USA ambassador to Iceland wants a gun

Grab All Association

https://twitter.com/yesmarkvalley/status/1287457572371353600?s=21

So the US ambassador to Iceland wants special permission from the Icelandic Government to carry a weapon. One of the safest countries in the world with a population of just 360,000 people.

A genuine fear for his safety or is just compensation for something not measuring up in his trousers?

Insect Overlord

Why should anybody in Ireland, or, more specifically in After Hours, care?

corner of hells

Insect Overlord wrote: »

Why should anybody in Ireland, or, more specifically in After Hours, care?

Maybe hes mixing up Iceland the country with Iceland the shop.
The Iceland shop in Finglas can be a bit hairy on late night shopping.

Manic Moran

At least he asked. I figure that with diplomatic immunity, they couldn’t do much about it.

The use of ambassadorial positions as a reward to political allies, friends, and donors is one of the most consistent embarrassments about the US government structure. One rarely ends up with someone particularly competent in charge.

Man with broke phone

All us officials are targets around the world. Iceland would be a soft place for somebody with a long pencil to turn up and start stabbing multiple people before the police put their 7 pairs of trousers on and ski to the scene.

What's the problem here?

Overheal

Man with broke phone wrote: »

All us officials are targets around the world. Iceland would be a soft place for somebody with a long pencil to turn up and start stabbing multiple people before the police put their 7 pairs of trousers on and ski to the scene.

What's the problem here?

Bringing a gun to a pencil fight.

We used to call them fella's "yellow" or "chicken" back in my day

Dj Stiggie

[Deleted User] wrote: »

We used to call them fella's "yellow" or "chicken" back in my day

No, if they were born in the USA, they were given guns to go kill the yellow men. Sorry pops.

Bobblehats

Gunter wants a gun. Funny that

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

It was a typo. He actually wants a gnu.

Strumms

If Gunter gets a gnu, I want a gnu, too.

There are US Marines stationed at the US Embassy in Dublin, I'd be kinda shocked if they don't have guns. Or the Ambassador, for that matter.

It's what we've come to expect from Americans.

YellowBucket

Iceland's not all that gun-free 30.3 guns per 100 ppl vs 8.6 here and 6.6 in the UK, but nobody has been shot in something like 11 or 12 years.

Zebra3

If he didn't want to take a post in such a dangerous country, he should've turned it down.

Rodney Bathgate

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

There are US Marines stationed at the US Embassy in Dublin, I'd be kinda shocked if they don't have guns. Or the Ambassador, for that matter.

It's what we've come to expect from Americans.

What’s the point in having marines there if they are unarmed?

Feisar

YellowBucket wrote: »

Iceland's not all that gun-free 30.3 guns per 100 ppl vs 8.6 here and 6.6 in the UK, but nobody has been shot in something like 11 or 12 years.

8.6% of people here have guns?!!

frozenfrozen

Feisar wrote: »

8.6% of people here have guns?!!

guns per population and some people would have several guns

jimgoose

I don't think all is quite well upstairs with that fella. Before this, didn't he return to California at the height of the panic over COVID-19 and announce that he wanted to conduct his ambassadorial function from there?

Randy Archer

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

What’s the point in having marines there if they are unarmed?

Would they not got cool martial arts skills and are trained to kill with a spoon ?

ShatterAlan

Manic Moran wrote: »

At least he asked. I figure that with diplomatic immunity, they couldn’t do much about it.

The use of ambassadorial positions as a reward to political allies, friends, and donors is one of the most consistent embarrassments about the US government structure. One rarely ends up with someone particularly competent in charge.

Dimplomatic immunity only protects you from prosecution it doesn't allow you to go around on a crime spree with impunity which effectivley is what carrying a firearm would be, i.e. being constantly in breach of the law.

Feisar

Feisar wrote: »

8.6% of people here have guns?!!

Most farmers have a shotgun.

jimgoose

Randy Archer wrote: »

Would they not got cool martial arts skills and are trained to kill with a spoon ?

The Marine Corps Martial Arts Program these days features an eclectic mix of disciplines and techniques with varying degrees of aggression/lethality, including but by no means limited to wrestling, Savate, Taijutsu, Taekwon-Do, Aikido and Krav Maga.

jimgoose

Deleted User wrote: »

Most farmers have a shotgun.

Many do, yes. Also, a lot of people who are into shooting sports would have more than one firearm, maybe a couple of shotguns and a pistol, or a shotgun and a centrefire rifle for deer.

ShatterAlan

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

What’s the point in having marines there if they are unarmed?

Like most things American they are there for show.
The place has bomb protection and metal-detectors. What the hell do you even need an armed soldier inside for if you have that?

Beechwoodspark

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

There are US Marines stationed at the US Embassy in Dublin, I'd be kinda shocked if they don't have guns. Or the Ambassador, for that matter.

It's what we've come to expect from Americans.

The ambassador is a frail old man, I doubt he personally “carries a piece” but he has fantastic security

Feisar

jimgoose wrote: »

Many do, yes. Also, a lot of people who are into shooting sports would have more than one firearm, maybe a couple of shotguns and a pistol, or a shotgun and a centrefire rifle for deer.

I have five, I thought the percentage was high as outside of my shooting circles I know one lad with a gun. Having said that I don't go around advertising the fact.

jimgoose

ShatterAlan wrote: »

Like most things American they are there for show.
The place has bomb protection and metal-detectors. What the hell do you even need an armed soldier inside for if you have that?

About the last thing the USMC Embassy Security Group are is "for show".

YellowBucket

Americans can be weird abroad. I remember being in college with someone in Cork and she was extremely worried that she couldn’t carry a gun.

She was from a state that licences people to carry concealed guns and she was a member of a gun club and all that.

As far as she was concerned she wasn’t safe if she couldn’t pull a gun. She has similar issues when she was in college in Massachusetts, where that is also illegal.

In general the parts of the US Irish people tend to be most familiar with have relatively tight gun control. It’s often the more “red states” that tend to be very pro gun, but because of lack of internal borders, guns bought or licensed out of state are often used by criminals in states with controls, so it’s all a little odd.

Overheal

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

What’s the point in having marines there if they are unarmed?

They have dozens of ways to kill you with their pinky finger

Manic Moran

ShatterAlan wrote: »

Dimplomatic immunity only protects you from prosecution it doesn't allow you to go around on a crime spree with impunity which effectivley is what carrying a firearm would be, i.e. being constantly in breach of the law.

The problem is in detecting it. You can't go about searching an ambassador to see if he's carrying a gun without violating diplomatic immunity or at the very least, causing an international incident. Unless he publicly announced or showed that he was wearing a firearm, it would be an extremely courageous move to search him for evidence that he's in breach of the law, even if the only recourse is expulsion and not prosecution.

ohnonotgmail

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

What’s the point in having marines there if they are unarmed?

what makes you think they are unarmed?

VinLieger

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

There are US Marines stationed at the US Embassy in Dublin, I'd be kinda shocked if they don't have guns. Or the Ambassador, for that matter.

It's what we've come to expect from Americans.

LOL great false equivalence,

Firstly the US embassy is american soil so they can have whatever guns they want there.

Secondly when outside the embassy they are still members of foreign armed forces so need special permission from our department of defence to even wear their own uniforms let alone posess and carry their own weapons.

Thirdly he's a civilian and theres no need for him to carry a gun on his person in a country like Iceland where gun crime is virtually non existent.

Odhinn

Grab All Association wrote: »

https://twitter.com/yesmarkvalley/status/1287457572371353600?s=21

So the US ambassador to Iceland wants special permission from the Icelandic Government to carry a weapon. One of the safest countries in the world with a population of just 360,000 people.

A genuine fear for his safety or is just compensation for something not measuring up in his trousers?

A virus might turn the icelanders into savage viking cannibals, led by the dark queen herself - Bjork. You can't deny a man a gun with that possibility hanging over him.

Irishman80

Grab All Association wrote: »

https://twitter.com/yesmarkvalley/status/1287457572371353600?s=21

So the US ambassador to Iceland wants special permission from the Icelandic Government to carry a weapon. One of the safest countries in the world with a population of just 360,000 people.

A genuine fear for his safety or is just compensation for something not measuring up in his trousers?

What? Really? I can’t believe this is happening.

The US ambassador to Iceland asked for increased security and a gun.

I’m literally shaken here with anger. I don’t know if I’ll be able to sleep for the next few nights.

Timberrrrrrrr

Irishman80 wrote: »

What? Really? I can’t believe this is happening.

The US ambassador to Iceland asked for increased security and a gun.

I’m literally shaken here with anger. I don’t know if I’ll be able to sleep for the next few nights.

Read your post a few times, sure you'll be out like a light

Manic Moran

VinLieger wrote: »

L
Firstly the US embassy is american soil so they can have whatever guns they want there.

No, it's Irish soil. Irish law applies, so any major crimes such as murder will be investigated by the Gardai, likely under US supervision, presuming the US approves the investigation. See Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations for the legal descriptions, see the Iranian Embassy Siege in London of the practical example of host nation law enforcement action, prosecution, and imprisonment.

There is a difference between the embassy's status as inviolate and a transfer of sovereignty.

A Tyrant Named Miltiades!

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

There are US Marines stationed at the US Embassy in Dublin, I'd be kinda shocked if they don't have guns. Or the Ambassador, for that matter.

It's what we've come to expect from Americans.

The ambassador wouldn't but his security probable do with permission.

Diplomatic immunity isn't the all powerful cloak it's made out to be.

VinLieger

Manic Moran wrote: »

No, it's Irish soil. Irish law applies, so any major crimes such as murder will be investigated by the Gardai, likely under US supervision, presuming the US approves the investigation. See Vienna Convention on Diplomatic Relations for the legal descriptions, see the Iranian Embassy Siege in London of the practical example of host nation law enforcement action, prosecution, and imprisonment.

There is a difference between the embassy's status as inviolate and a transfer of sovereignty.

True, the armed forces and security personnel in the embassy still have access to guns though, however they cannot leave the embassy with those guns without specific permissions same with wearing a uniform outside the embassy or shannon airport.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Strumms wrote: »

If Gunter gets a gnu, I want a gnu, too.

When you're ambassador to Iceland, you can have a gnu.

Overheal

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

When you're ambassador to Iceland, you can have a gnu.

The Antelope?

Rodney Bathgate

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

what makes you think they are unarmed?

Nothing. They would be pointless if they were unarmed. Of course they are armed.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Overheal wrote: »

The Antelope?

They prefer to be idenfied as wildebeast.

Victor

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

Nothing. They would be pointless if they were unarmed. Of course they are armed.

With out-sized pencils?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Victor wrote: »

With out-sized pencils?

Not if the pencils are pointless. That would be even more, eh - pointless.

Manic Moran

Manic Moran wrote: »

The problem is in detecting it. You can't go about searching an ambassador to see if he's carrying a gun without violating diplomatic immunity or at the very least, causing an international incident. Unless he publicly announced or showed that he was wearing a firearm, it would be an extremely courageous move to search him for evidence that he's in breach of the law, even if the only recourse is expulsion and not prosecution.

There's no issue in taking police action against a diplomat on a case by case basis. They are not above the normal rules.

You cannot arrest within prior approval or it was unavoidable. You can never prosecute without prior permission from the DPP for a criminal offense

Traffic is not considered Criminal for this purpose so tickets can be issued, directions given and so on and so forth. Usually if I've acts up, their diplomatic permission or invitation or whstever it's called, is revoked. I daresay the us and Russia have had a few 'diplomatic staff' expelled over the years.

In reality though, diplomats aren't generally South African drug barons

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

There's no issue in taking police action against a diplomat on a case by case basis. They are not above the normal rules.

You cannot arrest within prior approval or it was unavoidable. You can never prosecute without prior permission from the DPP for a criminal offense

Traffic is not considered Criminal for this purpose so tickets can be issued, directions given and so on and so forth. Usually if I've acts up, their diplomatic permission or invitation or whstever it's called, is revoked. I daresay the us and Russia have had a few 'diplomatic staff' expelled over the years.

In reality though, diplomats aren't generally South African drug barons

Diplomatic immunity is what's it's called - and yes, it does stop police taking action. The diplomat in question is simply recalled if accusations likely to be true are made. (Not sure if it includes serious crimes, but I think they'll be dealt with in the diplomat's hoem country - open to correction though.)

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Diplomatic immunity is what's it's called - and yes, it does stop police taking action. The diplomat in question is simply recalled if accusations likely to be true are made. (Not sure if it includes serious crimes, but I think they'll be dealt with in the diplomat's hoem country - open to correction though.)

It's too late to argue but no, it does not. By that rationale the diplomat could drive down the road mowing down children and shooting grannies through the window.

Hell, the embassadors driver could assassinate the president!

SnazzyPig

Insect Overlord wrote: »

Why should anybody in Ireland, or, more specifically in After Hours, care?

This seems to be a thing on Boards lately; asking why people on an information sharing platform are asking questions about something.

I would like to think it's just confusion but I doubt it.

Manic Moran

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

It's too late to argue but no, it does not. By that rationale the diplomat could drive down the road mowing down children and shooting grannies through the window.

Hell, the embassadors driver could assassinate the president!

Depends on if the ambassador's driver were accredited staff. My dad was an ambassador, we had immunity. The driver was a local hire, he did not.

I'm afraid, Niner, that the text of the convention disagrees with you. I would remind you of the case of Anne Sacoolas this year who killed a man in the UK and was protected under diplomatic immunity.

Article 29: The person of a diplomatic agent shall be inviolable. He shall not be liable to any form of arrest or detention.

Article 31: A diplomatic agent shall enjoy immunity from the criminal jurisdiction of the receiving State

These may be waived by the sending state, in the interests of goodwill. (Or if blackmailed by the receiving state to do so)

This is why all the traffic tickets in the world can be issued, but whether or not the diplomatic staff wish to pay it is up to them or their nation's policies. https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-un-fines-newyork/diplomats-owe-17-mln-in-new-york-parking-fines-idUSLNE78N00D20110924

New York City is owed nearly $17 million in parking tickets issued to diplomats, a hefty amount that may have grown this week as world leaders gathered for the U.N. General Assembly.

The city’s Department of Finance said unpaid tickets totalled $16.7 million through the end of July. Egypt topped the list with $1.9 million in tickets, followed by Nigeria with about $1 million and Indonesia with about $725,000.

Tony EH

Strumms wrote: »

If Gunter gets a gnu, I want a gnu, too.

This is how it starts.

You want a gnu, somebody else will want a gnu. Then you'll want a bigger gnu and someone else will want an even bigger gnu...

It'll never end.

Tony EH

YellowBucket wrote: »

Iceland's not all that gun-free 30.3 guns per 100 ppl vs 8.6 here and 6.6 in the UK, but nobody has been shot in something like 11 or 12 years.

I'd say that's because most of those guns are hunting rifles and not people walking around with glocks that get pulled out because they get into an argument in a carpark.