clear examples, considering contra-arguments or offering solutions? Probably Fintan O'Toole


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    Fintan O'Toole is one of the elite.

    Gript and a handful of TDs are the only critical news and opinion site in this country. Rest all singing from same song sheet.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,351 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    What hymn sheet do Gript sing from?

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,382 ✭✭✭✭Arghus


    Hermy wrote: »
    What hymn sheet do Gript sing from?

    The mad right wing one.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    Arghus wrote: »
    The mad right wing one.


    Would only appear "mad right" to someone who is "mad left" ;)


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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,351 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    Would only appear "mad right" to someone who is "mad left" ;)

    You don't consider it mad right yourself?

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 315 ✭✭Akesh


    As in someone who makes vague but impassioned speeches about how the elites are oppressing the masses, but without any clear examples, considering contra-arguments or offering solutions? Probably Fintan O'Toole

    I have to agree. Nothing is easier than pointing out problems. Anyone who wants to know about Chomsky should read his paper on the Khmer Rouge. This is a man not interested by facts, but by pursuance of an ideology.

    A darling for Guardian and NYT writers/readers but he's nothing more than a man of half-truths.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    Hermy wrote: »
    You don't consider it mad right yourself?

    What is mad right about it?

    As for Chomsky.

    Anyone who supported the Khmer Rouge is in same box as Holocaust deniers.




  • The Khmer Rouge stuff has been explained, at great length, for several decades.

    Although, based on the few replies so far, I'm unsure if the respondents have read a solitary syllable of Chomsky.


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    The Khmer Rouge stuff has been explained, at great length, for several decades.

    Although, based on the few replies so far, I'm unsure if the respondents have read a solitary syllable of Chomsky.

    Unlike yourself most likely I have read his piece for the Atlantic in 1977 (?) in which he claimed that the CIA had invented the genocide :rolleyes:

    How did he explain it again?

    No-one, rightly, accepts the excuses for people who supported Hitler. Lefties seem to get a bye ball for their serial fawning over Lenin, Stalin, Mao and all the rest of the murdering scum.


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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,351 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    What is mad right about it?

    The contributors and their contributions for a start.

    But if I was mad right myself that might not be apparent.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    Hermy wrote: »
    The contributors and their contributions for a start.

    But if I was mad right myself that might not be apparent.

    Which ones?

    Seriously.


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,351 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Seriously, you brought up Gript so I'll leave it to you to convince me that it is anything other than mad right wing.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users Posts: 17,899 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    Which ones?

    Seriously.


    Your talking about Gript whose launch funding was provided by the anti abortion lobby, whose editor John McGuirk was previously communications director of Libertas, was spokesperson for Save the 8th, and claimed if Dublin Central got 75% yes for repealing he would never take a political job again and when it got 76.5% proceeded to start a politically directed news blog. The Gript that has links to Cambridge Analytica, that don't run any advertisements and claim to be funded by their readers and supporters ie. Youth Defense and Declan Ganley.... that Gript?


    You are saying they are the only balanced view worth listening too?


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    So being opposed to abortion is "mad right" is it?


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,899 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    So being opposed to abortion is "mad right" is it?


    Youth Defense, Libertas and Cambridge Analytica..... in Irish terms its difficult to get further right and not be running into Gemma and her pals


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    That's not what I asked you.

    Gript does not hide the fact that it is opposed to abortion.

    So is being opposed to abortion "mad right" as this appears to be the basis of your claim.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,899 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    That's not what I asked you.

    Gript does not hide the fact that it is opposed to abortion.

    So is being opposed to abortion "mad right" as this appears to be the basis of your claim.

    I mentioned several conservative right wing associations, you seem strangely obssessed with abortion, like most conservative right wing associations funnily enough


  • Registered Users Posts: 6,665 ✭✭✭Bonniedog


    You mentioned abortion, not me.

    So, I will assume given that you can't produce any evidence of "mad right" content on Gript that it is the fact that it is opposed to abortion.

    Mad right would generally be anti Semitic for example. Like much of the left in it's alliance with Hamas and so on. The ones who also murder people like the former gay mayor of Dublin who the shinners sent to Gaza for some bizarre reason. Perhaps his party enemies were hoping Hamas might throw him off the roof :-)


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,899 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Bonniedog wrote: »
    You mentioned abortion, not me.

    Yeah and you got strangely singularly focused on it again like most mad right conservatives oddly always seem to do.
    Bonniedog wrote: »
    So, I will assume given that you can't produce any evidence of "mad right" content on Gript that it is the fact that it is opposed to abortion.

    Many in Ireland would consider Declan Ganley and Libertas as being Mad right especially considering those they chose to associate with and push forward as their candidates for Europe.

    https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-20093378.html
    Bonniedog wrote: »
    Mad right would generally be anti Semitic for example. Like much of the left in it's alliance with Hamas and so on. The ones who also murder people like the former gay mayor of Dublin who the shinners sent to Gaza for some bizarre reason. Perhaps his party enemies were hoping Hamas might throw him off the roof :-)

    Yeah read above also sorry to burst your politically naive bubble but Anti-semitism has never been confined to either side of the political divide.

    Im done with your pathetic excuses to ignore the obvious right wing dog whistling that is gript.ie, also its way off topic, you wanna discuss media sources start a thread


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  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,134 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Mod: I've deleted two well below standard posts. Personal abuse will not be allowed here.

    We sat again for an hour and a half discussing maps and figures and always getting back to that most damnable creation of the perverted ingenuity of man - the County of Tyrone.

    H. H. Asquith



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,809 ✭✭✭edanto


    OP this is a great question.

    Chomsky is a great man, a sincere and accomplished researcher who can tell us a lot about how the world works. Legions of propagandists have been sent to fling mud at him and damage his reputation and they will continue.

    I don't have any specific answer for you about a similar individual ; but you might want to look into the writings of and interviews with Michael D Higgins over the years. At one point he found himself a pillion passenger on a motorbike witnessing the destruction of CIA funded/trained death squads in South America, so he has seen behind the mask of the empire and fights against it. His position prevents him being overtly political when speaking publicly these days but he does great quiet work encouraging and mentoring younger groups.

    John Pilger would be another interesting person to read through. If you haven't read his 'Heroes' book from 1986, it's a good jumping off point. If you prefer video; most of his 60 documentaries and films are available here - http://johnpilger.com/videos

    In terms of general news sources, two good ones to keep an eye on are The New Internationalist (https://newint.org/), providing a magazine/mailing list which is based in the UK and Democracy Now (https://www.democracynow.org/) providing a daily 1h new report which is based in the US.

    There may well be European people who don't write in English that are a good answer to your question, but I'm not sure how to find out about them.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,618 ✭✭✭El Tarangu


    He wouldn't really be my cup of tea, but you could give Slavoj Žižek a lash, he would tick most of the same boxes.


  • Registered Users Posts: 106 ✭✭Historybluff


    Ive been reading understanding power and listening to few of his talks. He does cover on affairs in europe but mostly concentrates on the states.
    I would like to get some names of people to listen to or read who have a similar views who cover Ireland and Europe

    Chomsky is unique, I would say. He's an anarchist or libertarian socialist and I don't think there's any well known commentators who write about Ireland or Europe from that perspective. But, if you're looking for writers of a generally left wing bent, I would concur with previous posters in suggesting Fintan O'Toole and Slavoj Zizek. There's also Alain Badiou and Owen Jones.




  • As in someone who makes vague but impassioned speeches about how the elites are oppressing the masses, but without any clear examples, considering contra-arguments or offering solutions? Probably Fintan O'Toole

    There's precisely zero chance you've read more than a few lines of Chomsky.

    Absurd post.




  • Yanis Varoufakis is well worth reading/listening to.

    His books 'And The Weak Suffer What They Must?' and 'Adults in the Room' are both excellent reads.


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    The Khmer Rouge stuff has been explained, at great length, for several decades.

    Although, based on the few replies so far, I'm unsure if the respondents have read a solitary syllable of Chomsky.

    TBH if you're having to explain why you supported the Khmer Rouge why should anyone take you seriously?


  • Registered Users Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    Yanis Varoufakis is well worth reading/listening to.

    His books 'And The Weak Suffer What They Must?' and 'Adults in the Room' are both excellent reads.

    The bould Yanis did all his best hurling from the ditch, didnt last long when he got his game


  • Registered Users Posts: 439 ✭✭paddythere


    Ive been reading understanding power and listening to few of his talks. He does cover on affairs in europe but mostly concentrates on the states.
    I would like to get some names of people to listen to or read who have a similar views who cover Ireland and Europe

    James Connolly


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  • Registered Users Posts: 15,176 ✭✭✭✭ILoveYourVibes


    Ive been reading understanding power and listening to few of his talks. He does cover on affairs in europe but mostly concentrates on the states.
    I would like to get some names of people to listen to or read who have a similar views who cover Ireland and Europe
    Similar views would be hard. Because the range of his GENUINE bonafide credentialed expertise is so so vast.

    Maybe Michael Foucault.

    Varoufakis has been mentioned.


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