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If 911 was an inside job, why did insurers pay out?

  • 18-05-2020 8:58pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 17,621 ✭✭✭✭


    There were tens of thousands of insurance claims arising from 9/11 costing the industry tens of billions, if 9/11 was an inside job, then why didn't one single insurance investigation spot this?

    Why hasn't any insurer stepped forward since and said "hold on.."?

    There were extensive investigations into how the buildings fell, none found that the collapses were the result of controlled demolitions, lasers, energy weapons, mini-nukes or any of that..

    What's the alternative explanation for this, are all these insurance companies and their associated experts stupid?
    The Question of Cost: Insured Losses from September 11
    As of this writing (early August 2002), the “official” insured loss estimate issued by
    the Insurance Services Office (ISO) stood at $20.3 billion. The figure was revised
    upwards in June 2002 from the previous estimate of $16.6 billion. The figure is
    comprised of 51,000 claims in total (49,000 of them in New York and 2,000 in
    Virginia): 15,200 commercial claims (15,000 in New York, 200 in Virginia), 31,500
    personal property claims (30,000 in New York, 1,500 in Virginia) and 4,300 auto
    claims (4,000 in New York, 300 in Virginia).

    https://www.iii.org/sites/default/files/docs/pdf/sept11paper.pdf


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 25,205 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    Larry Silverstein was involved with a years long legal battle with his insurers after the attacks. They seemed like they were fighting tooth and nail to not pay out.
    The whole thing went to court several times.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Silverstein#Insurance_dispute

    Conspiracy theorists allege that Larry Silverstein admitted culpability to the conspiracy on camera and broadcasted on national tv.

    This would have been a boon to the insurance company as it would be clear evidence that he was engaging in insurance fraud on top of his other crimes.

    Yet at no point did the insurance company ever draw attention to this alleged admission for some reason...


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 322 ✭✭double jobbing


    King Mob wrote: »
    Larry Silverstein was involved with a years long legal battle with his insurers after the attacks. They seemed like they were fighting tooth and nail to not pay out.
    The whole thing went to court several times.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Silverstein#Insurance_dispute

    Conspiracy theorists allege that Larry Silverstein admitted culpability to the conspiracy on camera and broadcasted on national tv.

    This would have been a boon to the insurance company as it would be clear evidence that he was engaging in insurance fraud on top of his other crimes.

    Yet at no point did the insurance company ever draw attention to this alleged admission for some reason...


    Not to mention motive.

    In 2001 Silverstein was a 70 year old billionaire. He was already

    a- fantastically wealthy

    b- at an age of physical decline where one's potential death can be any time in the next few minutes to weeks away.

    It's very late in life to involve yourself in such a nefarious scheme that if found out would have you ending your days in a prison cell/ electric chair.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    A local transport contractor has come forward detailing new information about work activity in the Twin Towers two weeks before the attack. He came across many men inside the towers wearing blue jumpsuits using jackhammers and heavy equipment to drill and dust was everywhere. He saw wiring being installed. The floors was emptied out for this shutdown.

    He was contracted to remove network computers from floors inside the Towers because they planned to power down the buildings. And he heard the heavy noise and went to have a look "what the hell was going on there" and came across a number of men doing work.

    He says later after doing enquiries s and ringing up friends in companies, he was told, there were former Israeli paratroopers doing internal work inside the building. Some story this.

    https://soundcloud.com/user-989685163/pre-911-activity-at-the-twin-towers


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,201 ✭✭✭Man with broke phone


    Because they were in on it.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭Effects


    It was the insurance companies that planned the whole thing. I thought that was already widely known?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Because they were in on it.

    If we get a proper court case, let the man testify. He likely has evidence he was working inside the towers at the time and can give many detailed descriptions of the men he saw and the van ands trucks they used.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,621 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    A local transport contractor has come forward detailing new information about work activity in the Twin Towers two weeks before the attack. He came across many men inside the towers wearing blue jumpsuits using jackhammers and heavy equipment to drill and dust was everywhere. He saw wiring being installed. The floors was emptied out for this shutdown.

    He was contracted to remove network computers from floors inside the Towers because they planned to power down the buildings. And he heard the heavy noise and went to have a look "what the hell was going on there" and came across a number of men doing work.

    He says later after doing enquiries s and ringing up friends in companies, he was told, there were former Israeli paratroopers doing internal work inside the building. Some story this.

    https://soundcloud.com/user-989685163/pre-911-activity-at-the-twin-towers

    This has nothing to do with the insurance companies.

    So far there is no evidence that they were all "in on it" and no explanation as to why they would have paid out billions in claims if there was any real evidence 9/11 was an inside job


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,761 ✭✭✭Effects


    Detailed descriptions after 20 odd years?


  • Registered Users Posts: 25,209 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    A local transport contractor has come forward detailing new information about work activity in the Twin Towers two weeks before the attack. He came across many men inside the towers wearing blue jumpsuits using jackhammers and heavy equipment to drill and dust was everywhere. He saw wiring being installed. The floors was emptied out for this shutdown.

    He was contracted to remove network computers from floors inside the Towers because they planned to power down the buildings. And he heard the heavy noise and went to have a look "what the hell was going on there" and came across a number of men doing work.

    He says later after doing enquiries s and ringing up friends in companies, he was told, there were former Israeli paratroopers doing internal work inside the building. Some story this.

    https://soundcloud.com/user-989685163/pre-911-activity-at-the-twin-towers

    How did he get this information?


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,621 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    Effects wrote: »
    Detailed descriptions after 20 odd years?

    Yes. Before providing details perhaps start off by explaining why the insurance companies, who had to pay out billions, were involved? and then provide a basic timeline of your theory


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Effects wrote: »
    Detailed descriptions after 20 odd years?

    He talked about it with others obviously, but the first time coming forward on radio.

    After listening again, he says some trucks belonged to Moishe's Moving Systems. He says the men in the blue jumpsuits were not loading or unloading anything and one driver told him to mind his own business when he asked about the work they are doing

    Seems to be a legit company in New York.
    https://www.moishes.com/

    Why these men were drilling on an empty floor seemed odd to him. He says their boss was an older man, had a funny accent. He got angry with him for finding them and told him you should not be in here, get out.


  • Registered Users Posts: 25,209 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    He talked about it with others obviously, but the first time coming forward on radio.

    After listening again, he says some trucks belonged to Moishe's Moving Systems. He says the men in the blue jumpsuits were not loading or unloading anything and one driver told him to mind his own business when he asked about the work they are doing

    Seems to be a legit company in New York.
    https://www.moishes.com/

    Why these men were drilling on an empty floor seemed odd to him. He says their boss was an older man, had a funny accent. He got angry with him for finding them and told him you should not be in here, get out.

    Whats that got to do with the questions in the OP?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    How did he get this information?

    Facilities manager for a company inside the Towers told him Moishe had trucks over at WTC7 and Twin Towers and was doing work there. He learned from people that some Moishe employees were former Israeli paratroopers. I love a longer interview to hear more details.

    He says some man in the blue jumpsuits were hanging off the wall, dust was flying from the work and work was along the interior wall. This was the week before 9/11.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    That interview may have exposed who did it, maybe?
    Suter was head of Urban Moving Systems, which his sites say was disbanded on or after September 11, 2001. He was questioned by the FBI around September 12, and they removed boxes of documents and a dozen computer hard drives. Suter then left the country.[2][3]

    Suter is known to be a Mossad operative. He escaped back to Israel.

    Looking at his bio, this is very suspicious.
    Employment Operations manager

    In office
    1993 - 1996
    Employer Moishe's Moving System

    https://wikispooks.com/wiki/Dominik_Suter


  • Registered Users Posts: 80,328 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Mod

    Numerous posts deleted. Thanks for reporting; do not backseat mod on such posts.

    @Cheerful you have a chance to explain how your posts are relevant to the subject matter lain out in the OP? None of your posts appear to connect with the notion that the insurers were part of the conspiracy theory. If you can't: cut it out or make another thread to post about this stuff in.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Overheal wrote: »
    Mod

    Numerous posts deleted. Thanks for reporting; do not backseat mod on such posts.

    @Cheerful you have a chance to explain how your posts are relevant to the subject matter lain out in the OP? None of your posts appear to connect with the notion that the insurers were part of the conspiracy theory. If you can't: cut it out or make another thread to post about this stuff in.

    Insurance company will settle when they have no qualms about the official narrative for the collapse. Since this an intimate personal story told here, it’s highly improbable, the insurance company knew about it when they paid out. Dohnjoe of the opinion insurance companies knew everything and that may not be true it seems!

    Tom Hosey was the contractor selected by WTC management to remove numerous mainframe computers systems from the towers before the shutdown on the weekend before 9/11. His qualification and background here make’s his story more persuasive and, we know, FBI and local enforcement, insurance companies have not learned of his account before!

    The fact he saw trucks belonging to this firm outside all three buildings a week before the event has repercussions for future research. It reads like Moishe moving systems company least in the 90s and before 9/11 was a front group for Mossad. The fact Suter was an Employment operations manager for this firm in the 90s is no coincidence!

    You're right in a way it deserves a new thread because this the first time i heard from an actual witness. i have not heard men in blue jumpsuits were working there a week before 9/11. There was cabling and wiring and drilling of walls on many empty floors cleared out according to Tom.


  • Registered Users Posts: 80,328 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Well, that sounds like it belongs in its own thread then tbf: you're saying the insurance companies weren't in on the conspiracy, so it's not aligned with the nature of this thread.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Overheal wrote: »
    Well, that sounds like it belongs in its own thread then tbf: you're saying the insurance companies weren't in on the conspiracy, so it's not aligned with the nature of this thread.

    I disagree with your final remark.

    Since Dohnjoe wrote this, clearly is relevant to the thread.

    Dohnjoe wrote
    There were tens of thousands of insurance claims arising from 9/11 costing the industry tens of billions, if 9/11 was an inside job, then why didn't one single insurance investigation spot this?

    Like i have said. Tom Hosey story he only told friends and colleagues and no insurance or local law agency is aware of his story. If they knew his story the insurance company may have investigated this firm work in the towers a week before the 9/11 attack! Mr Hosey was suspicious also how Moishe got the contract for work since they are operate under no union rules and regulations there non union. He found that odd since WTC management hire only union companies.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,621 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    I disagree with your final remark.

    Apparently 3 large skyscrapers were "blown up" by separate controlled demolitions on 9/11, so why didn't any of the insurance investigations find a single piece of evidence for any of that? some of these investigations were going on 10 years after the event. In fact the evidence for what occurred on 9/11 was so conclusive that they paid out billions.

    (As for your point, an ex-worker, who is coincidentally a 911 conspiracy group member, making uncorroborated claims they saw something "suspicious" on 911 is not evidence. It's as strong as someone claiming that Elvis lives because they saw him, were suspicious he was maybe in the vicinity).


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭enno99


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    There were tens of thousands of insurance claims arising from 9/11 costing the industry tens of billions, if 9/11 was an inside job, then why didn't one single insurance investigation spot this?

    Why hasn't any insurer stepped forward since and said "hold on.."?



    What's the alternative explanation for this, are all these insurance companies and their associated experts stupid?



    https://www.iii.org/sites/default/files/docs/pdf/sept11paper.pdf


    Your assuming here that insurance companies investigated anything
    And if they even tried that they would get around FBI CIA and all government blocks

    A proposal by a small shareholder to withhold approval from the Board of Directors for failure to investigate signs of insurance fraud on 9/11 has been published on the website of the Allianz Group, one of the worldÂ?s largest insurers, in preparation for its May 4th annual meeting.

    https://www.prweb.com/releases/2005/05/prweb235341.htm

    What were their options cry foul and go to the media and try expose the government who regulates them
    or try to mitigate their loses

    option 2 seems to be their best bet


    How Insurance Companies Exploited 9/11


    The companies are not so crass as to suggest that they need the protection because a 66.4 percent increase in profits (after paying out more than $40 billion in claims) was inadequate. Instead they explain that unless the government lets taxpayers become coinsurers against terrorism losses, the companies will be unwilling to write insurance against terrorist attacks and the taxpayers will be the losers. That is a dismal prospect for the taxpayer and the government and the Congress.

    https://www.counterpunch.org/2005/05/19/how-insurance-companies-exploited-9-11/

    New $40bn terrorism insurance law is full of gifts to corporations

    The Terrorism Risk Insurance Act has never covered a single company from terrorism costs and has earned $40bn in revenue for insurance companies. But Congress is too afraid to end it

    The appeal is clear – to insurers, who have been raking in cash. Over 60% of all businesses have purchased government-subsidized terrorism insurance since 2002. The program has cost the government $1m a year – almost nothing – but has made an estimated $40bn in revenue for insurance companies, who have never paid a claim, or given a dime to the government for their reinsurance protection.

    Profits from terrorism protection
    Here’s how Tria rewards insurance companies: Tria only gets triggered if the Treasury secretary designates an attack as a “terrorist event.”

    That’s a high bar: Even the Boston Marathon bombing was not considered a terrorist attack for insurance purposes. In fact, the industry got a boost from that event, as more businesses decided to buy terrorism coverage in the aftermath.

    Because Tria forced transparency from insurers for the cost of terrorism insurance, we have a decent handle on precisely how much insurance companies have collected from companies in premiums.

    Tom LaTourette, a Senior Physical Scientist with Rand, ran the calculations. “In the end, I came up with $4.6bn a year,” he said.

    From that estimate, you can make a reasonable guess that the insurance industry has accumulated over $40bn in revenue from terrorism insurance premiums since the introduction of TRIA -- without ever paying a claim, and without giving a dime to the government for their reinsurance protection.

    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/jun/19/congress-renews-tria-terrorism-insurance-bill

    So as of the guardian article in 2014 they have recouped their money
    and it s set to run until 2027


    The fact that the industry was providing coverage against terrorist
    attacks for little or no additional premium is a practice that Berkshire Hathaway
    president and investment guru Warren Buffett would later deride as “foolish” and “a
    huge mistake.” In the wake of the attacks, however, Berkshire quickly emerged as
    one of the few insurers to offer coverage against terrorist acts, but in exchange for
    tight limits and a sizable premium.

    https://www.iii.org/sites/default/files/docs/pdf/sept11paper.pdf

    Funny how these guys keep popping up

    https://www.nationalreview.com/2014/01/insurance-company-bailouts-editors/

    Dont rock the boat


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  • Registered Users Posts: 17,621 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    enno99 wrote: »
    Your assuming here that insurance companies investigated anything

    I'm not assuming. They did. For example
    https://s3.amazonaws.com/tt_assets/pdf/WTC_7_Collapse_Analysis_and_Assessment_Report.pdf

    Insurance companies even tried to recover losses by launching litigation, one of several cases claimed that negligent design/maintenance of one of the buildings contributed to the collapse, which the above investigation addresses

    At no point in any of the investigations was it discovered that 9/11 was "an inside job" of any sort


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,748 ✭✭✭ExMachina1000


    Why didn't the air force shoot the planes down? Surely there is a nearby base?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,748 ✭✭✭ExMachina1000


    Overheal wrote: »
    Well, that sounds like it belongs in its own thread then tbf: you're saying the insurance companies weren't in on the conspiracy, so it's not aligned with the nature of this thread.

    Are you a mod?


  • Registered Users Posts: 80,328 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Are you a mod?

    Yes. Stay on topic please.


  • Registered Users Posts: 71,799 ✭✭✭✭Ted_YNWA


    Overheal wrote: »
    Well, that sounds like it belongs in its own thread then tbf: you're saying the insurance companies weren't in on the conspiracy, so it's not aligned with the nature of this thread.
    Are you a mod?

    Yes, he is.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭enno99


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    I'm not assuming. They did. For example
    https://s3.amazonaws.com/tt_assets/pdf/WTC_7_Collapse_Analysis_and_Assessment_Report.pdf

    Insurance companies even tried to recover losses by launching litigation, one of several cases claimed that negligent design/maintenance of one of the buildings contributed to the collapse, which the above investigation addresses

    At no point in any of the investigations was it discovered that 9/11 was "an inside job" of any sort

    Who was that investigation for ? which insurance companies


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,748 ✭✭✭ExMachina1000


    Ted_YNWA wrote: »
    Yes, he is.

    I was wondering alright. Iv reported him many times for various obvious infringements of the charter yet no action was ever taken. Now I know why.

    Why weren't the planes shot down or at least harassed by fighter jets?


  • Registered Users Posts: 80,328 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    I was wondering alright. Iv reported him many times for various obvious infringements of the charter yet no action was ever taken. Now I know why.

    We don't have any record of reports from you here, or in the CT parent forum. If you are referring to reports from other forums, that is completely out of bounds here. If you have a problem with moderation in other forums this is not the place to air those grievances: try the help desk, or PM the mods of those forums.

    This serves as your last notice to stay on topic. Thanks.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17,621 ✭✭✭✭Dohnjoe


    enno99 wrote: »
    Who was that investigation for ? which insurance companies

    The Collapse Analysis and Assessment Report WTC 7 by Weidlinger associates was commissioned I believe by the building owners to rebut arguments presented by insurers: Aegis ins, Liberty insurance, National Union insurance, Nuclear Electric insurance and other underwriters (Lloyds)


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,988 ✭✭✭enno99


    Dohnjoe wrote: »
    The Collapse Analysis and Assessment Report WTC 7 by Weidlinger associates was commissioned I believe by the building owners to rebut arguments presented by insurers: Aegis ins, Liberty insurance, National Union insurance, Nuclear Electric insurance and other underwriters (Lloyds)

    So not by the insurers as you said earlier


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