3 Way Fridge Not Working

Probably

Seems to be a few fake incidents

niloc1951

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

Probably

Seems to be a few fake incidents

No mention of the fridge being the cause.
A car fire
Another car fire
and not a fridge in sight

True Niloc, it probably had nothing to do with the naked pilot light thuther side of an unguarded 4" x 12" intake in the presence of inflammable vapours unlikely any ever had too.

Is it easier to look at the economics rather than the inefficiency?

I can buy enough solar to power a compressor fridge for 30 years with what I would spend running a gas fridge for 5 weeks.
If I pay €5 for a campsite hookup to power the fridge from mains that's equivalent to powering a compressor off utility for 20 days and nights.
If my split charge system only produces 7A < 15A when driving (like most) and there's a permanent load of 10A attached to the other side (like most) how long will it take to charge my house battery with a net charge current of -3A < 5A. Compared to a compressor fridge running 3.5A at 25% duty cycle?

If I adjust the temperature with the gas flame knob, setting the fridge to 3°C internal with an atmospheric temperature of 10°C in the day, say at night the atmospheric temperature drops to 0°C. If I don't faddle with the manual thermostat on a device with no feedback, what temperature will my provisions be in the morning if the wind doesn't blow out the pilot light?

How do I inspect the pilot light is on? By opening the door and letting all the cold out!

If one wants to argue it's not worth paying the extra for a few weekends a year A: the lemon was built into the price and B: say the camper was €50k and it's used 10 weekends for 5 year that's €1k per weekend, the fridge is a drop in the ocean.
Say you need it to be reliable... 5-week return on investment...that's before you account for all the spoilages, the cost and time of getting bottles refilled etc...

Sir Liamalot

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

If I pay €5 for a campsite hookup to power the fridge from mains that's equivalent to powering a compressor off utility for 20 days and nights.

If the only reason I have to visit the campsite is to charge a battery and power a fridge. It's €20 to pass the gate and €5 to get some lecky minimun.



For the low low price of 8 nights in a campsite I can buy enough solar & charge controllers to never need a campsite for the rest of the life of my vehicle.


...and then sell the electronics after the chassis rots out.

niloc1951

Sir Liamalot, your highly technical and financial musings are somewhat beyond me.

All I can recount are my own real-life experiences of over 30 years using having a caravan and then a motorhome using a three-way gas fridge has proved to be most satisfactory. My current 150 litre AES fridge freezer has performed perfectly in outside ambient temperatures from winter sub-zero to summer 40°C +. Chilled food has remained chilled and frozen food remained frozen.

As for running cost, for me, that has never been an issue. A fill of 25litres of LPG at €0.73/litre will last a number of weeks in summer without the use of a mains hook-up and that not only runs the fridge but also covers all hot water and cooking requirements, in winter with the heating running 24/7 that can reduce to maybe a week.
I run 200w of solar and that takes care of all my electrical requirements like tv, radio, lighting, water pumping, satellite receiver, etc. A 50A B2B unit supplements the solar when driving if the sun's not shining.

At a cost of €0.73/litre for LPG my 150L fridge which uses 400g/24hours costs about €0.60 per day, I've no complaint. For the cost-conscious, there are also much smaller fridges with equally smaller running costs.

Finally, with over 1.6m motorhomes on the roads of Europe, a few catching fire in service stations, as cars and other vehicles also do, is no indication that having a properly installed AES fridge on board is a significant hazard.

PS., as a rule, I never take an EHU if staying on a camping pitch if it's not included in the basic price.

niloc1951

niloc1951 wrote: »

my 150L fridge which uses 400g/24hours costs about €0.60 per day, I've no complaint. For the cost-conscious, there are also much smaller fridges with equally smaller running costs.

That's not a small running cost. 5.2kWh per day 1900kWh per year.
20 times worse than it's competition.
€300 per year to run from mains.
€108 of propane per year plus the getting it.

With a ~€2600 price tag?


An A++ 135L (€450) fridge will use 94kWh.
€15 per year






I can run the mains 135L with a €400 1.5kW inverter, a third of a 300W €100 solar panel and a €100 MPPT charge control with zero upkeep cost for the life of the fridge and I can use the solar & inverter for other appliances too.


That 135L A++ is a similar efficiency as a 60L Danfoss 12v/24v.

CelticRambler

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

say the camper was €50k and it's used 10 weekends for 5 year that's €1k per weekend, the fridge is a drop in the ocean.
Say you need it to be reliable... 5-week return on investment...that's before you account for all the spoilages, the cost and time of getting bottles refilled etc...

In fifteen years, I've never had any food spoil in my 3-way fridge; in the same period, I've lost about 1000€'s worth food in the always-on, mains-powered home freezers ... which have a habit of refusing to work when my surge-protected fuseboard takes offence at a local lightning strike while I'm off in the camper.

But your "drop in the ocean" comment is right on point. For those of us who come into the camper/motorhome market at a time and a place in our lives where we can't build them from scratch, there's almost never the opportunity to choose a compressor fridge. I asked for several modifications to be made to the catalogue version of my vehicle, including some relating to the electrical system, but changing the fridge was never in the picture.

And while I am actively considering replacing it now (not least because of your interventions on this forum! :pac: ) the fact remains that the additional cost of the gas is still a drop in the ocean. A 13kg refill of propane will set me back about 25€ and - in the summer - last about two weeks, all utilisations included. In the same period, I'll spend about 300€ on diesel. Adding extra battery and inverter weight is going to increase that side of the equation.

The interest for me in moving to a solar-powered "domestic" fridge lies in the incompatibility of the bottles across different European countries. For a long time, I planned to install a re-fillable LPG tank, but the cost of that retrofit is likely to be more than changing the fridge-freezer arrangement, and if the fridge isn't burning through the gas, then my 2x13kg bottles should be enough for most future excursions.

niloc1951

I suppose in a nutshell what I and others are saying is that when considering the overall cost of enjoying the motorhome lifestyle the relatively meagre difference between the running cost of a compressor fridge versus an absorption fridge is of no consequence. It's like the old adage attributable to owning a luxury car, "if you need to ask about its MPG's you can't afford one".

Gas is a pain in the butt especially for those who travel internationally due to empties only being exchangeable in their country of origin, but fixed refillable bottles/tanks overcome that issue. For those of us with back issues fixed bottles/tanks obviate the need to hump around the best part of 30kg and that's also a good reason, apart from the balance sheet, in their favour. Pain relief/avoidance often costs money.

Yes, all thing being equal a 12v compressor fridge is probably a better option. However, the additional cost and weight of enough battery and solar to provide a reliable supply is a factor to be considered. I do expect developments in solar and battery technologies to change the equation undisputably in favour of the compressor fridge as time passes. In the meantime 'gas is yer man' for most of us.

I can't work with a gas fridge if you want the vehicle to be autonomous. It's like fitting halogen lamps to an EV.
Gas is €2 per litre by the bottle.

Technology is here Niloc 300W of solar is €100. That's enough to power 3 compressor fridges. Arguably you don't need any additional battery.
The fitters need to move into the current century.

niloc1951

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

I can't work with a gas fridge if you want the vehicle to be autonomous. It's like fitting halogen lamps to an EV.
Gas is €2 per litre by the bottle.

Technology is here Niloc 300W of solar is €100. That's enough to power 3 compressor fridges. Arguably you don't need any additional battery.
The fitters need to move into the current century.

Gas is not €2 per litre by the bottle, an 11kg bottle which contains approx 22 litres @ €32 per bottle = €1.45
Please tell where 300w of solar can be bought for €100
With 300w of solar at these latitudes between the autumn and spring, 100w output would be a good result by day with zero bt night = 1/2 a compressor fridge.

€2 per litre in a 5kg bottle niloc. I run dual cylinders in the van because it's a pain in the hoop running out up a mountain. No coffee and melted ice cream ruins every morning. I got rid of the second cylinder after I flogged the gas fridge and went electric.


I'm flying a 265W MPPT and a Sterling 120A B2B that performs as well as the cable I used to connect it. I don't use the EHU.



300W of solar at these latitudes will produce ~1kWh per day April to November.
peaking at 2kWh.

Solar panels for grown ups here.
36 cell "12v" jobs are a rip off these days.

niloc1951

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

€2 per litre in a 5kg bottle niloc. I run dual cylinders in the van because it's a pain in the hoop running out up a mountain. No coffee and melted ice cream ruins every morning. I got rid of the second cylinder after I flogged the gas fridge and went electric.


I'm flying a 265W MPPT and a Sterling 120A B2B that performs as well as the cable I used to connect it. I don't use the EHU.



300W of solar at these latitudes will produce ~1kWh per day April to November.
peaking at 2kWh.

Solar panels for grown ups here.
36 cell "12v" jobs are a rip off these days.

Yes, and you can pay way more then €2 per litre if you choose to use Camping Gaz.
As for the rest, well, it's pretty much beyond me and it's all a matter of what best fits. I know there may always be a person out there with a 'better' way or 'cheaper' way of doing something but at the end of the day, much of what we choose is the result of a combination of knowledge, budget and capability or the lack thereof.

I know that your posts on the issue of electrics demonstrate a deep understanding of the subject but like the sea, the deeper one goes the less illumination there is.

CelticRambler

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

Solar panels for grown ups here.

Hmm. 110€ including VAT for the 320W model - or I can get the 330W version from my nearest online merchant for 89€ ... :rolleyes:

But here's the thing: 18kg! :eek: Compared to the 110W flexible panel at 1kg (for around twice the price ... so a total of six times the cost for one sixth of the weight. But still a few hundred Ah of battery to add. And an inverter.

So we're back to this same trade-off of highly cost- and energy-efficient performance of the power-bank versus the cost of a retro-fit and loss of payload.

As it happens, my local supermarket is running a 30% cashback promo tomorrow on household appliances. "My" fridge (right size and colour to replace the Dometic three-way, but pricey enough at 210€) has been sitting there unsold for two years, and I've been waiting for just such an offer to come up. Only suddenly it's not.

As for the rest sadly Niloc the market is offering us mobile installations that are dysfunctional without a tether.

Celtic; Thin solar is not UV stable; it lasts 5 years not 30+. It's between 4 & 10 times the cost of rigid 60cell. It is less efficient and if you heat sink it to a van it derates hugely compared to rigid that has rear-side cooling.

The simple fact of the matter is every time I step outside the motorhome market I can offer 2 > 4 times the performance at at least half the cost with a substantially longer expected lifespan and higher reliability.

I'm not paying list prices for solar by the way. I generally get 300Watters for ~ €75

Why do you need to add battery and an inverter because you got more solar?
I lost a gas bottle switching to an electric fridge, I did not increase my battery size just my generation capability for continuous year round autonomy and I can power my lights and laptop with that generation. I tried plugging a laptop into a gas bottle...it didn't work!?
I gained space internally and doubled the solar footprint on the roof where it doesn't bother anyone (and arguably fits on the exact same roof rack).

CelticRambler

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

Thin solar is not UV stable; it lasts 5 years not 30+. It's between 4 & 10 times the cost of rigid 60cell. It is less efficient and if you heat sink it to a van it derates hugely compared to rigid that has rear-side cooling.

That's useful to know. :cool:

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

Why do you need to add battery and an inverter because you got more solar?
I lost a gas bottle switching to an electric fridge, I did not increase my battery size just my generation capability for continuous year round autonomy and I can power my lights and laptop with that generation. I tried plugging a laptop into a gas bottle...it didn't work!?

No chance of losing a gas bottle, unless I switch to a re-fillable LPG system - as it is, I carry up to four bottles when I'm on an extended winter trip across central Europe (2x French, 2x German) which just about covers my heating and cooking needs. If I'm desperate, I can store all the fridge stuff outside (current temperature here, right now, 3.4°C and save the propane for myself; but at the other extreme, with minimum overnight temperatures in the mid-20s, and daytime temps hitting 40°, could a fridge survive on 200 stored Ah?

My old gas (as efficient as I could make it which is to say twice as good as standard) boat anchor fridge consumed 20L of gas a week. I lost a gas bottle because now they last for months with just cooking to supply that I always come back to harbour before the bottle reaches low volume.

A 12v fridge if insulated and cooled well uses 15Ah > 20Ah a day in fair weather. It's really not hard to generate that. Solar works well, it produces less in winter but the ambient is colder too so it runs less.

A simple cable upgrade ought to have the alternator producing ~ 60Ah per hour. Ironically a lottov these B2B units are current limiting compared to wiring the van better. A 30A unit as is pretty standard from most manufacturers would be bottlenecking the system 3X it's potential. They're really just lipstick application devices for porcine installs.

Sir Liamalot

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

A simple cable upgrade ought to have the alternator producing ~ 60Ah per hour. Ironically a lottov these B2B units are current limiting compared to wiring the van better. A 30A unit as is pretty standard from most manufacturers would be bottlenecking the system 3X it's potential. They're really just lipstick application devices for porcine installs.

I bet someone is gonna say there's no way €150 of cable & control can beat £600 boxes.



That's 35mm² cable intelligently routed compared to a Sterling "120A Input" B2B.
The alternator output is a function of battery size and state of charge.
The above example was a 235Ah battery.
I ran the same test on a 440Ah battery and split charge out-performed the Sterling by ~10%


Ctek, Redarc, etc only make <30A B2Bs ...less is more, Mad isn't it!

The next by the way we're being lied to/given poor advice about thing...




That 50% "rule".
First of all it's a rule of thumb based on cost effective energy extraction. Second it's not exactly true.
If I discharge to 80% SOC I get double the cycles as if I discharge to 60% SOC etc.

So we can read from this as long as the battery is charged correctly (new can of worms...not opening that one) meaning to specific gravity 1.28 once a month then just keep it above 20%.

The reason I say that is because the alternator is wayyy more efficient when the battery is very low and horses in power right fast that's received extremely efficiently as opposed to tyring to shoe-horn in the last 20% at low current long duration as most would have us do.

Having said that, I don't recommend pushing systems that hard unless the cabling, terminations and belts are in good order.

CelticRambler

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

My old gas (as efficient as I could make it which is to say twice as good as standard) boat anchor fridge consumed 20L of gas a week. I lost a gas bottle because now they last for months with just cooking to supply that I always come back to harbour before the bottle reaches low volume.

Hmm. Yeah ... I still wouldn't be happy tootling through Bavaria and the Czech Republic for three weeks in temps of -6° to -15°C with nothing but a single part-used French bottle of propane to keep me warm at night!

Anyway, what's the B2B that you've mentioned several times ... and the alternator to which you refer - is that vehicle's engine-driven one, or a different item altogether?

I generally prefer diesel heaters because I already have a big fuel tank I can reload anywhere. The van has a wood burning stove...never doing that again. So much hassle over nothing..

B2B = Battery to battery charger a purported split charge optimisation device. Actually a bottleneck a bad install by compensating for all the embedded issues without addressing the root cause device. More popular than recabling alternators for some mad reason.
Alternator is standard engine driven one in above references...but yes it can mean all sorts of other machines too.

CelticRambler

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

I generally prefer diesel heaters because I already have a big fuel tank I can reload anywhere.

Fair point ... but again, would require a retro-fit (that makes three now, all taking the vehicle off the road, which is a problem in itself).

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

Alternator is standard engine driven one in above references...

Ah, right. But that doesn't do anything when you're parked in a field for six days, so not really relevant to the current discussion.

Similarly, for a retro-fit, there's only so much insulation you can pack into the space available; any increase will require a compromise on storage space inside or outside of the fridge, which - in my case - are both non-negotiable.

The (domestic, compressor) fridge that works for me is declared to use 191 kWh/year, which I assume is based on being housed in a bricks-and-mortar dwelling that tends to remain in the 16-26°C temperature range. That's more likely to be a real-world consumption of an extrapolated 300kWh/an when the appliance is surrounded by air at 30-40°C

So lets say 6kWh for the week in the field, or about 800Wh in a 24-hour period, of which at least 10 hours are dark. That's ... 30Ah from the battery, 30A from the sun-on-the-roof - does that sound right?

CelticRambler

CelticRambler wrote: »

Fair point ... but again, would require a retro-fit (that makes three now, all taking the vehicle off the road, which is a problem in itself).

Who's counting? The saddest is when yer brand new factory fresh job needs a heating, refrigeration and power production overhaul outtov the gates. Throw ~€5k of obsolete inadequate and inappropriate hardware in the skip that was worth about €1k except is was "designed" for the recreational markets so qualified for a 5x performance exclusive markup.


And then the time to put it right.

CelticRambler wrote: »

Ah, right. But that doesn't do anything when you're parked in a field for six days, so not really relevant to the current discussion.

I do, you do, most don't. You can still turn the engine independently of the wheels when yer desperate although I design to avoid it.

CelticRambler wrote: »

Similarly, for a retro-fit, there's only so much insulation you can pack into the space available; any increase will require a compromise on storage space inside or outside of the fridge, which - in my case - are both non-negotiable.

Arah yee've all got small van problems! Think bigger, buy a truck!

CelticRambler wrote: »

The (domestic, compressor) fridge that works for me is declared to use 191 kWh/year, which I assume is based on being housed in a bricks-and-mortar dwelling that tends to remain in the 16-26°C temperature range. That's more likely to be a real-world consumption of an extrapolated 300kWh/an when the appliance is surrounded by air at 30-40°C

I'd go the other way retrofitting a domestic to an absorption cabinet you ought to have a huge atmospheric vent and intake. Most house fridges are poked in a corner with completely stifled condenser cooling.

CelticRambler wrote: »

So lets say 6kWh for the week in the field, or about 800Wh in a 24-hour period, of which at least 10 hours are dark. That's ... 30Ah from the battery, 30A from the sun-on-the-roof - does that sound right?

First off that sounds like an A-rated fridge.


Get a more efficient one.




And an inverter with hibernate/load detect function. They Idle about 1.5W and say they're 80% efficient.
Fridge = 220W per day @ 80% efficient (inverter losses) = 274W + (1.5W x 24hr) = 310Wh per day


110W of solar will run that fridge most of the year (and it's cheaper to get 300W)
Assuming zero solar or split charge input and a 200Ah battery...let's say 100Ah disposable after lighting etc.. so let's say about 4 days.


Two things though zero solar input is highly irregular in a field and if you sort yer split charge out you can run the fridge for a day every 30mins of engine running, but the lower the battery the more charge the alternator will produce so you could get it as low as 20mins per day.


Obviously, a kWh per year figure is Summer loaded and Winter light which is exactly the same output profile as Solar.


You can go around in circles with these things. Since I fitted my compressor fridge I've never worried about powering it or had to turn it off except when it was in storage.

CelticRambler

D'y'know, SirLiam, you're a terrible man for trying to fit the circumstances to the solution!

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

yer brand new factory fresh job needs a heating, refrigeration and power production overhaul outtov the gates. Throw ~€5k of obsolete inadequate and inappropriate hardware in the skip that was worth about €1k except is was "designed" for the recreational markets so qualified for a 5x performance exclusive markup.

I bought a house and a motorhome at the same time (and for the same price :cool: ) fifteen years ago. The house's heating, refigeration and power has all had to be renewed at a cost of considerably more than 5k, and running costs are considerably higher than a couple of bottles of gas every month (although the house gas bottle does last a longer :pac: ).

So while I accept that much of what goes into shiny new recreational vehicle is overpriced, as far as mine is concerned, all of it has given good service in that time. Of course, the only "fatal" problem was fridge-related, but that was (still is) a critical flaw in the charge relay - the fridge was doing what it thought right, based on false information. Ancient history now, though.

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

You can still turn the engine independently of the wheels when yer desperate although I design to avoid it.

But us lesser mortals have to work with what has already been designed, and in my field, with neighbours at a distance of +/-1m I'd be thrown out of the field with no right to appeal if I ran a smelly old diesel for twenty minutes. So a solar solution has to be a complete solution, no burning diesel instead of gas as a back-up.

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

Arah yee've all got small van problems! Think bigger, buy a truck!

It's not that small - six adult berths, seven belted seats - and functions perfectly well as a cargo vehicle when required. But changing a perfectly good vehicle, more or less designed to order, to accommodate a different type of fridge is not a reasonable proposition, even if I have a current C-licence.

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

First off that sounds like an A-rated fridge.


Get a more efficient one.

Again, suggesting a fridge-no-freezer of half the volume of the fridge-freezer that is just about sufficient for my needs is not an appropriate solution. It doesn't matter how many A-stars that Klarstein model has, it's not going to keep my choc ices frozen, so it's actually worse than the Dometic I'd like to replace.

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

Assuming zero solar or split charge input and a 200Ah battery...let's say 100Ah disposable after lighting etc.. so let's say about 4 days.

You can go around in circles with these things. Since I fitted my compressor fridge I've never worried about powering it or had to turn it off except when it was in storage.

I'm trying to get out of the circle! But working within the real-world constraints of retrofitting into an existing space, my personal requirements in terms of size and style, would you still say that a fridge with a notional consumption of three times your Klarstein example would run happily for two days with a 300W panel supplying 2x110Ah batteries?

CelticRambler

CelticRambler wrote: »

D'y'know, SirLiam, you're a terrible man for trying to fit the circumstances to the solution!

Maybe. To my mind a motorhome is a mobile installation. Being forced into premature harbour through a lack of resources is a failure of design and most are sold that way.

CelticRambler wrote: »

D'y'know, SirLiam, you're a terrible man for trying to fit the circumstances to the solution!
would you still say that a fridge with a notional consumption of three times your Klarstein example would run happily for two days with a 300W panel supplying 2x110Ah batteries?

First off if you're flying 300W you have to go MPPT!


191/365 = 523Wh p/d @ 80% efficiency = 640Wh + 36Wh quiescent = 676Wh per day.


300w solar will supply 900Wh to 1.8kWh April to November
There's ~2kWh of stored power available from 220Ah if they're genuinely rated.


You oughta be looking at at least 200Wh solar surplus per day with a healthy 2 day reserve.

niloc1951

I've stepped out of the absorption versus compressor fridge debate but let me give my real-life experience of a B2B charger.
I bought a Stirling B2B 50amp charger over 12 years ago (before solar) to keep my batteries (2X100amp) charged while touring.
I wired it as per instructions with a new dedicated connection from the engine battery and choose 55mm² cable for the job to more or less eliminate any voltage drop.
Result:
After a long night of battery use down to maybe 20% or 25% depth of charge, I get a full recovery to 100% charge after a couple of hours drive and ready for another night of winter off-grid. In such circumstances, my 200watt of solar via a quality MPPT charge controller contributes very little.

A real-life experience:
In 2017 we did the winter markets for ten days in The Alsace during which the daytime temperature hovered around 2°C and nighttime below zero. The heating was on 24/7. During the relatively short drives between the town/villages the B2B kept the battery up no problem. As for the gas, we consumed a full 13kg bottle of propane over six days.

PS. a separate generator or running the engine while stationary is not an option for us due to our social conscience

If you connected the 50mm² from your alternator B+ to you house battery across a contactor you'd get a pretty similar result Niloc. I stopped fitting B2Bs because it's the recommended cable does all the work. I've gotten better results by bypassing the £600 boxes.

niloc1951

Sir Liamalot wrote: »

If you connected the 50mm² from your alternator B+ to you house battery across a contactor you'd get a pretty similar result Niloc. I stopped fitting B2Bs because it's the recommended cable does all the work. I've gotten better results by bypassing the £600 boxes.

So what you are basically saying is that a four-stage charging regime (Bulk, Absorption, Float and Equalisation) is of no benefit over a simple alternator charging. Don't B2B units emulate the profile of mains chargers.
I must have something right as my leisure batteries have lasted on average seven years when most fail after three or four with luck.

Absolutely none Niloc a charger takes ~12hours to run through it's cycles. Most people don't drive that long or that long that often. It's just a bulk charger. You've always been good with batteries. 7 years in a motorhome is not difficult it's less than a coupla hundred cycles. Your solar is doing the maintenance though.

The fact that people can't seem to get 2 years from them is testament to how bad the chargers and user management is. How many people think a battery monitor isn't necessary? If you wanna pay 5x the rate you can buy li-ion. This has a BMS so while it's not any better other than lighter it is automated so the electronics prevent the user from breaking it. You could use a BMS with lead...I do. It works just as well but it's universally compatible.

My biggest problem with the B2Bs is the current limit and the price. If I removed your 50A unit I could probably get you 100A with the cable you connected it with.
Just connect the + input on the + Output terminal while the engine is running and tell me if you get more or less. If you connected alternator to house battery instead of alternator to engine battery to house battery it'd improve further.
Then you can join myself and Aidan M_M in the don't waste yer money club.

I have a 120A B2B fitted, ammeter in the dash board and a manual bypass.
If the altenator is running max output the efficiency is higher without the B2B so less heat more lecky.

If you have a "smart" alternator all bets are off. Fit a dumb alternator beside it is still a better deal than an box of electronics.

By the way bulk and absorption are the same thing. Bulk is marketing for saying the charger is trying to get to say 14.4V flat out but can't while delivering max current due to the limitations of electronic design. Absorption is a fancy way of saying now the battery needs less current than the charger output the voltage can be fixed.
If you put a 100A charger on a 5Ah battery there'd be no bulk stage.

Float in most cases is conservatively 6 hours too soon and a net-zero current not much difference from an alternator's regulator at net-zero current except a slightly higher voltage and the engine will turn off long before it's an issue.

EQ most people don't use it and highly unlikely that it's practical do one from an engine anyways.

niloc1951

So Sir Liamalot, if I understand you correctly what you are saying is that Charles Stirling is nothing better than a snake oil salesman