Where to get a non ripp off face mask ?

mondeo

Seems everywhere is hiking up the prices because of the virus... Surely these should be given out for free ? I need them for my parents and I am considering using one myself to be honest.

Are you wearing a mask and where did you get one ? I'm not paying a tenner for a fckn mask that probably cost half that 2 weeks ago.

un5byh7sqpd2x0

mondeo wrote: »

Seems everywhere is hiking up the prices because of the virus... Surely these should be given out for free ? I need them for my parents and I am considering using one myself to be honest.

Are you wearing a mask and where did you get one ? I'm not paying a tenner for a fckn mask that probably cost half that 2 weeks ago.

Unless your parents have the virus, they don’t need one

Birneybau

If you or they are well, they won't need one. It's is not airborne. It's it from hands and surfaces. Just imagine everything is covered in snot, including your own hands, and act accordingly.

youtube!

Birneybau wrote: »

If you or they are well, they won't need one. It's is not airborne. It's it from hands and surfaces. Just imagine everything is covered in snot, including your own hands, and act accordingly.

Is airborne though, if someone coughs or sneezes near you how do you think it gets in your lungs? Michael Osterholm had gone on record as saying this.

Wibbs

Birneybau wrote: »

It's is not airborne.

Of course it is, though depends on how one defines airborne. If someone with the infection coughs or sneezes it's in the air. How long it's in the air is a matter for debate but in the air it can be.

Link and https://www.newsweek.com/coronavirus-could-airborne-chinese-official-claims-1486493 and another

As for masks. The paper ones are not much use, crap seal against the face and too many gaps, but better than nothing and limit you touching your hands directly to your face. Though as non trained people don't know how to use them they could very well add to a false sense of security. The best would be proper half or full face respirator types with PP3 level replaceable filters. They could be had for 20 quid or so a few months back, now price gouging pricks are looking many multiples of that. If you can find them.

Which brings me to my next point. The good ones are in short supply and the people who need these the most and know how to use them and are going to be directly exposed to the virus are those in the Irish health service. If masks were cheap and easily available then game ball, but they're not and it's our doctors nurses and emergency services who need them the most. By a long margin.

BrianD3

I got some of the disposable* FFP2V respirators last Friday, 3 quid each which I didn't think was too bad, the shop I bought them in (not Woodies or B&Q) is known for being pricey.

I also have a Sundstrom half respirator which uses replaceable P3 filters, I couldn't find any replacement filters for it locally so yesterday ordered some off ebay UK which probably were way overpriced, 15 euros each incl. delivery. That's assuming that they are delivered which may not even happen given TEOTWAWKI

If you want to feel safer then you'll pay the money. There is limited and conflicting info online regarding the effectiveness of masks and respirators. I read somewhere of a small study that found if you are in a house with someone with the flu, if you wear a respirator your chances of catching it go from 17% to 4%

*can be reused if you are careful, I would imagine that if you take a respirator off after wearing it and then leave it to dry out for a few days, any virus in it should be gone. Although I'm not sure on that.

Wibbs

P3 particulate filters should last for many years B, unless of course you're using one in a very dusty environment and they clog up, so your "old" ones are probably fine. It's when filters contain things like activated charcoal and other compounds that rely on chemistry for filtration(mostly gas masks to be fair) then they have a limited use life. Some measured in hours IIRC.

Wibbs

I'm using one of these:



(20 quid before the virus, 100 plus with some online bastards now)

And yes I may look like Darth Vader's simple minded brother, but sure feck it. I DGAF as a baseline so... I'll bet now and when/if things get like Italy anyone who has any sort of a mask will be wearing them in a few weeks time and with no embarrassment at "what will people think?" guff.

BrianD3

Wibbs wrote: »

P3 particulate filters should last for many years B, unless of course you're using one in a very dusty environment and they clog up, so your "old" ones are probably fine. It's when filters contain things like activated charcoal and other compounds that rely on chemistry for filtration(mostly gas masks to be fair) then they have a limited use life. Some measured in hours IIRC.

Thanks Wibbs, filter has sat on a shelf out of its packet but unused for years. Long expired as is the mask itself but seems ok. Still likely better than nothing for trips to Tesco :eek:

Kivaro

Birneybau wrote: »

If you or they are well, they won't need one. It's is not airborne.

It actually is airborne.
The jury is out on the length of time that it is.

barneystinson

Wibbs wrote: »

I'm using one of these:



(20 quid before the virus, 100 plus with some online bastards now)

And yes I may look like Darth Vader's simple minded brother, but sure feck it. I DGAF as a baseline so... I'll bet now and when/if things get like Italy anyone who has any sort of a mask will be wearing them in a few weeks time and with no embarrassment at "what will people think?" guff.

When you say you’re using one of those, when / in what circumstances are you using it?

sdanseo

Wibbs wrote: »

I'm using one of these:



(20 quid before the virus, 100 plus with some online bastards now)

And yes I may look like Darth Vader's simple minded brother, but sure feck it. I DGAF as a baseline so... I'll bet now and when/if things get like Italy anyone who has any sort of a mask will be wearing them in a few weeks time and with no embarrassment at "what will people think?" guff.

I picked up something similar.
How does one ensure a reusable mask like that is clean / reusable?
Is it a matter of sanitising the outside, then taking it off and leaving it in the spare room for a few days until the virus inside dies or can you sanitise one for daily use?

Pkiernan

mondeo wrote: »

Seems everywhere is hiking up the prices because of the virus... Surely these should be given out for free ? I need them for my parents and I am considering using one myself to be honest.

Are you wearing a mask and where did you get one ? I'm not paying a tenner for a fckn mask that probably cost half that 2 weeks ago.

If you believe that a mask will save your life, you appear to be valuing same at 5 euro.

Pkiernan

sdanseo wrote: »

I picked up something similar.
How does one ensure a reusable mask like that is clean / reusable?
Is it a matter of sanitising the outside, then taking it off and leaving it in the spare room for a few days until the virus inside dies or can you sanitise one for daily use?

Stick it in the microwave for 20 mins on high.

Wibbs

sdanseo wrote: »

I picked up something similar.
How does one ensure a reusable mask like that is clean / reusable?
Is it a matter of sanitising the outside, then taking it off and leaving it in the spare room for a few days until the virus inside dies or can you sanitise one for daily use?

Rub it down with alcohol basically.The filter medium is out of the way on those particular ones, but even if it weren't I can't see any issue there. It would only be filters with chemical agents that I'd worry about. Dilute bleach would work too, though I dunno how the plastics would react.

There are people in the UK and elsewhere using actual military surplus gas masks. Overkill, but would offer even more protection and cleaning them would pose no issue as they're designed to withstand chemical attack. Horribly restrictive though. Way more than the half masks. Most can't be worn with glasses either. And you'd look like an even bigger gimp.

Tom Mann Centuria

Wibbs wrote: »

Rub it down with alcohol basically.The filter medium is out of the way on those particular ones, but even if it weren't I can't see any issue there. It would only be filters with chemical agents that I'd worry about. Dilute bleach would work too, though I dunno how the plastics would react.

There are people in the UK and elsewhere using actual military surplus gas masks. Overkill, but would offer even more protection and cleaning them would pose no issue as they're designed to withstand chemical attack. Horribly restrictive though. Way more than the half masks. Most can't be worn with glasses either. And you'd look like an even bigger gimp.

Not dismissing masks, but hands are the biggest risk. All about the hands, they're the biggest threat to giving yourself the virus, unless you're unlucky and in confined space you aren't getting directly infected by some cnut sneezing on you, you're way more likely to be picking it up from door handles, computers, seat arms etc etc on your hands and transferring it.

And seeing people with the same set of gloves on at checkouts etc. pointless because the virus can just as happily sit on those gloves, and a wipe of the nose, mouth or eyes and just as happily transfer.

Wibbs

Tom Mann Centuria wrote: »

Not dismissing masks, but hands are the biggest risk. All about the hands, they're the biggest threat to giving yourself the virus, unless you're unlucky and in confined space you aren't getting directly infected by some cnut sneezing on you, you're way more likely to be picking it up from door handles, computers, seat arms etc etc on your hands and transferring it.

Depends on the environment too. Walking into a quiet shop or garage to buy petrol and bread you'd be unlikely and unlucky to get a dose from the air, especially if you kept some distance. You're in and out in a couple of minutes. The risk there would be surfaces like door handles, counters, keypads, petrol pumps, etc. In a car, taxi, bus or Luas, train or plane the airborne and close contact element would be much higher. I recall reading a study ages ago where they looked at influenza transmission on a flight and the three routes, body contact/aerosol/surfaces were about equal IIRC.

I personally wouldn't get in a shared car, bus, tram, taxi, or plane without a mask. That's just me mind you. That's how I caught that dose around New Years. I gave a mate a lift somewhere that took 15 minutes and he had it. Three days later. Gargling glass throat, hacking cough and the heaving sweats.

On the surfaces front I kinda think of it like radioactive fallout dust. It gets potentially everywhere and is easily transferred. Though fallout is much easier to deal with as you can "see" it with detection. So you go to fill up your car, touch the contaminated pump, stick your now contaminated keys in your pocket, while you fiddle around for now contaminated cash(or card) to pay, then back into your car where you potentially contaminate the car door handle, seatbelt, steering wheel, gear knob, radio/touchscreen. You get home and the shopping bag has potential contamination, the items you bought that have been handled by the checkout person(and likely other customers), who has handled lots of things and after you wash your hands you put them into the fridge or press... That's before you consider your clothes, the front door handle, the kitchen handle and surfaces, your phone, the laptop, the remote for the telly...

When you start to break down how many things you touch that are a step removed from other people's touch and potential contamination you could end up with full on OCD with spells of paranoia.

Kivaro

Wibbs wrote: »

When you start to break down how many things you touch that are a step removed from other people's touch and potential contamination you could end up with full on OCD with spells of paranoia.

Just on this point alone, and there could be a full thread dedicated to it, but where do you stop? I try to be socially conscious as possible and after my first trip out in a number of days, my hands are raw from washing and hand sanitiser. And all of the hand washing happened when I came home.

Ah shoite, I touched the front door handle entering the house.
Ah shoite, I have to wash my hands after I put away each individual item that was purchased in CoronaWorld.
Ah shoite, this glove is now useless because I touched something, don't know what, but better not take the risk.

Did I decontaminate the dog when she jumped on me when I arrived into the house?
Here Molly ........... come here girl ..............

Full on OCD.

youtube!

It's really interesting that Michael Osterholm doesn't agree with the hand washing hand sanitisers etc having much of an effenct on the transmission of the virus, as he says the data is really weak and we are not being honest with people by saying it is effective. No harm but really no use either.

He is also against the idea of school closures for the simple reason that we lost over 20% of our fronline staff in the battle against this disease as they need to remain home to mind the children.

hairyslug

Screwfix still have a few p3 masks.

Having something cover your face will prevent you touching your face

Colonel Claptrap

Johnstone's decorating centre in Baldoyle have masks and disposable gloves.

Wibbs

youtube! wrote: »

It's really interesting that Michael Osterholm doesn't agree with the hand washing hand sanitisers etc having much of an effenct on the transmission of the virus, as he says the data is really weak and we are not being honest with people by saying it is effective. No harm but really no use either.

He is also against the idea of school closures for the simple reason that we lost over 20% of our fronline staff in the battle against this disease as they need to remain home to mind the children.

From what I've read of him(and his book, though that was ages ago) he seems to be of a similar mind to the British herd immunity notion. It's going to burn through the population no matter what you do and people will die and that's that, and it's better to keep the economic wheels turning. He claims masks were useless too, except for the half/full face respirators which are "pretty good".

It's the health workers I'd be worried for. They're far more exposed and when exposed they're also exposed to much higher viral loads at once*. Never mind the stress and exhaustion. They need full face respirators.







*If I happen to inhale a couple of dozen of the viral bastards in one go from some coughing muppet in public, they'll take a while to hijack my cells to produce more of their "children" . If I walked into an isolation ward and breathed in a couple of thousand of the viral bastards they're going to hit me far more quickly and from more infected cells.

Tom Mann Centuria

youtube! wrote: »

It's really interesting that Michael Osterholm doesn't agree with the hand washing hand sanitisers etc having much of an effenct on the transmission of the virus, as he says the data is really weak and we are not being honest with people by saying it is effective. No harm but really no use either.

He is also against the idea of school closures for the simple reason that we lost over 20% of our fronline staff in the battle against this disease as they need to remain home to mind the children.

He's said hand washing isn't going to stop the virus. He's right, but if it affects 1% of transmission it's worth doing. Certainly has some use and I'd hate to think people wouldn't bother if they followed the it's no use theory.

Wibbs

Kivaro wrote: »

Ah shoite, I have to wash my hands after I put away each individual item that was purchased in CoronaWorld.

For a second I was wondering where that shop was... :D Tea all over keyboard, you cnut. :pac::pac:

Tom Mann Centuria

Wibbs wrote: »

It's the health workers I'd be worried for. They're far more exposed and when exposed they're also exposed to much higher viral loads at once*. Never mind the stress and exhaustion. They need full face respirators.

FFP2 mask and glasses style goggles is the most we'll get in the HSE. And only FFP2 if we're giving a nebuliser etc which aerosolises the virus, otherwise surgical mask.

Wibbs

Tom Mann Centuria wrote: »

FFP2 mask and glasses style goggles is the most we'll get in the HSE. And only FFP2 if we're giving a nebuliser etc which aerosolises the virus, otherwise surgical mask.

Sh1t. I think I have a spare one somewhere around the place..

Xertz

Be VERY aware of using antique gas masks. I've seen a bit of that online.
A lot of those old devices form WWII would provide you with no protection whatsoever for this and also may contain toxic substances in their filters, notably asbestos fibres.
They're best left in a museum!

I've just seen a few weird tweets from the UK with people donning WWII air raid masks!

tayto lover

hairyslug wrote: »

Screwfix still have a few p3 masks.

Having something cover your face will prevent you touching your face

My face is itchy as hell since I was told not to touch it.

Xertz

Maybe we need a pair of glasses that generates a signal and two wrist watches that beep if you move anywhere near it!

Wibbs

Xertz wrote: »

Be VERY aware of using antique gas masks. I've seen a bit of that online.
A lot of those old devices form WWII would provide you with no protection whatsoever for this and also may contain toxic substances in their filters, notably asbestos fibres.
They're best left in a museum!

I've just seen a few weird tweets from the UK with people donning WWII air raid masks!

+1000. Most older military gas masks do use asbestos as part of the filtration. Pre 80's and some into the 90's with Eastern Bloc stuff, WW2 stuff definitely. Now it's behind the particle and activated carbon layers of the filter so you'd probably be ok, but no way in hell would I trust it. The masks themselves are fine material wise and many take the same thread as brand new or new enough filters(40MM IIRC). Military stuff tends to be standardised so you can nick the enemies stuff in a pinch. So you could use an older mask from say 1970's on with a new non asbestos filter. Though again we're talking major overkill here and looking like a complete gimp.

Though this English lad seems to get away with it. T'is the black gloves I reckon.



The bloke on the left's face is priceless.

They're also mad tiring and uncomfortable to wear(tried one halloween, minus a filter). Panic attack or claustrophobic folks need not apply. And you could get home be all confident and stick a finger up a nostril chasing a bogey and...

Kivaro

Wibbs wrote: »

For a second I was wondering where that shop was... :D Tea all over keyboard, you cnut. :pac::pac:

You're welcome.

Kivaro

Wibbs wrote: »

The bloke on the left's face is priceless.

It's gas.

Xertz

The other issue is many of those old masks were designed to neutralise chemicals in a battlefield, they may not necessarily be all that effective at removing virus particles which are absolutely tiny. They're only around 120 nm

Wibbs

Well the cold war and current stuff is NBC rated so nuclear, biological and chemical so they would be effective in that sense.