Bobby Sands - see Mod Note in OP.

corks finest

Start of our darkest period in modern Irish history, 5/5/81
Bobby Sands
I was living in Derry at the time, attended Kevin Lynch's and Patsy O'Hara's funerals etc,
awful awful awful time


Mod Note:
As per History charter, any posts that are derogatory to other posters are contra-forum rules. Please keep on topic and interact in a civil manner, especially with those of different viewpoints.

BloodyBill

corks finest wrote: »

Start of our darkest period in modern Irish history, 5/5/81
Bobby Sands
I was living in Derry at the time, attended Kevin Lynch's and Patsy O'Hara's funerals etc,
awful awful awful time

Why did you attend their funerals? Did you know them.

Peregrinus

This is Ireland, Bill. You don't have to know someobody to attend their funeral.

corks finest

BloodyBill wrote: »

Why did you attend their funerals? Did you know them.

I was living there and as a committed republican at the time showed my respects to those who made the ultimate sacrifice,
And yes I was a neighbour of one,and a family friend of another, that really doesn't matter either way, you're just being a gombeen man, I shouldn't really answer someone who's just being ignorant and looking for a reaction ( Troll)
As an ordinary Irishman living amongst the carnange of the 6 counties at the time I was showing my respect for all concerned by attending end of, won't reply again.

A rare photo of bobby sands was shared recently of his time between prison sentenaces




Is it true the brits,couldnt find a pic of him not smiling/happy for propaganda purposes??
(Or is that just a myth)

corks finest

Peregrinus wrote: »

This is Ireland, Bill. You don't have to know someobody to attend their funeral.

This explains a lot,one of his posts I copied and pasted,

Where does it all stop. I think it's a terrible idea to commemorate. The Kilmichael ambush is on the back and that was a piece of carnage that is still fought over by historians today. Theres Protestants in west Cork with a completely different set of memories and beliefs to the Republican ones. Are we going to commemorate their missing family members from 1920to23

corks finest

[Deleted User] wrote: »

A rare photo of bobby sands was shared recently of his time between prison sentenaces




Is it true the brits,couldnt find a pic of him not smiling/happy for propaganda purposes??
(Or is that just a myth)

Don't honestly know TBH, having spent 20 yrs in Derry as a republican it wouldn't surprise me

corks finest

BloodyBill wrote: »

Why did you attend their funerals? Did you know them.

Read some of your previous posts,you're anti republican very biased ,anti Crosbarry/ kilmichael/ 1981hunher strike commerations , embarrassed by your Irish roots living in Devon?
Those who died/ served their time for Irish freedom deserve to be remembered despite shauneens like yourself,
Kilmichael etc happened and you reap the benefits.

antgal23

Had one or two of his poetry books, I think he wrote them in cigarette paper and they were able to smuggle it out

Very dark and very depressing but no surprise

Most southerners have no idea nor knowledge of life up north in the Troubles, it might has well have been in China

But, honestly speaking I don't care.

The Hunger Strikers should be remembered.

Bassfish

corks finest wrote: »

This explains a lot,one of his posts I copied and pasted,

Where does it all stop. I think it's a terrible idea to commemorate. The Kilmichael ambush is on the back and that was a piece of carnage that is still fought over by historians today. Theres Protestants in west Cork with a completely different set of memories and beliefs to the Republican ones. Are we going to commemorate their missing family members from 1920to23

Commemorating does not equal celebrating. All people's stories and perspectives should be captured and respected. Yes the ambushes were murderous bloodbaths, as were the atrocities inflicted by the tans/auxiliaries. The stories of the protestant communities in West Cork and other places have been largely forgotten but all the more reason for people to talk about what happened and raise more questions. Nothing is achieved by trying to forget these things happened.

Iscreamkone

corks finest wrote: »

This explains a lot,one of his posts I copied and pasted,

Where does it all stop. I think it's a terrible idea to commemorate. The Kilmichael ambush is on the back and that was a piece of carnage that is still fought over by historians today. Theres Protestants in west Cork with a completely different set of memories and beliefs to the Republican ones. Are we going to commemorate their missing family members from 1920to23

I for one will commemorate the Kilmichael ambush on 28/11/2020. The Tans got what they deserved.

corks finest

Iscreamkone wrote: »

I for one will commemorate the Kilmichael ambush on 28/11/2020. The Tans got what they deserved.

Same as,my grandfather spent his time in Brixton same time as Mcswiney I'm proud not ashamed of mine,our heritage,yes of course atrocities were committed by all sides , but you can't dig a ditch without getting the shovel dirty, dirty-jobs had to be done

Rows Grower

I'm very proud of my heritage but credit where it's due you have to hand it to the Rangers fans for the chant they would sing at the Old Firm games at the time.

un5byh7sqpd2x0

Should this not be in the Terrorism forum?

Rows Grower

Selene Whining Threshold wrote: »

Should this not be in the Terrorism forum?

Never!

(all we want is dialogue).

corks finest

Selene Whining Threshold wrote: »

Should this not be in the Terrorism forum?

Define terrorist- Michael Collins- Che-Tom Barry-
Raf Bomber Harris
Franco
Eamonn De Valera. Etc rtc

corks finest

Rows Grower wrote: »

I'm very proud of my heritage but credit where it's due you have to hand it to the Rangers fans for the chant they would sing at the Old Firm games at the time.

I respect all war dead be in Irish republican or British war dead,
But what I can't understand is Irishmen ( plastic paddies mostly) who are ashamed of how we became what we are,it wasn't around a table in Dublin castle, but in ditches and country roads, street corners awaiting the enemy from Cork to Donegal and Dublin to Galway

Jim2007

corks finest wrote: »

Read some of your previous posts,you're anti republican very biased ,anti Crosbarry/ kilmichael/ 1981hunher strike commerations , embarrassed by your Irish roots living in Devon?
Those who died/ served their time for Irish freedom deserve to be remembered despite shauneens like yourself,
Kilmichael etc happened and you reap the benefits.

The likes of Bobby Sands had no mandate to kill anyone and should not even be mentioned in the same sentence as the men and women of the war of independence. And before you ask, I am a Republic, one that respects the decisions of the Irish people and one that signed up in 1981 to defend the Irish State against terrorists.

You brainwashed brand of republicanism is not the only flavour in town.

antgal23

Jim2007 wrote: »

The likes of Bobby Sands had no mandate to kill anyone and should not even be mentioned in the same sentence as the men and women of the war of independence. And before you ask, I am a Republic, one that respects the decisions of the Irish people and one that signed up in 1981 to defend the Irish State against terrorists.

You brainwashed brand of republicanism is not the only flavour in town.

After 50 years of being treated like third class citizens NoI Catholics asked for equal rights. The British backed Protestant / Loyalist RUC attacked this peaceful request for rights.

No human being with any dignity would stand back and let this happen.

Meanwhile, the 26 counties stood by and watched.

So, before we start branding people let's get some context first.

CrankyHaus

In the context of British oppression, contemporary and historic, it's difficult to imagine how the War of Independence could have been fought by the IRA with any more restraint and decency than it was. Just compare it with similar national liberation struggles in history and their all-too-common atrocities.

In the same vein the restraint shown by the nascent Irish State in overturning the old economic and social order and the enormous privileges of the Anglo-Irish ascendency was remarkable, so much so that many Republicans felt betrayed and saw it as little more than changing the colour of the post boxes from red to green. Again compare this to other post-colonial states and their (often disastrous) appropriations of property and wealth to amend the vast inequalities remaining from colonialism. It's sad that despite this a small but vocal group of hypocrites are given platforms to slander the founders of this state as vengeful sectarians.

The British public, to their credit, also had an aversion to the repressive methods employed in their name in Ireland. For instance Churchill's opponents in subsequent elections raised his responsibility for the Black and Tans to erode his support and in response his wife circulated pamphlets crediting him for the Anglo-Irish Treaty. This was when he was campaigning as a Conservative candidate for an English electorate.

antgal23

I think a lot of people particularly down here miss the significance of historical events in the rise of Republicanism on the island

1916 was the result of the Fenians who in turn were greatly influenced by the The Great Hunger ( a man made event by London)

70s Republicanism in the NoI was a result of partition ( again a man made event by London)

I'm not blaming sides on what has happened here but trying to connect dots to understand people's actions

We have a shared history regardless of flag colour

Del.Monte

Selene Whining Threshold wrote: »

Should this not be in the Terrorism forum?

AH - It certainly doesn't belong in here.

corks finest

CrankyHaus wrote: »

In the context of British oppression, contemporary and historic, it's difficult to imagine how the War of Independence could have been fought by the IRA with any more restraint and decency than it was. Just compare it with similar national liberation struggles in history and their all-too-common atrocities.

In the same vein the restraint shown by the nascent Irish State in overturning the old economic and social order and the enormous privileges of the Anglo-Irish ascendency was remarkable, so much so that many Republicans felt betrayed and saw it as little more than changing the colour of the post boxes from red to green. Again compare this to other post-colonial states and their (often disastrous) appropriations of property and wealth to amend the vast inequalities remaining from colonialism. It's sad that despite this a small but vocal group of hypocrites are given platforms to slander the founders of this state as vengeful sectarians.

The British public, to their credit, also had an aversion to the repressive methods employed in their name in Ireland. For instance Churchill's opponents in subsequent elections raised his responsibility for the Black and Tans to erode his support and in response his wife circulated pamphlets crediting him for the Anglo-Irish Treaty. This was when he was campaigning as a Conservative candidate for an English electorate.

Great post

not yet

corks finest wrote: »

Read some of your previous posts,you're anti republican very biased ,anti Crosbarry/ kilmichael/ 1981hunher strike commerations , embarrassed by your Irish roots living in Devon?
Those who died/ served their time for Irish freedom deserve to be remembered despite shauneens like yourself,
Kilmichael etc happened and you reap the benefits.

I Think your looking for the phrase that starts with west and ends with brit..:D

corks finest

antgal23 wrote: »

I think a lot of people particularly down here miss the significance of historical events in the rise of Republicanism on the island

1916 was the result of the Fenians who in turn were greatly influenced by the The Great Hunger ( a man made event by London)

70s Republicanism in the NoI was a result of partition ( again a man made event by London)

I'm not blaming sides on what has happened here but trying to connect dots to understand people's actions

We have a shared history regardless of flag colour

My best friend in Cork is C of
Ireland
Without dissenters/ Presbyterians we'd have had no 1798 rebellion, (maybe no fenians who knows)
My youngest is called after Kevin Barry, Bobby ( Sands) and Francis ( Hughes,)
A name i hope will always remind him and those who meet and greet him remember who he's called after.
Hes Kevin Barry Bobby Francis D***"*
So it's not a Catholic v Protestant thing at all but the writing is on the wall reference UI, it's coming

not yet

Little known fact, Bobby Sands wrote back home in Derry.

It makes me proud we had men like him to stand against British Imperialism.

Fuascailteoir

I recently saw a video of his granddaughter singing in a pub. How time flies that he would have been a grandparent at this stage. Is an interesting documentary about him prior to the troubles and the soccer team he played on which had a mixture of Catholics and Protestants. When the troubles came there was an inevitable split

That doc is on YouTube and is called old scores

corks finest

Fuascailteoir wrote: »

I recently saw a video of his granddaughter singing in a pub. How time flies that he would have been a grandparent at this stage. Is an interesting documentary about him prior to the troubles and the soccer team he played on which had a mixture of Catholics and Protestants. When the troubles came there was an inevitable split

That doc is on YouTube and is called old scores

Saw that she sang "Grace" if I remember correctly
I never met a Protestant from Derry until I started travelling to Romania in the 90s there we worked in orphanages/ aids clinics etc drank and ate together, good for both sides of the divide, until then the only Protestant id met were cops raiding, or screws whilst visiting tbe H blocks, and Maghaberry prison

Class of 82

not yet wrote: »

Little known fact, Bobby Sands wrote back home in Derry.

It makes me proud we had men like him to stand against British Imperialism.

I thought that was a well known fact. Anyone who is a fan of Christy would/should know where the song came from.

mfceiling

corks finest wrote: »

Start of our darkest period in modern Irish history, 5/5/81
Bobby Sands
I was living in Derry at the time, attended Kevin Lynch's and Patsy O'Hara's funerals etc,
awful awful awful time

I worked with Kevin Lynch's nephew for years. I'm from the north with a protestant father and catholic mother. No religion in our house.
He took a fair while to warm to me but we became great pals. He would have given me the shirt from his back. We never discussed politics (I've no interest) but we had loads of shared interests.

Hopefully the peace becomes stronger in the north and the youth will drive the hatred away for ever.

corks finest

mfceiling wrote: »

I worked with Kevin Lynch's nephew for years. I'm from the north with a protestant father and catholic mother. No religion in our house.
He took a fair while to warm to me but we became great pals. He would have given me the shirt from his back. We never discussed politics (I've no interest) but we had loads of shared interests.

Hopefully the peace becomes stronger in the north and the youth will drive the hatred away for ever.

Any normal person be they orange or green background just don't care, it was relevant in the past but thank God it's nearly gone,
You're a Dungiven man I take it? Sur, went to Romania with a few lads and one lady from there ( they've a pub in the town)

mfceiling

corks finest wrote: »

Any normal person be they orange or green background just don't care, it was relevant in the past but thank God it's nearly gone,
You're a Dungiven man I take it? Sur, went to Romania with a few lads and one lady from there ( they've a pub in the town)

Dungiven how dare you!! Rural Tyrone!! We worked for the same company. All Derry lads and me the hateful blow in as they called me!!

corks finest

mfceiling wrote: »

Dungiven how dare you!! Rural Tyrone!! We worked for the same company. All Derry lads and me the hateful blow in as they called me!!

Haha Love it, imagine me with a vv broad Cork city accent living in the Creggan,and worked in clubs for years bouncing
Sure Brolly was born in Tyrone

antgal23

corks finest wrote: »

Haha Love it, imagine me with a vv broad Cork city accent living in the Creggan,and worked in clubs for years bouncing
Sure Brolly was born in Tyrone

Met a guy in Florida in the 90s, tall unit of a man, originally from the Creggan, can't mind his name - such a character

It was Big Noel

SEPT 23 1989

Edgware

antgal23 wrote: »

Met a guy in Florida in the 90s, tall unit of a man, originally from the Creggan, can't mind his name - such a character

It was Big Noel

Thats very informative

NIMAN

History wise, the thing that always amazed me was how the PM of Britain let one of her country's MPs starve themselves to death.

I always try to imagine if some MP in Birmingham or Glasgow had a belief in something as strong as BS, and starved to death, how would it have gone down with the British people?

Edgware

NIMAN wrote: »

History wise, the thing that always amazed me was how the PM of Britain let one of her country's MPs starve themselves to death.

I always try to imagine if some MP in Birmingham or Glasgow had a belief in something as strong as BS, and starved to death, how would it have gone down with the British people?

If the MP was a member of an organisation that slaughtered young people on a night out in Birmingham, Guildford or people shopping in London they probably wouldnt be too concerned.

corks finest

Edgware wrote: »

If the MP was a member of an organisation that slaughtered young people on a night out in Birmingham, Guildford or people shopping in London they probably wouldnt be too concerned.

They murdered 2 of Corks elected Lord mayor's,shot one in his bed

corks finest

Edgware wrote: »

If the MP was a member of an organisation that slaughtered young people on a night out in Birmingham, Guildford or people shopping in London they probably wouldnt be too concerned.

Bobby Sands never set foot in Britain,and if u want to bring up slaughtered civilians Google"Bomber Harris" royal air force he managed a score of 10s of thousands of ordinary civilians in Cologne etc

corks finest

Edgware wrote: »

If the MP was a member of an organisation that slaughtered young people on a night out in Birmingham, Guildford or people shopping in London they probably wouldnt be too concerned.

Or if he was a British army chap who murdered via plastic bullets innocent Irish children.
Or bloody Sunday etc etc,it goes on

Edgware

Edgware wrote: »

If the MP was a member of an organisation that slaughtered young people on a night out in Birmingham, Guildford or people shopping in London they probably wouldnt be too concerned.

It really should've saved his life though

They died for what were very modest political compromises

RandomViewer

Jim2007 wrote: »

The likes of Bobby Sands had no mandate to kill anyone and should not even be mentioned in the same sentence as the men and women of the war of independence. And before you ask, I am a Republic, one that respects the decisions of the Irish people and one that signed up in 1981 to defend the Irish State against terrorists.

You brainwashed brand of republicanism is not the only flavour in town.

So Martin Luther King got what he deserved?

Zaph

NIMAN wrote: »

History wise, the thing that always amazed me was how the PM of Britain let one of her country's MPs starve themselves to death.

I always try to imagine if some MP in Birmingham or Glasgow had a belief in something as strong as BS, and starved to death, how would it have gone down with the British people?

He was an MP in name only. Even if he wasn't in prison he wouldn't have attended parliament or participated in the democratic process to represent his constituents. Thatcher was pretty cold hearted, but I fail to see why she would or should care more about Sands just because he was an MP.

corks finest

Zaph wrote: »

He was an MP in name only. Even if he wasn't in prison he wouldn't have attended parliament or participated in the democratic process to represent his constituents. Thatcher was pretty cold hearted, but I fail to see why she would or should care more about Sands just because he was an MP.

Kieran Doherty was also a TD
( Irish member of parliament)
He also died

corks finest

Zaph wrote: »

He was an MP in name only. Even if he wasn't in prison he wouldn't have attended parliament or participated in the democratic process to represent his constituents. Thatcher was pretty cold hearted, but I fail to see why she would or should care more about Sands just because he was an MP.

And you categorically know this? Methinks not

Zaph

corks finest wrote: »

Kieran Doherty was also a TD
( Irish member of parliament)
He also died

And what difference does that make? He was in prison in a foreign jurisdiction, it's not like the government here were going to bust him out just so he could take his seat.

Zaph

corks finest wrote: »

And you categorically know this? Methinks not

And just how many SF MPs have taken their seat in Westminster? There's no way Bobby Sands would have been any different.

corks finest

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It really should've saved his life though

They died for what were very modest political compromises

As an ex republican ( N and S- arrested for suspected membership etc 2003- Dundalk)
Walked away after a lifetime of it , I can heart on hand categorically state that all the hunger strikers were used for political gain for SF, which in turn brought about the GFA
Before they died SF were dead ducks so the ultimate sacrifice brought about some semblance of peace
But they were used no doubt, anyone interested Google " Brendan " the dark" Hughes"

corks finest

Zaph wrote: »

And just how many SF MPs have taken their seat in Westminster? There's no way Bobby Sands would have been any different.

That's as Maybe-MAYBE

Edgware

corks finest wrote: »

They murdered 2 of Corks elected Lord mayor's,shot one in his bed

I dont need a history lesson from you. The poster raised a question and I answered it.