Zero Sympathy for Publicans

Justin Credible Darts

When the smoking ban was first discussed, and was obvious to anyone with a brain that banning smoking would NOT make pubs busier, publicans did not care about their customers and did nothing to prevent it in fact they encouraged it knowing the majority of customers were against it.



Then when set prices were spoken about for drink prices, again the mean greedy publicans only thought of themselves.


Now you have publicans actually telling us that covid could spike if we dont allow the pubs go back to normal.


Or how with pubs closed people will go to house parties.


You have pubs pretending to be restaurants in order to get around laws.



I love my pint, probably more than most, but if this covid means I have to wait another 6 months so be it, I will not be rushing to any house party, and the publicans and their "poor me" complaints wont be getting any sympathy from me.


To me the whole point of the pub was a hub for social interaction and this desire to rush to a pub so you can sit meters away from others in a boring sterile environment is not something I would go to, let alone book in advance.

AllForIt

Well, some people like to sit in a pub by themselves with a pint. Don't necessarily have to socially interact.

Leg End Reject

People need to make a living and we're a sociable species.

I wouldn't judge anyone for wanting to open their business or go out for a drink.

Tourists are arriving at our airports and ports and carrying on as normal. That's much more of a risk than people from communities with very low infection rates going to their local.

Atlantic Dawn

Waiting out the Covid is a complete waste of time when the airports are open.

Scuid Mhór

What this really brings home for me is how profoundly weird Irish culture is around drinking. I've lived abroad in different countries and the fulcrum of their social activities was never drinking. Rather, drinking was an ancillary activity to their main activities. Here, we have it front and centre as a thing to do. There must be more variance than that in life. It's terribly depressing to see how dependent we are as a nation, to see that the publican debate is even a thing.

Have a good sleep, it'll all look better in the morning.

Dtp1979

Thank fcuk the smoking ban did go through. Jesus the stink off my clothes alone the next day was sickening. Disgusting fcukers expecting it to be ok to poison everyone with their smoke indoors

Sam Quentin

It's Gods revenge for the publicans demanding that the pubs be allowed open on Good Friday. Amen

Rock77

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

When the smoking ban was first discussed, and was obvious to anyone with a brain that banning smoking would NOT make pubs busier, publicans did not care about their customers and did nothing to prevent it in fact they encouraged it knowing the majority of customers were against it.



Then when set prices were spoken about for drink prices, again the mean greedy publicans only thought of themselves.


Now you have publicans actually telling us that covid could spike if we dont allow the pubs go back to normal.


Or how with pubs closed people will go to house parties.


You have pubs pretending to be restaurants in order to get around laws.



I love my pint, probably more than most, but if this covid means I have to wait another 6 months so be it, I will not be rushing to any house party, and the publicans and their "poor me" complaints wont be getting any sympathy from me.


To me the whole point of the pub was a hub for social interaction and this desire to rush to a pub so you can sit meters away from others in a boring sterile environment is not something I would go to, let alone book in advance.

Just on your smoking ban comment.. publicans didn’t care about their customers?? Are you serious? What about their customers that don’t smoke?

I agree with everything else you said but I don’t think the smoking ban can be used as a stick to beat them with..

(I was a smoker when the ban came in by the way)

Atlantic Dawn

Dtp1979 wrote: »

Thank fcuk the smoking ban did go through. Jesus the stink off my clothes alone the next day was sickening. Disgusting fcukers expecting it to be ok to poison everyone with their smoke indoors

I often wonder how it ever was acceptable that your clothing would need to be washed after attending a social gathering to facilitate a hobby killing people is beyond me.

Rodney Bathgate

I’d have zero sympathy for republicans.

Rodney Bathgate

Smokers are jokers. I wouldn’t worry too much about them.

MrMusician18

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

When the smoking ban was first discussed, and was obvious to anyone with a brain that banning smoking would NOT make pubs busier, publicans did not care about their customers and did nothing to prevent it in fact they encouraged it knowing the majority of customers were against it.



Then when set prices were spoken about for drink prices, again the mean greedy publicans only thought of themselves.


Now you have publicans actually telling us that covid could spike if we dont allow the pubs go back to normal.


Or how with pubs closed people will go to house parties.


You have pubs pretending to be restaurants in order to get around laws.



I love my pint, probably more than most, but if this covid means I have to wait another 6 months so be it, I will not be rushing to any house party, and the publicans and their "poor me" complaints wont be getting any sympathy from me.


To me the whole point of the pub was a hub for social interaction and this desire to rush to a pub so you can sit meters away from others in a boring sterile environment is not something I would go to, let alone book in advance.

In fairness to publicans, they are looking at everything else going on and are wondering why they are being targeted. It's not as if a €9 bowl of chicken wings offers immunity to covid, and there are a lot of pubs/restaurants only paying lip service to the regulations. If I was a pub owner I'd be pissed.

Sam Quentin

I read the op with confusion.. no way did publicans want a smoking ban, shir they thought it would ruin their business!?

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/publicans-appeal-to-minister-on-smoking-ban-1.490364?mode=amp

Justin Credible Darts

Leg End Reject wrote: »

People need to make a living and we're a sociable species.

I wouldn't judge anyone for wanting to open their business .

True, however when publicans start lying its another matter.


When i heard one prominent publican claim they could be a spike unless pubs were open it shows how far these liars would go in order get what they want.
Somehow pubs would be immune they would have us believe.




and you are right we are sociable creatures, I certainly miss the pub, but ringing up to book a table to sit in a pub with my wife when I could be at home safer is not my idea of the pub.




We waited this long, lets make sure it is really as safe as possible before the pubs open, as a second wave would make all the previous months all for nothing

Justin Credible Darts

MrMusician18 wrote: »

In fairness to publicans, they are looking at everything else going on and are wondering why they are being targeted. It's not as if a €9 bowl of chicken wings offers immunity to covid, and there are a lot of pubs/restaurants only paying lip service to the regulations. If I was a pub owner I'd be pissed.

I agree , it is lip service with some places circumventing the laws offering a scabby pizza and pretending to be a restaurant bar.


But publicans are not being solely targeted, sports, concerts, and countless others who depend on a crowd or the public are suffering.


I value my health, and the health of my family more than a pint.

Leg End Reject

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

True, however when publicans start lying its another matter.


When i heard one prominent publican claim they could be a spike unless pubs were open it shows how far these liars would go in order get what they want.
Somehow pubs would be immune they would have us believe.




and you are right we are sociable creatures, I certainly miss the pub, but ringing up to book a table to sit in a pub with my wife when I could be at home safer is not my idea of the pub.




We waited this long, lets make sure it is really as safe as possible before the pubs open, as a second wave would make all the previous months all for nothing

Tourist spots are full of people from worse affected countries, schools and colleges will be open in September etc.

It's one thing acknowledging that the pub experience will be different, it's another to have no sympathy for those hoping to reopen their business, for the staff hoping to return to work and for people hoping to have access to a social outlet.

If you can open on the condition everyone buys a meal worth at least €9 and stays for less than 2 hours, I don't understand why others can't let people buy a few drinks and leave in the same time frame.

If I owned a pub I'd be raging too.

Justin Credible Darts

I read about something in cork recently on the monday they opened the "pub restaurants".

All the people sitting apart social distancing outside, then it started to rain, and all the people huddled together under a canopy to stay dry......making the entire process completely worthless.

JohnFalstaff

Whatever about the pubs, it was the nightclubs that really suffered from the smoking ban.

The smoking ban was the beginning of the end for the nightclub scene in Ireland as it brought attention to the fact that most nightclubs stink of farts and sweat.

Without the smell of smoke to mask it, the pungent aromas now linger in the air repulsively.

MrMusician18

Leg End Reject wrote: »

Tourist spots are full of people from worse affected countries, schools and colleges will be open in September etc.

It's one thing acknowledging that the pub experience will be different, it's another to have no sympathy for those hoping to reopen their business, for the staff hoping to return to work and for people hoping to have access to a social outlet.

If you can open on the condition everyone buys a meal worth at least €9 and stays for less than 2 hours, I don't understand why others can't let people buy a few drinks and leave in the same time frame.

If I owned a pub I'd be raging too.

It's because they won't leave in the same time frame - we can see that now. Pass most pubs at the moment and you'll see the same thing on the tables - maybe the remnants of a dinner or a basket of sausages and chips with 10 empty pint glasses waiting for collection. 1hr 45, yeah... Many pubs are currently paying lip service to the rules and that's with food. Take the food away and you'll have a free for all. Quite simply publicans nor their customers are going to be trusted to act with public health in mind, let alone at the forefront of their business.

The rules are the moment are contradictory really though. They only serve as a rather crude way to limit pub capacity nationally, rather than them being controlled environment the lobby groups are claiming that they are.

Sam Quentin

I'll ask one question:: is there a rent/lease pause/freeze for pub and club 'owners' in that position?

Tony EH

Dtp1979 wrote: »

Thank fcuk the smoking ban did go through. Jesus the stink off my clothes alone the next day was sickening. Disgusting fcukers expecting it to be ok to poison everyone with their smoke indoors

I think that the OP will find that the majority of customers were IN FAVOR of the smoking ban as well. Because the majority of pub go'ers were and still are non-smokers.

It was one of the best things we ever did as a country.

Sam Quentin

Sam Quentin wrote: »

It's Gods revenge for the publicans demanding that the pubs be allowed open on Good Friday. Amen

Just on this..we let the gays get married, brought in abortion..bam.. pestilence..

Not saying it's, like, definitely the reason.. probably just a coincidence..

Leg End Reject

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

I read about something in cork recently on the monday they opened the "pub restaurants".

All the people sitting apart social distancing outside, then it started to rain, and all the people huddled together under a canopy to stay dry......making the entire process completely worthless.

You see the same things in supermarkets, groups huddled looking at the same section, or people browsing beside others queuing at the 2 metre distance markers. A lot don't even bother to sanitise their hands and trolley on the way in.

Tony EH

JohnFalstaff wrote: »

Without the smell of smoke to mask it,

This is a bit of a myth and one that's lingered...ahem...like a bad smell since the smoking ban came in.

The smell of farts is in no way "masked" by the smell of smoke.

All you had was the worst of both stinks in your nose.

Leg End Reject

MrMusician18 wrote: »

It's because they won't leave in the same time frame - we can see that now. Pass most pubs at the moment and you'll see the same thing on the tables - maybe the remnants of a dinner or a basket of sausages and chips with 10 empty pint glasses waiting for collection. 1hr 45, yeah... Many pubs are currently paying lip service to the rules and that's with food. Take the food away and you'll have a free for all. Quite simply publicans nor their customers are going to be trusted to act with public health in mind, let alone at the forefront of their business.

The rules are the moment are contradictory really though. They only serve as a rather crude way to limit pub capacity nationally, rather than them being controlled environment the lobby groups are claiming that they are.

Well if people are overstaying sitting over plates of cold food in pubs that serve food can you explain the logic of pubs that don't serve food being forced to stay closed?

It's unfair, close them all or let them all open.

lalababa

Tony EH wrote: »

This is a bit of a myth and one that's lingered...ahem...like a bad smell since the smoking ban came in.

The smell of farts is in no way "masked" by the smell of smoke.

All you had was the worst of both stinks in your nose.

I remember nightclubbing just after the smoking ban. And it was like a dead hobo lying in an open sewer drain.

Sam Quentin

I never ever anytime anywhere in life see a more toxic pandemic spreading environment than an establishment that involves drinking, getting drunk, dancing, cheering, shouting, fighting, crying, hugging, reminiscing etc etc than a drinking 'place'... Hence(unfortunately for people involved in those establishments)they will not be allowed open until it is 'somewhat' safe to do so.
I do hope there is a complete rent/lease freeze/pause for those'owners' in that position.. and I do hope nobody loses any money because of it.. but it's so friggin obvious why it has to be.

MrMusician18

Leg End Reject wrote: »

Well if people are overstaying sitting over plates of cold food in pubs that serve food can you explain the logic of pubs that don't serve food being forced to stay closed?

It's unfair, close them all or let them all open.

I never said it was fair. It isn't. But the logic that I can see behind it is that it allows the largest pubs to open and only half the pubs at that.

It's a crude way of reducing capacity in the trade really.

Strumms

Leg End Reject wrote: »

Tourist spots are full of people from worse affected countries, schools and colleges will be open in September etc.

It's one thing acknowledging that the pub experience will be different, it's another to have no sympathy for those hoping to reopen their business, for the staff hoping to return to work and for people hoping to have access to a social outlet.

If you can open on the condition everyone buys a meal worth at least €9 and stays for less than 2 hours, I don't understand why others can't let people buy a few drinks and leave in the same time frame.

If I owned a pub I'd be raging too.

If people are going to a pub to eat, the drink as in alcohol is only a side issue. If you have a 3 course meal, you are sitting down, stationary and you’ll probably have no more than 2 - 3 drinks say... or share a bottle of wine..

If you allow people in a pub to purely drink and say end up in a situation where in two hours they neck 4-5 pints in a pub.... off to another pub... another 2 hours 4 more pints... there is going to be a whole heap of trouble...

Many people won’t have an issue doing that... they have money, time to kill, there will be trouble to make. The HSE, hospitals, staff, patients with everything going on don’t need that... the last thing they all need.

According to the Irish nurses and midwives organization, approximately 20% of people presenting in hospitals a&e’s with a condition or injury, the root cause of the condition or injury is alcohol use / abuse.

Do we want to put that extra strain on the health services ? With all the heroic work been done, being done ? We don’t. So fûck the publicans. This is about health and we are sticking with the winning formula.

Losty Dublin

Dtp1979 wrote: »

Thank fcuk the smoking ban did go through. Jesus the stink off my clothes alone the next day was sickening. Disgusting fcukers expecting it to be ok to poison everyone with their smoke indoors

I worked in bars and clubs both pre and post smoking ban. It had got to the stage when I would come home at all hours O'Clock and immediately hit the shower alone just to get rid of the smell of tobacco, with all that nights clothes going straight into the wash when I got in. I even had to keep footwear for work and leave them outdoors, that's how much the smells lingered. 29th march 2004 was like night and day to us it made so much a difference.

Justin Credible Darts

Leg End Reject wrote: »

You see the same things in supermarkets, groups huddled looking at the same section, or people browsing beside others queuing at the 2 metre distance markers. A lot don't even bother to sanitise their hands and trolley on the way in.

because it happens in supermarkets which is bad enough does not mean it is ok for pubs though.


supermarkets for food are essential....pubs are not

Dtp1979

Dtp1979 wrote: »

Thank fcuk the smoking ban did go through. Jesus the stink off my clothes alone the next day was sickening. Disgusting fcukers expecting it to be ok to poison everyone with their smoke indoors

Just got a massive craving for a cigarette

Tony EH

lalababa wrote: »

I remember nightclubbing just after the smoking ban. And it was like a dead hobo lying in an open sewer drain.

Before, though, it was like a dead hobo lying in an open sewer drain, with a fag in his gob.

Rodney Bathgate

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

Smokers are jokers. I wouldn’t worry too much about them.

Smokers rhymes with jokers. That’s hilarious!

A Tyrant Named Miltiades!

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Just got a massive craving for a cigarette

A fresh one is the greatest smell ever. Must be like a coriander type thing.

Metroid diorteM

Close them all permanently. And the bookies (online included) too.

They do way more harm than good.

Metroid diorteM

Metroid diorteM wrote: »

Close them all permanently. And the bookies (online included) too.

They do way more harm than good.

I assume your hobbies include hillwalking, cycling, and thinking everyone should be like you?

ReginaldSmythV

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

I assume your hobbies include hillwalking, cycling, and thinking everyone should be like you?

Cycling, definitely. I'll bet my firstborn's college fund/ fag budget on it.

Sam Quentin

Metroid diorteM wrote: »

Close them all permanently. And the bookies (online included) too.

They do way more harm than good.

ReginaldSmythV wrote: »

I assume your hobbies include hillwalking, cycling, and thinking everyone should be like you?

Slag of the active healthy guy speaking the truth... only trying to send people in the right direction. Cause we all know it's the truth. I'm sure he doesn't think everyone should be like him. He just knows it's a feel good better way to live. Jeeeeeez.

king_of_mayo

Tony EH wrote: »

I think that the OP will find that the majority of customers were IN FAVOR of the smoking ban as well. Because the majority of pub go'ers were and still are non-smokers.

It was one of the best things we ever did as a country.

While I agree with the latter, not sure about the former. I remember some pubs 2000/2001/2002 going for a no-smoking policy, all failed and had to recant due to customers not showing up.

Necro

Mod:

I think you will find plenty of discussion on the pubs in the Covid forum OP, no need to duplicate it elsewhere.