Closure of creches

Melted

I would like to get other parents input and experience here regarding crèche closures until the 29th.

We have two children in the crèche and we spend nearly 2k on fees a month. Yesterday we were told that there will be no refund or reduction in fees during this period.

I understand staff have to get payed but is there no social insurance fund from the government to cover this? I just can’t seem to wrap my head around a privately owned business getting away with charging money when there is no service being delivered?

Am I the only one thinking like this?

HelgaWard

I have a pre school child who attends full time and an older child who attends after school in a creche in a provincial town.We have not been told to pay or not to pay. My intention is not to pay. The creche owner told me they have been advised to temporarily let go their staff and they will get social welfare. She was meeting with her bank to put a stop on the business mortgage today. I don't think you should have to pay for a service you are not receiving.

Seems unreasonable. You paid for a service. If the service isn't provided, then you should receive a refund, or at least, a deferral to cover when it starts again. The company is responsible for paying the employees... you're not. You're simply the customer and responsibility stop there.

Considering how expensive creche fees can be, I'd suggest contacting the other parents, and consider getting legal advice. I wouldn't stand for it. (I don't have children, but I'd feel the same about any service, with that kind of cost)

Boggles

Not all staff will be automatically paid, so don't fall for that one.

Also if the place of business is closed it will not be incurring other costs, food, heat, etc.

So straight away no one should be paying full whack.

Creches need to be reasonable as do parents.

bladespin

i'd be inclined to pay a retainer for places etc but would refuse point blank to pay full rate for no service.

Woshy

I don't mind paying as normal as long as the staff are also being paid. I have heard of crèches getting staff to sign-on but still charging parents full whack which is terrible.

I'm only paying for three afternoons a week of after school care for one child so I know not paying nearly as much as other people, which has influenced how I feel too

suicide_circus

wonder what the consumer rights people have to say.

2k a month, jesus

Boggles

Woshy wrote: »

I don't mind paying as normal as long as the staff are also being paid. I have heard of crèches getting staff to sign-on but still charging parents full whack which is terrible.

I'm only paying for three afternoons a week of after school care so I know not paying nearly as much as other people, which has influenced how I feel

I'll put it to you this way. Do you think the Creches will be paying their food providers over the next 2/4/6. etc weeks as normal?

Like fúck they will.

appledrop

I have absolutely no problem paying once staff are paid.

It's not their fault the creche is closed + they should be entitled to pay. Management cannot pay their wages if no money from parents.

Now I am in lucky position that I'm I'm allowed work from home until creche /school open ago.

Timfy

That's right... you are "only customers" and you should all stop paying...

After all it's not like creches will still have to pay;

heating
electricity
gas
insurances
licensing
existing invoices for supplies
upcoming invoices for supplies
water rates
business loans
mortgages (may be able to mitigate this one with a bit of hoop jumping)

Oh hang on, yes they will!

A vast number of creches are charitable institutions, not making huge profits and with very little spare capital. They are heavily reliant on government funding and the yearly subs from parents. Staff have already been laid off and day to day capitation and ancillary costs are mounting up despite there being no children in the building.

Creches (and schools for that matter) haven't closed for ****s and giggles, there is a major health alert and they were instructed to close. They would much rather be looking after your kids than sitting at home filling in their social welfare forms.

I'm not sure about your local creche, but for the majority, parents signed up for a set period, not a day to day drop off service (that's what "babysitters" are for), and somewhere in those terms and conditions that you received and never read it will state that the creche service may be interrupted by major incidents, of which this closure certainly qualifies.

By all means cut the throats of local creches, but get ready to be searching for a new one as many will go down the pan without support from parents in these unprecedented times.

Hearing a parent say "We're only customers" would break the hearts of most childcare workers who rightly believe that they are far more than just suppliers of a "service".

Boggles

Timfy wrote: »

Staff have already been laid off

So the Staff still need to be paid we are still charging full whack is just a load of bollix then?

The staff at my local créche have been told to contact welfare.

I'm not saying Creches don't need help, but they shouldn't profit from this either.

appledrop

Boggles wrote: »

So the Staff still need to be paid we are still charging full whack is just a load of bollix then?

The staff at my local créche have been told to contact welfare.

I'm not saying Creches don't need help, but they shouldn't profit from this either.

If we are paying are fees as normal which I have no problem with whatsoever then creches are taking the pi** if not paying their staff. There is no justification for this whatsoever. I have asked my creche if staff will still be paid during this period. If not I'll be having strong words with them.

TheValeyard

Boggles wrote: »

So the Staff still need to be paid we are still charging full whack is just a load of bollix then?

The staff at my local créche have been told to contact welfare.

I'm not saying Creches don't need help, but they shouldn't profit from this either.

Our creches owner is not currently taking calls. But I will be very unhappy if she profits from this crisis.

Melted

Timfy wrote: »

That's right... you are "only customers" and you should all stop paying...

After all it's not like creches will still have to pay;

heating
electricity
gas
insurances
licensing
existing invoices for supplies
upcoming invoices for supplies
water rates
business loans
mortgages (may be able to mitigate this one with a bit of hoop jumping)

Oh hang on, yes they will!

A vast number of creches are charitable institutions, not making huge profits and with very little spare capital. They are heavily reliant on government funding and the yearly subs from parents. Staff have already been laid off and day to day capitation and ancillary costs are mounting up despite there being no children in the building.

Creches (and schools for that matter) haven't closed for ****s and giggles, there is a major health alert and they were instructed to close. They would much rather be looking after your kids than sitting at home filling in their social welfare forms.

I'm not sure about your local creche, but for the majority, parents signed up for a set period, not a day to day drop off service (that's what "babysitters" are for), and somewhere in those terms and conditions that you received and never read it will state that the creche service may be interrupted by major incidents, of which this closure certainly qualifies.

By all means cut the throats of local creches, but get ready to be searching for a new one as many will go down the pan without support from parents in these unprecedented times.

Hearing a parent say "We're only customers" would break the hearts of most childcare workers who rightly believe that they are far more than just suppliers of a "service".

All the above is good arguments for the reason why crèches should not be privatised, I firmly believe the state should be responsible for the institutions surround childcare but I digress. At the end of the day it is a business, if I need to take time off to mind my kids who’s going to pay my wages?

looksee

Those parents paying fees could easily be out of pocket themselves as a result of lack of work or the necessity to mind children. They should not have to be losing both ways. The government has created a social welfare situation that will accommodate most child care workers, in the same way that workers in other affected areas will be paid. The most reasonable result would be for a directive that people should expect to pay x% as a holding fee for their creche place.

If there are childcare workers that fall between the cracks of the social welfare situation that is a different argument and will have to be dealt with, there will be other workers in the same situation, the few exceptions should not cause the whole structure of support to collapse.

If the child care center has told staff to contact welfare no one should pay the full amount while salaries are the biggest expense it not the only one.

If the child care center is paying staff then yes the fees should be paid.

There should be some system to pay a tax rebate to those who are out of work and not being paid fully.

BrianBoru00

Timfy wrote: »

That's right... you are "only customers" and you should all stop paying...

After all it's not like creches will still have to pay;

heating
electricity
gas
insurances
licensing
existing invoices for supplies
upcoming invoices for supplies
water rates
business loans
mortgages (may be able to mitigate this one with a bit of hoop jumping)

Oh hang on, yes they will!

A vast number of creches are charitable institutions, not making huge profits and with very little spare capital. They are heavily reliant on government funding and the yearly subs from parents. Staff have already been laid off and day to day capitation and ancillary costs are mounting up despite there being no children in the building.

Creches (and schools for that matter) haven't closed for ****s and giggles, there is a major health alert and they were instructed to close. They would much rather be looking after your kids than sitting at home filling in their social welfare forms.

I'm not sure about your local creche, but for the majority, parents signed up for a set period, not a day to day drop off service (that's what "babysitters" are for), and somewhere in those terms and conditions that you received and never read it will state that the creche service may be interrupted by major incidents, of which this closure certainly qualifies.

By all means cut the throats of local creches, but get ready to be searching for a new one as many will go down the pan without support from parents in these unprecedented times.

Hearing a parent say "We're only customers" would break the hearts of most childcare workers who rightly believe that they are far more than just suppliers of a "service".

Most people are aware of these unprecedented issues. But if a crèche is not paying wages to staff , they are not paying suppliers if they are not using daily supplies.

The OP is certainly entitled to expect a reduction.

The Creche is entitled to take measures to survive but if they're costs are being reduced then it is only ethically and morally right to reduce charges correspondingly

Beasty

Moved from Current Affairs

Hammer Archer

Our creche have said that we're not getting a partial refund of March fees and we've also found out that they won't be paying staff while they're closed. We've been told that they won't collect April fees if they stay closed after March 29th but it's still odd that we've paid for a service that we won't be getting.

Toastytoes

No refund here and have been told it’s full fees as normal. I doubt we’ll allow the full DD to go through for April if the place is still closed and there’s no conversation about a reduction to account for their reduced outgoings. We’re taking unpaid leave to mind a toddler, working from home means nothing with a 22 month old. She needs to be minded regardless of whether or not mom has a conference call to join. Have contacted our local TD to find out is there is anything being done for people in our situation.

Pawwed Rig

Melted wrote: »

I firmly believe the state should be responsible for the institutions surround childcare but I digress.

Because the State have such a good track record of looking after children? I hope you are not being serious here. Noone does well when looked after by the State see State nursing homes, see Tulsa, see direct provision and the list goes on

Melted

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

Because the State have such a good track record of looking after children? I hope you are not being serious here. Noone does well when looked after by the State see State nursing homes, see Tulsa, see direct provision and the list goes on

Please stay on topic.

What is your point here? I can name plenty of privately owned businesses/enterprises who have failed with their duty of care, that should not allow us to set our expections.

Primary & secoundary schools are for the most part state controlled, why not creches?

Pawwed Rig

Melted wrote: »

What is your point here?

I thought what I wrote was fairly clear

Shedite27

I have no bother paying this.

For the crèche: staff need to be paid, the staffs bills needs to be paid, mortgage on the building needs to be paid. Those staff aren’t paid enough as it is, putting them on social welfare for a few months shouldn’t happen.

For myself: If the crèche go bust over the next few months, where am I gonna put my kids when it reopens.

Pawwed Rig

Our creche staff are not being paid at the moment from what I have heard. We have paid for the month in advance. In such a scenario I would assume there will be a reduction next month.

baldbear

Our kids are in Giraffe . We have heard nothing about payment. We are all in unknown territory. If staff there continue to get paid I can stomach payments for now.

We have to take it in turns to stay at home now unpaid. But I suppose lots of sacrifices have to be made. People are already loosing there jobs across various sectors.

The number one priority should be childcare for health care workers and all front line staff in this crisis.

byhookorbycrook

Melted wrote: »

Please stay on topic.

What is your point here?

Leave the modding to the mods, please . If you have an issue with a post, report it .

Melted

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Leave the modding to the mods, please . If you have an issue with a post, report it .

I do not see anything wrong with that request, if he wants to start another topic I would be happy to discuss that with him, just not derail the thread.

Bit of a shame that I’ve to tell a mod to stay on topic?

Olivia Pope

Our creche contacted today. We have to pay until the end of March as they are paying all staff a full wage until the end of March. We don't have to pay anything after April 1st. One of the creche workers babysits for me and she has confirmed to me that they are being paid until the end of the month. I am happy with that and relieved. One less bill for awhile. This is in Cork City, southern suburb.

Melted

Olivia Pope wrote: »

Our creche contacted today. We have to pay until the end of March as they are paying all staff a full wage until the end of March. We don't have to pay anything after April 1st. One of the creche workers babysits for me and she has confirmed to me that they are being paid until the end of the month. I am happy with that and relieved. One less bill for awhile. This is in Cork City, southern suburb.

Good to hear I hope ours is the same.

appledrop

Well well well not happy at all with response from our creche today.

They admitted didn't play full wages to staff for March + told them to contact social welfare.

However they also asked us to pay April fees so they can try + pay staff wages to top up social welfare.

Disgraceful that they treated staff like this when has full payment for March from parents. If they were going to pay staff initially for April they would never have told them to contact social welfare. No they have been caught out because we all asked questions about staff getting paid.

They will be getting a strongly worded email from me + I'm going to contact local T.D.

baldbear

So for the forseeable future social distancing will be the norm. I can't see creches opening back up before June or later. It will be a nightmare for creches to get kids to stay apart from one another.

Or creche is paying their staff fully. Fees will be revisited at the end of March. I'm guessing we will have to continue paying something. Insurance costs , rates etc will have to be covered

neris

Its not just the children to be kept apart. Its staff and also parents.